Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Hotfeet444]

Thanks for the explanation.
I do disagree with that though. I do believe an "all-encompassing" Zelda is definitely possible. But the main problem I see with her is Sheik. I have no idea how that would work with an "all-encompassing" Zelda, or if she'd even have a transformation at all. I think it's idiotic when people say Zelda will transform into Impa, seeing as Impa =/= Zelda. Ganondorf really baffles me. He's never really had art that went a bit cartoony (aside from Toon G-dorf), so I'm not sure how he'd be pulled off, or even implemented. A 2nd Link also scares me, because I think it is totally necessary to represent the Zelda series by having 2 Links(as does Sakurai when he mention Toon Link on the Brawl Dojo).

In conclusion, "WTF is gonna happen with the Zelda cast" is my biggest concern.

I would have said an all-encompassing Zelda was easily done, but that would have been before Skyward Sword. Considering Zelda's character is portrayed so differently and has enough abilities to make its own moveset without the need of taking elements from the game that she didn't use, and I of course mean the use of harp magic, much like how I designed Toon Zelda to use Spirit Flute magic, which came from the design of designing SS Zelda with Harp magic. Of course, it wouldn't change her moveset persay, just make the animations different. Nayru's Love would become Lanaryu's Wisdom, Din's Fire would become Din's Flame, Farore's Wind would remain unchanged, and so on.

As for the use of Sheik, I think it'd be interesting if Sheik got a design that reflected Impa in Skyward Sword, mainly changing around the color scheme to more Black and Orange, maybe even pulling out a couple of her abilities for use as everything Sheik's had up until this point was created seperately since there was no source material for a moveset, but with the display of Impa's powers, I think we now have something to work off of.

Ganondorf...I know some people disagree with this, but I think just having Ganondorf from Ocarina of Time 3D would suffice. Make him use dark magic that he used in his boss battle, his large sword, and make him Ganon from the final Boss battle, I think it still works and is still relevant. Because mixing Demise with Ganondorf is an awkward idea, and his appearances are so different from one another that it'd look like a mutated mess if it was made to be all-encompassing.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Vaati is not convincing enough for me to play as him.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I'm personally thinking this "all-encompassing" thing isn't going to work with Zelda and Ganondorf like it does for Link. Link almost always looks the same, young man in a green tunic with a sword and shield. Zelda and Ganondorf almost always look differently in each game, Ganondorf especially.

Considering that the Twilight versions look the most similar to the Ocarina versions, I'd say we'd get edited versions of those as our "All encompassing" designs. It's better than having Skyward Sword Zelda which just looks like nothing, but Skyward Sword Zelda and having Ganondorf look like a metro sexual.

 

[Curious Villager]

However don't forget about Tetra and Vaati. They aren't one-offs and are important to the series still.

Yeah I have them in the "tied with the younger Link" section. I'm not really sure I can see them making it in if Toon Link for example isn't in it. But that's just my opinion really. :/

 

[BluePikmin11]

Zelda characters will be in bright primary colors.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Considering that the Twilight versions look the most similar to the Ocarina versions, I'd say we'd get edited versions of those as our "All encompassing" designs. It's better than having Skyward Sword Zelda which just looks like nothing, but Skyward Sword Zelda and having Ganondorf look like a metro sexual.

Give Ocarina of Time Ganondorf a beard...there, all-encompassing. :D

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, and Toon Link are the most important to the series. Any other Zelda character taking their place is just unrealistic. (Yes, that includes Tingle and especially Ancient Link)

 

[Bajef8]

I would have said an all-encompassing Zelda was easily done, but that would have been before Skyward Sword. Considering Zelda's character is portrayed so differently and has enough abilities to make its own moveset without the need of taking elements from the game that she didn't use, and I of course mean the use of harp magic, much like how I designed Toon Zelda to use Spirit Flute magic, which came from the design of designing SS Zelda with Harp magic. Of course, it wouldn't change her moveset persay, just make the animations different. Nayru's Love would become Lanaryu's Wisdom, Din's Fire would become Din's Flame, Farore's Wind would remain unchanged, and so on.

As for the use of Sheik, I think it'd be interesting if Sheik got a design that reflected Impa in Skyward Sword, mainly changing around the color scheme to more Black and Orange, maybe even pulling out a couple of her abilities for use as everything Sheik's had up until this point was created seperately since there was no source material for a moveset, but with the display of Impa's powers, I think we now have something to work off of.

Ganondorf...I know some people disagree with this, but I think just having Ganondorf from Ocarina of Time 3D would suffice. Make him use dark magic that he used in his boss battle, his large sword, and make him Ganon from the final Boss battle, I think it still works and is still relevant. Because mixing Demise with Ganondorf is an awkward idea, and his appearances are so different from one another that it'd look like a mutated mess if it was made to be all-encompassing.

Well the problem there is you're basing designs and moves off of SS, instead of previous Smash games. Zelda isn't going to look like SS. Sheik, hopefully makes it, and will have this "all-encompassing" design as well, not an Impa one. Link, as it stands, leans more towards an OoT/TP mix than anything SS. His bombs are even based on the TP design. I think, as Noah said, they'll lean towards re-drawn artworks based around an OoT/TP mix. That being said, I'm still curious how they'll look. And about 2nd Link and Sheik's playable statuses.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Give Ocarina of Time Ganondorf a beard...there, all-encompassing. :D

I want the Ocarina voice back. He sounds so stupid in Wind Waker/Twilight Princess.

Well the problem there is you're basing designs and moves off of SS, instead of previous Smash games. Zelda isn't going to look like SS. Sheik, hopefully makes it, and will have this "all-encompassing" design as well, not an Impa one. Link, as it stands, leans more towards an OoT/TP mix than anything SS. His bombs are even based on the TP design. I think, as Noah said, they'll lean towards re-drawn artworks based around an OoT/TP mix. That being said, I'm still curious how they'll look. And about 2nd Link and Sheik's playable statuses.

I said before that Toon Link on the train is literally the ONLY thing that gives me the smallest doubt that Toon Link won't return. If he does thought I guess it would be Wind Waker. Having ST link would be kind of like having Matthew or Alph.

EDIT: I don't think the twilight versions got in JUST because they were recent. They already looked similar to the OOT versions.

 

[Bajef8]

I want the Ocarina voice back. He sounds so stupid in Wind Waker/Twilight Princess.

Actually, not to be a Zelda nerd or anything, G-dorf had the same voice actor in OoT and WW. TP is the only time his voice actor changed.
Also fun fact, Demise is voiced by Oot & WW Ganondorf's voice actor.

 

[Hotfeet444]

I want the Ocarina voice back. He sounds so stupid in Wind Waker/Twilight Princess.

Stupid or not, he had an awesome laugh.

Actually, not to be a Zelda nerd or anything, G-dorf had the same voice actor in OoT and WW. TP is the only time his voice actor changed.
Also fun fact, Demise is voiced by Oot & WW Ganondorf's voice actor.

Demise sounded more like Bowser than Ganondorf IMHO.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I'm pretty curious what Toon Link's redesign looks like.

 

[Bajef8]

I said before that Toon Link on the train is literally the ONLY thing that gives me the smallest doubt that Toon Link won't return. If he does thought I guess it would be Wind Waker. Having ST link would be kind of like having Matthew or Alph.

EDIT: I don't think the twilight versions got in JUST because they were recent. They already looked similar to the OOT versions.

Again, they aren't versions of Link, they just happened to be the most recent artworks of the characters. We are repping the triforce trio spiritually, not picking TP Link or WW Link. We rep the trio and a 2nd Link (who just so happens to be represented in the series with the Toon-style artwork).

 

[Curious Villager]

I'm pretty curious what Toon Link's redesign looks like.

I wouldn't actually mind them incorporating Toon Link with Cell Shading, the game is already looking pretty bright and colourful compared to Brawl so I'd imagine he wouldn't look too off.... But I suppose he would probably look more like he does in those sections in Wind Waker HD where you can't really see any cell shading on him for some reason....

 

[kingmario92]

I don't think the twilight versions got in JUST because they were recent. They already looked similar to the OOT versions.

UNTRUE. Zelda is brown haired in TP. BIIIIIIIIIIIIG difference.

 

[TumblrFamous]

I'm pretty curious what Toon Link's redesign looks like.

If Toon Link is in, it will most definitely look similar to his WWHD counterpart, only his colors will be brought down a little bit. Not so much as they did with him in Brawl, though.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I'll just assume everyone will look like the "Kingdom Shader."

 

[Bajef8]

I'm pretty curious what Toon Link's redesign looks like.

Done.

 

[Hotfeet444]

If Toon Link is in, it will most definitely look similar to his WWHD counterpart, only his colors will be brought down a little bit. Not so much as they did with him in Brawl, though.

Is "actually being cell-shaded" an option for appearance?

 

[Gune]

Done.

he looks like a action figure.

 

[Bajef8]

he looks like a action figure.

Yeah that's what I thought. I'm guessing though he'll just look like he did in Brawl but HD. Tad bit more details, a bit brighter "primary colors."

 

[Hotfeet444]

he looks like a action figure.

Well then, considering this is a universe where fake caricatures of characters (basically just figures/models) fight other fake caricatures of characters, he'll fit right in.

 

[Curious Villager]

I actually kinda wouldn't mind a stage that gives everyone a cell shading art style now that I think about it. Perhaps in a new Wind Waker stage. I mean they kinda did this with this "Super Mario Galaxy" stage where Kirby gets that White Brightness on him like how Mario looked in the box arts so I would imagine the possibility isn't too out there. Then again, I don't really know much about game design and all so achieving that would probably be a bit more complex.... :/

 

[TumblrFamous]

Talking about the whole Zelda cast thing: I expect there to be two Links, so I'm assuming Toon Link is returning. I think Zelda will return with Sheik as her Down B. It's still a very unique playstyle, having the slow and kinda powerful Zelda with the faster, weaker Sheik. I say Sheik will stay. As for Ganondorf, I can only hope he gets at least buffed. I don't care if he's decloned or not, just make him useful.

 

[BluePikmin11]

There's no reason Shiek should be removed, that's kinda like Prince Sable without his two forms.

 

[Hotfeet444]

I actually kinda wouldn't mind a stage that gives everyone a cell shading art style now that I think about it. Perhaps in a new Wind Waker stage. I mean they kinda did this with this "Super Mario Galaxy" stage where Kirby gets that White Brightness on him like how Mario looked in the box arts so I would imagine the possibility isn't too out there. Then again, I don't really know much about game design and all so achieving that would probably be a bit more complex.... :/

Well, they managed to create several stages that make your normally 3D character flat, so I guess it can't be a stretch, but it could cause some glitches in programming and take more time to develop as you'd need to go back and turn every single character into a cell-shaded model, and seeing how they're pressed for time already, I don't see it happening.

 

[Gune]

all I expect from the zelda franchise is the triforce trio if there is cuts, but if there isnt i expect the zelda franchise to look the same.

 

[Curious Villager]

Well, they managed to create several stages that make your normally 3D character flat, so I guess it can't be a stretch, but it could cause some glitches in programming and take more time to develop as you'd need to go back and turn every single character into a cell-shaded model, and seeing how they're pressed for time already, I don't see it happening.

Yeah I thought so. Ah well, it would have been nice but it's not really a necessary feature they need to include, just a nice little easter egg. If their pressed for time then I'd rather they focus on the characters, stages, modes and the game's overall balance etc.

 

[Louie G.]

The Triforce Trio and a younger Link.
That's all that is needed.

 

[zauberdragon]

It's the old battle between how a series had progressed in terms of characters and design versus the smash status quo. While how the Zelda series has progressed since Brawl will have some impact, look at the skyloft stage and the Link redesign, the precedents set by the older smash games is still very important, particularly when it comes to character selection. Two links has been the norm for the past two iterations, and so has Sheik.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Here's another question. Do people think the rep cap is still going to remain at four? If they're going for a lower number roster, I see Pokemon, Mario and Zelda staying at four reps a piece, the only newcomer there being Mewtwo.

 

[Bajef8]

It's the old battle between how a series had progressed in terms of characters and design versus the smash status quo. While how the Zelda series has progressed since Brawl will have some impact, look at the skyloft stage and the Link redesign, the precedents set by the older smash games is still very important, particularly when it comes to character selection. Two links has been the norm for the past two iterations, and so has Sheik.

Exactly. This makes me feel more confident in Toon Link and Sheik's returns. I've been arguing the same thing for Jiggs. She's been in the past 3 along with Pikachu, so why expect them to deviate from Smash history.

And a rep cap is a silly thing to begin with. Mario and Pokemon are arguably larger anyways. My money is on Mario and Pokemon having 5 tops, but Zelda remaining at 4.

 

[Arcanir]

Here's another question. Do people think the rep cap is still going to remain at four? If they're going for a lower number roster, I see Pokemon, Mario and Zelda staying at four reps a piece, the only newcomer there being Mewtwo.

Nah, they didn't do it in Melee or (if you include transformations) Brawl and even considered bringing Mewtwo back so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't adhere to that cap.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Here's another question. Do people think the rep cap is still going to remain at four? If they're going for a lower number roster, I see Pokemon, Mario and Zelda staying at four reps a piece, the only newcomer there being Mewtwo.

Really hope it stays at four, 5 kinda goes too far for me, the only exception is Pokemon, but really it should stay at four.

 

[Louie G.]

Really hope it stays at four, 5 kinda goes too far for me, the only exception is Pokemon, but really it should stay at four.

My prediction is that Mario and Zelda stay at 4, but Pokemon gets bumped up to 5.

 

[zauberdragon]

Here's another question. Do people think the rep cap is still going to remain at four? If they're going for a lower number roster, I see Pokemon, Mario and Zelda staying at four reps a piece, the only newcomer there being Mewtwo.

I've said it before but ideally they remain at 4, and other well endowed franchises like Star Fox and Kirby stay at 3, but the likes of Metroid and Kid Icarus maybe get one more while the main focus is on introducing new franchises. Whether Sakurai sees the same way I don't know. All newcommers have come from new franchises so far but it's too early to say how important that is.

 

[CrusherMania1592]

I'm gone for an hour of class and nearly five pages? Jeez

What's the topic, Zelda characters?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Should the "rep count" stay at 5 or 4 reps? Thats the topic.

 

[Louie G.]

I've said it before but ideally they remain at 4, and other well endowed franchises like Star Fox and Kirby stay at 3, but the likes of Metroid and Kid Icarus maybe get one more while the main focus is on introducing new franchises. Whether Sakurai sees the same way I don't know. All newcommers have come from new franchises so far but it's too early to say how important that is.

I think Smash 4 has a huge focus on new franchises, and characters like Little Mac and Shulk will likely appear to expand on this. Smash 5 is when I expect Kirby to get Waddle Dee, Star Fox to get Krystal, and so on.
Also, I kinda have my hopes down for Ridley now, so not really Metroid, as awesome it would be.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Nah, they didn't do it in Melee or (if you include transformations) Brawl and even considered bringing Mewtwo back so I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't adhere to that cap.

Well, consider how things were at the time of Melee compared to now. Mario was their big flagship franchise, easily shown to be their most important franchise. Zelda was doing very well from the still recent success of Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask, and Pokemon was just three years old, still at the beginning of its life. Now, both Mario and Pokemon are almost tied for being the biggest franchise in the world, and they have no competitors for that position either, of course they're going to keep even. Zelda is still a hugely successful franchise, basically Nintendo's equivalent of Metal Gear Solid in the fact that a new game doesn't come out very often, but when one does, it's always very highly acclaimed and considered one of the best games of its time. As of now, Pokemon is celebrating its 15 year anniversary here in North America, Mario is still going on strong with a new title on the way, and the Legend of Zelda's new title, most hinted to be a sequel to Twilight Princess, is going to be a huge hit when it comes out like every other 3D Zelda game before it. Sure Zelda doesn't need to be tied with Mario and Pokemon, but Mario and Pokemon should not exceed each other, especially Pokemon exceeding Mario.