Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Starcutter]

Why trim? Your original one looked really nice as it was.

because I really don't think Smash will have 51 characters, but then again it might.

that's also why I trimmed, so people could look at different versions depending on how big they think the roster is.

EDIT:

Can somebody tell me how a Namco character (someone who is not Nintendo) getting into Super Smash Brother is NOT Special Treatment?
Hence Sakurai's Statement: "Namco characters are getting no special treatment."

Maybe it means no extra merits. like, no BIG BONUS for getting in. whatever, it's not like I have any namco ppl on my roster.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Can somebody tell me how a Namco character (someone who is not Nintendo) getting into Super Smash Brother is NOT Special Treatment?
Hence Sakurai's Statement: "Namco characters are getting no special treatment."

Pac-Man getting in due to his iconic status.

Really the only one that comes to mind.

I know you think that's ballocks but you can't deny Pac-Man's place as an icon.

Whether or not that will do something is another story entirely, but if Pac-Man got in. That's why.

I guess we could also get another Snake situation and have one of Sakurai's friends beg for his character to be included but I'm not sure who that would be.

 

[Hotfeet444]

METAL GEAR!!!

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Pac-Man getting in due to his iconic status.

Really the only one that comes to mind.

I know you think that's ballocks but you can't deny Pac-Man's place as an icon.

Whether or not that will do something is another story entirely, but if Pac-Man got in. That's why.

I guess we could also get another Snake situation and have one of Sakurai's friends beg for his character to be included but I'm not sure who that would be.

It doesn't matter how iconic you are, if you're not Nintendo and you get into Smash Brothers as a playable character, that is special treatment. Sonic in Brawl is special treatment. He's being treated specially because Sakurai doesn't treat other third-parties this way.

 

[Gune]

The point isn't Lucario being considered a semi-cone (which he's not) It's more so to make the Pokemon different as much as possible. Lucario's Auroa is similar to Mewtwo's Shadow as well as his shape & form, they are also pretty lightweight characters. I know they aren't clones, but for Pokemon I think it's best to have reps be more different from each other than Lucario & Mewtwo are. I know a lot of people are okay with Mewtwo over Lucario. It's to avoid having pokemon of the same type or similar type.

You made up this logic just so Genesect could get in didnt you? dont lie to me noah...

 

[TheLastJinjo]

You made up this logic just so Genesect could get in didnt you? dont lie to me noah...

Nope! I don't add characters based off preference or else I'd be making up excuses to have Lucario over Mewtwo. I'm not saying Genesect is more popular than Lucario.

But, being such a big lucario fan, I'd say you're avoiding anything that may credit Genesect or discredit Lucario in the slightest.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

It doesn't matter how iconic you are, if you're not Nintendo and you get into Smash Brothers as a playable character, that is special treatment. Sonic in Brawl is special treatment. He's being treated specially because Sakurai doesn't treat other third-parties this way.

How was Sonic different than say Megaman? Both got in due to popularity. They both had to EARN their way into smash. Not special treatment.

Snake is a weird case. He got the special treatment.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

How was Sonic different than say Megaman? Both got in due to popularity. They both had to EARN their way into smash. Not special treatment.

Snake is a weird case. He got the special treatment.

But, it's STILL an All-Nintendo fighting game. They earned it so that's WHY they get special treatment. You have to earn special treatment.

 

[PK-Omelette]

Oh, we're going THERE now are we? Well then

 

[Swamp Sensei]

But, it's STILL an All-Nintendo fighting game. They earned it so that's WHY they get special treatment. You have to earn special treatment.

The interviewer in question asked if we will be seeing a Namco character in the game because Namco is working with him. Sakurai said no Namco character will get special treatment.

Sakurai said that just because Namco is working on the game does not mean they will get a character.

No special treatment = No character for Namco just because they are working on the game.


In theory, its possible Pac-Man could get in through other means, such as his iconic status and fan demand (though it's currently lacking) especially if that rumor is to be believed.

 

[Gune]

Nope! I don't add characters based off preference or else I'd be making up excuses to have Lucario over Mewtwo.

there is no excuse for that except for instance of brawl but there was the factor that mewtwo had not shown in advertising or tv since 2004 up since I believe while know you has been prominent ever since his debut. the fact that there is a bunch of charecter's that share characteristics in smash I dont think its fair that you single out Lucario for it you know its not right, I know its not right and the people here know its not right.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

there is no excuse for that except for instance of brawl but there was the factor that mewtwo had not shown in advertising or tv since 2004 up since I believe while know you has been prominent ever since his debut. the fact that there is a bunch of charecter's that share characteristics in smash I dont think its fair that you single out Lucario for it you know its not right, I know its not right and the people here know its not right.

I am singling him out because he's the only character with similarities to another Pokemon already in the game. I'm not saying Lucario ISN'T going to be in the game.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Wait...

You're taking out Lucario because you're afraid they might be too similar but you left Toon Link?

Da fuq?

I am singling him out because he's the only character with similarities to another Pokemon already in the game. I'm not saying Lucario ISN'T going to be in the game.

Like one special and a forward smash?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Wait...

You're taking out Lucario because you're afraid they might be too similar but you left Toon Link?

Da fuq?




Like one special and a forward smash?

Maybe you should read the list of similarites, also what influenced his removal MAYBE happening is an all-veteran Pokemon roster. I even said several times we could just replace JigglyPuff instead of Lucario.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Maybe you should read the list of similarites, also what influenced his removal MAYBE happening is an all-veteran Pokemon roster. I even said several times we could just replace JigglyPuff instead of Lucario.

Okay.

The aura/shadow effect.
Both are humanoid.
Both are pokemon.
They share a forward smash and a side special.

That's not a lot.

Especially considering Mewtwo and/or Lucario may very well be reworked.

 

[Gune]

But, being such a big lucario fan, I'd say you're avoiding anything that may credit Genesect or discredit Lucario in the slightest.

Hey I cant deny it I love the blue guy hes too just too badass , but Im definitley not the one to disregard any information be it good or bad unless its just fan speculation if thats the case I dont move on it till its proven by the company or trusted source like the mewtwo frome was,so far the ony things discrediting him is fan speculation and the things crediting him is from the actual directors and developers so unless gamefreak drops him from advertisements game cameos and anime episodes or his popularity Sinks faster than a metal box full of rocks then Im not moving on my point that Lucario should be in thats just how im gonna be about it.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

In all reality, Noah you still have to sell Genesect.

We don't have to resell Lucario. Everyone knows why he would be a decent choice. Few people seem to know why Genesect would be a good idea.

Genesect strikers me as bazaar.

 

[MagnesD3]

Another realistic roster. The ones on the bottom represent characters I would not be surprised to see be put in.

 

[Gune]

I am singling him out because he's the only character with similarities to another Pokemon already in the game. I'm not saying Lucario ISN'T going to be in the game.

kirby has smiliaritys to a pokemon too.....are seeing how this fall's apart yet?

 

[shinhed-echi]

Just so I can be among the cool kids, I've retaken playing Fire Emblem.
This will be my SECOND FE game. So hopefully I'll be able to hop in on FE discussions as well.

I had forgotten how fun it is... And how freaking unforgiving it can be on your units, lol.
Also playing Advance Wars 1 ATM.

 

[PK-Omelette]

Just so I can be among the cool kids, I've retaken playing Fire Emblem.
This will be my SECOND FE game. So hopefully I'll be able to hop in on FE discussions as well.

I had forgotten how fun it is... And how freaking unforgiving it can be on your units, lol.
Also playing Advance Wars 1 ATM.

Yeah, FE can be a huge troll sometimes XD But hey, how else are you going to learn? After all, it is a strategic turn based game series, so it be trollin makes sense if they wanted to help you out in the long run for future battles.

 

[Starbound]

If Pac-Man gets into Smash, it will be because he's literally a gaming icon, not because he's popular.

Like Pac-Man's iconic status can literally give Mario a run for his money, while leaving Pikachu and Sonic in the dust.

http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/world-records/7000/most-recognizable-videogame-character

And this isn't coming from a Pac-Man supporter.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Another realistic roster. The ones on the bottom represent characters I would not be surprised to see be put in.

It's not bad, but I must ask, does Bowser Jr. really need a Shadow Mario transformation? He's evolved over the years into his own independent character, I think if he gets in Smash Bros, he should be representative of said independence. That doesn't mean he can't use the paintbrush for certain attacks though. Also, I think four Fire Emblem characters a little too much, Diddy and Dixie don't need to be a tag-team, and while I like the idea of Krystal's inclusion, I don't think she's exactly needed. Also, I'd really consider adding Takamaru somewhere in your roster, he just seems so likely right now.

 

[MagnesD3]

It's not bad, but I must ask, does Bowser Jr. really need a Shadow Mario transformation? He's evolved over the years into his own independent character, I think if he gets in Smash Bros, he should be representative of said independence. That doesn't mean he can't use the paintbrush for certain attacks though. Also, I think four Fire Emblem characters a little too much, Diddy and Dixie don't need to be a tag-team, and while I like the idea of Krystal's inclusion, I don't think she's exactly needed. Also, I'd really consider adding Takamaru somewhere in your roster, he just seems so likely right now.

Well I did include takamaru in the very likely section. Also I love shadow mario, its what made me like jr. so much his paint brush moves will make him super unique, now true they can just give this to normal bowser jr. but Id rather it be a transformation like in sunshine.

 

[FlareHabanero]

In all reality, Noah you still have to sell Genesect.

We don't have to resell Lucario. Everyone knows why he would be a decent choice. Few people seem to know why Genesect would be a good idea.

Genesect strikers me as bazaar.

Bazaar? Genesect is a market?

Well, when it comes to describing any character, the most important factor is to win over others. You know, the words that can convince people that something can be worthwhile. If you lack those words, you won't win over people. It's common sense for a lot of things, and is a very important "business" weapon. Of course, making the wrong moves can cause discouragement, so naturally saying the right stuff is an ideal factor.

 

[TheDivineDeity]

I'm going to ask a legitimate question here - is there any reason, other than being a Famicon original, that Takamaru is even considered a likely candidate for Smash? I mean, don't get me wrong, I welcome the inclusion, but why is the surge of popularity now?

 

[MagnesD3]

I'm going to ask a legitimate question here - is there any reason, other than being a Famicon original, that Takamaru is even considered a likely candidate for Smash? I mean, don't get me wrong, I welcome the inclusion, but why is the surge of popularity now?

It's the search for retro characters probably.

 

[FlareHabanero]

I'm going to ask a legitimate question here - is there any reason, other than being a Famicon original, that Takamaru is even considered a likely candidate for Smash? I mean, don't get me wrong, I welcome the inclusion, but why is the surge of popularity now?

Believe it or not, but Takamaru has always had a mild amount of support, dating back to the days of Melee. It was primarily Japanese support at the time, due to the obscurity of The Mysterious Murasame Castle causing it to be unknown to a lot of people (more so back then anyway). I suppose it's been increasing over the years because of the steady stream of publicity of The Mysterious Murasame Castle has been receiving, starting with Pikmin 2 back in 2004. Naturally when something is getting more exposed, you're going to have more people curious. It also helps that Sakurai himself is already familiar with the character.

 

[Arcadenik]

I guess we could also get another Snake situation and have one of Sakurai's friends beg for his character to be included but I'm not sure who that would be.

You mean like how the Tales creator basically told the Tales fans to beg Sakurai to put a Tales character in Smash? Why is it that the Tales fans have to beg Sakurai to add a character but the Pac-Man fans don't? Probably because the Tales creator knows that the series is a niche franchise with a small following and he wants to use Smash to make Tales popular in the West... whereas Pac-Man is already popular in the West and doesn't need any propping from Smash to make him popular.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

kirby has smiliaritys to a pokemon too.....are seeing how this fall's apart yet?

The point is Pokemon being similar, not characters being similar. Genesect's inclusion was not related to Lucario as none of my rosters ever had Lucario, but jeez I might as well add him if everyone is gonna ***** about it. I took other things into consideration such as the classic smash rep and her new fairy abilities probably being more impressive than Lucario's abilities. Just because Lucario's abilities aren't the same doesn't mean they're similar. Similar doesn't equal the same.

The topic is similar Pokemon, not similar characters and not clones. Please don't change the subject. This kind of brings me back to having 2 Pokemon Trainers because I don't want 2 Pokemon of the same type. Regardless of them not having the same moves.

And I'm not removing Lucario because he's a similar character, it's because Pokemon's roster may experience cuts. I didn't cut Toon Link for being similar because there's nobody to take his spot.

I'm going to ask a legitimate question here - is there any reason, other than being a Famicon original, that Takamaru is even considered a likely candidate for Smash? I mean, don't get me wrong, I welcome the inclusion, but why is the surge of popularity now?

It's popular in Japan, and due to the appearance in Samurai Warriors and Nintendo Land. He's more well known than Ice Climbers and has more potential. If anything it makes WAAY more sense than Ice Climbers.

In all reality, Noah you still have to sell Genesect.

We don't have to resell Lucario. Everyone knows why he would be a decent choice. Few people seem to know why Genesect would be a good idea.

Genesect strikers me as bazaar.

Genesect has sold to a fair amount of people. You can find those people on SmashBoards as well as real life and other sites. I'm not assuring you Lucario's removal. In fact I assume he will return enough to make it part of my next roster. But, for a guy who remove Mewtwo.........you seem REALLY Damn sure Lucario is coming back.Like many people I still don't believe in an All-Veteran roster.

Bazaar? Genesect is a market?

Well, when it comes to describing any character, the most important factor is to win over others. You know, the words that can convince people that something can be worthwhile. If you lack those words, you won't win over people. It's common sense for a lot of things, and is a very important "business" weapon. Of course, making the wrong moves can cause discouragement, so naturally saying the right stuff is an ideal factor.

Pretty sure if Lucario wasn't new, Mewtwo would be slightly bigger priority, just like I think JigglyPuff got in over Mewtwo for being a classic.

AND DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT TWISTING MY WORDS TO MAKE ME SOUND LIKE LUCARIO GOT IN JUST BECAUSE OF RECENCY!

Things I find important to the Pokemon roster

1. Having more than just Generation 1 (at least 1 character from a different gen).
2. Not having Pokemon of similar type.
3. Having a Pokemon that hasn't been playable before.
4. In SOME situations representing the newest gen, this was mostly just important to brawl.

 

[God Robert's Cousin]

Checked to see what it was Noah was saying in his arguing. I'm not impressed.

Genesect has sold to a fair amount of people. You can find those people on SmashBoards as well as real life and other sites.

Care to show a link leading to a statistic, poll, or forum thread supporting specifically what you just claimed?

Of course you wouldn't, because that would actually mean finding evidence for your claim, wouldn't it?

I'm sure your professors are going to love it when you write your essays with no citations just like how you drive all of your other fact-based arguments home.

 

[Glaciacott]

Usually only lurk around this site, but since this game seems like all I can talk about, I'll just go ahead and post as well as reading.

Here's the roster I've developed, with explanation below.
Keep in mind it's based both on what I want and what I perceive to be likely.

Mario series: no newcomer. If there was a newcomer, I'd bet on Toad, but there's plenty of characters I prefer to bet on.

DK serier: K. Rool for reasons we are all aware of. No Dixie due to, imo, similar moveset fighting style to Diddy or potentially a light-weight clone of DK.

Wario Ware series: Here's my first big justification. The Wario Ware series has gone on to become Nintendo's go-to way to showcase hardware, and given that I see it as a relevant franchise in smash. As for, why Ashley? I'm basing it on both ease of making a moveset for her due to what's established in the series, and the fact she seems to be the more popular suggestion from people who want a Wario Ware rep. However, that said, this is one of my more risky and unlikely guesses.

Metroid: Obviously Ridley for reasons we all know.

Earthbound/Mother: I see Lucas coming back as the present veteran, Ness as one of the first unlockables, and Porky as a new unlockable.
The reason for Porky is that Nintendo seems to have realized the meaning this series has to fans, and thanks to the VC release and the fanfare it received, the fanbase will no doubt expand. As a series, it is currently more relevant than even Star Fox. And a way to honor that is to bring in the character that connects both Mother 2 and 3.
And it's not just a case of "oh, he's a villian and has appeared in both games." But really, just the fact that Porky is such an embodiment of the series, even more so than Ness and Lucas who are silent protagonists. Porky is tragic, depressing, funny, absurd, creepy ... soo many adjectives that really bring light to the fact of why Mother's tone is so unique and captivating.
Yes, I concede that he has a harder moveset potential than, say, Masked Man or Kumatora or Duster ... but he's just so much more important in the greater context of the series. The most likely scenario to me is no new Mother rep, but if there is one, I'm betting on Porky.

Zelda: Ghirahim replacing Toon Link. I think this series is represented excellently by the Triforce and having another link always feels excessive. Ghirahim brings something new to the table by being a villian outside the triforce who was a serious threat.
That said, this is easily my least desired character in my roster, and he's only there because I don't see the Zelda roster going down, and of all Zelda characters he makes the most sense to me. Tone-wise, Impa would be obvious, but the moveset potential for her would just mean striping Zelda of Sheik to avoid redundancy.

Takamaru: Most likely retro callback to me. Nintendoland and Samurai Warriors have increased awareness of this guy, and he's to Link what Pit is to Samus. I'd be surprised not to see him in and then hear about a revival of the franchise from Platinum Games or someone else.

Kirby: perfect trio is already in. Bandana Dee would be, imo, the most likely Kirby rep, but definitely not essential to the roster. Perhaps more fitting to be an assist.

Kid Icarus: the heart of Uprising is the rapport between Pit and Palutena. I can't see a better Kid Icarus rep, even though more than half of the cast would make a solid character addition. Also, I'm biased in that Palutena is by far my most desired character.

Starfox: this franchise is really currently frozen, and I don't see Krystal being relevant enough to be included. Even Pygma means more to the series, imo.

F-Zero and Pikmin: nothing new here, carry on ...

Fire Emblem: another one bound to be complicated. Marth isn't going anywhere, and I don't see Ike leaving either. Roy I don't see coming back.
Now, I used to believe Chrom was obvious, but after Sakurai opted for the Animal Crossing Villager instead of Tom Nook, commenting he's the one you play as, I've begun to believe more in the Tactician/Robin. Along with the fact that both Chrom and Lucina's moveset would obligatorily have swords and this series has more than swords. Robin, meanwhile, relies more on magic, and his/her moveset would as a result be much more unique. And really, it'd be nice to have a non-blue haired Fire Emblem rep.
Like Ashley, I see this one as a bit unlikely, but I'm sticking with it.

Pokemon: While I'd like a new trainer, I don't see it happening. I don't see Lucario happening either, like Roy to me he was more of a flavor of the month thing. Mewtwo to me is certain, and I imagine his useless Down B being replaced with the awakened form transformation in some way. Jigglypuff is now a mainstay to me.

Punch-Out!: Little Mac is happening. I don't see how it won't. Moving on.

Pac Man: My only wanted/expected third party rep. Pac Man is just waay too iconic not to make it, and Sakurai's interview with IGN implied he had been wondering about including a Namco character. Sonic being in Brawl made noise all over gaming sites due to the sheer meaning of the fight ... two gaming titans going at each other. Pac Man can make such noise to much greater degrees.
The moveset is easy, Namco would love the exposure, the character fits in perfectly as it has in Mario Kart, and it would lead to a game that is truly an all-star fight between the most iconic images in gaming. The way I see it, few other third parties deserve this spot over Pac Man, and NO others would have the sheer impact he would.

Ok, that's all! My apologies for the length of my explanations

 

[AEMehr]

Difference is Baby Yoshi isn't a prediction, who would predict Baby Yoshi?

Is that right? I remember there being a certain youtube video of yours that suggested you thought it would be very possible for their to be a second Yoshi rep in Baby Yoshi.

I mean I thought it was pretty obvious that was just something that I think is cool. He thought Duck Hunt Dog, Gooey, and Prof. Layton WERE predictions. And no they don't work.

What makes Duck Hunt Dog, Gooey, and Layton NOT work?

Duck Hunt Dog is infamously known for his laugh and is from a relatively popular and well known NES Game. What's wrong with him being a retro character?

Gooey is the original player 2 that wasn't just Kirby. He was considered the next potential Kirby character before Waddle Dee made his playable appearance in Return to Dreamland (Gooey could also represent Dark Matter in some form too).

Layton is from an incredibly popular Nintendo Exclusive franchise. His creator has expressed interest in seeing Layton in crossover games and the supposed "Final Layton game" might not even be the final one in the series after all.

What makes these three characters impossible? They each have their own reasons to be included (Layton would just be tougher to get into the roster due to Third-Party Status).

Hey there guys, I'm back, so what's new?

So anyways, I've updated my roster prediction to be more realistic, so I was wondering what everybody thinks:

View attachment 1897

Green = Newcomer
Yellow = Potential DLC (if there is any)
Red = Almost impossible and highly improbable (but possibly possible)

So, what does everybody think?

- You've got too many Mario characters here.
I think you might have missed the previous discussion about why many people are against having two or more Mario characters. You'll have to decide between Bowser Jr., Toad, and Paper Mario.
- Four Donkey Kong characters right off the bat like that seems like too many characters for my personal tastes. I think you should probably move Dixie or K. Rool to DLC.
- I think forcing Impa to be stuck with Zelda is a bad idea. You might of missed out another discussion that was put on a few pages back that discussed why Sheik should return and why Impa shouldn't be forced to be included with Zelda. I think it's very likely that we'll see Zelda and Sheik comeback.
- There is no way that Toon Link will be replaced by Classic Link. If Toon Link isn't going to return, there won't be a second Link. I'd suggest either keeping Toon Link or add in Impa as a separate character.
- Kid Icarus has one too many characters here. More than two is too much, so I'd just stick to Palutena.
- Additional Kirby characters are understandable, but more so for a DLC spot rather than making it on the actual roster.
- Cutting both Lucario and Jigglypuff isn't a good idea. Especially if you're going to take away from Pokemon but still give Mario three additional characters. You should keep both Jigglypuff and Lucario, maybe remove Genesect though. A fifth generation rep is really sketchy at this point.
- We were just told that Namco won't be getting any special attention. So giving them two third-party characters (Especially when one isn't even confirmed to happen). You should at least bring Sonic back before adding in any other Third-Parties (I'd consider Snake too).
- You still refuse to add any Earthbound characters. You need to remember when making a roster that you aren't catering to yourself here, you need to consider everyone. Earthbound is an important franchise that, surprising, Nintendo is paying attention to lately.
- I'm not going to touch your DLC section, but an Angry Bird? Really? I really doubt we'd ever see those things in Smash Brothers.

Hooray for 400 pages! Anyways, while my Smash Bros artwork video renders, I created a new roster:

Total Characters: 48 + Mii Option
Returning Characters: 34
Cut characters: 1 (Lucario)
Newcomer List: Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, MegaMan, Paper Mario, King K.Rool, Impa, Ridley, Eevee, Mewtwo, Chrom, Palutena, Takamaru, Little Mac, Isaac, Mii
DLC Choices: Roy, Lucario.

Since the rendering is going to take a while, I have all the time in the world.

I like it, but the lack of Shulk on it is pretty disappointing (Add him as extra DLC with another character?).
I'd play the game if it was like this for sure, I'd just sort of question where Eevee came from but I understand where your coming from with adding it in.

 

[Swift Fox]

The point is Pokemon being similar, not characters being similar. Genesect's inclusion was not related to Lucario as none of my rosters ever had Lucario, but jeez I might as well add him if everyone is gonna ***** about it. I took other things into consideration such as the classic smash rep and her new fairy abilities probably being more impressive than Lucario's abilities. Just because Lucario's abilities aren't the same doesn't mean they're similar. Similar doesn't equal the same.

The topic is similar Pokemon, not similar characters and not clones. Please don't change the subject. This kind of brings me back to having 2 Pokemon Trainers because I don't want 2 Pokemon of the same type. Regardless of them not having the same moves.

And I'm not removing Lucario because he's a similar character, it's because Pokemon's roster may experience cuts. I didn't cut Toon Link for being similar because there's nobody to take his spot.



It's popular in Japan, and due to the appearance in Samurai Warriors and Nintendo Land. He's more well known than Ice Climbers and has more potential. If anything it makes WAAY more sense than Ice Climbers.



Genesect has sold to a fair amount of people. You can find those people on SmashBoards as well as real life and other sites. I'm not assuring you Lucario's removal. In fact I assume he will return enough to make it part of my next roster. But, for a guy who remove Mewtwo.........you seem REALLY Damn sure Lucario is coming back.Like many people I still don't believe in an All-Veteran roster.



Pretty sure if Lucario wasn't new, Mewtwo would be slightly bigger priority, just like I think JigglyPuff got in over Mewtwo for being a classic.

AND DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT TWISTING MY WORDS TO MAKE ME SOUND LIKE LUCARIO GOT IN JUST BECAUSE OF RECENCY!

Things I find important to the Pokemon roster

1. Having more than just Generation 1 (at least 1 character from a different gen).
2. Not having Pokemon of similar type.
3. Having a Pokemon that hasn't been playable before.
4. In SOME situations representing the newest gen, this was mostly just important to brawl.

I sense someone's logic scattered so bad... Can't compute

I don't think Sakurai will even think of Genesect by a slightest. You are really blatantly biased for the inclusion of Genesect into your roster and kicking Lucario outta the way for no (good) reason. It's really showing... so bright!! Just saiyan'.

 

[TheCreator]

It's party time, baby.

If you mean the one by SmashDaddy, it's quite a poor attempt at making a Pac-Man move set. The move-set is incredibly underwhelming and consists mostly of moves used by characters such as JigglyPuff, Bowser, and Wario.

I don't look at the movesets in that thread. I looked at one or two and didn't think they were exactly what I'd like Pacman to have so I'm apathetic about fan movesets for Pacman. I know Sakurai can make a good one.

It seems the only affiliation from Nintendo mentioned was an obscure Arcade Game, which does not compare to the Nintendo affiliation of Snake, Sonic, nor Bomberman.

Hehe. Well let's first hit essentials. 3 'obscure' arcade games were mentioned, and they form a steady series of 'obscure' arcade games, with the most recent being enough so for Pac-man to have his design from his cartoon. That's all that was mentioned. And the fact that Mario and Pac-man are in this game side by side, dwarfs any kind of relationship that nintendo has with the metal gear series as a whole, (next to none) and still overpowers the relationship nintendo had the bomberman of old. Sonic overcomes this though, of course no explanation necessary. What is NOT mentioned, is that Nintendo EAD actually helped to develop a Pac-man game for gamecube, called Pac-man VS. this is the only time they have ever helped to develop a 3rd party title. Also not mentioned is Miyamoto's known respect for the character, saying in interviews how much he loves Pac-man.

He goes on to claim that while the current Pac-Man isn't as popular or has good moves, that characters like Pit & Ice Climber got in and do have moves. This works for NINTENDO characters. Third-Parties are suppose to be already popular and already have a move set. Third-Parties are very exclusive so it shouldn't be somebody where you have to invent things in order for it to work. He constantly compares this third-party to many semi-obscure Nintendo icons such as R.O.B., Ice Climbers, and Pit. That's not a good sign.

Don't see how that could only work for Nintendo characters. "Third parties are supposed to be already popular and have a moveset." What? lol no. And nothing would need to be invented at all, he has plenty of moveset potential. Idk why he does that, because Pac-man dwarfs all of those characters in iconic status. Including mario.

It's mostly just him saying that what Pac-Man doesn't have can simply be invented. I don't think Sakurai is going to choose a Third-Party if he has to go to lengths to make it work. He doesn't add just ANY third-party.

Nope. But I guess you fail to see how Pac-man is not just ANY third party character? And again. Pac has tons of moveset potential.

Also why would Sakurai say "Namco characters aren't getting any special treatment" if not to lower people's hopes when no Namco characters appear. Why would he bother releasing a statement of what WASN'T the reason a character WAS included. It's just as pointless as saying "Well, Sonic will get in, but he's not getting special treatment because he's blue." Being playable in Super Smash Brothers would be considered special treatment for ANY non-Nintendo Character.

Because if he hadn't have, you KNOW that a lot of people would have been expecting an ass ton of Namco characters in this game. The mentality is that namco bandai is working on the game? OH **** WE MUST BE GETTING ALL THESE CHARACTERS HURR. This statement was likely to prevent THAT. Notice please in his statement the word character is plural. If he would have said say, "No namco character is getting special treatment" that would be more like it.

If you have a fighting game exclusively for "Nintendo All-Stars" Being one of the only Non-Nintendo characters in it IS "Getting Special Treatment" Going to the length of inventing moves for a character that's not Nintendo and then making them a playable ****ing character seems like special treatment to me.

No move inventing is necessary, friend. And Pac-man is probably one of the ONLY 3rd party characters who deserves a playable spot on the smash bros. roster if you ask me. And yes that is getting special treatment you are right. But he didn't say a Namco character wasn't getting in the game. He said they weren't getting special treatment, because this is still a Nintendi all star game, and it would have to be a special situation to include a character non-nintendo. Well fella, Pac-man is about as special as a situation gets.

Pac-man earned the **** out of a spot in smash bros. if you ask me. He's one of the only ones who have.
I'm tired. Goodnight smash brothas

 

[Zhadgon]

New roster just for fun.

-) 32 Veterans.
-) 11 New Comers.
-) 1 "Phoenix Character" (bring back from the past).
-) Cuts: Toon Link, Lucario and Wolf.
-) 19 Classic series
-) 8 New series
-) 27 series represented in the game.

Total: 44 characters.

Decisions:
Why 44 characters?
My decision is because of the limitations of the 3DS and getting more characters than this number will be difficult to balance and work with it.

Why Tingle instead of Toon Link?
The first and main reason is because of his potential moveset (no more clone). Second, it has his following. Third, the inclusion of the stage Spirit Tracks where it shows Toon Link making it strange if he appear in the stage and in the fight. Fourth he has his own games making him like the Donkey Kong, Wario and Yoshi of Mario series but for Zelda series.

Why cut Toon Link, Lucario and Wolf?
Toon Link see reasons above. Lucario it was difficult decision he is interesting and unique but I feel if I need to choose between Mewtwo with new form or him probably will go with the first for popularity reasons (new movie, new type and highly requested to come back to the series) and finally Wolf, his moveset has to little changes from Fox and Falco and please no more Master Tanks (just joking... well not really) and other reason to consider there are other five series with only two characters, the only exceptions are Mario Bros, Zelda, Pokemon and Kirby, the first three because they are the Holy Trinity of Nintendo and need more representatives than other series (4 to be exactly) and Kirby because his three characters has different and unique movesets that make them pretty original and great to play.

Why Shulk?
He is a new character that represent the union between Nintendo and Monolith Soft, not only that, it was one of the best games to come to the Wii console (high popularity from east and west with a lot of reviews that praise the game as a gem of this generation), is a new franchise that seems to continue with more games (refer to "X" game for WiiU), finally he has a great move potential to add diversity to Smash.

Why Pacman?
Well for obvious reasons that Namco is working with Nintendo and is a Icon of the Videogame World (for the record he has appeared with Mario before in the arcade edition of Mario Kart some years ago).

Why not more characters for series like Mario Bros, DK, Zelda, Pokemon, Kirby, Fire Emblem, Star Fox and Earthbound?
I consider that the amount of characters that each series has is enough, if I start adding more characters from Mario, Zelda or Pokemon it will opaque the other characters from the different franchises and will unbalance the whole roster. Lets be honest is always great to see new faces and series in Smash.

Controversial decisions:
Who the F@#&K is Harry?
Ok first we need to learn a little bit of history, this character was from the game Teleroboxer that appear in 1995 for the Virtual Boy, the playstyle of it was like Punch Out!. The story is simple, Harry was created to fight against similar robots from around the world to become the champion (remember the movie Real Steel... yeah that one where Hugh Jackman controls a robot to box against other ones, well is the same story here instead of Atom is Harry and you are Hugh Jackman in the the game, sounds awesome, yeah, maybe... idk). So ok, you have explain the story and character but why choose to add him to the roster, it was a decision that I make seeing what Sakurai did with the previous games of the series, in SSB for N64 the obscure character from that game was Ness, for the SSBM for Gamecube it was Mr. Game & Watch and for SSBB for Wii it was ROB so seeing the pattern I get to the conclusion that the roster need a obscure character and at the same time make it like WTF who is it and from what console came, add that the only New IP from Nintendo for the Virtual Boy was this game, makes it one of the most strange and rare characters that can be included in the roster. Obviously this pick can be changed for personal preference some people will ask why don´t you change it for the Dog of Duck Hunt or maybe the Sheriff, I will say those choices are fine too.

Well this is for now, thanks for reading this and good luck.
.n_n.

 

[MasterOfKnees]

​

If Ridley is in he'll probably be a unlockable. Just personal opinion. Also Wolf and Lucas being cut for DLC is highly unlikely. Cutting a character simply because of priority isn't a good reason at all, and considering his importance to the franchise, is very unlikely. Lucas being Japan only isn't a point against him, since that's exactly why he got in. And considering the Japanese audience is the most important to Sakurai, he's safer than others.

Who would you cut instead of Lucas and Wolf then? Take into consideration that it'll always hurt more to remove unique characters than semi-clones, no matter how important the semi-clones are to their franchises. Falco and Luigi are the only semi-clones I consider safe, Luigi is obvious while Falco already won over Wolf in Melee as the Fox clone and is more popular in general than him.

And no, Sakurai checks all audiences, I'm not sure where the whole "Japan is best to Sakurai" mentality stems from, but it's not true.

 

[CalumG]

How was Sonic different than say Megaman? Both got in due to popularity. They both had to EARN their way into smash. Not special treatment.

Snake is a weird case. He got the special treatment.

Just for the record:

Spoiler

Here it is. It's low quality and it doesn't prove anything one way or the other, but the fact that Sonic was intended to be in Melee according to Naka, just like Snake was, surely implies on some level that Sonic did not get in on popularity polls alone. In fact, although some people mistakenly voted for third-parties on the pre-Melee polls, even Chocobo got a higher amount of votes than Sonic did at the time. So was Sonic put in Brawl purely out of popularity, or was it a combination of popularity, Sega/Nintendo's newfound borderline-sexual partnership, and cutting-room-floor ideas from Melee? Just stirring the pot here of course, but I think it throws into question the concept of popularity being a major factor for third-party inclusions.

I know popularity was a big factor in Sonic's inclusion, but I think we'd all do well to look at the third-party inclusions critically rather than just assuming they each got in for one reason and one reason only. Sonic was more than likely put in out of a combination of popularity and Sega's request, considering he was going to be included in Smash long before he was even included on most character polls.

 

[low tier user]

In my unrealistic wishlist roster, I have four Ganon characters:

View attachment 1810
-"Captain Ganon" from OOT and SSBM who mainly uses dark magic and has the Gerudo Dragon from Melee.

-Twilight Princess Ganondorf from SSBB who uses a combination of dark magic and the sword of the sages (and flame choke from Brawl)

-Wind Waker Toon Ganon who is speedy and uses swords and has a parry attack.

-Classic Pig Ganon who uses fire kneese and a trident.

Unlike Link and Toon Link, all these Ganons are the same person (not sure about classic Ganon, though), but Smash is not canon, so I'll excuse it.

----
Captain Ganon's luigified moveset:

Warlock Punch is the same as in Melee and Brawl, but if you press B before he fully charges the magic in his hand, he'll throw it out as a projectile, like in OOT. Makes him more unpredictable.

Gerudo Dragon remains similar, but it has an extra property from Raptor Boost. (haven't thought of it yet)

Dark Dive remains the same, but now Ganon spins his cape and reflects projectiles if you press B at the top of his jump. Pressing B after UP+B when using the move on the ground will also make him spin his cape instead of jumping.

Wizard's Foot remains similar to Falcon Kick, but it has an extra property to it. (haven't thought of it, either.)

His Final Smashes are either the earthquake punch, the homing magic attack, or his Ganon transformation. (would be like Giga Bowser)

----
As for Twilight Ganon's Flame Choke, it will be the same, but act more like an actual grab, allowing you to literally choke the life out of an opponent if you mash B after holding someone up.

Not sure if I should've used past tense or present tense for these ideas.

I like Melee Ganondorf better. Having him restored to his Melee self and bringing back Roy is not bad. I'd also like Dr. Mario. At least his down B isn't FLUDD.

 

[Swift Fox]