...Wat. I specifically said that if you had aimed your insults at me, I would have been fine, but you're aiming them at everyone who likes Ghirahim.
You specifically said 'one-shot'. I was using one-shot and flavor of the month interchangebly because they mean the same thing. The masks never appeared again after MM. One-shot. They could have been added to future games (somehow, this is Nintendo we're talking about), but weren't. Flavor of the month. See? Totally interchangeble.
You know what? Do it. Cite your sources for SS. Heck, have them come here, since you don't seem kean at all with have a discussion. We bring legitamate sources, you say 'haha, they're being bribed'. I've read some of the reviews. There's no lies in them. This is why I want to see your sources, lest they be 'they changed it, so it sucks'. A game review is supposed to do things: Decide if the game was well-made, and Detail how the game plays so players can make their own descisions on whether to buy it. The second they say 'I didn't like it, and no one will' it is a bad review.
Okay, I'm going to be very, very clear with you. THIS IS SMASH BROS! The original smash had 4 mario characters, making 1/3 of the rooster. Melee had 7 Mario character, making up 25% of the rooster. Brawl had, again, 7 characters, making up about 1/5th of the rooster. The fact that bigger nintendo series gets more reps is a given in Smash Bros. It's always been that way. Get over it. Plenty of people like it that way, and saying it hurts Smash Bros is unfitting because Smash Bros is still going strong. This is what I'm getting at. Your's is one opinion. I'm not objecting to it, I'm objecting to the fact you believe everything should be done your way.
If you don't start citing sources, I'm done. I'm not gonna argue facts against opinions anymore. If you can't bring sources, your merely a troll.
Sources:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qAjK7wd5QE
http://www.screwattack.com/news/top-5-reasons-why-skyward-sword-awesome-and-sucks-top-10-review
http://www.1up.com/do/blogEntry?bId=9093308
http://www.gameinformer.com/blogs/members/b/the_towel_boy_blog/archive/2011/12/21/skyward-sword-worst-zelda-game-ever-according-to-the-escapist-39-s-ben-quot-yahtzee-quot-crosshaw.aspx
http://zeldadungeon.net/forum/f54/skyward-sword-worst-3d-zelda-title-26390.html
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards
https://boards.4chan.org/v/
Knock yourself out, that video review is very well made and comprehensive, I thouroughly recommend it. It breaks down everything in the game. No, I am by no means saying that SS is a BAD game. I'm simply saying it is the WEAKEST 3D Zelda.
Also, I recommend you stop taking "Official Reviewers" seriously if you want honest opinions on a game, especially considering their reviews essentially break down into this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIP73xIAPLU
Metacritic is a decent source, but the problem is that with fanboy heavy series (which is very common with Nintendo titles) the "true" score will be bumped up thoroughly by endless ZOMG 10/10 BEST GAIM EVAR, HURR DE HURR, scores from the fanbase.
Ultimately, what you can do is keep an open mind and ear and try to hear different points of view on the good and the bad of newer games. Review sites like IGN and the like are not credible sources, they are simply paid hype machines. Best thing to do in all honesty is to play the game yourself and make your own opinion. However since we're debating over the general opinion in retrospect to the Zelda series as a whole, MY and YOUR personal opinions are invalid.
Ok
1. a 3rd party does not have a greater chance then a nintendo character, no matter what nintendo character
2. Yet your dream roster had 9 pokemon characters and you say that it's 5 is one to many
3. Meta Critic has a 93% ranking based on 81 reviews with 1/3 being perfect
4. Those so called ****holes are added to metacritics score
http://www.metacritic.com/game/wii/the-legend-of-zelda-skyward-sword
5. Pokemon had 6 playable characters out of 39 characters in brawl
My reply above also applies to you. And one thing.
>1. a 3rd party does not have a greater chance then a nintendo character, no matter what nintendo character
You sure about that? Because Waluigi, a 1st party character, didn't make the cut for Brawl, while Sonic was pretty much guaranteed a spot once we saw Snake make the cut.
Oh, and for the Record, Pkmn Trainer/Unova Trainer are 1 character. If we go by that it's 4 in Brawl and 4 in my roster.
Hoo boy, from the >greentext attempts, the reaction images, mfw's and "hurr putting stupid things in quotes" deal, it looks like a 4channer's made it here to Smashboards. Wonderful.
I used to lurk these boards since back in 2005. I just recently came back since I've been banned from 4chan because of the new Nazi-Mods, and I was itching to discuss some Smash Bros.
Anyhow, a lot of this argument seems to stem from the fact that you seem to believe that there's not going to be any more characters past the four we have added for the three big series: Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon, which is an understandable line of thinking. I mean, there's no need to overcrowd the roster with too many characters from one series right? However, the fact stands that not only have we already had more per series (5 Mario Reps in Melee, 5 Zelda reps in Melee/Brawl if you count Zelda/Sheik as separate, and 6 Pokemon in Brawl if you count PT's mons individually), but that Brawl was originally going to have at least one more character for each series. Dr. Mario, Toon Zelda/Tetra, Mewtwo and supposedly Plusle and Minun were all going to be added to Brawl at one point or another. This would have brought the totals for each series (depending on how you view alts) to 5 Mario, 5-7 Zelda characters, and a whopping 6-9 Pokemon characters.
And before the whole "oh they were cut to keep reps down" thing gets brought up, it's been thoroughly proven and/or accepted that the reason for their removal was the addition of Sonic late into the game.
That is true, and I agree with your point of view. I'll take that into consideration. I still feel it'd be best to limit the roster capacity for the Big 3, in order for other IPs to show up. Also, keep in mind that over 100 new IPs have been created by Nintendo over the course of the Wii's lifespan. This was not the case back when Brawl came out. So now there is a higher demand for some of these newer IPs to get representation so that they may be further fleshed out in the future. Back when Brawl was coming out, most people simply wanted to see: SMRPG character, Pit, Toon Link, Ike and Lyn, Diddy Waluigi, Sonic, Isaac, and a handful more (what really surprised me was that the concept for the Pkmn trainer which I had read on here was actually fully implemented into the game). But for the most part, the support for lesser known, or newer IPs wasn't as strong. That's not the case anymore. If Operation Rainfall is to serve as an example, the fans DO have certain influence on Nintendo's decisions. So, if they are vocal enough and they get enough support, you can definitely see a more "balanced" Roster than, Big 3 + SF and Samus, with a couple 3rd party.
As for Bayonetta's chances, I personally really don't see why having a Nintendo exclusive sequel is really THAT big of a deal for her chances. I mean, Rayman has Rayman Legends as a Wii-U exclusive title, but I don't see people clamoring about how amazing his chances are, even with the fact that he fits the overall theme of Smash better. (Not saying that Bayonetta couldn't fit, Snake is proof enough that she could.)
This is just MY opinion and MY opinion alone. But to me it seems Ninty's direction with the WiiU is more of a balance b/w the casual, while looking to hook the "hardcore" audience. Things don't look too good for Sony at the moment, and many of their publishers are leaving them and heading over to Nintendo instead. The new Monster Hunter, originally as Sony Exclusive Franchise, is now Exclusive to the WiiU. Bayonetta, and all of Platinum Games, has headed over to working under Nintendo. Not to mention Ninty's pushing their console release with a bunch of notable titles such as Batman, AssCreed, and CowaDoody. Certainly not an approach they took with the Wii.
Therefore, in MY humble opinion, it seem's Ninty is pushing for the "more mature" Sony crowd (well really, the HARDCORE edgy teenagers, but who gives a damn). Well, that's if we look at the west, if we look towards the east instead, I think we get a clearer picture of what they want to draw in. More like a mix and match of the Otaku-Gamer. The kinds of hard core Asians that dominate at tourneys.
I'm basically using games like ProjectXZone as an example, but a slighly more mixed and varied fast fighter, with competitive potential, rather than an attempt at being a fanboy's wet dream like Brawl did. I think the fact that Sakurai said he wanted the game to play more like Melee is proof enough. But that's just my personal opinion (and hopes, give me Melee with a good online mainframe, and it's a 1st day buy for me).
Regarding Ghirahim and the whole debacle involving him, let's just do a quick mental exercise. If Sakurai HAD to include a fifth Zelda character, for whatever reason, and he had to pick one based on marketability, popularity and importance, who do you personally think he would choose? Toon Zelda is most likely done and dusted as an idea, MM Link would require an inordinate amount of work for a character that's no longer of importance, and Skull Kid and Zant, like you said, are old-time oneoffs. The only three characters that stand a decent chance are Tingle, Vaati, and Ghirahim. Tingle (thankfully) will most likely make the cut due to his general lack of fans, and while Vaati is a recurring villain in the series (and would be my personal choice for a fifth character), he seems to have fallen off Nintendo's radar as of late. The character that makes the most sense as a fifth Zelda rep is Ghirahim, as he fits all three of Sakurai's qualifications of importance, marketability and popularity. Despite whatever bias you may have against him (he's not personally my favorite Zelda character either) he's got a large fanbase, he's recent enough to still be marketable to those who haven't bought Skyward Sword yet, and he's important enough to the Zelda series as a whole, being the character that set everything in the series into motion, to deserve playability. Although he may not be liked by everyone, you and me included, it's pretty silly to claim that he's on the level of Zant and Waluigi in terms of chances.
Interesting point of view, I hadn't considered it that way. However, I think you are too quick to give Ghir more credit than he deserves.
First off, lets look at a gameplay standpoint, do we really NEED another speedy gay swordsman? I mean, we already have Marth. Ghirahim brings NOTHING new to the table in terms of playability. Oh look, ANOTHER ****ing clone. Thanks but no thanks. It's clear the Smash-fanbase is pretty vocal about their dislike toward clone characters.
Second, ok Toon Zelda is out, MM Link has very slim chances (unless we get a MM revival), Vaati, like you said, seems to have fallen off the Radar. But what about Ganon the Pig to complement Ganondorf? The blue ******* with the Trident? Ok, too retro? Fine, so, if we can't come up with a NEW Zelda newcomer, then that begs the question... Do we really NEED a Zelda Newcomer? There's no need to add anyone else in. Especailly since the Roster seems cramped for space. Why give the spot to a character that isn't optimal, when you could have a character from a different 1st party franchise that could bring other interesting playstyles to the table?
And as a final note, Pac-Man and Megaman are most likely going to be the only third parties added, if any. Travis, while cool, has nowhere near the amount of popularity, character weight, or overall importance to edge out either of these two. Hell, I'd put money on Rayman or Layton before I would on Travis. Megaman is EASILY the most requested third party right now, has had a long-standing history with Nintendo dating back to the NES, and has had NUMEROUS statements from Capcom devs saying that they would love to add him to the game. Pac-Man on the other hand, benefits from a number of different factors, mostly stemming from the fact that Namco is working on Smash 4. The Tekken and Soul Calibur producer has already said that he's not up for adding his characters, and most anything else that Namco has to offer is much too obscure to be viable (and yes, that goes for the Tales games as well). Pac-Man himself has appeared on almost every Nintendo console, and has crossed over with Mario not once, not twice, but THREE times. Pac-Man (and Ms. Pacman and Blinky) appeared in the two Mario Kart arcade games as playable characters, with their own tracks and everything. Meanwhile, Pac-Man Vs. for the Gamecube featured Mario as the announcer for the game. To say that any other Namco character stands a chance other than Pac-Man is ridiculous. Regarding their moveset potential, Megaman has years of games and the MVC series to pull from, and Pac-Man has more than enough material for a moveset thanks to Pac-Man World 2 and 3.
As much as I hate to say it, I have to admit you're right. Maybe not so much with Megaman, simply because sometimes fan outcry isn't enough. I still get the impression Capcom is having too good a time trolling it's fanbase to allow Megaman to grace the stages of Smash Bros. You saw the adaptation of Megaman in SFxTekken. It was brilliantly hilarious. Capcom is basically sticking the big middle finger to all of it's fans. Don't get em wrong, I'd love to see Megaman in Smash, I just don't see it happening with the current trends, MvC3 is another example.
As for Pacman, you're right and I totally agree. It's a shame, as KOS-MOS or Lloyd or Alisa would MUCH more interesting to play as in my opinion. But that's NAMCO's call, I guess one could say it falls out of even Sakurai's hands.
Overall, while you are entitled to you opinions, to say that others are outright wrong in theirs is taking it one step too far. I know 4chan can be a turbulent place and that it can affect how you interact on other websites (trust me, I frequent 4chan Smash threads from time to time), but here we try and take a little more of a relaxed, nonagressive approach. If you don't go out and jump at anyone, they're most likely not going to do anything of the sort to you, and we can avoid having arguments blow up like this from time to time.
Meh, I suppose, like I said, I'm permabanned from 4chan, so until I can ban evade, I'll probably stick around here. Hell maybe even after. But you are correct, 4chan does affect the way you interact in other virtual spaces, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. Behind the ****posting and aggression, there is a lot of truth and valuable and intelligent/tasteful points of view. It's not a stretch to say that the general opinion of the conglomerous 4chan hivemind, is for the most part in the right. However, such expression is better expressed through anonymity.
