Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Knight Dude]

Toon Sheik will never excist, and if she did, she would instantly be the worst Lord, and have the most worthless Landmaster in the game. I wouldn't consider unlocking her even if she has immunity against Ghost attacks, cause with Nidoking, Sigurd and Lanky Kong in the lead, I have all my weaknesses covered.

Dude you need Metalman on your team too, he gets mad crits. And he also has a Dive Kick. Not to mention, Steel types are bulky as hell.

 

[?????????????]

Toon Sheik will never excist, and if she did, she would instantly be the worst Lord, and have the most worthless Landmaster in the game. I wouldn't consider unlocking her even if she has immunity against Ghost attacks, cause with Nidoking, Sigurd and Lanky Kong in the lead, I have all my weaknesses covered.

But you forgot to consider Bandana Dee, who is a Spear type and not only gets past Lanky's immunity, but is a 4x weakness. However, this would not work if you had a Toon Zelda on your team. She could even cover Sigurd's role since they are both Royal types. Also, her Landmaster is super-effective against Bandana Dees.

 

[Morbi]

Apparently none of these reasons were deterrents from Sakurai attempting to include her in the past. And to begin programming her, even if she was never completed implies Sakurai was well aware of these things even in the planning phase and still pushed ahead. These notions seem like they would better apply to a character Sakurai hadn't already given the green light.

Precisely, this is one of the notions that leads me to the conclusion that he is incompetent. As stated several times, those were merely circumstantial assertions, none of them were definitive. However, one would hope with 5 plus years that he realizes that the premise was indeed horrible. I also think it is significant to note that he didn't add them, plans are just that. I prefer to analyze the objective facts, Toon Zelda was excluded (regardless of his intent).

The circumstances are entirely different for this game. It is a new console, a new generation of gaming, and the desire to utilize Smash as a console-seller is more prominent. So including a double-clone from a series that most deem complete seems unlikely in this iteration. I don't care what he was thinking 6 years ago, none of that is relevant currently (obviously it is a good indicator, the results seem negligible though).

 

[?????????????]

Oh, pish posh. There's always going to be people who complain about ANY character addition. People complained about WFT. People complained about Toon Link. People would complain about Ridley. People would complain about Toon Zelda. People would complain about K. Rool or Dixie or Cranky or Chrom or Roy or Pac-Man or Mii.

Doesn't matter. People will buy the game anyway.

 

[Morbi]

Oh, pish posh. There's always going to be people who complain about ANY character addition. People complained about WFT. People complained about Toon Link. People would complain about Ridley. People would complain about Toon Zelda. People would complain about K. Rool or Dixie or Cranky or Chrom or Roy or Pac-Man or Mii.

Doesn't matter. People will buy the game anyway.

That was most likely what he was thinking 6 years ago when he tried to add his favorite character, Toon Zelda.

 

[FlareHabanero]

What kind of idiot is going to complain about Ridley?

 

[?????????????]

What kind of idiot is going to complain about Ridley?

Shokio and anyone who agrees with Shokio. That's a lot of Miiverse kids.

 

[Morbi]

What kind of idiot is going to complain about Ridley?

Probably most people who didn't want him in the game.

 

[Autumn ♫]

I think I may know why Toon Zelda and Toon Sheik were considered for Brawl, back during Brawl's development the two art styles between the normal characters and the Toon characters were pretty emphasized and had big fans following both sides, so thus Sakurai decided to have Toon Zelda and Sheik along with Toon Link to contrast regular Zelda and Sheik and Link.

If that makes sense whatsoever.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Shokio and anyone who likes Shokio. That's a lot of Miiverse kids.

Probably most people who didn't want him in the game.

What kind of disgusting world do we live in if people cannot even appreciate violent space dragons?

 

[shinhed-echi]

Bah, if anything, this game needs nothing but new blood. For variety's sake, and to prove to all the naysayers that Nintendo doesn't run exclusively on Mario and Zelda, which is a common misconception.

Bring in the Mac, bring in Shulk, Isaac, Saki, or someone from Fossil Fighters. Doesn't matter if the franchise sells well, if it had many games, or if it's obscure as heck.
It's about time we get a truckload of NEW faces, or forgotten ones. Anything that steers away from Mario and Zelda at least.

 

[?????????????]

What kind of disgusting world do we live in if people cannot even appreciate violent space dragons?

We've reached a tragic point where we have elementary school level kids who are saying, "No, I do not want to play as a dragon." That is truly sad.

 

[Zhadgon]

Oh please no, I prefer the idea of Dixie, Roy or even Pichu before Toon Zelda / Toon Sheik / Tetra. Anyway what would you prefer King K. Rool or Ridley or Porky or Ganon (A Link to the Past)?

.n_n.

 

[N3ON]

Precisely, this is one of the notions that leads me to the conclusion that he is incompetent. As stated several times, those were merely circumstantial assertions, none of them were definitive. However, one would hope with 5 plus years that he realizes that the premise was indeed horrible. I also think it is significant to note that he didn't add them, plans are just that. I prefer to analyze the objective facts, Toon Zelda was excluded (regardless of his intent).

The circumstances are entirely different for this game. It is a new console, a new generation of gaming, and the desire to utilize Smash as a console-seller is more prominent. So including a double-clone from a series that most deem complete seems unlikely in this iteration. I don't care what he was thinking 6 years ago, none of that is relevant currently (obviously it is a good indicator, the results seem negligible though).

Incompetent in your opinion or not, all those points are based on the chance he's reconsidered, none of them are actually grounded in anything more than a possibility we have no proof will even happen.

And yeah, Toon Zelda didn't end up making the cut, but if he was going to count up how many reps Zelda now had, or think about the fact that Toon Sheik didn't actually exist, or really any of those points, it would've happened before the actual implementation and programming started. Again, it's really just basing it on the chance that she passed the initial green light, when all these problems were just as apparent, yet when the programming started (which isn't generally the stage characters get cut for conceptual reasons, usually just time constraints or programming issues) Sakurai suddenly realized all these problems and decided to cut her. That's not very likely, and really is just a guess, it's hardly enough to definitively say that will keep her out of future games.

Also, I don't see how including a double-clone from a series that most deemed complete back during Brawl times isn't a problem (and even if it is - it still was attempted - so it wasn't a problem to Sakurai), but now, after Toon Zelda has only continued to re-appear is now a problem. If anything it should've been a bigger problem then, not now.

Lastly, Sakurai's opinions, especially opinions we have absolutely no proof have changed are of course relevant. He's still making Smash games, isn't he? Plus he often includes characters and ideas he wasn't able to include previously.

Toon Zelda does have some points against her, but to argue reasons Sakurai has looked past only to say "He's probably changed his mind. Plus she didn't make it - that proves he didn't want her after all. No matter, what Sakurai attempts in past Smash games isn't relevant to future Smash games." isn't the best approach, considering it's all predicated on guesswork. If you prefer to analyze the objective, you shouldn't focus so much on unfounded possibilities.

 

[Morbi]

Oh please no, I prefer the idea of Dixie, Roy or even Pichu before Toon Zelda / Toon Sheik / Tetra. Anyway what would you prefer King K. Rool or Ridley or Porky or Ganon (A Link to the Past)?

.n_n.

That is a tough one, K. Rool or Ridley? Um... I have to go with the purple space dragon. I need the villain for my new main!

 

[Deleted member]

*laughs* That would be pretty impossible. I guess if we worked really hard we could make it happen, would you care if he was slow?

Still, his innitial reaction was nothe****way.

Improper context.

Question being asked: "There was a rumor at one point about Ridley being playable. Was that ever a consideration?"

Sakurai's response: "I think that would probably be pretty impossible. [Laughs] If we had put our best efforts into it, we may have been able to do it. But he might have been a little slow. Would that be all right? [Laughs]"

The context is not that he doesn't see Ridley working (though it wouldn't matter if it was; remember that Sakurai pulled a complete 180 in regards to Villager "not being suited for battle"), but rather that the notion about Ridley ever being considered is non-existent in a grammatically bizarre way (though that may be the fault of the translator; it would be better if we knew his original Japanese words). Followed by a statement that it could have been possible if it was seriously considered, though Ridley would have been slow (for balance purposes) with a coy question of approval.

As for the laugh intervals, he's a very laugh-happy man and laughs quite a bit in that Nintendo Power interview, not at just the Ridley part. Even the Iwata Asks interview for Brawl, Sakurai breaks into laughter a lot.
It isn't really wise to make any serious connotation out of it.

 

[Sobreviviente]

Who is the most requested zelda character? who is the most likely choice? im sure is toon zelda/tetra. If is not she, it must be a SS character, and those guys will be forgeted next gen.

The only problem with her is being a clone, otherwise, there is no real reason to exclude her, except the fact that she is a zelda character and we dont need another one.

 

[FlareHabanero]

We've reached a tragic point where we have elementary school level kids who are saying, "No, I do not want to play as a dragon." That is truly sad.

Oh right, I forgot kids want to play as the bald space marines these days.

Confound it, back in my days kids gravitated towards the BIG SCAWY DWAGON characters like a bunch of ants seeing candy.

 

[?????????????]

Oh right, I forgot kids want to play as the bald space marines these days.

 

[Knight Dude]

What kind of disgusting world do we live in if people cannot even appreciate violent space dragons?

Tell me about it. I would be all for Space Dragons! But the truth is, pretty much any character will have detractors anyhow. I don't know why exactly Ridley's are the most notable.

All I know is that a single character, Megaman made me hype for this game, I can still look at his trailer and get excited to fight with him. So I imagine it would be the same for Space Dragons and Gun-toting Crocodiles.

Seriously man, we need Bowser vs Ganondorf vs Ridley vs King K. Rool to happen someday.

 

[Deleted member]

Patrick Stewart for Smash.

 

[Morbi]

Incompetent in your opinion or not, all those points are based on the chance he's reconsidered, none of them are actually grounded in anything more than a possibility we have no proof will even happen.

And yeah, Toon Zelda didn't end up making the cut, but if he was going to count up how many reps Zelda now had, or think about the fact that Toon Sheik didn't actually exist, or really any of those points, it would've happened before the actual implementation and programming started. Again, it's really just basing it on the chance that she passed the initial green light, when all these problems were just as apparent, yet when the programming started (which isn't generally the stage characters get cut for conceptual reasons, usually just time constraints or programming issues) Sakurai suddenly realized all these problems and decided to cut her. That's not very likely, and really is just a guess, it's hardly enough to definitively say that will keep her out of future games.

Also, I don't see how including a double-clone from a series that most deemed complete back during Brawl times isn't a problem (and even if it is - it still was attempted - so it wasn't a problem to Sakurai), but now, after Toon Zelda has only continued to re-appear is now a problem. If anything it should've been a bigger problem back during Brawl times.

Lastly, Sakurai's opinions, especially opinions we have absolutely no proof have changed are of course relevant. He's still making Smash games, isn't he? Plus he often includes characters and ideas he wasn't able to include previously.

Toon Zelda does have some points against her, but to argue reasons Sakurai has looked past only to say "He's probably changed his mind. Plus she didn't make it - that proves he didn't want her after all. No matter, what Sakurai attempts in past Smash games isn't relevant to future Smash games." isn't the best approach, considering it's all predicated on guesswork. If you prefer to analyze the objective, you shouldn't focus so much on unfounded possibilities.

Again; allow me to reiterate for the 4th time. Those were just circumstantial notions that I felt like drafting up to articulate my thoughts, nowhere did I ever proclaim that they have any bearing on her chances. Take them with a grain of salt.

Secondly, the entire premise of my argument is based on Smash 4. Not Brawl.

Lastly, we do have proof. That proof is common-sense. People tend to change their minds during half a decade. The is no objective proof; however, we can look at characters that he deemed impossible such as Villager to indicate that his ideas have radically shifted. I never stated that he decided against Toon Zelda, that was your assumption. I actually believe that he simply ran out of time which is why I clarified with my "(regardless of intent)".

The only evidence for Toon Zelda is that she was planned 6 years ago, she wasn't included, just planned. This is relevant to me, it doesn't have to mean anything to you.

Sorry if that came of as rude, I am slightly annoyed at the unfounded accusations. Do I truly need evidence to enjoy speculation? If we did, no one would be a member as we had nothing aside from our assumptions.

 

[Zhadgon]

Seriously man, we need Bowser vs Ganondorf vs Ridley vs King K. Rool to happen someday.

Thats a fight I would play 100 times in a row without being tired of it.

.n_n.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Did you draw that yourself or did you get it from somewhere?
It's based off the "pony shrug" pic.

Oh please no, I prefer the idea of Dixie, Roy or even Pichu before Toon Zelda / Toon Sheik / Tetra. Anyway what would you prefer King K. Rool or Ridley or Porky or Ganon (A Link to the Past)?

.n_n.

Toon Sheik is indeed vomit-worthy, but why Tetra?

-----
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[KingofPhantoms]

What kind of idiot is going to complain about Ridley?

Shokio

Smashbro99

Nessokman

And a whole bunch a Miiverse, GameFAQs, and Youtube users.

 

[FinalStarmen]

Thats a fight I would play 100 times in a row without being tired of it.

.n_n.

Woah there Ridley, what are you doing to King K. Rool?

Shokio

Smashbro99

Nessokman


And a whole bunch a Miiverse, GameFAQs, and Youtube users.

You can potentially add 4chan to this prestigious list of honorable mentions. although I may be assumptiously mistaken.



EDIT: Everytime I post, I receive a cautionary message stating there is a "server error", and that I have to refresh the page. When done so, the post goes through as normal. Has anybody else had this technical issue?

 

[TempahRelapse]

Who is the most requested zelda character? who is the most likely choice? im sure is toon zelda/tetra. If is not she, it must be a SS character, and those guys will be forgeted next gen.

The only problem with her is being a clone, otherwise, there is no real reason to exclude her, except the fact that she is a zelda character and we dont need another one.

Not a 100% sure but I think Tingle is more requested. I see him in sigs more often.

 

[BKupa666]

Today's pic reminds me: why does Miiverse overflow with "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts when Skull Kid is shown with a caption that labels him an assist trophy, but when Yellow Devil is shown with no such caption, there are no "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts whatsoever?

Pic of the day goes in, Miiverse spew goes out...sometimes. You can't explain that.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Pic of the day goes in, Miiverse spew goes out...sometimes. You can't explain that.

 

[N3ON]

Today's pic reminds me: why does Miiverse overflow with "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts when Skull Kid is shown with a caption that labels him an assist trophy, but when Yellow Devil is shown with no such caption, there are no "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts whatsoever?

Pic of the day goes in, Miiverse spew goes out...sometimes. You can't explain that.

Probably because
1) Yellow Devil has been shown before without character fanfare, Skull Kid's pic was the first time he was shown
2) The picture didn't focus solely on Yellow Devil like it did Skull Kid
3) Yellow Devil is too big (No but for real, we wouldn't get a playable character whose default is that big)
4) A lot more people were wanting/expecting a playable Skull Kid than Yellow Devil
5) Reading requires more brain cells than many people on Miiverse have

Next time we get an AT revealed of a character people wanted playable, it's going to be the whole "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" all over again.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

Today's pic reminds me: why does Miiverse overflow with "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts when Skull Kid is shown with a caption that labels him an assist trophy, but when Yellow Devil is shown with no such caption, there are no "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" posts whatsoever?

Skull Kid probably got the "ZOOMG NEW CHARACTER" post overflow because many people focus so much on the picture that they don't even bother to read the caption before posting.

With the Yellow Devil...dunno, I guess it's either by chance, or many Miiverse users think he is too big. (yeah...I'd bet that they probably think THAT is his only obstacle of getting in.......)

 

[YoshiandToad]

3) Yellow Devil is too big (No but for real, we wouldn't get a playable character whose default is that big)

This.

Incidentally from what little time I've experienced on Miiverse so far, I asked what were the weirdest suggestions for playable characters of the Miiverse users. Here's the list I recieved:

"dillion from dillions rolling west"
"=John Cera="
"slenderman"
"CoD soldier"
"Hatsune Miku"
"ridley from metroid"
"Batman"
"Definitely Ridley. He is one character I can guarantee will never become playable."
"Cave Johnson"
"someone said Mario's mom XD"
"Jeff the Killer. They were serious about it too."

Dillon and Ridley made the list, yet Goku, Naruto, Ichigo and the thousand Sonic suggestions never got a mention. A very different community indeed.

 

[Baskerville]

It should've been obvious to people in the the Megaman trailer.

 

[shrooby]

"someone said Mario's mom XD"

Pretty sure Mama Mario would just be a clone of Mario. I mean, in the Super Show they're both played by Lou Albano!

And technically it wouldn't even be adding another female to the roster!

 

[Depressed Gengar]

... Do I even want to know what's been going on in this thread?

 

[Gunla]

Batman isn't THAT out there....

But no, No Yellow Devil. We got one MM rep, that's ALL we are getting. At this point, if we don't get another reveal, expect the next direct to have some. At this point Nintendo is dangling it at us, like tiny, adorable kittens.

 

[Chandeelure]

Well,no reveal today,that means a Christmas reveal or a Nintendo Direct soon.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Thats a fight I would play 100 times in a row without being tired of it.

.n_n.

Put in Classic Ganon instead of Ganondorf, and you got yourself a truly big battle in your hands.

 

[FalKoopa]

I think Yellow Devil is a confirmed Stage Hazard now.

And now I'm over 7000 posts, folks.

 

[shinhed-echi]

I do think Yellow Devil is a stage hazard, but his attack is a little too much imo.
I remember that stage hazards in the past were limited to a small part of the screen (Saffron City), (Jungle Japes), (New Pork City).
But Yellow Devil basically takes over the entire platform. O.o
I'll have to prove my Megaman expertise everytime I fight on it.