Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[FalKoopa]

not cutting frenzy. Realistic Roster size expectations. 40 to 45 characters is all that there is.

Realism =/= Pessimism.

 

[drag0nscythe]

What makes you sound ridiculous is the fact that you act like you know that these characters will not return, when you see something like WFT come to fruition you should maybe stop and think hey, maybe we dont know anything really....

But we can see the seed of Wii Fit Trainer. Sakurai said during Brawl that he liked to add WTF characters because adding in the typical crowd would be boring. No one expected her and that is exactly what Sakurai wanted. He has also said that he wants to bring everyone back, but will not have the time to. Given that, and adding in new characters. There will be people that are left behind.

Lucina should get in because shes a girl? Really? That's your reasoning?

That's pretty bad reasoning. She would be the EXACT same as Marth, in both appearance, and assumably her fighting style. As far as I know, Ike is one of the most popular lords of the series. He is not considered "old" to most of the Smash fanbase.

The problem with people "accepting" your thought process, is that your logic is inconsistent. The "old hat" argument could be used on several characters. Yet it isn't used against Marth, Jigglypuff, Ganondorf etc... You can't use an argument for one character and then not have it apply to the other.


I'm assuming you haven't played Awakening, and if you haven't I would recommend that you don't say Lucina would be a good choice. While it is an opinion, saying she would be different is far from the truth. Everything about her was based off of Marth, literally. Ike looks nothing like Marth, has a different personality, uses a different type of sword, and has a different playstyle in Smash. He is not a clone at all.

Marth is poster of FE.
Jigglypuff is from SSB64. Those 12 are untouchable.
Ganondorf is part of the holy trinity. Toon Ganon is a better choice though.
Any others?

Not 100%, but I believe that Ike in Smash plays different from Ike in RD and the other one he was in.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Lucina should get in because shes a girl? Really? That's your reasoning?

That's pretty bad reasoning. She would be the EXACT same as Marth, in both appearance, and assumably her fighting style. As far as I know, Ike is one of the most popular lords of the series. He is not considered "old" to most of the Smash fanbase.

The problem with people "accepting" your thought process, is that your logic is inconsistent. The "old hat" argument could be used on several characters. Yet it isn't used against Marth, Jigglypuff, Ganondorf etc... You can't use an argument for one character and then not have it apply to the other.

I'm assuming you haven't played Awakening, and if you haven't I would recommend that you don't say Lucina would be a good choice. While it is an opinion, saying she would be different is far from the truth. Everything about her was based off of Marth, literally. Ike looks nothing like Marth, has a different personality, uses a different type of sword, and has a different playstyle in Smash. He is not a clone at all.

...You won here.

Also yes, Ike is basically the 2nd most popular Lord at least. Not Old Hat in the slightest.

 

[FalKoopa]

But we can see the seed of Wii Fit Trainer. Sakurai said during Brawl that he liked to add WTF characters because adding in the typical crowd would be boring. No one expected her and that is exactly what Sakurai wanted. He has also said that he wants to bring everyone back, but will not have the time to. Given that, and adding in new characters. There will be people that are left behind.

Either show proof that you work for Sakurai, or GTFO.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

SOMEBODY PLEASE END THIS DISCUSSION! IT'S GOING NOWHERE! THIS IS POINTLESS! He has no idea what he's talking about and is clearly either trolling or under the influence. I just want to talk about roster predictions. Pleas Mario Sonic, Ask that this discussion take place in a thread about character cutting. Anything!

 

[Frostwraith]

@drag0nscythe: Kindly shut up if you don't know what you're talking about.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

But we can see the seed of Wii Fit Trainer. Sakurai said during Brawl that he liked to add WTF characters because adding in the typical crowd would be boring. No one expected her and that is exactly what Sakurai wanted. He has also said that he wants to bring everyone back, but will not have the time to. Given that, and adding in new characters. There will be people that are left behind.



Marth is poster of FE.
Jigglypuff is from SSB64. Those 12 are untouchable.
Ganondorf is part of the holy trinity. Toon Ganon is a better choice though.
Any others?

Not 100%, but I believe that Ike in Smash plays different from Ike in RD and the other one he was in.

Marth isn't the poster boy for Fire Emblem, ANNA is, at least in Japan.

But Jigglypuff is "old hat". Shouldn't she be gone?

Ganondorf is more of a clone that Ike and Lucario, yet he is not put there. Not to mention, he wasn't in Skyward Sword. Is this "old hat" too?

On that last bit, Mario plays differently in his many games than he plays in Smash. That point matters for nothing.

 

[Banjodorf]

Oh! This sounds like another person like Noah. Sweeeeet.~

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Oh! This sounds like another person like Noah. Sweeeeet.~

I have more credibility for Noah now. No joke.

@drag0nscythe: Kindly shut up.

Fixed.

Alright, so here's my question: If you were doing the roster, what direction would you prefer? Let's say you have to pick only one. More new franchise characters, or more characters added to current franchises? Be minded, if you say pick more new franchise characters, a few (Very slim though) could be added to more characters with current franchises and vice-versa.

I want to actually see some really interesting posts on this.

 

[drag0nscythe]

@drag0nscythe: Kindly shut up if you don't know what you're talking about.

I do.
That seems to be the problem.

Why is cuts so scary to everyone? We know it will happen. Every fighting game runs into it. We also know that he said he will try his best, but not everyone will return. Adding new characters will also take from his time.

Like I said before, 40-45 characters will be the limit.

We know the usual crew will appear and we know who have low priority compared to newer characters, games, etc. It is all very logical.

I have more credibility for Noah now. No joke.



Fixed.

Alright, so here's my question: If you were doing the roster, what direction would you prefer? Let's say you have to pick only one. More new franchise characters, or more characters added to current franchises? Be minded, if you say pick more new franchise characters, a few (Very slim though) could be added to more characters with current franchises and vice-versa.

I want to actually see some really interesting posts on this.

More new franchises. Most series that already have characters have reached their limit and people are just fishing for new reps at this point. Waddle Dee is not a good character.

I think new franchises and characters are best. I would rather have a game with resources spent on new characters and a final roster of say 36 then a game with as many crammed in with a total of 50.

 

[Banjodorf]

Fixed.

Alright, so here's my question: If you were doing the roster, what direction would you prefer? Let's say you have to pick only one. More new franchise characters, or more characters added to current franchises? Be minded, if you say pick more new franchise characters, a few (Very slim though) could be added to more characters with current franchises and vice-versa.

I want to actually see some really interesting posts on this.

Is this a general question? If it was me, I'd do more characters for current franchises, (i.e. Donkey Kong, Metroid, FE, Pokemon, KI, Mother, etc.) However, I'd also add Little Mac, Takamaru and Isaac to rep new series. Maybe Shulk too. Definitely going to be heavier on the returning franchises, though.

That seems to be the problem.

Why is cuts so scary to everyone? We know it will happen. Every fighting game runs into it. We also know that he said he will try his best, but not everyone will return. Adding new characters will also take from his time.

Like I said before, 40-45 characters will be the limit.

We know the usual crew will appear and we know who have low priority compared to newer characters, games, etc. It is all very logical.

Alright listen, you're pulling alot of logic out of your ass. I know you're probably just another who thinks they're being clever or "insightful", but honestly, shut it.

For one thing, you know none of this, and you're making assumptions based in incorrect citations. Here's a couple points you're missing, champ:

1. Did we have any cuts after 64? No. Your statement about "Every fighting game runs into it" is aready invalid, and no amount of assinine presumption will save you there.

2. Sakurai said "If we have to." Is it possible? Sure. Is it 100% going to happen? No. By the way, Sakurai said he was pretty happy with the way the Brawl roster turned out. And the article that says "Not all characters will return" included all characters in the series. There are those out there that thing Y. Link, Pichu and Doc should return. He was most likely referring to them, as he didn't specifically say Brawl.

You also say "His" time like he's some kind of one-man messiah. In general, I don't know what you're trying to do with this post, but you're just coming off as a moron.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Is this a general question? If it was me, I'd do more characters for current franchises, (i.e. Donkey Kong, Metroid, FE, Pokemon, KI, Mother, etc.) However, I'd also add Little Mac, Takamaru and Isaac to rep new series. Maybe Shulk too. Definitely going to be heavier on the returning franchises, though.

A general question. I want to see detailed responses. In Brawl and Melee we got more representatives to current series.

It's a hard bite, really.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Like I said before, 40-45 characters will be the limit.

No, this is the problem.

You say "this is just my opinion", but then say this!

Hypocrisy at it's finest.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Claiming that something is right is not a true fact unless the original source or person says so.

 

[MagnesD3]

I do.
That seems to be the problem.

Why is cuts so scary to everyone? We know it will happen. Every fighting game runs into it. We also know that he said he will try his best, but not everyone will return. Adding new characters will also take from his time.

Like I said before, 40-45 characters will be the limit.

We know the usual crew will appear and we know who have low priority compared to newer characters, games, etc. It is all very logical.

When comparing smash to a normal fighting game that is your mistake, smash is about representing a history while most fighters just consist of popular character choices mixed with some new characters when they make a sequel, smash expands itself with trying not to cut anyone, sakurai even tried to include dr. mario in ssbb (which is a poor choice.) so he doesnt even want to cut the characters that arent really needed, at most we will get 2 character cuts 3 if something goes wrong.

 

[Frostwraith]

I do.
That seems to be the problem.

Why is cuts so scary to everyone?

You yourself admitted you hated Fire Emblem and didn't know anything about it, so NO, you don't ****ing know what you're talking about regarding Ike and Marth.

Why would I be afraid of cuts? Does it look like so in this post below?

The reason I don't post here as frequently as before is because of the insane debates between cut-happy people and people defending that there will be no cuts at all.

I consider both possibilities. I cannot guarantee that the roster will have cuts, nor I can't guarantee that all veterans will return.

Anyway, stop making assumptions like you know what will happen.

I'm not going to argue with you anymore. It seems that logic is a foreign concept to you. At this point, I think you're trolling. That's why I'm not feeding you anymore.

 

[FalKoopa]

Alright, so here's my question: If you were doing the roster, what direction would you prefer? Let's say you have to pick only one. More new franchise characters, or more characters added to current franchises? Be minded, if you say pick more new franchise characters, a few (Very slim though) could be added to more characters with current franchises and vice-versa.

Hm. I'd prefer to add more new franchises. We have a good number of smaller franchises that do not have a single rep yet. Golden Sun, Najo no Murasame Jo, Xenoblade, Chibi Robo, other retro reps, etc. Most of the franchises already in Smash are quite well represented at this point.

 

[drag0nscythe]

When comparing smash to a normal fighting game that is your mistake, smash is about representing a history while most fighters just consist of popular character choices mixed with some new characters when they make a sequel, smash expands itself with trying not to cut anyone, sakurai even tried to include dr. mario in ssbb (which is a poor choice.) so he doesnt even want to cut the characters that arent really needed, at most we will get 2 character cuts 3 if something goes wrong.

Or more depending on how many new characters Sakurai wishes to add.

Alright, so here's my question: If you were doing the roster, what direction would you prefer? Let's say you have to pick only one. More new franchise characters, or more characters added to current franchises? Be minded, if you say pick more new franchise characters, a few (Very slim though) could be added to more characters with current franchises and vice-versa.

I want to actually see some really interesting posts on this.

Also. Repost of this, mainly so it did not get lost. He asked a question so.


More new franchises. Most series that already have characters have reached their limit and people are just fishing for new reps at this point. Waddle Dee is not a good character.

I think new franchises and characters are best. I would rather have a game with resources spent on new characters and a final roster of say 36 then a game with as many crammed in with a total of 50.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Waddle Dee is not a good character.

Hey, that's something we can agree on.

Just keep an open mind when people critique your posts, okay?

 

[FalKoopa]

Why is cuts so scary to everyone? We know it will happen. Every fighting game runs into it. We also know that he said he will try his best, but not everyone will return. Adding new characters will also take from his time.

I'll say it one last time.

Brawl's roster was perfect. EACH AND EVERY character in it earned their spot based on his/her own merits.

It's something that can only be added to. Replacing a character will degrade the quality of the roster. It's not difficult to understand this.

 

[Banjodorf]

Or more depending on how many new characters Sakurai wishes to add.



Also. Repost of this, mainly so it did not get lost. He asked a question so.


More new franchises. Most series that already have characters have reached their limit and people are just fishing for new reps at this point. Waddle Dee is not a good character.

I think new franchises and characters are best. I would rather have a game with resources spent on new characters and a final roster of say 36 then a game with as many crammed in with a total of 50.

Well trust me, you're in the minority. Characters are what sell the game, like it or not. And did you miss the part where Sakurai said "He didn't want to hurt the fans of the character he cuts, and that factors into his decision?"

Besides, 35 fit into Brawl, but the resources are much larger these days.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Why are we not posting in the back room guys? This is a complete waste of time and is only pissing me off. Seriously. Let's just drop it. All of us. This is not getting anywhere.

 

[Frostwraith]

Why are we not posting in the back room guys? This is a complete waste of time and is only pissing me off. Seriously. Let's just drop it. All of us. This is not getting anywhere.

I agree. He's just a troll who wants attention. No sane person would use logic as demented as his.

 

[drag0nscythe]

Hey, that's something we can agree on.

Just keep an open mind when people critique your posts, okay?

Have been keeping an open mind. I see everyone else going "OH NO! 40 Characters. It is not possible. Never. No Cuts." I would say everyone needs to be more open minded to the situation. All the series have capped out more or less. Adding any more to the series already available is scraping the bottom of the barrel at this point. Let the new shine in. That is why replacements, etc. work in the same manner.

I'll say it one last time.

Brawl's roster was perfect. EACH AND EVERY character in it earned their spot based on his/her own merits.

It's something that can only be added to. Replacing a character will degrade the quality of the roster. It's not difficult to understand this.

Brawls roster was not perfect. If anything, the biggest complaint aside from tripping was the roster. When it was first released everyone went "What?". really? Also, finish my comment for you in the next section.

Well trust me, you're in the minority. Characters are what sell the game, like it or not. And did you miss the part where Sakurai said "He didn't want to hurt the fans of the character he cuts, and that factors into his decision?"

Besides, 35 fit into Brawl, but the resources are much larger these days.

More resources yes. But only 2 or so years of development. Maybe 3. When did they finish KI:U? And they also have to re-add all older characters and change them. Add what ever new thing he is thinking off, etc.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Oh. Well I think Mewtwo will be in his X & Y form the whole time. There is no point in having an alternate form if it's more powerful, then you'd be that form the whole time. Plus if he uses that as his main form we can count him as an X/Y rep.

The formes are going to have their own distinct pros and cons. For example, Normal Forme Mewtwo would be much heavier than its Awakened Forme, along with have a stronger shield resistance, albeit not being as powerful offensively.

The scenario is not too different from that of Zelda and Sheik, with Sheik being much more nimble, while Zelda has more attacks that pack a bigger punch.

 

[FalKoopa]

Brawls roster was not perfect. If anything, the biggest complaint aside from tripping was the roster. When it was first released everyone went "What?". really? Also, finish my comment for you in the next section.

Yeah. The biggest complaint was that the ROSTER WAS SMALLER THAN WHAT PEOPLE EXPECTED. Ironically.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

This is my final post on this topic, because this is all I have left to say.

Sakurai has NOT ONCE guaranteed that there will be cuts. So the idea that they will definitely happen needs to be taken out of this argument.

Sakurai has already stated that there won't be as many additions as in past games. The argument that he would get rid of some to include more is knocked out by this. Brawl added a little over 15 I believe. Brawl's roster, currently at 39, could add 10, which is almost half of Brawl's additions, and would be at a total of 49. Not to mention, even 12 additions would be less than Brawl.

That's my last comment on this. Let's please change the subject.

 

[drag0nscythe]

The formes are going to have their own distinct pros and cons. For example, Normal Forme Mewtwo would be much heavier than its Awakened Forme, along with have a stronger shield resistance, albeit not being as powerful offensively.

The scenario is not too different from that of Zelda and Sheik, with Sheik being much more nimble, while Zelda has more attacks that pack a bigger punch.

That is how I saw it. I akin it to what many Deoxys fans always wanted.

Mewtwo Normal could be average stats and medium knock back.
Mewtwo X could be very fast and easy to send slying.
Mewtwo Y could be very slow and hard to smash away.

But not change the animations of B moves. I think that would add some really good strategy if done correctly.

Yeah. The biggest complaint was that the ROSTER WAS SMALLER THAN WHAT PEOPLE EXPECTED. Ironically.

True, but given the time it takes to develop games, it is still probable to have about 40-45 characters.

Just for BS sake, lets say that it takes 3 months to add in a new character and only 1 month to re-add a character. If he wants to desperately add in 4 new characters, then an entire year is lost. and we are out of 12 or so characters.

This is not a perfect example at all, but it stresses my point. By adding in new characters, older ones will be left behind. These characters are "cut" due to time. Not on purpose, just cut due to time.

He will make a list of all the characters in order to add back to the game. Those on the bottom must fear the ax.

This is my final post on this topic, because this is all I have left to say.

Sakurai has NOT ONCE guaranteed that there will be cuts. So the idea that they will definitely happen needs to be taken out of this argument.

Sakurai has already stated that there won't be as many additions as in past games. The argument that he would get rid of some to include more is knocked out by this. Brawl added a little over 15 I believe. Brawl's roster, currently at 39, could add 10, which is almost half of Brawl's additions, and would be at a total of 49. Not to mention, even 12 additions would be less than Brawl.

That's my last comment on this. Let's please change the subject.

He has also not once guaranteed that everyone will return.

 

[greenluigiman2]

Yeah. The biggest complaint was that the ROSTER WAS SMALLER THAN WHAT PEOPLE EXPECTED. Ironically.

This^

 

[Banjodorf]

More resources yes. But only 2 or so years of development. Maybe 3. When did they finish KI:U? And they also have to re-add all older characters and change them. Add what ever new thing he is thinking off, etc.

Melee already had a shorter development time than Smash 4, by about 3 months. Melee was a 13 month cycle, and KI:U was finished in early Feb. 2012. Do the math.

Brawl only had a longer dev time because of Sonic delays and the like. That won't happen this time, I can almost guarantee it.

 

[josh bones]

Waddle Dee is not a good character.

.

Drag0nscythe, you're fired

 

[MagnesD3]

The formes are going to have their own distinct pros and cons. For example, Normal Forme Mewtwo would be much heavier than its Awakened Forme, along with have a stronger shield resistance, albeit not being as powerful offensively.

The scenario is not too different from that of Zelda and Sheik, with Sheik being much more nimble, while Zelda has more attacks that pack a bigger punch.

Im still hoping that Mewtwo's new form will be earned in some fashion, so that he will have better hitboxes, speed, priority, etc. basically just become better in every regard until he is KO'd and then returns to normal form where you have to earn the awakened form again.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Hey, Smash 4 Backroom people, let's use the backroom more. I'm dead serious.

 

[Frostwraith]

Hey, Smash 4 Backroom people, let's use the backroom more. I'm dead serious.

Jones has already posted there and so did I.

 

[3Bismyname]

i had an interesting conversation with a friend of mine about who i'd add or cut if i were Sakurai. i know this is kind of random but I wanted to post it. This is how I would make Smash 4.

When dealing with the franchises we already have repped. the first question is just who could actually use one or two more characters. Personally, while I do think series like Legend of Zelda and Kirby do deserve the extra character, it's not necessary. We have the core characters and while I'm sure ppl would appreciate characters like Waddle Dee, Vaati, or another Toon character, they would be a low priority at best given the characters already included. As far as cuts would go I could imagine Toon Link getting cut but I find him far too important in order to represent the 2 different types of Links (The young and adult versions). And if you believe a character like Toon Gandandorf or Vaati would be included if he was left out then you’re delusional.

This applies Mario as well. Mario is the number one series for Nintendo, I don't think anyone would debate that. But we have the core characters involved already. And with the spinoff series like Yoshi and Warioware being repped they arguably have the most characters depending on how you wanna look at it. Anyone else is just icing really and not crucial or scream "add me." Now I would consider adding Paper Mario as his own franchise, similar to Dr Mario. But unlike Doc, he would be far more unique. I realize there's a want for characters like Toad, Bowser Jr and even Waluigi is there, however Waluigi is really a character I feel most people would be ok with me skipping. Toad is definitely an important character to the series, however from a gameplay standpoint there's nothing i see in him that makes him standout. many of his moves would be derived from what Mario & Luigi are capable of within the games unless we wanna get really creative with him. And while Jr is definitely a character who holds a fair amount of prominence within the series and could easily be unique by comparison to Bowser, I feel that Paper Mario would be more interesting personally and could technically represent his own series. But if I were to add another character who is purely Mario based, it would probably be Jr.

Pokemon is another story in itself. It has the largest pool of possibilities than any other series in Smash. Gen repping isn't important. However, to limit the series to only the first gen is negligible. It doesn't represent the series as a whole. It would be like having Fire Emblem Characters who only appeared in the first game. Lucario solves that problem while still being one of the more popular Pokemon within the series. So his inclusion won't be unwarranted. Mewtwo seems to be in a must re-add situation. With gen 6 on the way and no real viable fighters with the exception of the new Mewtwo form, he seems to be a near shoe-in. I personally would like Zoroark or Genesect in Smash. However, neither character has become overtly popular to the point that anyone would be legitimately upset with their exclusion. Pokeballs are also the best way to represent Pokemon of other gens if a viable fighter doesn't pan out. Pikachu is a must stay and Jigglypuff seems essential to Smash personally. And as far as the Pokemon trainer is concerned, replacing him with another gen trainer is just flat out not an option. Given that the PKMN trainer we have has easily some of the most iconic and popular pokemon on his team, and any replacement would be a significant downgrade.

Donkey Kong warrants a third character. Frankly I would've added Diddy back in Melee and probably K. Rool for Brawl. But what's done is done. and as of right now Dixie looks to be standing the best in terms of a new character. Yoshi and Wario don’t really need one. I would consider a character like Mona for Wario but she’d be a low priority, probably ending up in my own version of the “Forbidden 7.”.

Starfox has the viability for an additional character. The popularity of the series is the question. I myself have never been a huge fan of the series, but it’s definitely not in as great a standing as it used to be. That being said, cutting characters like Wolf and Falco make little sense to me. They are both not only important to the series, but as far as I can tell were very well received additions to Smash. Especially Falco within Brawl. Krystal would be my next choice if it were to get a new character. But it’s not necessary.

Metroid needs Ridley. Second most reacurring character in the series and he’s heavily requested.
I also feel Kid Icarus could include Palutena. Don’t really have much more to say on that.


Fire Emblem warrants 3 characters. Sakurai felt this back in Brawl. The series has really picked up steam and has become somewhat of a staple and has more than enough viable choices. The real question is who and that’s a debate for another time.

Now as far as Ice Climbers, R.O.B, and G&W are concerned, they should all stay. They are all immensely unique and have no real reasons to be excluded imo. Can they be expanded… not really. Arguably Ice Climbers has a viable fighter or two but they aren’t necessary in the slightest and are really just common enemies anyway.

Series that I’d leave alone include F-Zero, Mother, Pikmin.

But now to talk about new series. I would personally add characters who
A. A)Have a strong reacurring and well received series
B. B)are iconic to Nintendo
C. C)Appear to have a strong future (I know that’s a hard thing to judge but it can be done)
D. d)Add diversity

So personally I would look at series like Advance/Famicon/Gameboy/Battalion Wars, Punch Out and the Wii series first.
The War series I feel warrants a character for its long string of games alone. None of which were poorly received as far as I can tell. And adding a character to Smash would probably increase interest in the series much like Melee did for Fire Emblem. For the most part a character from this series would def fit in categories A and D and arguably category B. As to who would be added, that’s another debate. I would like Grunt myself but characters like Andy make sense as well. Now I could imagine Sakurai skipping over the series again, I personally wouldn’t but that’s just me.

Little Mac could’ve made it as a Retro pick I think. He stands a better chance as new series rep though having some of the most well liked games of the generations where it was present. He fits categories A and B to me and even D considering he’s a traditional fighter in an untraditional fighting game. Most people agree so moving on.

Like it or not the Wii series fits pretty much all these categories that I find important and deserves representation. Which Sakurai appeared to agree on seeing as he’s already included Wii Fit Trainer. I personally would’ve chosen the Miis but maybe they are still in. Who knows.

Animal Crossing definitely deserved the rep. Not much to say on that.

Characters like Shulk I would personally skip since he appears to not have a strong future since X appears to have nothing to do with him or his series, but we’ll see. He’s not really iconic to Nintendo to any capacity but yeah I would just skip him as a character, not as an assist trophy though. I would choose Dillon however cause I feel that that series could have a good future. He definitely adds diversity and has been pretty well received as far as I can tell. He’d be more of an interest pick on my part.
Retros are harder to judge so let’s just skip that.

And as far as Third party characters are concerned, to me they should not only be strong gaming icons, but also should have a fair amount of history with Nintendo. I’d have Pac-Man and Megaman. I’d probably even drop Sonic and Snake and have them exclusive to Brawl personally. Something to make them more special.


But whatever that’s how I’d do it. I know this may not be exactly how Sakurai thinks, nor is it exactly what everyone else agrees with, but that’s how I would look at choosing characters for Smash.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Jones has already posted there and so did I.

I'm going to start making threads there later tonight/tomorrow and start using that more, especially if people hop on board with me.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

[quote="drag0nscythe, post: 15608737, member: 71857"



He has also not once guaranteed that everyone will return.[/quote]

This is my point though. Neither side can prove it. So stop acting like you know they will happen. Go ahead and say you don't mean it like that, but it certainly is coming across that way.

 

[drag0nscythe]

i had an interesting conversation with a friend of mine about who i'd add or cut if i were Sakurai. i know this is kind of random but I wanted to post it. This is how I would make Smash 4.

When dealing with the franchises we already have repped. the first question is just who could actually use one or two more characters. Personally, while I do think series like Legend of Zelda and Kirby do deserve the extra character, it's not necessary. We have the core characters and while I'm sure ppl would appreciate characters like Waddle Dee, Vaati, or another Toon character, they would be a low priority at best given the characters already included. As far as cuts would go I could imagine Toon Link getting cut but I find him far too important in order to represent the 2 different types of Links (The young and adult versions). And if you believe a character like Toon Gandandorf or Vaati would be included if he was left out then you’re delusional.

This applies Mario as well. Mario is the number one series for Nintendo, I don't think anyone would debate that. But we have the core characters involved already. And with the spinoff series like Yoshi and Warioware being repped they arguably have the most characters depending on how you wanna look at it. Anyone else is just icing really and not crucial or scream "add me." Now I would consider adding Paper Mario as his own franchise, similar to Dr Mario. But unlike Doc, he would be far more unique. I realize there's a want for characters like Toad, Bowser Jr and even Waluigi is there, however Waluigi is really a character I feel most people would be ok with me skipping. Toad is definitely an important character to the series, however from a gameplay standpoint there's nothing i see in him that makes him standout. many of his moves would be derived from what Mario & Luigi are capable of within the games unless we wanna get really creative with him. And while Jr is definitely a character who holds a fair amount of prominence within the series and could easily be unique by comparison to Bowser, I feel that Paper Mario would be more interesting personally and could technically represent his own series. But if I were to add another character who is purely Mario based, it would probably be Jr.

Pokemon is another story in itself. It has the largest pool of possibilities than any other series in Smash. Gen repping isn't important. However, to limit the series to only the first gen is negligible. It doesn't represent the series as a whole. It would be like having Fire Emblem Characters who only appeared in the first game. Lucario solves that problem while still being one of the more popular Pokemon within the series. So his inclusion won't be unwarranted. Mewtwo seems to be in a must re-add situation. With gen 6 on the way and no real viable fighters with the exception of the new Mewtwo form, he seems to be a near shoe-in. I personally would like Zoroark or Genesect in Smash. However, neither character has become overtly popular to the point that anyone would be legitimately upset with their exclusion. Pokeballs are also the best way to represent Pokemon of other gens if a viable fighter doesn't pan out. Pikachu is a must stay and Jigglypuff seems essential to Smash personally. And as far as the Pokemon trainer is concerned, replacing him with another gen trainer is just flat out not an option. Given that the PKMN trainer we have has easily some of the most iconic and popular pokemon on his team, and any replacement would be a significant downgrade.

Donkey Kong warrants a third character. Frankly I would've added Diddy back in Melee and probably K. Rool for Brawl. But what's done is done. and as of right now Dixie looks to be standing the best in terms of a new character. Yoshi and Wario don’t really need one. I would consider a character like Mona for Wario but she’d be a low priority, probably ending up in my own version of the “Forbidden 7.”.

Starfox has the viability for an additional character. The popularity of the series is the question. I myself have never been a huge fan of the series, but it’s definitely not in as great a standing as it used to be. That being said, cutting characters like Wolf and Falco make little sense to me. They are both not only important to the series, but as far as I can tell were very well received additions to Smash. Especially Falco within Brawl. Krystal would be my next choice if it were to get a new character. But it’s not necessary.

Metroid needs Ridley. Second most reacurring character in the series and he’s heavily requested.
I also feel Kid Icarus could include Palutena. Don’t really have much more to say on that.


Fire Emblem warrants 3 characters. Sakurai felt this back in Brawl. The series has really picked up steam and has become somewhat of a staple and has more than enough viable choices. The real question is who and that’s a debate for another time.

Now as far as Ice Climbers, R.O.B, and G&W are concerned, they should all stay. They are all immensely unique and have no real reasons to be excluded imo. Can they be expanded… not really. Arguably Ice Climbers has a viable fighter or two but they aren’t necessary in the slightest and are really just common enemies anyway.

Series that I’d leave alone include F-Zero, Mother, Pikmin.

But now to talk about new series. I would personally add characters who
A. A)Have a strong reacurring and well received series
B. B)are iconic to Nintendo
C. C)Appear to have a strong future (I know that’s a hard thing to judge but it can be done)
D. d)Add diversity

So personally I would look at series like Advance/Famicon/Gameboy/Battalion Wars, Punch Out and the Wii series first.
The War series I feel warrants a character for its long string of games alone. None of which were poorly received as far as I can tell. And adding a character to Smash would probably increase interest in the series much like Melee did for Fire Emblem. For the most part a character from this series would def fit in categories A and D and arguably category B. As to who would be added, that’s another debate. I would like Grunt myself but characters like Andy make sense as well. Now I could imagine Sakurai skipping over the series again, I personally wouldn’t but that’s just me.

Little Mac could’ve made it as a Retro pick I think. He stands a better chance as new series rep though having some of the most well liked games of the generations where it was present. He fits categories A and B to me and even D considering he’s a traditional fighter in an untraditional fighting game. Most people agree so moving on.

Like it or not the Wii series fits pretty much all these categories that I find important and deserves representation. Which Sakurai appeared to agree on seeing as he’s already included Wii Fit Trainer. I personally would’ve chosen the Miis but maybe they are still in. Who knows.

Animal Crossing definitely deserved the rep. Not much to say on that.

Characters like Shulk I would personally skip since he appears to not have a strong future since X appears to have nothing to do with him or his series, but we’ll see. He’s not really iconic to Nintendo to any capacity but yeah I would just skip him as a character, not as an assist trophy though. I would choose Dillon however cause I feel that that series could have a good future. He definitely adds diversity and has been pretty well received as far as I can tell. He’d be more of an interest pick on my part.
Retros are harder to judge so let’s just skip that.

And as far as Third party characters are concerned, to me they should not only be strong gaming icons, but also should have a fair amount of history with Nintendo. I’d have Pac-Man and Megaman. I’d probably even drop Sonic and Snake and have them exclusive to Brawl personally. Something to make them more special.


But whatever that’s how I’d do it. I know this may not be exactly how Sakurai thinks, nor is it exactly what everyone else agrees with, but that’s how I would look at choosing characters for Smash.

Interesting. I would say that D is the most important though. Wii Fit Trainer does not have a strong future.

[quote="drag0nscythe, post: 15608737, member: 71857"



He has also not once guaranteed that everyone will return.

This is my point though. Neither side can prove it. So stop acting like you know they will happen. Go ahead and say you don't mean it like that, but it certainly is coming across that way.[/quote]

I did mean it that way though. I am certain people will get cut. How many, I do not know. But some are going to get cut. Happens all the time in games.

I just hope for DLC to come out with the cut characters in it. I really hope Nintendo jumps on that wagon.

 

[Curious Villager]

How can I access the backroom? I don't want to be stuck with all these cut-happy people and terrible character requesters. Don't leave me aloooone.... D:

Yeah, we won't know what is going to happen, it is quite assuring that he is going to try and bring back as many characters as he can though. ^_^

 

[3Bismyname]

Interesting. I would say that D is the most important though. Wii Fit Trainer does not have a strong future.

Wii Fit U comes out in December and the Wii Fit games have sold remarkably well. overall it is a gimmick based series, but its a gimmick based series that works