Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Kenith]

Hey, I know how to stop your arguing...
Ridley confirmed a Stage Hazard!

Spoiler

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Is Mr. L the star of his own series? Nope.
Is Mr. L a major character in the series he's in? Nope.

That aside, your comparison falls apart when you factor in that Mr. L is a separate character to Luigi while using the same body (much like Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde or Bruce Banner, Hulk, and Grey Hulk). As opposed to Mario using a medical alias while playing doctor or "Toon Link" being just Link from Wind Waker and Phantom Hourglass.
It also falls apart when....Toon Link and Dr. Mario were all in Smash already and Mr. L has not been.

The problem I have with Dr. Mario, is that he isn't nearly as important with Sakurai's reasoning for Toon Link. Mario doesn't need a second version of himself, because in 90% of his games, he's in his iconic red and blue.

When looking at Zelda, there are several games with a child Link. While they may not all be Toon Link, there are a fair share of games where he is a younger protagonist. Off the top of my head, I can think of...

OoT
Majora's Mask
Wind Waker
Phantom Hourglass
Spirit Tracks
Both Oracle games
ALBW
ALttP
...so on and so forth

Dr.Mario does not have the same prominence in the Mario series as a young version of Link does in the Zelda series. While the model of Toon Link may only be from two games, the idea of a "Toon/Young Link" embodies all Young Links.

At least that's how I look at it.

 

[Deleted member]

Preteen =/= adult.

Pre-teen =/= child either.
Never said Pre-teen was adult either, and how you got that out of my post shows you didn't actually read it.

Yeah, and this is also a 'persona' of Mario:

Uh, no. No it's not.
That's a power-up.

Ever watch American Dad? Those personas Roger goes into while dressing up? That's what Dr. Mario is to Mario.

 

[Louie G.]

Explain why Paper Mario is suddenly more iconic than Dr. Mario? Because he's more requested? Well then I guess Geno is more iconic than him too in that case.

Well I mean, aside from normal Mario, Paper Mario seems to be the Mario most associated with the character.
Not even from being requested or even Paper Mario being a popular game.
Paper Mario as a design is popular. Most casual gamers know Paper Mario, sometimes not even differentiating Mario from his paper form.
I'm sure they would probably look at Dr. Mario and say, "Why is Mario dressed like that?"
For us Smash players, Doc may be the most iconic. But for everyone else, Paper Mario and Mario are one in the same, so I'd go with Paper Mario.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

How about using Rally as a Down B to boost a stat? Or using a Bow and Arrow as a side B, and then using the Lance as both a stabbing and throwing attack, whether one be a Smash attack and one a special/tilt? Or having a stance change to have different moves aside from Falchion?

Then what about his smash attacks? And why does Chrom use different weaponry, but not Marth or Ike?

You lack vision, except when it fancies you. Just because it isn't iconic to Chrom, he can't use it?

I didn't say he can't use it. I said he wouldn't.

They only possible move he has that can be unique is a side special. You clearly aren't trying hard enough to come up with something.

Just because I tried super hard to give a clone source material that's barely significant to them or their character doesn't mean they are going to get it.

But of course Roy, who has Fire has waaaay more chance to be unique...

Yep pretty much.

It isn't iconic for Rosalina to use the Lumas to fight, yet she does it in game.

It's iconic to have Luma by her side.

It isn't iconic for the Villager to fight anybody, nor the Wii Fit Trainer.

What kind of defense is that?

It isn't iconic of Mario to do the Mario Tornado, but he does it anyway.

He had a spin attack in Super Mario World actually.

Doesn't matter what is iconic in Smash Bros. Sometimes Sakurai takes liberties.

Sometimes he does, but sometimes he doesn't. This is one of those situations when Sakurai usually doesn't.

You can't say he won't take liberties with Chrom just because you don't think there's any chance. Of course there is a chance. Just like Roy being only a semi-clone instead of completely original.

I never said he COULDN'T. You guys really like to connect wanting with predicting & doubting with denying possibility.

 

[Kenith]

Well I mean, aside from normal Mario, Paper Mario seems to be the Mario most associated with the character.
Not even from being requested or even Paper Mario being a popular game.
Paper Mario as a design is popular. Most casual gamers know Paper Mario, sometimes not even differentiating Mario from his paper form.
I'm sure they would probably look at Dr. Mario and say, "Why is Mario dressed like that?"
For us Smash players, Doc may be the most iconic. But for everyone else, Paper Mario and Mario are one in the same, so I'd go with Paper Mario.

Hey, we should have Peach Luigi as an alt for Luigi!

Also @ BluePikmin11 can you think of something else to talk about?

 

[Deleted member]

Pre-teen =/= child either.
Never said Pre-teen was adult either, and how you got that out of my post shows you didn't actually read it.



Uh, no. No it's not.
That's a power-up.

Ever watch American Dad? Those personas Roger goes into while dressing up? That's what Dr. Mario is to Mario.

Just for arguments sake, when you have personas, doesn't the original also count as one of these personas? It's like multiple personality disorder, when you wear so many masks, where does the real one begin and the fake one end?

Original Mario or, Plumber Mario is as much of a persona as Doc Mario is.

 

[Gunla]

Hello folks, anyone care to inform me of..

I see we're talking about Personas of Mario, because we've already got 5 Mario slots and a 6th isn't very likely, only slightly. I don't think we are getting any other Marios in Smash 4 other than plain old Mario. And Alts, that's a different story.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I posted a pic of original Mario and you said

That was Wing Mario in case you are blind too.

Look, quit getting so butthurt over nothing ok

Nobody here is getting butthurt. Please stop being a DD

 

[Deleted member]

You can want him all you like, but I'll tell you the same I tell Yuii, just cause you want him doesn't mean he's got any chance really... Especially not when Paper Mario is as popular as he is.

Except that:
a. I never argued about his likelihood.
b. His chances have everything to do with actual logic rather than my wanting of him. And logically, Rosalina put a fricking huge roadblock anyway.
c. The opposite holds true for you. Just because you don't want him doesn't mean he has no chance.
d. Paper Mario hasn't a snowball's chance in Hell when logic is applied, regardless of Dr. Mario's inclusion or not.

 

[Deleted member]

That was Wing Mario in case you are blind too.

No... that's normal Mario with a wing cap power up.

Nobody here is getting butthurt. Please stop being a DD

DD?

Spoiler

??

Well... I DO have the pigtails...

 

[Deleted member]

Just for arguments sake, when you have personas, doesn't the original also count as one of these personas? It's like multiple personality disorder, when you wear so many masks, where does the real one begin and the fake one end?

Original Mario or, Plumber Mario is as much of a persona as Doc Mario is.

So, OoT Zelda is as just as much a persona as Sheik?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

No... that's normal Mario with a wing cap power up.

And this is normal Mario with a doctor outfit.

But, that and Wing Mario is an alternate persona of normal Mario.

I'm just gonna end things right there, I don't really feel like arguing something like this.

 

[Deleted member]

d. Paper Mario hasn't a snowball's chance in Hell when logic is applied, regardless of Dr. Mario's inclusion or not.

Except, I don't see how Rosaline being in totally negates the likelihood that Paper Mario would show up as well. It's not like Lucario hurt Pokemon Trainer's chances? (or vice-versa, I forget which came first).

Paper Mario still has a better chance than Doc, like he always has.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Also @ BluePikmin11 can you think of something else to talk about?

How bout the chances of Porky replacing Lucas?

 

[Louie G.]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

How bout the chances of Porky replacing Lucas?

A flat out 0%.

 

[Deleted member]

So, OoT Zelda is as just as much a persona as Sheik?

Psychologically speaking, I don't see why not...

And this is normal Mario with a doctor outfit.
View attachment 5737

Exactly, and since normal Mario is already in, Doc is already in, and thus, doesn't need to be a seperate character, case closed, g'day to you sir.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Except, I don't see how Rosaline being in totally negates the likelihood that Paper Mario would show up as well. It's not like Lucario hurt Pokemon Trainer's chances? (or vice-versa, I forget which came first).

Usually you can't have more than 5 representatives, but not more than 5 characters. Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard are different characters, but together they are one representative: Pokemon Trainer.

Paper Mario still has a better chance than Doc, like he always has.

Except during Melee and Brawl.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Then what about his smash attacks? And why does Chrom use different weaponry, but not Marth or Ike? Irrelevant. This concept is to make Chrom unique from the first two. Why would all three do the same stuff?


I didn't say he can't use it. I said he wouldn't. You got proof of that?


Just because I tried super hard to give a clone source material that's barely significant to them or their character doesn't mean they are going to get it. See, this is exactly why I can't take you seriously. You call Chrom a clone, yet ROY WAS ALREADY A CLONE IN MELEE! WE DON'T EVEN KNOW IF CHROM WOULD BE A CLONE! It doesn't need to be significant. Is Mario's spin attack significant? Not really



Yep pretty much.


It's iconic to have Luma by her side. Yes, but not iconic to use them to fight for her.



What kind of defense is that? What kind of argument is "Chrom won't be unique" without having any proof that he won't?can't be?


He had a spin attack in Super Mario World actually. Maybe. But it isn't the same animation as the Mario Tornado, and it's just one thing to draw from, which is a similar case with Chrom or Roy.


Sometimes he does, but sometimes he doesn't. This is one of those situations when Sakurai usually doesn't. I have to ask. Do you know something about Sakurai's methodology that we all don't Saturn? You seem to know quite a bit of what goes on. Actually, that was what you claimed when you first came here, but then again, your roster has changed drastically since then. So basically, no, you don't know what he thinks, so this is a crock of bull****.


I never said he COULDN'T. You guys really like to connect wanting with predicting & doubting with denying possibility. No, it's because YOU tend to type your comments in a manner that makes it seem as if your opinion should be treated as fact, when clearly it isn't. Because, opinion's CAN'T be facts.

Responses in red.

 

[Baskerville]

Except during Melee and Brawl.

Except Doc had no chance of returning.

 

[Louie G.]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

 

[Kenith]

NO MORE DOCTOR MARIO!! How about we talk about Assist Trophies?

 

[Swamp Castle]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

This one's tough. On one hand, King K. Rool plays a bigger role in the Donkey Kong series, but he hasn’t been fulfilling that role as of late. Meanwhile, Dixie Kong has had more recent appearances (and by that I mean Tropical Freeze), but it would mean adding ANOTHER ape to the roster as opposed to someone more unique (not saying she'd be a clone, just that K. Rool has more moveset potential).

Until K. Rool makes a comeback, I'm going with Dixie.

(I don't blame you for trying to change the subject, this clone arguement is giving me a headache)

EDIT: Don't get me wrong, I'd love playing as K. Rool.

 

[Baskerville]

Doctor Mario Assist Trophy

 

[Deleted member]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

A flat out 0%.

I think we can easily get both Dixie and K.Rool, especially if Dixie pairs up with Diddy for a Duo-Stance character to make up for that empty slot Sheik is gonna leave with our transforming characters.

Think about it... Diddy+Dixie can do what Shielda don't.

Usually you can't have more than 5 representatives, but not more than 5 characters. Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Charizard are different characters, but together they are one representative: Pokemon Trainer.

>representatives

There's that word again...

I didn't know Smash Bros made up the Legislative Branch of the US government...

Except during Melee and Brawl.

Oh, RIGHT, cause Doc was totally in Brawl! I totally forgot. Silly me .

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

NO MORE DOCTOR MARIO!! How about we talk about Assist Trophies?

Oh ok.

What about Dr.Mario as an Assist Trophy?

 

[Deleted member]

Except, I don't see how Rosaline being in totally negates the likelihood that Paper Mario would show up as well. It's not like Lucario hurt Pokemon Trainer's chances? (or vice-versa, I forget which came first).

Paper Mario still has a better chance than Doc, like he always has.

Paper Mario never had a better chance.
If Sakurai considered Doc's return over Paper Mario in Brawl when the Paper Mario series was at its heyday (character decisions were made about a year after TTYD came out and with Super Paper Mario on the horizon) as opposed to pulling a Toon Link and having Paper Mario be intended as a replacement, there's no ****ing way that Paper Mario will get in now.
"Uniqueness" isn't valid of an excuse; Paper Mario is just as easy to turn into a clone as Dr. Mario, and Dr. Mario can be made unique as easily as Paper Mario can.

 

[Oniric Spriter]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

A flat out 0%.

Bring me dat crocodile, the fight of the 3 kings need to happen.

 

[Deleted member]

Except Doc had no chance of returning.

Bull. ****.

They were there until Rosalina came in.

 

[Louie G.]

Honestly, with the direction that Smash 4 is going in at this point, I wouldn't be surprised at all to see K. Rool get in over Dixie Kong.
Dixie Kong is more relevant, but K. Rool, even though he is somewhat expected, could be far more unique.

 

[Kenith]

I actually just finished my Assist Trophy roster. Here it is (I designed this with regards to my actual playable roster)

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

Bring me dat crocodile, the fight of the 3 kings need to happen.

You can do that already with bowser, dedede, and ganondorf

 

[YoshiandToad]

So how about that Dixie Kong?
Seriously, this is something I want to talk about.
Dixie wouldn't be as unique as the current newbies, so I'm worried about her chances right now.
K. Rool seems to be the most realistic option at this point actually.

If newcomers are getting in based on the way their games play as I read on these boards today...I'm actually not sure, but that dreaded Dixie-Diddy thing that gets suggested a lot could be how it goes down.

Although probably not with Diddy...I don't think Sakurai would screw with veterans playstyles that bad, I just don't know who she'd pair with....Cranky? Kiddy?

 

[Baskerville]

Bull. ****.

They were there until Rosalina came in.

. . . . . . . . .
Believe what you will I guess.

 

[Deleted member]

That reminds me, I often forget Ganondorf is technically a king.

. . . . . . . . .
Believe what you will I guess.

I believe in logic.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

You can do that already with bowser, dedede, and ganondorf

Mmm...

Ganondorf's title of King of Evil isn't exactly an official title...

Dedede and Bowser are literal kings.

Ganondorf while a leader, isn't.

 

[Swamp Castle]

I actually just finished my Assist Trophy roster. Here it is (I designed this with regards to my actual playable roster)

View attachment 5738

Three Fire Emblem assists? Dayum. I could argue about this roster, but I'd rather just compliment you on the inclusion of the Wrestler. Well done.

 

[Deleted member]

Mmm...

Ganondorf's title of King of Evil isn't exactly an official title...

Dedede and Bowser are literal kings.

Ganondorf while a leader, isn't.

He's the King of the Gerudo.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

He's the King of the Gerudo.

When is that stated though?

He leads them, yes, but I don't think he's ever called a king.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I actually just finished my Assist Trophy roster. Here it is (I designed this with regards to my actual playable roster)

View attachment 5738

I don't it's likely that Chrom will be an AT. That would piss off Awakening fans.