Rock Paper Scissors

[Limeee]

1. I doubt people will want to do this for every single set.
2. I don't think we should stray to far away from SBR rules
3. It reduces the importance of the first match.
4. It takes away some of the potential of certain characters (I.E characters that do well on all or some stages)
5. Why fix what isn't broken?

 

[T-block]

Chill... we're just discussing =\

1) valid
2) SBR rules are pretty mediocre when it comes to stages
3) could easily be argued as a good thing
4) i could say that our current system inflates the potential of certain characters (that do well on all stages)... it's all relative
5) why not move to what's better? (not saying it is)

 

[x After Dawn x]

nah I don't think it's better in this case, there's no need to change things so drastically from the SBR rules and make everything so different =/

have you thought about changing stage striking just for the first match, though? like making a stage list with a low, odd number of stages (like say 11) and then getting people to stage strike all of them until 1 remains? it's REALLY tedious but I think overall more fair...but then again, people will be too lazy to do it so idk

btw I am thinking out loud right now, I'm bored

 

[T-block]

Tyler, you confuse me <3

Weren't you one of the ones that was so opposed to 7 starters? If I had my way, I'd go with either 9 or 11 stages, but people were already exploding over Halberd and PS1.

Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island
Lylat Cruise
Halberd
Pokemon Stadium 1
Delfino Plaza
Castle Siege
(Pictochat
Frigate Orpheon)

Overall I agree that it's more fair.

 

[Limeee]

Chill... we're just discussing =\

1) valid
2) SBR rules are pretty mediocre when it comes to stages
3) could easily be argued as a good thing
4) i could say that our current system inflates the potential of certain characters (that do well on all stages)... it's all relative
5) why not move to what's better? (not saying it is)

yeah i'm chill no worrys

i'm just saying, no one is gonna want to do this, as its very unpractical.

and as far as i can see, its not better.

 

[T-block]

Well, if you're thinking time-wise, it wouldn't actually take that much longer. If you consider how long some people tend to take CPing between games, we save some time by shortening that, since there's only two stages to pick from. As for being better... I really don't know lol

I'm only defending this because you're opposing it btw... all in all I think I'm slightly opposed to it as it is now.

 

[x After Dawn x]

well, it depends. I think if you're gonna add more stages to strike, it should be like an all or nothing kind of thing. I'm completely fine with the normal, 5 neutral stages kind of thing, but if we're gonna add more stages to it, I think it's only fair that all CPs would be added. If the general community feels that stages like delfino are categorized as being just as "fair" as pokemon stadium 1, then why not have them both in there? what if I feel that, say, castle siege feels completely fair to me in a specific matchup, but it's still not in that list of 7? if it's for the concern of people just being lazy and not doing it, then might as well stick to the 5 neutral list. but otherwise, I think they should all be added, but the issue of laziness / time arises again.

edit: also, I'm not really TOO opposed to having ps1 and halberd as neutral, I saw lots of people play on them and they seemed alright to me. I'm more opposed to the cps allowed like yoshi's pipes, hanenbow, etc.

 

[T-block]

Why do you think it should be an all-or-nothing thing? I don't see any real reason for that... In my opinion, it's just 11 > 9 > 7 > 5 > 3. Obviously increasing the number of starter stages can't make the first match less "fair" (in the absolute sense of the word), so why not increase it? As for people feeling a stage is fair, they're welcome to bring it up and we can debate its starter status, although it can quickly get into the grey area with anything past 7 imo. Also, we suck at debating >_<

 

[DTP]

Well, with the current stage list we have going, it would be nice to change some things in regards to counter picking.

There were a bunch of ideas mentioned already.

- Stage striking all of the stages? I think that one one.
- Stage strike all the stages at the start until 5 stages are left or whatever.
- Having 2 bans.

Might be more but I forgot.
Personally I'm up for trying any one of these. If no one wants to, then maybe the current stage list should just be looked at again and revised.

 

[Alphicans]

1. I doubt people will want to do this for every single set.
2. I don't think we should stray to far away from SBR rules
3. It reduces the importance of the first match.
4. It takes away some of the potential of certain characters (I.E characters that do well on all or some stages)
5. Why fix what isn't broken?

1. yeah

2. Why not? The rules haven't been updated in awhile, and they'll probably be changed.

3. The first match is already pretty over centralizing. Why should one match in the set be more important then the other one or two?

4. I'd classify that as showing their true potential, but in this case it's negative potential. It takes over hyped characters and cuts them down. Even MK would be hurt by this system.

5. The current system is pretty broken.

I was saying to mike that maybe we could fix the proposed system slightly. Instead of striking the full list to 5 or 3, cut it down to half. After you get down to half, strike those remaining ones till you have one match, and use that as your first stage in your first match. When match 1 is over, only use the remaining half stages for the next one or two matches. It uses this new system, and keeps a variety of CPs. Also bans would still be in place.

 

[DTP]

That sounds like a really good idea Luke.
Might have to bust out a piece of paper to keep track (At least I would lol) but it'll be worth it imo.

 

[T-block]

We can just use the Random Stage Select Screen like we always have lol... if we were to use Luke's suggestion I would say no bans after we get down to the 11 or so stages.

If we were to do something like this, I think I would turn on a lot of stages (Rumble Falls, Big Blue, Onett, Green Hill Zone, Corneria, Skyworld, possibly Bridge of Eldin). I like it actually... it's a system that rewards playing more than one character, which is something I want to do (allows you to deal with more stages so you can focus on getting rid of what's good for your opponent instead of what's bad for you), while slightly nerfing the power of CPing (it's far less likely to end up in a one-sided situation [Diddy on FD, MK on Port Town] I think...this is where I'd have to do some trial runs).

Also, you could consider "random" stages like Wario Ware and Mario Bros. Leaving stages like this on automatically slightly handicaps the better player, the pressure is on the stronger player to strike these stages to be assured of the win.

 

[Fraser]

God this thread hurts me a little bit more everytime I see it. Wasn't Alberta's stage list enough of a joke already guys? Are we trying to be made fun of here? I just dont think rumble falls and mario bros have any place in competetive smash and Mike's argument about them neutralizing good players makes them even less valid because the current system is designed to make the better player win even if they lose on the other guys Mickey Mouse cp. I don't think this stage system is valid as it rewards stage knowledge more than matchup knowledge as almost all of the matchup discussion have advice pertaining to actual stages as well as what to ban and what to strike. Also we are already attempting to implement a mid teir event at the next monthly why don't we try sticking to one radical change per month(or at least try this method with one of the smaller less legit events like low teir) Also on friday Luke Tyler and I will test this method extensively and see how it works with just our characters

 

[x After Dawn x]

We can just use the Random Stage Select Screen like we always have lol... if we were to use Luke's suggestion I would say no bans after we get down to the 11 or so stages.

If we were to do something like this, I think I would turn on a lot of stages (Rumble Falls, Big Blue, Onett, Green Hill Zone, Corneria, Skyworld, possibly Bridge of Eldin). I like it actually... it's a system that rewards playing more than one character, which is something I want to do (allows you to deal with more stages so you can focus on getting rid of what's good for your opponent instead of what's bad for you), while slightly nerfing the power of CPing (it's far less likely to end up in a one-sided situation [Diddy on FD, MK on Port Town] I think...this is where I'd have to do some trial runs).

Also, you could consider "random" stages like Wario Ware and Mario Bros. Leaving stages like this on automatically slightly handicaps the better player, the pressure is on the stronger player to strike these stages to be assured of the win.

What the ****, Mike.

Seriously. Too far.

God this thread hurts me a little bit more everytime I see it. Wasn't Alberta's stage list enough of a joke already guys? Are we trying to be made fun of here? I just dont think rumble falls and mario bros have any place in competetive smash and Mike's argument about them neutralizing good players makes them even less valid because the current system is designed to make the better player win even if they lose on the other guys Mickey Mouse cp. I don't think this stage system is valid as it rewards stage knowledge more than matchup knowledge as almost all of the matchup discussion have advice pertaining to actual stages as well as what to ban and what to strike. Also we are already attempting to implement a mid teir event at the next monthly why don't we try sticking to one radical change per month(or at least try this method with one of the smaller less legit events like low teir) Also on friday Luke Tyler and I will test this method extensively and see how it works with just our characters

 

[T-block]

God this thread hurts me a little bit more everytime I see it.

You could try actually reading the thread? Do you actually read what we're saying? Or do you just see us talking about stages and automatically go into a rant about how much you love the old system? We're looking at this as a possibility, nothing more -_-

Wasn't Alberta's stage list enough of a joke already guys? Are we trying to be made fun of here?

No, it never was a joke actually.

I just dont think rumble falls and mario bros have any place in competetive smash and Mike's argument about them neutralizing good players makes them even less valid because the current system is designed to make the better player win even if they lose on the other guys Mickey Mouse cp.

It was a THOUGHT, not an argument. SLIGHTLY handicapping the better player was just an interesting CONCEPT. I never stated an opinion on whether it was a good or bad thing. You need to think about it within the context of the new system... basically what I'm saying is that the weaker player will get to strike one or two more stages. When we're striking out of 20+ stages, the advantage gained from that is very slight. The thing I find interesting about it is that it does the handicapping naturally. We could instate a rule giving the weaker player more strikes (NOT saying we should), but that would involve some sort of judgement as to who the weaker player is. This way, IF WE WANTED TO DO THAT, we don't have to make such a judgement.

I don't think this stage system is valid as it rewards stage knowledge more than matchup knowledge as almost all of the matchup discussion have advice pertaining to actual stages as well as what to ban and what to strike.

I wouldn't say it rewards stage knowledge MORE than matchup knowledge. It does reward stage knowledge more than the previous system, but in a different way. In any case, rewarding stage knowledge is not a bad thing by any means.

Also we are already attempting to implement a mid teir event at the next monthly why don't we try sticking to one radical change per month(or at least try this method with one of the smaller less legit events like low teir)

I never intended to use this system at this monthly. If you had read the thread you would have known that.

Also on friday Luke Tyler and I will test this method extensively and see how it works with just our characters

Maybe I'll come ^^

 

[Limeee]

You could try actually reading the thread? Do you actually read what we're saying? Or do you just see us talking about stages and automatically go into a rant about how much you love the old system? We're looking at this as a possibility, nothing more -_-

possibilities turn into reality buddy, were just hoping you don't make another radical change



No, it never was a joke actually.

yes it was, remember the east coast players?

It was a THOUGHT, not an argument. SLIGHTLY handicapping the better player was just an interesting CONCEPT. I never stated an opinion on whether it was a good or bad thing. You need to think about it within the context of the new system... basically what I'm saying is that the weaker player will get to strike one or two more stages. When we're striking out of 20+ stages, the advantage gained from that is very slight. The thing I find interesting about it is that it does the handicapping naturally. We could instate a rule giving the weaker player more strikes (NOT saying we should), but that would involve some sort of judgement as to who the weaker player is. This way, IF WE WANTED TO DO THAT, we don't have to make such a judgement.

How is handicapping the better player an interesting concept
competition /=/ fun or interesting things
its just fun for people who find competetion fun and/or interesting



I wouldn't say it rewards stage knowledge MORE than matchup knowledge. It does reward stage knowledge more than the previous system, but in a different way. In any case, rewarding stage knowledge is not a bad thing by any means.
legito, but this will **** us over if we ever try to go to another region, and realize we can only play well on mario party stages


I never intended to use this system at this monthly. If you had read the thread you would have known that.
Its the fear that this "possibility" might turn into a reality

dur dur dur

my responses in the bold, don't take em too seriously i probably said alot of stupid things

 

[T-block]

My changes weren't even that radical in the first place lol... changing the stage selection process would be a lot more radical than adding more stages.

The east coast players are whatever... they never respected us anyways, so I don't see why people care so much about what they think of our stages. If you're desperate for recognition, go over there to play and show your stuff. Changing to a super conservative list would not improve their opinion of us.

The "random" stage addition was just an observation. I think it's a bad idea too, so let's forget I ever said it if you're all so hung up on it lol

 

[KarlR]

as an example: adding bridge of eldin or shadow moses would be good counter picks against metaknight, who imo is a pretty gay char. adding these stages would help a lower tier against him.

people should really head over to the stage discussion forum and READ the **** threads in there before going on rants about stages, i can say i qq'd to mike about these stages before i went and read up that forum.

and the jokes on EC for being close minded and not trying different stages out

lets see # of radical changes for this monthly: none.

mid tier isnt really radical at all and mostly everyone i talked to was in favor of it

 

[Limeee]

i'm still convinced its not a good idea, i pretty much agree with what tyler bolded in frasers post

 

[KarlR]

it doesn't neutralize good players, good players will still be good players -_-

what it could do is neutralize a few of the top tiers

and when did anyone say it was a good idea lol, it was mostly an interesting thought to ponder and discuss.

 

[SuPeRbOoM]

so when is mike changing the stage list back to normal?

 

[T-block]

When I start taking first in doubles and singles, Dan.

Giving the weaker player more strikes when there are 20+ stages is such a small advantage that it shouldn't even affect the outcome of the match. Think about it... it was an interesting observation - that's all.

 

[MeSSi]

So as it turns out the videos for the last RPS and Alberta beatdown were uploading last night.... but halfway through the day Ash's computer crashed (probably from overheating) and now he has to re-edit all the videos... which means that they will not be up by friday or saturday. Sorry for the delay and i dont know when Ash has time to edit the videos and upload them again... he said he will try to get them ASAP but it might be next week. again were sorry for the wait... i was hoping to see Jack vs minus (real good set)

and on another note... wilson wont be at the next monthly ... I might need a partner (Mike wong maybe... for some reason i team with asian people) or maybe brandon (sonic and snake?) PM me if u guys are interested.

 

[T-block]

I'll most likely be teaming with Colin again... one of these days I'd love to team with you though <3

Don't worry about the vids... it's all good. Although I'm wondering why you have to re-edit them... if you've edit and rendered, they should be on the hard drive somewhere. Unless they got corrupted during upload?

 

[DTP]

k so it turns out I work on the 27th lol
I can't take it off or switch shifts either. Already tried.

BUT, I start work at 4 so I can at least play for a couple hours.



And lol, you guys ***** alot.

 

[x After Dawn x]

Maybe I'll come ^^

lol...I don't think you understand

we're playing drunk smash, brawl + melee

 

[KarlR]

1 beer and mike will be done ;p , i kid i kid

 

[T-block]

wowowow where did you get that from -_-

this ain't charles

 

[Yoshara]

OK, so is the idea for striking every stage (and banned stages) being used, and if so is it gonna be used in pools? If it is then I can already say that most people will probably just agree to Battlefield (or Smashville) instead of going through the process of striking 20+ stages because of how tidious and long it would be, thus removing stage striking altogether.

 

[Frio]

I'd strike 20+ stages. And I'd stike all the neutral and cp stages first

 

[Yoshara]

That is actually what I would do too.

 

[Limeee]

i happen to enjoy the original system

 

[T-block]

So today we were at Sean's house, having a lovely day of smash, when suddenly, we were coerced into playing something competitive Mario Party by the one and only Colin Fitzpatrick. "I'm gonna **** you all at Mario Party", he said. "I am the champion of competitive Mario Party. Does anyone want to money match me?". Having no choice, we reluctantly agreed to being the random luckfest.

The stage was set. Pyramid Park... 8 pm... FOUR PERSON FREE FOR ALL MADNESS. It begins.

I'm tired of typing like this, so long story short:

Colin was in last place the whole game, continuously saying how he was going to comeback. He almost did, just off of first place by the second last turn. Then he got ***** and ended up in last place by a long shot looool.

So next time he feels like claiming to be the master of competitive Mario Party, feel free to call him on his bull****.

 

[Limeee]

So today we were at Sean's house, having a lovely day of smash, when suddenly, we were coerced into playing something competitive Mario Party by the one and only Colin Fitzpatrick. "I'm gonna **** you all at Mario Party", he said. "I am the champion of competitive Mario Party. Does anyone want to money match me?". Having no choice, we reluctantly agreed to being the random luckfest.

The stage was set. Pyramid Park... 8 pm... FOUR PERSON FREE FOR ALL MADNESS. It begins.

I'm tired of typing like this, so long story short:

Colin was in last place the whole game, continuously saying how he was going to comeback. He almost did, just off of first place by the second last turn. Then he got ***** and ended up in last place by a long shot looool.

So next time he feels like claiming to be the master of competitive Mario Party, feel free to call him on his bull****.

LMAO, i should've came today.

i heard your jiggs ***** everyone

 

[Alphicans]

Tyler, Fraser and I played some drunk smash, but in the midst of it all we tried the stage striking proposal. Fraser said he was going to apologize about beaking the system, and it worked out quite nicely.

 

[KarlR]

LMAO, i should've came today.

i heard your jiggs ***** everyone

Indeed you should have, missed out on GOOD TIMES with melee. The match on luck party 7 was pretty epic and hilarious. Ya mikes jiggs was owning us nicely, my dr mario is pretty fail rofl. you also missed me ra.ping colins snake BAHAAHA.


AHAHA

 

[T-block]

Haha last night was pretty fun... I just realized my Mario Party post is pretty incoherent lol... I guess I was laughing too hard typing it.

I actually tried this new striking system today with my brother.

First match characters: PT, Lucas
Strike down to 7 stages: Luigi's Mansion, Rumble Falls, Halberd, Yoshi's Island (Melee), Corneria, Smashville, Onett (I think...not sure of the last one)
Strike down to 1 stage for first match: Luigi's Mansion
T-block wins
Tokaio CP's Rumble Falls
T-block chooses Game and Watch
Tokaio chooses Wario
Tokaio wins
T-block CP's Corneria
Tokaio chooses Lucas
T-block chooses Olimar
T-block wins

I think overall it was a very fair set

 

[x After Dawn x]

Tyler, Fraser and I played some drunk smash, but in the midst of it all we tried the stage striking proposal. Fraser said he was going to apologize about beaking the system, and it worked out quite nicely.

I don't even remember how it turned out

also I only have $5 left in my wallet and I don't know why =/

edt: oh I remember getting jv4 stocked in brawl by luke LOL, it was against ICs and I don't remember who I was playing

 

[Alphicans]

You were ganon. I said it was a 100-0 match-up, you said it was 95-5 meaning you had a 5% chance of winning and that you were gonna own me. I said that I was gonna JV 4 stock you, and I did >_>.

You kept claiming you were theshizwiz.

 

[Frio]

Like I would've gone. But you guys wanted to get drunk :/ the only legit one is fraser cause he's 18

EDIT: **** I rly want to brawl