Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Bowserlick]

So Ike is a valuable character while Lucas is not because he has an Up B with invincibility frames (Since Dedede covers the rest of that)?

More valuable. I am not a fan of a billion Fire Emblem characters. I was happy with just Marth Pre-Brawl.

Fire Emblem is a larger series so I can see why it merits two characters. I would prefer all of the specials to be different and perhaps showcasing different weapons.

If a small and relatively unsuccessful series like Mother is represented by two characters, there should be a gameplay reason. Like offering a new mechanic or interesting specials.

 

[Louie G.]

More valuable. I am not a fan of a billion Fire Emblem characters. I was happy with just Marth Pre-Brawl.

Fire Emblem is a larger series so I can see why it merits two characters. I would prefer all of the specials to be different and perhaps showcasing different weapons.

If a small and relatively unsuccessful series like Mother is represented by two characters, there should be a gameplay reason. Like offering a new mechanic or interesting specials.

This is exactly how I feel.
I love MOTHER as much as the next guy, but if Lucas doesn't step up his game, I won't miss him.
Not that he's going anywhere.

 

[FlareHabanero]

For sure Chrom would be the balance of Ike and Marth.

Get more creative, I've seen this suggested several times already but it's too vague and lazy. Not to mention he doesn't seem much like a balance type of character, he's lacking in versatility for starters that most balance characters sport.

 

[Arcadenik]

Seriously? Had the Ice-Climbers not been introduced in Super Smash Brothers Melee, they would have simply faded away into obscurity.

I know a certain NES game that never had a playable character (yet) and that character never faded away into obscurity.

 

[Silverjay323]

More valuable. I am not a fan of a billion Fire Emblem characters. I was happy with just Marth Pre-Brawl.

Fire Emblem is a larger series so I can see why it merits two characters. I would prefer all of the specials to be different and perhaps showcasing different weapons.

If a small and relatively unsuccessful series like Mother is represented by two characters, there should be a gameplay reason. Like offering a new mechanic or interesting specials.

So an almost entirely different set of normals, aerials, tether grab, 3 different smashes and spacing game isn't bringing anything new, nor differentiate him from Ness? Aside from Mario and Luigi, they're the least clone like out of brawl. In addition, Mother may not have sold well, but it has a passionate fanbase that still cares about these characters' inclusion.

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

More valuable. I am not a fan of a billion Fire Emblem characters. I was happy with just Marth Pre-Brawl.

Fire Emblem is a larger series so I can see why it merits two characters. I would prefer all of the specials to be different and perhaps showcasing different weapons.

If a small and relatively unsuccessful series like Mother is represented by two characters, there should be a gameplay reason. Like offering a new mechanic or interesting specials.

I don't see why gameplay is such a big deal. I think it's much more important to look at what the character brings as the character, like how Lucas and Ike brought the recent protagonist. If you disagree with that, then I guess that's all there is to it.

 

[No Control]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

I would like to see Lucas cut from the game. I would also like to see Wolf, Ike and Lucario cut (I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

The roster to this game, no matter what people say, is obviously going to be fairly limited (no more than 40-45 char. slots, which is only 5-10 more than the last game). Neither Wolf, Toon Link or Lucas add any real personality to the game. Sure, they have (to varying degrees) their own moves, but they lack any real personalities distinguishing them from the characters their Smash models are clearly based on (Fox, Link and Ness, respectively).

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Get more creative, I've seen this suggested several times already but it's too vague and lazy. Not to mention he doesn't seem much like a balance type of character, he's lacking in versatility for starters that most balance characters sport.

Well it's the first thing I can mention that seems like it suits for Chrom.
Like how Tanooki powers seems like it suits Tom Nook well.

 

[FinalStarmen]

(I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

I see what you did there.

 

[Arcadenik]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

Well, you have no control over SSB4's development.

 

[Bowserlick]

So an almost entirely different set of normals, aerials, tether grab, 3 different smashes and spacing game isn't bringing anything new, nor differentiate him from Ness? Aside from Mario and Luigi, they're the least clone like out of brawl. In addition, Mother may not have sold well, but it has a passionate fanbase that still cares about these characters' inclusion.

I am not saying he is not different than Ness. But in terms of Brawl as a whole, I don't think he offers much except for being a time-saver on development side. He has a similar model to Ness and has similar movement animations.

And remember the storyline in Brawl took alot of resources, so there was probably less time for character creation.

 

[Louie G.]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

I would like to see Lucas cut from the game. I would also like to see Wolf, Ike and Lucario cut (I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

The roster to this game, no matter what people say, is obviously going to be fairly limited (no more than 40-45 char. slots, which is only 5-10 more than the last game). Neither Wolf, Toon Link or Lucas add any real personality to the game. Sure, they have (to varying degrees) their own moves, but they lack any real personalities distinguishing them from the characters their Smash models are clearly based on (Fox, Link and Ness, respectively).

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

I agree partially.
I for one wouldn't mind losing Lucas, especially if that spot goes to a more unique character.
Wolf I wouldn't miss either, but I love Toon Link. And he has loads of personality.
Lucario and Ike are actually cool unique characters. Their series can warrant them and possible "replacements" just fine.
Those 5 plus Snake though are the characters I would bet on leaving if it came to that (before TL was announced that is).

 

[Autumn ♫]

Are we seriously arguing that Lucas is a Ness clone? This thread gets stupider everyday.

I love you guys, don't hurt me.

 

[Bowserlick]

I don't see why gameplay is such a big deal. I think it's much more important to look at what the character brings as the character, like how Lucas and Ike brought the recent protagonist. If you disagree with that, then I guess that's all there is to it.

I think we just disagree, but I understand the desire for the recent protagonist.

 

[No Control]

Well, you have no control over SSB4's development.

Haha, very good.

Yeah I understand that, obviously this is all my own conjecture and I have no idea what the developers are doing!

 

[FlareHabanero]

Well it's the first thing I can mention that seems like it suits for Chrom.
Like how Tanooki powers seems like it suits Tom Nook well.

Chrom is not exactly a balanced character, he does not specialize in utility like Pit or versatility like Mario. He's more of a Beat Down character, a character that specializes in hitting hard and fast. I'd compare him to Captain Falcon in that regard.

 

[Bowserlick]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

I would like to see Lucas cut from the game. I would also like to see Wolf, Ike and Lucario cut (I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

The roster to this game, no matter what people say, is obviously going to be fairly limited (no more than 40-45 char. slots, which is only 5-10 more than the last game). Neither Wolf, Toon Link or Lucas add any real personality to the game. Sure, they have (to varying degrees) their own moves, but they lack any real personalities distinguishing them from the characters their Smash models are clearly based on (Fox, Link and Ness, respectively).

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

Very good post. Glad you brought up the limited roster aspect.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Chrom is not exactly a balanced character, he does not specialize in utility like Pit or versatility like Mario. He's more of a Rush Down character, a character that specializes in hitting hard and fast. I'd compare him to Captain Falcon in that regard.

A better Marth with strength, that seems overpowered.

 

[Silverjay323]

I am not saying he is not different than Ness. But in terms of Brawl as a whole, I don't think he offers much except for being a time-saver on development side. He has a similar model to Ness and has similar movement animations.

And remember the storyline in Brawl took alot of resources, so there was probably less time for character creation.

If you're thinking like this than Fox/Falco Capt./Ganon offer nothing as well. The fact that Lucas was more different than veteran clones proves that thought and development was put into him. As far as bringing something new, coming from you the phrase seems to only refer to specials. Animations have nothing to do with it because almost every other clone set shares this quality.

 

[FlareHabanero]

A better Marth with strength, that seems overpowered.

Not exactly, Marth's archetype is more of a Momentum character. Momentum characters are typically fast characters that exploits any mistakes with long combos and trying to keep up that pace (hence the name). Basically those characters need to have a rhythm in order to succeed, until then they try to fish for a weak spot. Within Super Smash Bros. examples include Marth, Sheik, and Fox. Beat Down characters meanwhile tend to simply have raw speed and power with an emphasis on hitting hard and quickly. The downside to those characters typically is a lack of defensive synergy.

It might not make sense, but from experience I can say that you cannot treat Marth like Captain Falcon and vise versa.

 

[Gune]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

I would like to see Lucas cut from the game. I would also like to see Wolf, Ike and Lucario cut (I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

The roster to this game, no matter what people say, is obviously going to be fairly limited (no more than 40-45 char. slots, which is only 5-10 more than the last game). Neither Wolf, Toon Link or Lucas add any real personality to the game. Sure, they have (to varying degrees) their own moves, but they lack any real personalities distinguishing them from the characters their Smash models are clearly based on (Fox, Link and Ness, respectively).

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

Well can't really get mad, its your opinion though mine differs in well...a lot of aspects I still respect it but I do disagre on Ike and Lucario.

Not what I meant.

If you ever want a fraction of hope of damaging this Ctarl-Ctarl skin, you'd best turn said dull spikes sharp.

Dull?......why don't you give me a hug and test these things out?

 

[Bowserlick]

If you're thinking like this than Fox/Falco Capt./Ganon offer nothing as well. The fact that Lucas was more different than veteran clones proves that thought and development was put into him. As far as bringing something new, coming from you the phrase seems to only refer to specials. Animations have nothing to do with it because almost every other clone set shares this quality.

Lucas did have more time and thought put into him than clones from Melee. I do not disagree.

No, coming from me it does not have to do just with specials. Mechanics matter. Movements matter.

I want Ganondorf and Falco to be more different. But they are going in the right direction. Falco has a laser used for stun and a semi-spike theme. He has a much different jump than Fox. He also utilizes his reflector in a manner consistent with his aggressive nature. I would want his Side and Up B to also be used in a different manner.

Ganondorf has a power theme going on. And his side B is a very interesting special; consisting of a mini-game mechanic. I also want his other specials to be different.

 

[Arcanir]

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

I do disagree on the whole Lucario/Ike thing since they're no more guilty then any other newcomer in that regard (particularly PT for Lucario), but that's all I'll really say on the matter.

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

Are we seriously arguing that Lucas is a Ness clone? This thread gets stupider everyday.

I love you guys, don't hurt me.

Well, uh, he kinda is. He's a semi-clone. The special moves and final smash are very similar, but the other moves are generally unique.

I'm not what you'd call an "intelligent poster", so I might've just said something dumb.

-----

 

[Silverjay323]

Lucas did have more time and thought put into him than clones from Melee. I do not disagree.

No, coming from me it does not have to do just with specials. Mechanics matter. Movements matter.

I want Ganondorf and Falco to be more different. But they are going in the right direction. Falco has a laser used for stun and a semi-spike theme. He has a much different jump than Fox. He also utilizes his reflector in a manner consistent with his aggressive nature. I would want his Side and Up B to also be used in a different manner.

Ganondorf has a power theme going on. And his side B is a very interesting special; consisting of a mini-game mechanic. I also want his other specials to be different.

That being said, shouldn't you want Lucas to receive the same treatment? Even though he differs from Ness in a far greater manner than Falco does already. Or is him being cut a personal preference? That I can understand.

Well, uh, he kinda is. He's a semi-clone. The special moves and final smash are very similar, but the other moves are generally unique.

I'm not what you'd call an "intelligent poster", so I might've just said something dumb.


-----

Tread on the terms clone and semi-clone lightly, but what you said is true. What he basically meant is the fact that people use his "clone" status as a reason for him not to return.

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

Are we seriously arguing that Lucas is a Ness clone? This thread gets stupider everyday.

I love you guys, don't hurt me.

You must not have been paying attention. This thread gets more stupid every hour.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Let's talk about who's going to be starters and who's going to be unlockables

Starters:
Villager
Starfy
Chrom (Marth if we get Roy)
King K. Rool
Palutena
Mii
Little Mac
Takamaru
Shulk


Unlockables:
Ridley
Issac
Wii Fit Trainer
Dixie Kong
Mega Man
Paper Mario/Bowser Jr

 

[TumblrFamous]

Let's talk about who's going to be starters and who's going to be unlockables

Starters:
Villager
Starfy
Chrom (Marth if we get Roy)
King K. Rool
Palutena
Mii
Little Mac
Takamaru
Shulk


Unlockables:
Ridley
Issac
Wii Fit Trainer
Dixie Kong
Mega Man
Paper Mario/Bowser Jr

You think WFT will be unlockable?

 

[Johnknight1]

I disagree entirely. I see more people on the side of removing Jiggs as opposed to keeping her because of her irrelevancy. meanwhile the ones who want to keep just do it out of some sort of made up "original 12 rule." she's majorly insignificant by comparison to Meowth. as are Pichu, Plusle and Minun

Who the heck cares about relevancy=???

The fact of the matter is Meowth has almost nothing to work with, whereas Jigglypuff is easily one of the best Smash characters ever.

She made it into Melee, but was one of the last characters added in Brawl.

Source or you're wrong.

Last I checked, Sakurai said the whole roster (sans Sonic) was planned back in 2005.

Don't say "not appearing in the SSE," because that was clearly the last addition into Brawl.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Eh, I don't think WFT will be unlockable. Lots of people would to play as her to test what she plays like from the start.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

You think WFT will be unlockable?

Maybe, she's like a surprise/strange character. But, Wii Fit is really well known so maybe not.

Eh, I don't think WFT will be unlockable. Lots of people would to play as her to test what she plays like from the start.

Like every character in the game?

 

[Bowserlick]

That being said, shouldn't you want Lucas to receive the same treatment? Even though he differs from Ness in a far greater manner than Falco does already. Or is him being cut a personal preference? That I can understand.

I want Lucas to have different specials (or mechanic) that add something to the game. Otherwise, I think his slot is better taken by someone who can offer something new.

 

[Silverjay323]

Let's talk about who's going to be starters and who's going to be unlockables

Starters:
Villager
Starfy
Chrom (Marth if we get Roy)
King K. Rool
Palutena
Mii
Little Mac
Takamaru
Shulk


Unlockables:
Ridley
Issac
Wii Fit Trainer
Dixie Kong
Mega Man
Paper Mario/Bowser Jr

You think Ridley will be playable? I'd switch Palutena and Isaac. Other than that, a reasonable assumption

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I want Lucas to have different specials (or mechanic) that add something to the game. Otherwise, I think his slot is better taken by someone who can offer something new.

Ugh, I hate when people want favorite and loveable Nintendo characters removed and replaced for muh moves.

 

[OcarinaOfDoom]

Let's talk about who's going to be starters and who's going to be unlockables

Starters:
Villager
Starfy
Chrom (Marth if we get Roy)
King K. Rool
Palutena
Mii
Little Mac
Takamaru
Shulk


Unlockables:
Ridley
Issac
Wii Fit Trainer
Dixie Kong
Mega Man
Paper Mario/Bowser Jr

imo WFT will be starter. K Rool could be moved to unlockable imo.

And also, because I'm too lazy to look stuff up, mind giving me links that debunk the whole "Ridley is too big" thing?

 

[Johnknight1]

*Warning: Unpopular opinion trigger*

I would like to see Lucas cut from the game. I would also like to see Wolf, Ike and Lucario cut (I would've liked them to lose Toon Link too, but that boat has obviously sailed).

The roster to this game, no matter what people say, is obviously going to be fairly limited (no more than 40-45 char. slots, which is only 5-10 more than the last game). Neither Wolf, Toon Link or Lucas add any real personality to the game. Sure, they have (to varying degrees) their own moves, but they lack any real personalities distinguishing them from the characters their Smash models are clearly based on (Fox, Link and Ness, respectively).

As for Lucario and Ike, I'd like to see them replaced by Mewtwo and Chrom. I know "replaced" is gonna get me all kinds of responses from people saying "nobody replaces anyone, there's no such thing as slots" but to a degree there is. Some chars push others out of the game, and if we hardly have room on the roster, I'd like to see these chars go to let some more promising characters forward.

You're acting like cutting a character = getting another character instead, which is not how it works.

Learn the rules of design and business, and then we'll care about your opinions.

Seriously, just look up the cost of keeping a customer in business versus losing them and getting a new customer. That's essentially what is the case with the smash bros. roster.

Keeping a customer is 6 times less time consuming, cheaper, and more efficient than losing said customer and getting a new one. It's likely the same with keeping veterans and keeping clones (hence why we got 5 additional clones in Melee instead of just merely extra content; that's right, 5 clones is easier to add than 1 additional new character).

Also, the fact you say Wolf, Toon Link, or Lucas don't add personality to the game, or that Chrom is better than Ike shows how much of a noob you are.

Please, wise up son.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

So I decided that the prediction of character regal dates needed its own thread.
http://smashboards.com/threads/character-reveal-day-prediction-thread.341512/
You can thank me later
NOW FLY AWAY TO A NEW LAND!

 

[G0LD3N L0TUS]

Let's talk about who's going to be starters and who's going to be unlockables

Starters: Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, Little Mac, Takamaru

Unlock: K. Rool, Ridley, Megaman, Mewtwo, Tetra/Toon Zelda, Paper Mario, Tactician, Samurai Goroh, Masked Man

^ my set

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Why do people think King K. Rool should be unlockable???

I'd switch Palutena and Issac

Palutena is the Zelda of Kid Icarus and would promote the recent Kid Icarus: Uprising game. Issac on the other hand is from a less popular Nintendo franchise. I'd say they are both in the right spot

 

[Johnknight1]

You know, I find it quite funny how during gen 5 whenever Zoroark or Genesect were brought up. People were always complaining about how recentness doesn't matter and whatnot. And now when gen 6 came along. People are now saying that Zoroark and Genesect can't get in because their not recent anymore. Poor Zoroark and Genesect, they just can't win can they? :/

Eh, the only reason I like new-ish Pokémon is because they "feel" more different than just choosing from the same ole' crop as usual. I mean, we've already had 6 playable Pokémon from generation 1. Sure, there's a ton of awesome choices from Gen 1 left, but from a design standpoint, Gen III on we see new "trends" and "styles" be a crucial part of the designs.

I mean, compare Meowth to the current slate of Pokémon characters who were in Melee and Brawl, then do the same with Zoroark, Genesect, Plusle and Minun, and Pichu. Meowth doesn't stick out quite as much, and honestly, he has less tools to work with anyways.

IMO Zoroark and Genesect both stick out from the Gen 1-heavy roster, much like Lucario does.