Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Bowserlick]

Mach Rider Moveset

Mach Rider has a redesign. His armor is more futuristic looking and bulkier. This is because Mach Rider can transform himself into a motorcycle just like Samus can morph into a ball. Mach Rider in normal form is only slightly above average in running speed, but as propulsion jets on his calves for accelerated moves. He also holds a massive energy shooting chaingun. The chaingun mounts onto the driver's seat when he morphs into a motorcycle. In normal form he has a fast medium roll, but a lousy spot dodge. His dodge in mid-air is average. His speed comes in his other mode where it can be difficult to handle. Expect to drive off the stage multiple times before you get the hang of his intense speed.

Specials
Down B Motorcycle Mode: Armor transforms into a motorcycle with a chain-gun turret on the driver seat. Can use specials and drive back and forth. This mode as one low jump, but with fast air speed that travels further depending on how fast the bike is going. A press of A or Down B exits this mode.

B Chain Gun: Holds gun forward, which spins and delivers ten energy shots in a short burst. Does 10 percent damage. If the enemy is close enough, the shots will cause stun and some knock-back.

Motorcycle Chain Gun: The chain gun is mounted on the driver's seat. B causes the gun to fire a burst. Can be used while moving.

UP B Materialization: Explodes into fragments and materializes a short distance in any direction. If B is pressed during the sequence, Mach Rider will rematerialize as his bike.

Motorcycle Materialization: Explodes into fragments and materializes a short distance in any direction. If B is pressed during the sequence, Mach Rider will rematerialize in normal form.

Side B Mach Engine: Does a short burst in the direction pressed and grabs at the end. If the opponent is grabbed, Mach Rider's jets on his armor will fire and he and the opponent will travel half the distance of Fox's Illusion. Mach Rider will jump off and upwards at the end.

Motorcycle Mach Engine: Jets will fire for a big burst of speed. Can be very dangerous to use. While it can have big KO potential, it knocks the enemy in the opposite direction the bike is traveling.


Ground Attacks
A Mach 1, Mach 2, Mach 3: Delivers three quick punches in succession with one press of the A button.

Dash A Hit-and-Run: Delivers a knee to the enemy.

Side A Chain Gun Backhand: Delivers a backhand with his massive chaingun.

Down A Kneecap Punch: Crouches down on one knee. Punches forward with a press of A. Could cause the opponent to trip.

Up A Chain Gun Uppercut: Delivers a rising uppercut with his chain gun.

Forward Smash Turbo Punch: Mach Rider shoots forward, slightly off the ground a good distance and delivers a punch. (Similar in stats to Wolf's Forward Smash).

Down Smash Donut: Sticks out a braced elbow, fires jets, and rotates in a circle leaving skid marks on the ground. Good clear away move with good knockback).

Up Smash Highway to Heaven: Does a fist pump while holding his chain gun in a vertical-fashion. Hits opponent straight up. If it connects, the gun fires quickly sending five gun shots toward the sky.

Aerial Attacks
Neutral A: A fast flip kick with limited knockback.

Forward A: Swings his gun forward and downwards with both hands. Can Meteor Smash.

Back A: Jets fire sending a massive spray of sparks backwards. First use propels Mach Rider forwards. Good for racking up damage.

Down A: Slams his chain gun straight down as it rotates and fires a burst of five shots. Meteor Smash.

Up A: Flips upside down, bends legs, and kicks straight up. Can be charged.

Throws
Pummel: Headbutts.

Forward Throw: Slams gun in chest, launching them at a 45 degree angle and fires five scattered shots.

Down Throw: Shoulders his chaingun, throws the enemy to the floor and machine gun punches them with both fists until they pop upwards.

Back Throw: Dematerializes and rematerializes behind them to deliver a punch.

Up Throw: Bends his knees and extends legs quickly as he throws the enemy straight up.​

 

[N3ON]

Except he's a random and comparatively poor choice. Especially since a new transforming character isn't a necessary prerequisite for each roster iteration. (and even if it was there are more likely choices)

 

[TumblrFamous]

Then in that case, Chrom wouldn't be replacing Ike, but rather outprioritizing him.

When I say "replace", I don't really mean the type of replace like Young Link-Toon Link. But generally, yes, I meant outprioritize. There's no real reason to REPLACE a character this time around.

 

[Chandeelure]

I don't see a scenario where it's likely that Sheik gets cut. However, if I were to just go into personal feelings with the Legend of Zelda series...

I like Impa a lot and I would not care at all if Sheik were cut. Then again, I would not care at all if either Jigglypuff or Ness were cut.

You're dead to me.

 

[Zhadgon]

When I say "replace", I don't really mean the type of replace like Young Link-Toon Link. But generally, yes, I meant outprioritize. There's no real reason to REPLACE a character this time around.

Except Lucario with Mewtwo .
.n_n.

 

[Morbi]

I don't see a logical reason to remove Sheik. However, if I were to just go into personal feelings with the Legend of Zelda series...

I like Impa a lot and I would not care at all if Sheik were cut. Then again, I would not care at all if either Jigglypuff or Ness were cut.

Precisely, everyone has their preconceived notion of what the ideal roster comprises of. Obviously every character has their devoted fan-base, that is exactly why Sakurai is going to have a difficult time attempting to cut a character. He has to look at the "metaphysical (for lack of a better word) aspects" of each selection. Honestly, I think most people wouldn't mind seeing Jigglypuff or Ness go (unless they main the characters and/or maintain the "purist" perspective). However, they both offer some unique aspects to the roster. So it becomes a balancing act. This is where is gets extremely arbitrary, it is up to Sakurai to pick who makes the cut based on: development time, popularity, personality, move-sets, what the character offers, etc.

I wouldn't mind if they cut the retro-characters that were not received well (Game and Watch or ROB). They mean something to Nintendo though... so who knows really?

 

[N3ON]

Well the only ones that I could think that are more deserving for a spot based in how unique they are, their gameplay and the universe they come from is the Wars Series (Famicom Wars, Advance Wars, Battalion Wars, etc.), Starfy, Golden Sun and Punch Out! that are still not represented with a playable character.

.n_n.

One could also make the argument for Xenoblade, and compared to Baten Kaitos even Custom Robo and Sin & Punishment. And especially Mii. Plus with a retro series, three existing new series already added, perhaps another third-party series, and the four you mentioned, you can see why Kalas is pretty far down the line. Not to say he wouldn't be an interesting addition, just that... it's not in the cards.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Except Lucario with Mewtwo .
.n_n.

NO! Lucario deserves to be in the game! He has merits to stay!

Why not both?

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Nobody should be cut for anyone, period.

When I say "replace", I don't really mean the type of replace like Young Link-Toon Link. But generally, yes, I meant outprioritize. There's no real reason to REPLACE a character this time around.

Fair enough.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Nobody should be cut for anyone, period.

Pretty much. People think that some characters deserve to be cut, but realistically, they've all left an impression on the roster. They're all great and have no real reason to be legitimately cut, like the way we saw happen to Pichu and Young Link.

 

[?????????????]

You're dead to me.

Ha ha... I've gotten a lot of flak before for saying that

To me...Ness and Lucas both fulfill the same role and nearly the same exact abilities in their respective games, which are both part of the same series, but MOTHER 3 is the newer installment and the better game. Not to mention that Lucas was apparently meant to replace Ness back in Melee; Ness is lucky MOTHER 3 was cancelled at the time. If he weren't a tradition at this point, he might not be back.

But now, I seriously doubt either Ness or Lucas will be leaving. If someone DID leave, it's probably more likely to be Lucas. Though I'd prefer to keep him over Ness.

 

[Morbi]

Nobody should be cut for anyone, period.



Fair enough.

That is not the way it works unfortunately.

NO! Lucario deserves to be in the game! He has merits to stay!

Why not both?

I do agree with you to an extent... and then I remembered that Jigglypuff is in the game, while Meowth rots in a hole.

 

[?????????????]

...I still want Meowth...

 

[Zhadgon]

One could also make the argument for Xenoblade, and compared to Baten Kaitos even Custom Robo and Sin & Punishment. And especially Mii. Plus with a retro series, three existing new series already added, perhaps another third-party series, and the four you mentioned, you can see why Kalas is pretty far down the line. Not to say he wouldn't be an interesting addition, just that... it's not in the cards.

Hehe... I see what you did there, yeah I hope at least Sakurai could bring us a nice surprise, there still a lot of options and interesting characters from series that have not been represented that could bring something unique and interesting to the game, he could bring this characters to inject some new blood and get the gears of the game rolling with an awesome flavor, I´m expecting low count of new characters probably nine more so I hope at least some of those choices are from series that deserve a spot like Punch Out!, Mii, Wars, Costume, Sin and Punishment or others.
.n_n.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Ha ha... I've gotten a lot of flak before for saying that

To me...Ness and Lucas both fulfill the same role and nearly the same exact in their respective games, which are both part of the same series, but MOTHER 3 is the newer installment and the better game. Not to mention that Lucas was apparently meant to replace Ness back in Melee; Ness is lucky MOTHER 3 was cancelled at the time. If he weren't a tradition at this point, he might not be back.

But now, I seriously doubt either Ness or Lucas will be leaving. If someone DID leave, it's probably more likely to be Lucas. Though I'd prefer to keep him over Ness.

I love Lucas, and I'm pretty meh towards Ness, but if either of them left I'd be so sad.

 

[Morbi]

I love Lucas, and I'm pretty meh towards Ness, but if either of them left I'd be so sad.

I love Lucas, and I'm pretty meh towards Ness, but if either of them left, I'd be so happy.

...I still want Meowth...

Yes, this notion alone proves that importance to a series is highly irrelevant.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Except he's a random and comparatively poor choice. Especially since a new transforming character isn't a necessary prerequisite for each roster iteration. (and even if it was there are more likely choices)

I personally think his (underlooked) series deserves a revival the most, just like Takamaru and Lip. And I know a transformation character isn't a requirement, I just wanted to mention him when it came to transformation characters.

 

[Zhadgon]

NO! Lucario deserves to be in the game! He has merits to stay!

Why not both?

Because I can´t see Pokemon getting 7 playable characters in a roster of 45 playable characters and besides Lucario was one of the blandest character addition to Brawl (the Pokemon is great I love it but his moveset... "was terrible and the mechanic didn't help").
.n_n.

 

[Morbi]

Because I can´t see Pokemon getting 7 playable characters in a roster of 45 playable characters and besides Lucario was one of the blandest character addition to Brawl (the Pokemon is great I love it but his moveset... "was terrible and the mechanic didn't help").
.n_n.

However, what if Pokemon Trainer was replaced by Charizard? Would that be more ideal?

 

[N3ON]

Because I can´t see Pokemon getting 7 playable characters in a roster of 45 playable characters and besides Lucario was one of the blandest character addition to Brawl (the Pokemon is great I love it but his moveset... "was terrible and the mechanic didn't help").
.n_n.

To be fair we were going to get 7 playable Pokemon characters in a roster of 40.

 

[TumblrFamous]

I love Lucas, and I'm pretty meh towards Ness, but if either of them left, I'd be so happy.

 

[?????????????]

Because I can´t see Pokemon getting 7 playable characters in a roster of 45 playable characters and besides Lucario was one of the blandest character addition to Brawl (the Pokemon is great I love it but his moveset... "was terrible and the mechanic didn't help").
.n_n.

Where is 7 coming from? I don't know your roster, but mine is:
-Pikachu
-Jigglypuff
-Trainer
-Mewtwo
-Lucario

..Unless you're counting "transformations" as separate entities.

While transformation characters may take up the same amount developmental time or whatever, the character is still encompassing to one idea. Sheik is a part of Zelda. The Pokemon are a part of the Trainer. Zero Suit Samus is just Samus in another outfit. These characters do nothing to expand the representation of that series. They're parts of one character.

That's the way I see it anyway.

 

[Zhadgon]

However, what if Pokemon Trainer was replaced by Charizard? Would that be more ideal?

I´m pretty "Meh" to the inclusion of PKMN Trainer in Brawl, I never used it and was really confused about the whole mechanic and for me it was a completely mess maybe if Sakurai could improve a much better version I will play it more but for now I think PKMN Trainer with all three or no one at all.

To be fair we were going to get 7 playable Pokemon characters in a roster of 40.

But we didn't get 7 playable Pokemon in Brawl so for now I will wait and see but I think the ideal balance would be Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Mewtwo and Pokemon Trainer.

.n_n.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I really see no reason to remove or cut down Pokemon Trainer. It represents the main character(s) of the series. This is a very unique mechanic introduced in Smash and it gives us a lot of variety in terms of Pokemon. I feel that the trainer and his starters are deserving beyond belief regardless of popularity and it's actually nice we don't have to just have massively popular Pokemon.

I don't believe for second that Sakurai would tear apart a character for any reason no matter how overrated Charizard is. Either keep the character together or don't put it in at all. Besides it would make it weird for the next game.

 

[TumblrFamous]

Where is 7 coming from? I don't know your roster, but mine is:
-Pikachu
-Jigglypuff
-Trainer
-Mewtwo
-Lucario

..Unless you're counting "transformations" as separate entities.

While transformation characters may take up the same amount developmental time or whatever, the character is still encompassing to one idea. Sheik is a part of Zelda. The Pokemon are a part of the Trainer. Zero Suit Samus is just Samus in another outfit. These characters do nothing to expand the representation of that series. They're parts of one character.

That's the way I see it anyway.

Sakurai has said the Trainer counts as three fighters, and the way we interpret that is up to us frankly.

I view it the same I guess. They count as characters, and count as separate development-wise. But in all, they're one entity. Like Morbid said, however, I'm all for having Charizard on his own. Takes away the unique factor, but I'd be fine with it.

 

[Zhadgon]

Where is 7 coming from? I don't know your roster, but mine is:
-Pikachu
-Jigglypuff
-Trainer
-Mewtwo
-Lucario

..Unless you're counting "transformations" as separate entities.

While transformation characters may take up the same amount developmental time or whatever, the character is still encompassing to one idea. Sheik is a part of Zelda. The Pokemon are a part of the Trainer. Zero Suit Samus is just Samus in another outfit. These characters do nothing to expand the representation of that series. They're parts of one character.

That's the way I see it anyway.

But not as how Sakurai see it and a playable character is a playable character even if it shares the spot with one, two, three or more characters, so for now 6 is the magic number nothing more, nothing else.
.n_n.

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

Because I can´t see Pokemon getting 7 playable characters in a roster of 45 playable characters and besides Lucario was one of the blandest character addition to Brawl (the Pokemon is great I love it but his moveset... "was terrible and the mechanic didn't help").
.n_n.

Well, we got 6 in a roster of 35. That's about a sixth of the roster. 7 in a roster of 45 actually lowers the average of Pokemon characters.

 

[?????????????]

Charizard is my favorite Gen 1 starter and all, but what I don't like about the lone Charizard is that...well...I think it's just unfair to people who DIDN'T pick Charmander as their starter. They can't be the Trainer they are if they don't have that choice.

I remember being disappointed that Blaziken was the only Gen 3 with a Mega Evolution. Sceptile is my favorite...

 

[TumblrFamous]

I remember being disappointed that Blaziken was the only Gen 3 with a Mega Evolution. Sceptile is my favorite...

Sucks for you because Blaziken's my favorite Pokemon!

 

[?????????????]

But not as how Sakurai see it and a playable character is a playable character even if hi shares the spot with one, two, three or more characters so for now 6 is the magic number nothing more, nothing else.
.n_n.

If Sakurai didn't view the character as one entity, he wouldn't have included a stamina system that forces you to switch.

 

[Zhadgon]

Well, we got 6 in a roster of 35. That's about a sixth of the roster. 7 in a roster of 45 actually lowers the average of Pokemon characters.

But as a developer I prefer to put more resources in getting a better balance between all the series (big, medium and small) than going crazy with one alone, especially if say Second Party is a pain in the ass to work with and don´t let me use the characters until is approved and is worse than even using Third Party characters (obviously I´m referring to Game Freak).

.n_n.

 

[Curious Villager]

I would have liked to see a Mega evolution for Sceptile and Swampert as well... :T

 

[Izingo]

I don't understand when people say lucario out prioritized Mewtwo. If anything The pokemon trainer's development of 3 characters left little time for mewtwo.

 

[N3ON]

But we didn't get 7 playable Pokemon in Brawl so for now I will wait and see but I think the ideal balance would be Pikachu, Jigglypuff, Mewtwo and Pokemon Trainer.

.n_n.

No we didn't end up getting seven, but it was Sakurai's intention that we would, so now that the roster's only bigger and the character that just missed it last time has new momentum behind him (as well as all the Brawl veterans having a pretty decent chance of sticking around), it definitely wouldn't be too much to assume Sakurai will still want seven total, and will actually be able to implement them all.

Plus even though your opinion of Lucario is less than stellar doesn't mean others share that opinion. His popularity and prevalence have once again spiked, which can only mean promising things for his chances.

I don't understand when people say lucario out prioritized Mewtwo. If anything The pokemon trainer's development of 3 characters left little time for mewtwo.

If Lucario didn't out-prioritize Mewtwo we would've gotten Mewtwo and not Lucario.

 

[TumblrFamous]

I would have liked to see a Mega evolution for Sceptile and Swampert as well... :T

Yeah... I would've liked that as well. Imagine a Grass/Dragon Sceptile. Oh, that makes me shake.

So, what do you all think the chances are for a character reveal this week? I'm guessing a solid 5%.

I don't understand when people say lucario out prioritized Mewtwo. If anything The pokemon trainer's development of 3 characters left little time for mewtwo.

Well sure, it wasn't Lucario that solely outprioritized Mewtwo, but he was a factor. The two Pokemon newcomers outprioritized him.

 

[Zhadgon]

If Sakurai didn't view the character as one entity, he wouldn't have included a stamina system that forces you to switch.

A broken mechanic that force yourself in switching is not convenient (and I hope in the future is removed or better handled) if that is the case why Zelda and Sheik, Samus and ZSS don´t use the stamina system too?
.n_n.

 

[?????????????]

A broken mechanic that force yourself in switching is not convenient (and I hope in the future is removed or better handled) if that is the case why Zelda and Sheik, Samus and ZSS don´t use the stamina system too?
.n_n.

It'd be redundant if they all used the same system.

 

[Zhadgon]

No we didn't end up getting seven, but it was Sakurai's intention that we would, so now that the roster's only bigger and the character that just missed it last time has new momentum behind him (as well as all the Brawl veterans having a pretty decent chance of sticking around), it definitely wouldn't be too much to assume Sakurai will still want seven total, and will actually be able to implement them all.

Plus even though your opinion of Lucario is less than stellar doesn't mean others share that opinion. His popularity and prevalence have once again spiked, which can only mean promising things for his chances.



If Lucario didn't out-prioritize Mewtwo we would've gotten Mewtwo and not Lucario.

And this time I can see Mewtwo out-prioritize Lucario, the only way I can see Lucario coming back is that late in the development of the game they couldn't include a character and need to pick up one really quickly.
.n_n.

 

[?????????????]

And this time I can see Mewtwo out-prioritize Lucario, the only way I can see Lucario coming back is that late in the development of the game they couldn't include a character and need to pick up one really quickly.
.n_n.

Really? Because Lucario has only gotten MORE popular and has had MORE prominent roles since being introduced.

 

[Curious Villager]

Yeah... I would've liked that as well. Imagine a Grass/Dragon Sceptile. Oh, that makes me shake.

So, what do you all think the chances are for a character reveal this week? I'm guessing a solid 5%.

Yeah I suppose, Mega Swampert would also have been pretty interesting, then again. The Blazikinite was an item that is unobtainable through normal play, perhaps there may exist a "Sceptilite" and "Swamperite" megastones as well but has yet to be released until a future event? :/ I don't know..... probably not likely though.

Not sure we will be seeing a character this week though unless we have another Peach + Toon Link month in our hands....