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Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

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Johnknight1

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More games will be announced before Ssb4 releases,
With games being announced, priorities change.
Nope. K. Rool is still more interesting, has more to work with, and just "stands out" more.
So assuming MM 3d/HD comes out , or even the new Zelda WiiU is a MM sequel, what impact would that have on Smash.
It will have no impact at all, other than maybe a stage... just like the original Majora's Mask release! :awesome:

Also, anybody else think we're gonna get a Wind Waker HD stage=???
 

Jaedrik

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A place where less stupid people go to get away from the flock. You know, kind of like how parents go to Las Vegas to get away from their children.
Those are the best. I've witnessed numerous forums turn into hnnnnnnneh (massive doo doo) because of an influx of people. Perfect example, PlanetSide 2 forums. After closed beta ended and the perpetual beta started, that place went downhill fast.
You know, I bet there's a back room of the back room that has super secret password you get by entering a numpad unicode to a secret editable portion of one random post in there. And if not there should be.
 

3Bismyname

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meh, as far as the Dixie/K Rool argument goes I can see it going either way honestly. both characters bring something to the table that the other doesn't. K Rool brings in a new villain as well as another heavy weight addition. While Dixie can satisfy those "Smash needs more females dur" fans while still heavily capable of having a strong moveset. K Rool is the definitive villain of the series, while Dixie is the next most reoccurring DK character after DK and Diddy (technically that's Cranky but w.e). best option would be add them both imo. the series can warrant the 2 spots.
 

Johnknight1

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Maybe I should just go back to the backroom... I haven't been there for awhile.
I'm trying to make the Smash thread back there more active. You can make the character prediction thread more active, too.

Honestly the whole "I wanna leave thing" has caused me to leave like half a dozen threads forever. It's why I wish we made the BRoom into more of a "shelter."
They are the minority.
Doesn't make them wrong.

Simon Belmont has amazing potential as a playable character. Still, his chances are next to zero, sadly.

Hopefully some day he is playable in a future Smash Bros game, because he would be fan-freaking-tastic to play as. :)
 

Johnknight1

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Oh yes, and speaking of Snake, I have a lot more confidence that Snake will return now ever since Sonic being confirmed. Because it shows that the third party characters characters can return, contrary to how guest characters are typically treated in other games.
On top of that, Sakurai has said before he felt Snake (and Sonic) were fantastic additions to Brawl, and added something no Nintendo character could add.
How is this any different from Brawl?
People say Snake's "need of a promotion" is totally different from Brawl, and yet in Brawl, he basically advertised Metal Gear Solid 4 only! :laugh:

Also, the Nintendo fanboys who want Snake got annoy me. Take off your Nintendo thong for a second, and appreciate Snake for what he is: better than any damn newcomer in Brawl (sans maybe Olimar). Why would you want that removed=??? To protect your sacred Nintendo virginity or some creepy crap like that=???

If Nintendo really wanted that, a Nintendo studio would actually make said game, instead of a 3rd party company for the 2nd and 3rd time in a row (meaning 3 out of 5 of the smash games will be made primarily by 3rd party studios).
 

Johnknight1

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Id like the pirate ship to return, love that stage. But I think it would be cool to have either outset island or Forsaken Fortress
Honestly, I would really love a Outset Island or Windfall Island stage.

It would be so cool to see that stage confirmed, and then to have Zelda confirmed with pictures of her on that stage! :love:
 

TheLastJinjo

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Every ****ing day I come in here, "Oh look. SaturnGamer64 started yet another argument over a ****ing video game. SURPRISING."
I think either you have me confused for the one of the other users or are being a complete hypocrite. You really singled ME as the person who starts uncivil arguments that get out of hand when in reality we're simply talking about video games? I'm probably the person who complains most about people doing that and try to maintain that. Give me a break.

Anyway, there was no real dispute about this King K. Rool & Dixie Kong discussion until you came in and decided to ***** and accuse me of arguing because I simply disagree.

And yes, I do have a problem with us talking about boring discussions that have literally nothing to do with this thread. I have every right to complain that we are talking about character reveal dates and Pokemon games on a thread not made for it.

In conclusion, go ***** to real people who are actually bickering about video games when there are actually those people present and doing so. If you really can't stand apposition to something or nay saying go report me. So yes, go to the back room if it bothers you so.
 

Swamp Sensei

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It's for people who don't like disagreeing. So they make their own room where they all agree on stuff.
...

Yeah.... That's not it. It's more about what you've contributed to the forums as a whole. That's what gets you in.

There's like no debating there. Mostly a hang out spot. Games everywhere!
 

Johnknight1

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Yeah.... That's not it. It's more about what you've contributed to the forums as a whole. That's what gets you in.

There's like no debating there. Mostly a hang out spot. Games everywhere!
The debating there is really civil, sans when me and Manly fake feuds just to make everyone thing that we hate each other (hint: we don't, because Manly is mah waifu).
 

Swamp Sensei

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The debating there is really civil, sans when me and Manly fake feuds just to make everyone thing that we hate each other (hint: we don't, because Manly is mah waifu).
Still, even though it's quite civil, there's not a lot of it.

I mean c'mon. You know everything in there stopped for mafia!
 

shinhed-echi

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So just out of curiosity, what does it take to be in the backroom?

Don't know why I've always pictured it as the club for people who can pull off all those crazy moves in Melee, and to become a member you should at the very least know how to perform a shineblind. :p
 

EddyBearr

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Using the terrible methodology of "discussion on Smashboards = character hype level" (folks spending time thinking of movesets, etc, truly getting immersed into a character.) The more interest folks have, the better the game will perform.

Hype Tier List:
For controversial characters: take their page count with a couple dozen grains of salt.
Returning characters not included, except Roy and Mewtwo, as they were cut and have a decent chance of returning.

I'm going to cut it off at 30, because I don't wanna make a 200 character list.

Controversy scale:
***Ridley's too big!, many concerns piling up
**Moderate/reasonable/obvious clone concerns, 3rd party (except Namco, Sega, & Konami), dead franchise, multiple 1-star concerns, Krystal
*Potential clone concerns, questionable for children, "over-represented franchise", "dead/dying franchise, "replacing veterans", "mostly for fun," "one-time character," "Missed their chance," competing franchise, "SWF hatred (filthy casual character)"



S TIER
***Ridley (Metroid) === 285 pages
King K. Rool (Donkey Kong) == 97 pages

A TIER
Mewtwo (Pokemon) == 44 pages
Little Mac (Punch-Out!!) = 32 pages
*Pac-Man (Pacman) == 35 pages
**Krystal (Star Fox) == 36 pages
*Chrom (Fire Emblem) == 31 pages

B TIER
*Roy (Fire Emblem) == 32 pages
Isaac (Golden Sun) == 25 pages
Palutena (Kid Icarus) == 24 pages
Waluigi (Mario) == 21 pages
Shulk (Xenoblade) == 19 pages
Anna (Fire Emblem) == 19 pages
Toad (Mario) == 19 pages

C TIER
**Geno (Super Mario RPG) == 25 pages
Takamaru (The Mysterious Murasame Castle) = 16 pages
**Impa (Legend of Zelda) == 20 pages
*Ghirahim (Legend of Zelda) == 14 pages
Professor Layton (Professor Layton) == 13 pages
*Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong) == 12 pages
Dillon (Dillon's Rolling Western) == 10 pages
Tingle (Legend of Zelda) == 10 pages

D TIER
Lip (Panel De Pon) == 8 pages
*Mii (Wii) == 9 pages
*Lloyd Irving (Tales Of) == 9 pages
*Lucina (Fire Emblem) == 9 pages
Lyn (Fire Emblem) == 7 pages
Bowser Jr. (Mario) == 7 pages
Paper Mario (Paper Mario) == 7 pages
Tom Nook (Animal Crossing) == 7 pages*Different Pokemon Trainer (Pokemon) == 8 pages
**Dark Samus (Metroid) == 9 pages

F Tier
Everything with 4+ pages not listed. Try not to talk about these.

Negligible Tier
Everything else. Don't even consider bringing up these.

Only exceptions I would say are Toon Zelda and Starfy, who both technically fall in Negligible Tier, but we can all agree have a visible chance.
 

Johnknight1

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Still, even though it's quite civil, there's not a lot of it.

I mean c'mon. You know everything in there stopped for mafia!
Not really. Your thread on Characters play styles keep running and rolling.

However, most of the actual debating stays in the Skype chats for whatever reason, specifically the voice chats. You've been there for some of our chats on stuff.

Still, I do wish we talked about it more there. I want to get the ball rolling there on that one, which is why I'm so adamant about it.

Also, I really would like to see stages being used to hint at characters from now on... although for those stages hinting at characters, I want some answers starting in March with newcomers, dang it! :mad:
 

---

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...

Yeah.... That's not it. It's more about what you've contributed to the forums as a whole. That's what gets you in.

There's like no debating there. Mostly a hang out spot. Games everywhere!
More or less. Most of the people who have invites are those who are vets of the past and current Smash 4 threads or are active and level headed. Bar a certain Admin who wanted in on the fun.

There is Smash talk, but most of us have forsaken that after hanging out in threads like this one after 2+ years. We just don't have the patience to argue anymore. Now we just discuss whatever we feel like (usually Off-Topic/Smash/Pokemon), play games like Mafia, and eat popcorn as we watch threads like this go more and more down hill.

So just out of curiosity, what does it take to be in the backroom?

Don't know why I've always pictured it as the club for people who can pull off all those crazy moves in Melee, and to become a member you should at the very least know how to perform a shineblind. :p
That's a competitive backroom.

The one people keep talking about here is a social group the original owner named a Backroom (which we can't seem to change :laugh:). You yourself were invited to the group probably back in 2011 when it was first created and are currently on the member list.
 

EddyBearr

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Just because you've never fully experienced one doesn't mean they don't exist.
I've been in several, and seen several.

The only thing is, they never include two specific posters.

Noah (SaturnGamer64)
Johnknight1

This is, of course, from my own personal observation, and I certainly haven't observed everything, but Noah seems to frequently dwell into "I rarely block people but I'm raging," and Johnknight1 has a very sharp tongue, which sets things off.

I mean no offense to either of you, but in honesty: cool it down. This thread needs to be more like Yoshi's Story, and less like Battlefield w/ Cruel Melee.
 

Johnknight1

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Man, I would really laugh so hard if we got Nintendogs as a newcomer after Sakurai used Nintendogs and the Villagers as character models that "don't work in the context of Smash" (roughly said) in his "Iwata Asks" interview dealio back in like January of 2008 for promoting Brawl! :laugh:
So just out of curiosity, what does it take to be in the backroom?

Don't know why I've always pictured it as the club for people who can pull off all those crazy moves in Melee, and to become a member you should at the very least know how to perform a shineblind. :p
Me and Smooth are probably the only people who can shine spike in the BRoom out of all 65 (plus Fatmanonice, who never accepted the invite) of us, lol.

And you should know that; you've been a member for about 2 years, or roughly about 3 months less than I have been a member! :laugh:
 

TheLastJinjo

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The only thing is, they never include two specific posters.
They start out civil, but when you push people by constantly nay-saying facts or points and simply dismiss them entirely without actual valid reasons to do so, we become rather frustrated.
 

KingofPhantoms

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This thread will probably never change. Until, Smash 4 is released and the thread is closed that is.

Fortunately the community backlash won't be as bad as it was back when Brawl's full roster was revealed. I hope...
 

Johnknight1

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Johnknight1 has a very sharp tongue, which sets things off.
If you take me seriously, then you are doing it wrong. Like way wrong.

I'm not sure if it was me using a Guile avatar or what, but I'm not serious whatsoever. I'm just straight-forward and goofy. I tell you my opinion on something, crack a joke, state my opinion on something else, and move on. I don't over-think it... unless it's gameplay!!! :laugh:

And if you think I'm ever mad, you're even more wrong. I've never mad at posts. They're just words written out about a piece of plastic software we are hyped for.

Anyways, all the people who take me seriously are seriously out of the loop.

Like "oh, Johnknight1 hates ManlySpirit, Habanero, augustoflores, KumaOso, N3ON, and/or shortiecanbrawl". Yes, I have gotten several PM's from people asking me why I hate or argue with those users so much. Which is funny, since the are among my favorite people to talk to, I don't hate them, and I never argue with them.

But to be serious, y'all need some reading comprehension, or to learn the psychology of humans, and how to spot what kind of people they are based on their written words.
 

Knight Dude

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I'm not gonna lie when this thread closes I'm gonna miss it some...

The thread can live on in your soul. In all of our souls. We will always remember the good times. Arguing about whether or not Ike will get replaced with Chrom and people still saying that Mewtwo was replaced with Lucario. untilssb5getsannouncedandwewontcarethatmuchanymoreyknowyeahyouknow
 

EddyBearr

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They start out civil, but when you push people by constantly nay-saying facts or points and simply dismiss them entirely without actual valid reasons to do so, we become rather frustrated.
You shouldn't let arguments you don't agree with upset you. If a person has a differing opinion than you based upon their own subjective system of value, then that also shouldn't upset you. At least not in regards to who's gonna be a character in SSB4.

Simultaneously, I've seen you many times cast off reasons as "invalid" using things that lack evidentiary basis (such as "Sakurai plans the roster before development.") I don't think this is a case of folks casting off your views with invalid reasoning, I think it's a case of tunnel vision and perception bias.

If you take me seriously, then you are doing it wrong. Like way wrong.

I'm not sure if it was me using a Guile avatar or what, but I'm not serious whatsoever. I'm just straight-forward and goofy. I tell you my opinion on something, crack a joke, state my opinion on something else, and move on. I don't over-think it... unless it's gameplay!!! :laugh:

And if you think I'm ever mad, you're even more wrong. I've never mad at posts. They're just words written out about a piece of plastic software we are hyped for.

Anyways, all the people who take me seriously are seriously out of the loop.

Like "oh, Johnknight1 hates ManlySpirit, Habanero, augustoflores, KumaOso, N3ON, and/or shortiecanbrawl". Yes, I have gotten several PM's from people asking me why I hate or argue with those users so much. Which is funny, since the are among my favorite people to talk to, I don't hate them, and I never argue with them.

But to be serious, y'all need some reading comprehension, or to learn the psychology of humans, and how to spot what kind of people they are based on their written words.
I don't think you hate folks or get too mad, but I never said that. What I said is that you have a sharp tongue. You ought to be more considerate of other people, so that you don't rile them up.

If it was only one or two people who got riled up by you, who simultaneously got riled up by other folks, then it might be their problem, but from what I've observed, your comments have regularly upset many different people, people who weren't necessarily getting upset otherwise. Saying "they should learn to understand you better" or "get better reading comprehension" won't change much how they react to things, and if you yourself went ahead to "learn the psychology of humans," you wouldn't expect them to.

To put it as bluntly as possible, the problem isn't people taking you seriously, the problem is you not taking other's feelings seriously.


Again, to both of you, I don't mean offense, just honesty so we can get a better discussion. I used to be a bit like John on other forums (and I'm still far from perfect,) but I shaped up.
 

TheLastJinjo

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You shouldn't let arguments you don't agree with upset you. If a person has a differing opinion than you based upon their own subjective system of value, then that also shouldn't upset you. At least not in regards to who's gonna be a character in SSB4.

Simultaneously, I've seen you many times cast off reasons as "invalid" using things that lack evidentiary basis (such as "Sakurai plans the roster before development.") I don't think this is a case of folks casting off your views with invalid reasoning, I think it's a case of tunnel vision and perception bias.
While I don't know the exact source of that, there is stuff that supports this and I'm sure there are other people who will tell you the same and actually do have sources for it. I'm not frustrated that you have a different opinion, I'm frustrated that you ignore any evidence contradicting your opinion and continue to make claims about Sakurai's criteria that are simply not true, and lies about characters you don't support.
 

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While I don't know the exact source of that, there is stuff that supports this and I'm sure there are other people who will tell you the same and actually do have sources for it. I'm not frustrated that you have a different opinion, I'm frustrated that you ignore any evidence contradicting your opinion and continue to make claims about Sakurai's criteria that are simply not true, and lies about characters you don't support.
I can think of a couple things that contradict your claim of the pre-determined roster. The only question is whether or not you consider them relevant. That's where most arguments you're involved in stem, and that's why everyone hates them.
 

EddyBearr

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While I don't know the exact source of that, there is stuff that supports this and I'm sure there are other people who will tell you the same and actually do have sources for it. I'm not frustrated that you have a different opinion, I'm frustrated that you ignore any evidence contradicting your opinion and continue to make claims about Sakurai's criteria that are simply not true, and lies about characters you don't support.
Your first sentence is not an argument, it's not a justification, and it's not evidence. It's just an apology. Saying "I'm sure there's evidence," or "I know there's evidence but I don't know it," doesn't do anything for credibility, it only goes to show your own personal resolve. Even if it was true, that you know 100% there's evidence of that, but can't bring it up, it does nothing for the person you are debating with. You can't just expect them to "take your word for it." There's too many variables that make that an implausible preposition, with the absolute most basic one being "it's a lie."
Your second sentence, I assume is a misguided criticism. I have argued time and time again: they might be variables. I am not saying they are 100%. If we lack evidence (re-read first paragraph if necessary) that they are or aren't variables (solid evidence. Not subjective interpretations as to why situations came to be,) then the only thing we have to work with are our own subjective systems of valuation in which we rate things based upon what we think, because we our who we are, is important.

The problem is, you're constantly saying things "are absolutely not factors," but you're never, ever supplying evidence. And so for people who look at indeed possible factors, and because of who they are, value them to a noticeable amount, you'll straight out tell them they're wrong as if it's an objective fact. This is on par with saying, "my values are right, yours are wrong, this is fact." You need evidence, (and once again, real evidence, not subjective interpretations of situations.)

For instance, if I say that Mewtwo didn't make it into Brawl because he fulfills the same niche as Lucario, and Lucario was more relevant, I'll tell you that this is my opinion based upon some things I value (fulfillment and variety in niches, relevancy).
If you want to disprove this as a possibility, then you need real evidence.
Real evidence: "Mewtwo and Lucario are completely different characters, and the only reason Mewtwo isn't in Brawl is because didn't have the time to code him. We never chose Lucario over him. We don't really care about how relevant something is either." - Quote from Sakurai, developer, or anyone else of that manner.
Not evidence: "Mewtwo obviously ran out of time for coding, because they're obviously very different. Sakurai just ran out of time." - Noah. (just an example, replace Noah with Obama if need be.)
The second example, the "not evidence," is a subjective interpretation of a situation based upon what you value and what you think is more probable.
 

EddyBearr

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Food items for Smash. What could be new food items?

Wrong thread.

New topic starter: Tetra is the most likely Zelda newcomer.

Tetra has great moveset potential, a unique playstyle, looks completely unique, and does will with the "4 pillars of success."

Appeal: The release of WWHD, even with less sales, has resparked interest. The prospect of playing as a pirate is very appealing. It's also a strong, less-girly female character, which some folks might feel is missing.
Style: Definitely would fit in smash, and the WW style is already immersed into Smash.
Unique: She's quite unique. There's some similarities with Sheik, but the radically different artstyle (and presumably, radically different physics [and radically different moveset potential due to lack of usable legs]) makes her quite different. Simultaneously, the pirate idea is pretty much a new one, and another female character is, of course, more unique than another male character.
Balance: It would help balance out the roster by making Toon Link less of an odd duckling, and allow for a "realistic vs toon" dichotomy to exist with characters that are technically "Zelda."

And to add with it, a Skyward Sword zelda artstyle is very unlikely. It would be very difficult for SS zelda to transition into Sheik, with Sheik given a "Shoo-in" pass, and it wouldn't be very unbalanced to see cartoony Zelda stand next to realistic Link.
 
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