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Roll>turnaround Utilt...info on the punishment punisher

PEEF!

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 25, 2008
Messages
5,201
PP does this all the time so i figured itd be worthwile to write up my observations of this trick.

What is it:
Roll, and at the end, do a turnaround uptilt.

What is the theory behind it/Why does it work?:
The first is that in smash rolling is considered bad and people like punishing rolls. Falco has a pretty good roll, so this trick is meant to take advantage of the 2 facts that people like to punish rolls and that Falco has a good one.

When to do it?
Defensively only, I am quite sure. Out of a shield, or out of a corner seem to be the most useful situations, because your opponent is usually overcome by the wolf's rage and is going at you no matter where you go. This works best against characters that are all about pressure and speed, so Falco, Fox, and Falcon are standout candidates. I'm sure PP has more uses that he can share.

Why do it?
PP may have more good reasons, but for now I see 2. The first is that if someone tries to punish your roll on instinct they will probably fail. If you want to see this in action watch Jman vs Dr. PeePee, especially the second match on Yoshi's. Jman attempts to punish PeePee's rolls and gets comboed mad hard for it alot. In theory, this means that unless your rolls are really predictable, you should be able to use them to get out of sticky situations. Either your opponent keeps getting uptilted then comboed, or they just let you roll. If they let you roll, that's awesome because then you have a way out of alot of tight spots.

How to do it?
This isn't the easiest thing in the world to do, but I've found ways that make it easier. The way I do it is I roll, then during the roll I put the control stick up and barely toward the direction that my roll went, and then as soon as the roll finishes, press A. This eliminates all the hard parts of the turnaround uptilt (not jumping, not upsmashing, not turning around) and replaces just a simple direction and A that is pretty easy to get right given that you have the entirety of the roll to imput it. PP may have a better way.

It pisses people off too!
 

ZoSo

Smash Champion
Joined
Jul 7, 2003
Messages
2,885
Location
Melee
Most characters' rolls are identical in terms of duration and invincibility, including Falco's.

I don't want to seem derisive, but there could be any number of reasons why Jman was failing to punish PP's rolls. To say that your opponent will "probably" fail if they try to punish your rolls comes across as pretty misinformed.

Falco's utilt is ridick though. Roll > shine is good too.
 

Dr Peepee

Thanks for Everything <3
Moderator
BRoomer
Joined
Sep 29, 2007
Messages
27,766
Location
Raleigh, North Carolina
I laughed really hard when I saw this thread title because I knew it was about me playing like an idiot. XD

I -usually- roll because I can usually tell when someone is going to commit hard to an approach, especially Fox(excluding Jiggz.....I'm workin on it).

Uptilt is just an amazing move. I've abused the heck out of it for so long haha.
I made a couple NC Falcos Utilt-wh0res just by playing them a lot. It's really fun to watch them fight because they don't always do it right so they sit around uptilting at each other sometimes LOL.
 

Charlesz

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 6, 2007
Messages
2,043
Wait so if this is timed right, this is like a shine out of roll?
 

bahamutz69

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Oct 5, 2008
Messages
342
Location
Oakland, CA
its pretty **** and i like the thread but also remember that if you do it enough people will start to anticipate the utilt and punish that as well

anyhow im gunna try this thang out
 

Mogwai

Smash Gizmo
BRoomer
Joined
Sep 30, 2006
Messages
10,449
Location
I want to expect better of you, but I know not to
lmao... this isn't really a strat...

turn around utilt is just a good default "oh ****, I ****ed up" action cause it's really fast and has good priority so that if they fail to punish, you **** them.

Wait so if this is timed right, this is like a shine out of roll?
errr... sorta, I guess, it's slower and has longer range, but I guess they're sorta similar in that they're ways to try to cover up a mistake.
 
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