Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Louie G.]

For the record, Sakurai mentioned that he was trying his best to revive old franchises through Smash, but that's something he has BEEN doing.
I would be surprised to see more than one "revival retro" along the lines of Pit. It will likely be Takamaru though. I can see Sakurai doing something great with Murasame Castle.

 

[XStarWarriorX]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Smash_Bros._for_Nintendo_3DS_and_Wii_U#cite_note-23

That doesn't necessarily mean retros. It could mean he could bring older characters like isaac and stuff. This just shows that recency doesn't matter, he could have put in a pikmin 3 protagonist. but no he kept gamecube olimar. The roster isn't gonna be filled with retros dude . (imo) I interpret this as including the gamecube/gba/wii characters that were overlooked. imo

@morbid You got ninja'd by bluepikmin lol

 

[BluePikmin11]

It's likely the whole batch of newcomers won't be retros, perhaps the retros could be 1/4 of the newcomers in the game.

 

[3Bismyname]

For the record, Sakurai mentioned that he was trying his best to revive old franchises through Smash, but that's something he has BEEN doing.
I would be surprised to see more than one "revival retro" along the lines of Pit. It will likely be Takamaru though. I can see Sakurai doing something great with Murasame Castle.

well here's what I somewhat recall hearing about certain retro franchises.
he's interested in rebooting Murasame Castle and Mach Rider
He considers Panel De Pon to be a masterpiece
He was a fan of Mole Mania.

I don't have any sources for these but I vaguely remember hearing it. take it for what it is.

 

[Louie G.]

well here's what I somewhat recall hearing about certain retro franchises.
he's interested in rebooting Murasame Castle and Mach Rider
He considers Panel De Pon to be a masterpiece
He was a fan of Mole Mania.

I don't have any sources for these but I vaguely remember hearing it. take it for what it is.

I've heard all of these, I believe you. These are the 4 most likely retros really.
Edit: Takamaru, Mach Rider, Lip, and Muddy Mole that is.

It's likely the whole batch of newcomers won't be retros, perhaps the retros could be 1/4 of the newcomers in the game.

Here's my list of newcomers:
Paper Mario
King K. Rool
Dixie Kong
Ridley
Mewtwo
Palutena
Chrom
Villager
Little Mac
Shulk
Wii Fit Trainer
Takamaru
Mega Man
Pac-Man

Out of these, 5 are arguably retro. Palutena, Little Mac, Takamaru, Mega Man, Pac-Man.
It depends on how you define retro though. I only consider Takamaru retro out of the bunch.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I would love a source on that he was a fan of Mole Mania.

I've heard all of these, I believe you. These are the 4 most likely retros really.
Edit: Takamaru, Mach Rider, Lip, and Muddy Mole that is.

Here's my list of newcomers:
Paper Mario
King K. Rool
Dixie Kong
Ridley
Mewtwo
Palutena
Chrom
Villager
Little Mac
Shulk
Wii Fit Trainer
Takamaru
Mega Man
Pac-Man

Out of these, 5 are arguably retro. Palutena, Little Mac, Takamaru, Mega Man, Pac-Man.
It depends on how you define retro though. I only consider Takamaru retro out of the bunch.

Eh retro franchises are basically dead franchises that haven't had a sequel in years.

 

[APC99]

Well, I'd personally love to see Lip, Mach Rider, Takamaru or Muddy get revived, but I'd also like Bubbles (from Clu Clu Land), Balloon Fighter, Stanley the Bugman (Donkey Kong 3) or Prince Sable get revived.


But I've a feeling we won't see Ice Climbers or R.O.B. get a revival soon.

 

[3Bismyname]

I would love a source on that he was a fan of Mole Mania.


Eh retro franchises are basically dead franchises that haven't had a sequel in years.

http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/molemania/molemania.htm

" At any rate, this is actually pretty shocking as initial reports from Super Smash Bros. Brawl indicated Masahiro Sakurai as being interested in giving Muddy the full "playable character" treatment and even featured him as a selection on polls during the game's development period."

 

[Louie G.]

Eh retro franchises are basically dead franchises that haven't had a sequel in years.

Then only one retro.
You basically helped prove my point.

Well, I'd personally love to see Lip, Mach Rider, Takamaru or Muddy get revived, but I'd also like Bubbles (from Clu Clu Land), Balloon Fighter, Stanley the Bugman (Donkey Kong 3) or Prince Sable get revived.


But I've a feeling we won't see Ice Climbers or R.O.B. get a revival soon.

No Tamagon?

 

[BluePikmin11]

I think you were looking at the unofficial Brawl poll that (I think) the fans sent to Sakurai.

 

[3Bismyname]

I think you were looking at the unofficial poll.

ive never looked at polls. I really don't bother with that crap cause in the end, whether or not the characters I want make it, im still gonna enjoy the game

 

[APC99]

Then only one retro.
You basically helped prove my point.

No Tamagon?

I'd love to see Tamagon, but I'm not sure if he's even on Sakurai's radar as worthy (although they were represented in Melee & Brawl by trophies & Assist Trophies)

 

[Morbi]

I've heard all of these, I believe you. These are the 4 most likely retros really.
Edit: Takamaru, Mach Rider, Lip, and Muddy Mole that is.

Here's my list of newcomers:
Paper Mario
King K. Rool
Dixie Kong
Ridley
Mewtwo
Palutena
Chrom
Villager
Little Mac
Shulk
Wii Fit Trainer
Takamaru
Mega Man
Pac-Man

Out of these, 5 are arguably retro. Palutena, Little Mac, Takamaru, Mega Man, Pac-Man.
It depends on how you define retro though. I only consider Takamaru retro out of the bunch.

14 Newcomers... and no cuts I presume? Good luck, you will need it (unless that is just a list of all plausible newcomers).

I'd love to see Tamagon, but I'm not sure if he's even on Sakurai's radar as worthy (although they were represented in Melee & Brawl by trophies & Assist Trophies)

I misread that as "tampon".

It's likely the whole batch of newcomers won't be retros, perhaps the retros could be 1/4 of the newcomers in the game.

It is also likely that we will get two... just like Melee, and just like Brawl.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Well there aren't that much viable options other than K. Rool, Palutena, Ridley, and a third FE character. So I could see many other franchises having their turn to have at least one playable character.

 

[Deleted member]

MUH PATTERNS

...haven't you people learned by now not to stick by patterns, let alone ones people make up by themselves?

 

[BluePikmin11]

Yeah, Sakurai can for sure break a pattern whenever he wants to depending on the situation on deciding newcomers.

 

[LoneKonWolf]

I thought breaking patterns was Sakurai's thing

 

[Morbi]

MUH PATTERNS

...haven't you people learned by now not to stick by patterns, let alone ones people make up by themselves?

You are saying that the way Sakurai has dealt with retros in the past doesn't set a precedent? It does. Whether or not Sakurai continues to follow the ESTABLISHED pattern is irrelevant. At which point the pattern ceases to be a pattern.

Well there aren't that much viable options other than K. Rool, Palutena, Ridley, and a third FE character. So I could see many other franchises having their turn to have at least one playable character.

I would probably add Mewtwo or Little Mac to that list.

 

[volbound1700]

Except Nintendo isn't making Smash 4... or Brawl. It's being made by a 3rd party company, and on top of that, Sakurai is minimally under their control. In fact, Sakurai has Nintendo by the balls (especially since the Wii U is selling about as well as fried turds on a hot afternoon), not the other way around.

Also, Nintendo should learn how to make more good home console games before they tell 3rd parties making their IP's what to do.

Smash Brothers is still Nintendo. I mean they are paying for it, it is mostly their IP, and it is going on their console. Without Nintendo, Sakurai wouldn't have a series.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I would probably add Mewtwo or Little Mac to that list.

I was talking about franchises currently represented in Smash, Punch-Out hasn't been represented yet.
Although I could add Mewtwo, I was really talking about newcomers.

 

[Deleted member]

You are saying that the way Sakurai has dealt with retros in the past doesn't set a precedent? It does. Whether or not Sakurai continues to follow the ESTABLISHED pattern is irrelevant. At which point the pattern ceases to be a pattern.

I am saying there was NO pattern to begin with, let alone "ermahgerd 2 rertrur rerps!".

The only character we know for a fact was included BECAUSE of being "retro" is the Ice Climbers.

Pit was due to worldwide popularity.
R.O.B., hasn't been stated. Though the case of R.O.B. being a throwback to an icon in Nintendo history is more believable than "cuz retro".

Game & Watch was just as "retro" in Melee's time as Little Mac and Pit are today. Ever hear of the Game & Watch Gallery series?

 

[Morbi]

I was talking about franchises currently represented in Smash, Punch-Out hasn't been represented yet.
Although I could add Mewtwo, I was really talking about newcomers.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I might add Dixie to the list though. I honestly believe that she could co-exist with K. Rool. I don't really see any evidence to sway the result one way or another. It could be none/both/or either of them.

Smash Brothers is still Nintendo. I mean they are paying for it, it is mostly their IP, and it is going on their console. Without Nintendo, Sakurai wouldn't have a series.

Nintendo is not DEVELOPING the game, Sora Ltd. and Namco Bandai are.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I still see the Diddy + Dixie combo happening though.
Anyways, I must leave for now.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I am saying there was NO pattern to begin with, let alone "ermahgerd 2 rertrur rerps!".

The only character we know for a fact was included BECAUSE of being "retro" is the Ice Climbers.

Yes, there is a pattern.
2 retro reps per game, one obscure, one just retro.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I still see the Diddy + Dixie combo happening though.

That still sounds like a poor way for Dixie Kong to be represented. Diddy and Dixie do not operate in the same manner as the Ice Climbers, so I don't see why they can't be separate.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Yes, there is a pattern.
2 retro reps per game, one obscure, one just retro.

There's also the bad made-up logic that a new Starfox character is added every installment, so now everyone is assuming Krystal is happening.

 

[Morbi]

I am saying there was NO pattern to begin with, let alone "ermahgerd 2 rertrur rerps!".

The only character we know for a fact was included BECAUSE of being "retro" is the Ice Climbers.

Are you seriously insinuating that Pit wasn't added because he was a retro character? That seems pretty overt. We don't know about G&W or ROB, I prefer to call them historical characters personally. A pattern can be conceived from only two games, do you know why? Mostly because it is an inherent quality of a pattern; however, it has more to do with the notion that these 2 games span across a period of 10 years. It is a safe assumption that we will get 2 retro characters. Sakurai might not like the fact that he is predictable, thus he will probably change it up.

This does not change the established precedence. It is a pattern, regardless of whether or not you immaturely mock me for having a different perspective.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Tingle's greatest obstacle is the severe hatred, or considerably vocal dislike (depending on your subjective interpretation), displayed by Western gamers towards the character - the negative reactions to his inclusion would be undesirably dreadful.

Sora is located in Japan, where Tingle is a beloved character.
I you had a company located here, would you care if a popular character was hated in Japan?

 

[FlareHabanero]

MUH PATTERNS

...haven't you people learned by now not to stick by patterns, let alone ones people make up by themselves?

You're giving humanity too much credit.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Apparently talking about recency as a factor, Shulk's chances, and predictions on retro revivals for characters isn't being on topic in a thread about predictions on rosters and the characters in them.

Talking about Pokemon and game consoles is not staying on topic. Maybe you missed that part.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

There's also the bad made-up logic that a new Starfox character is added every installment, so now everyone is assuming Krystal is happening.

Well yeah........ But there's, oh wait........ What about that, wait no......... I got nothing.

But Starfox isn't very popular in Big N's eyes. While retro characters are a huge part of history and have been a tradition in SSB since Melee.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I still see the Diddy + Dixie combo happening though.

There is absolutely no feasible way for it to physically work and even if it did we want them separate. Anybody who thinks it's going to happen is kidding themselves. Especially when Sakurai of all people acknoledges that it just doesn't work and don't give me that Villager bull crap. Just because Sakurai couldn't think of a way to make Villager a good fighter doesn't mean there was never a way to do so like there isn't for Diddy & Dixie.

 

[Morbi]

You're giving humanity too much credit.

It is funny that the brain interprets patterns on its own, so humanity is unintelligent for discerning a pattern? It is ironic, the act of dismissing the established pattern is actually a pattern within itself that follows the precedence of Sakurai's "unpredictability". It is inevitable that people are drawn to patterns. They usually have meaning. It would be ignorant to desecrate our values on prior knowledge over a video game.

So what are you getting at? Follow one pattern over the other or you are ignorant?

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I still see the Diddy + Dixie combo happening though.
Anyways, I must leave for now.

Diddy and Dixie only worked side by side in one game.
That means it is also a good idea to add in Maroo & Luigi as one character since they worked together in the Mario and Luigi series.

 

[FlareHabanero]

So what are you getting at? Follow one pattern over the other or you are ignorant?

That humanity is full of dip****s.

 

[Morbi]

That humanity is full of dip****s.

While I do agree with this notion (I am misanthropic myself), I don't like the implications of that statement. It is antithetical.

 

[Deleted member]

Are you seriously insinuating that Pit wasn't added because he was a retro character? That seems pretty overt. We don't know about G&W or ROB, I prefer to call them historical characters personally. A pattern can be conceived from only two games, do you know why? Mostly because it is an inherent quality of a pattern; however, it has more to do with the notion that these 2 games span across a period of 10 years. It is a safe assumption that we will get 2 retro characters. Sakurai might not like the fact that he is predictable, thus he will probably change it up.

This does not change the established precedence. It is a pattern, regardless of whether or not you immaturely mock me for having a different perspective.

I was well aware that Pit was a popular character in both America and Japan.

According to MUH PATTERNS, we're getting another Fox semi-clone and two Pokémon Newcomers.

 

[Morbi]

According to MUH PATTERNS, we're getting another Fox semi-clone and two Pokémon Newcomers.

That is the beauty of patterns, you can choose whether or not they are valid. You might dismiss the retro pattern just as easily as most competent people would dismiss the Pokemon pattern. That is irrelevant. The only reason I responded to you was because you implied (more like directly stated) that there was NO pattern. This is fallacious. There IS a pattern. IT doesn't have to mean anything.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Are you seriously insinuating that Pit wasn't added because he was a retro character? That seems pretty overt. We don't know about G&W or ROB, I prefer to call them historical characters personally. A pattern can be conceived from only two games, do you know why? Mostly because it is an inherent quality of a pattern; however, it has more to do with the notion that these 2 games span across a period of 10 years. It is a safe assumption that we will get 2 retro characters. Sakurai might not like the fact that he is predictable, thus he will probably change it up.

This does not change the established precedence. It is a pattern, regardless of whether or not you immaturely mock me for having a different perspective.

I think it's safe to say we either get 1 retro character and 1 hardware character or just 1 retro character. There's not much to choose from for Hardware characters except Diskun. Also if we got a character like Mii that would make up for it. We COULD get 2 Retro Protagonists, but this is assuming Sakurai is okay with that.

Diddy and Dixie only worked side by side in one game.

Technically she just followed him. The only way to really make a duo work is if they are both identical in abilities and usually body shape like Popo & Nana, Plusle & Minun, or Mario & Luigi. Dixie's Hair can't combine with Diddy's Barrel Rocket or Peanut Popgun. These 2 moves are unique to him and can't be made into a duo.

I wonder what would happen if our 5th Mario character was the Mario Brothers (from Mario & Luigi)

 

[Mega Bidoof]

According to MUH PATTERNS, we're getting another Fox semi-clone and two Pokémon Newcomers.

Watch that happen just because you said it.
We get Krystal,
Genesect replacing Lucario, Kalos Trainer replacing Pokemon Trainer
Diskun, and Takamaru.