Robotic Counterpicking (updated as of 4/06/09)

[Jamnt0ast]

I agree on the camping and transformation dtilts, but your dsmash can be teched so easily on the windmill it's stupid. You dont want to take D3, Falco, MK, GnW or Snake there though because of the high ceiling and the fact that it is a better counterpick for all of them.

 

[Sudai]

If someone tech's the windmill, you USmash them. You shouldn't be mindlessly spamming DSmash under a ceiling, you watch and react.

I'd personally like a high ceiling vs D3 and Snake, but not MK or GnW. It's part of the reason I take both to Japes..don't see why you wouldn't want a high ceiling, you can only DI a BAir so much, so just use that to kill instead of NAir. The high ceiling means you live longer from their UTilts, but they don't really live longer from your BAir at all.

That said, yes, there are much better CPs.

 

[JCaesar]

/agrees with Sudai

I much prefer a high-ceiling stage against DDD and Snake, and one with plenty of room to camp. I think it's easier to gimp them than to outright kill them (moreso for Snake). The longer ROB lives the better.

 

[Jamnt0ast]

I mean the high ceiling with minimal effective projectile camping. I would take a Snake to Japes which has a high cieling. I prefer D3 on brinstar though because it pwns him 99.9% of the time.

 

[GwJ]

How does brinstar help you over DDD? I know he can't CG effectively, but what else? I'm not well-versed at all in the DDD matchup.

 

[Raffi815]

I'd never cp jungle japes as R.O.B.
Next time I fight a D3 main I'm gonna try cping brinstar and see if it's actually a good stage against him.

 

[★J.G WentWorth★]

I'd never cp jungle japes as R.O.B.

You can't be serious!

I'm also curious as to what else R.O.B has on DDD on brinstar. lol Brinstar is usually my ban.

 

[Mr.E]

I did some theorycrafting in the Dedede topic about Brinstar. JJ is easily the best CP, meaning it's probably going to be banned by any sensible D3, and I assume Orpheon would probably be good against him too. As for Brinstar...

It's too small to camp, which usually isn't a good thing against Dedede. However, the fact his CG is basically useless here removes most of the need to camp him. (The other reason to camp him is simply because he's a gigantic, slow-*** target.) There's no way he can edgeguard you because the terrain is so broken-up and you can fly through the floor. And you could probably camp quite effectively if you focus on keeping the stage split by keeping the "energy tanks" broke whenever they reform, like you took JJ's platforms and widened the gap between them.

All theoretical, though. Lain always plays his D3 against me instead of IC's, though, mebbe next time I see the MI guys I'll try Brinstar to see if it's as effective as it seems it could be. I don't see much reason to BAN it, though. Why would Dedede want to take ROB to Brinstar? I'd ban Rainbow Cruise before anything, FD is obvious, and I'd look out for any stages with walls or walk-offs (such as Delfino) before Brinstar pops into my mind. (I actually like Delfino, but most people don't.)

 

[JCaesar]

I like Delfino against DDD too. So much room to run away, and the go-through floors are amazing vs DDD. I wouldn't CP it but I wouldn't ban it either.

I've never tried it, but I think Brinstar could work against DDD. ROB ***** DDD if he can stay underneath, which is very easy on Brinstar (and when the lava rises, just camp on the other side). 2 or 3 hovered uairs in a row from under the stage will shieldpoke guaranteed and score some great damage.

 

[★J.G WentWorth★]

So I usually Ban Brinstar but I'm going to start using it more.
What do you guys usually ban?

 

[Jamnt0ast]

Brinstar is easily my favorite stage on D3. It screws up his ledge camping because of lava, his ground game is trashed, and you can uair/ attack through the bottom with little to no punishment! Give it a try. I find it much less irritating than the campfest you get on JJ.

 

[GwJ]

I usually ban BF. It just seems to help most others than it helps ROB in particular.

 

[jjvirus]

Regardless of the matchup I ALWAYS ban BF. I dont know if thats such a smart idea, but I find it to be safer to ban BF than any other stage since 1. I suck on platforms (johnz), 2. ROB sucks there for the most part.

 

[★J.G WentWorth★]

I know R.O.B gets punished hard when he's on the platforms since his weakest spot is under him. But BF is my favorite Neutral, I feel like R.O.B has so much control on that stage. Yoshi's Island is definately my worst Neutral by far because of the gyro shenanigans.

 

[JCaesar]

Really? My favorite neutrals are Yoshi's and Smashville because of the different unorthodox ways you can use the gyro (bouncing off the balloon/shooting it into angled parts of the stage).

 

[Nintendevil]

I really have no idea what I'm good on but I like SV >___> thatsit

 

[Jamnt0ast]

In certain matchups i feel that BF is advantagious to rob.

 

[Sudai]

Yoshi's island has become my favorite. I tend to strike Smashville since that's what almost every match-up plays on via striking...so I like to throw people for a loop. I've since learned most of the silly shots you can do with lasers and gyros on all the slants. Ever killed a Snake with a fully charged laser off the top of the screen while they recover? I have. It feels great. ; )

It's also a long stage and the ledges tend to help when it comes to ledge camping vs certain characters and it definitely makes getting off the ledge easier when you can make a gyro linger in the air for 3-4 seconds as a shield. There's just a -lot- about it that I love.

 

[Mr.E]

I don't like not being able to fly under the stage, though, and the support ghost can save bad recoveries. ;(

 

[Commander_Beef]

Another great counterpick stage is Lylat Cruise. This is only against certain characters, but I am not sure which ones.

 

[Jamnt0ast]

Another great counterpick stage is Lylat Cruise. This is only against certain characters, but I am not sure which ones.

It's a good all around stage. Just dont cp it vs anyone with an up B that can stage spike in any way shape or form. (kirby, ike, marth, mk, etc)

 

[Nefarious B]

I really like lylat vs Falco since you can aim your laser around the slanted stage but he can't.

 

[Raffi815]

I disagree cping RC against a wario.
Not really a good idea >.>

 

[GwJ]

He's too air-maneuverable. I usually take him to frigate. Not a lot of airspace yet a good ROB stage too.

 

[JCaesar]

Yeah, vs Wario I like having platforms to hide under. It really limits his approaches. And all his sh approaches are easily ftilted.

 

[GwJ]

I know I can't play Brawl right now, but where do you guys counterpick Sonics? I play Camalange way too much and I'm stuck on where to take him.

 

[jjvirus]

Rainbow Cruise is what I'd do.

 

[JCaesar]

You have to counterpick a Sonic? Shame!

Iunno, Frigate, RC, Japes maybe?

 

[Sudai]

I personally take Sonics to Japes. Spring > UAir is easy to avoid, but this just means it doesn't matter even if they do. Also means they can't approach with grounded spins. If thye ban it, I go to RC because they can't really approach with grounded spins there either.

 

[GwJ]

He's a really good Sonic. I didn't have as much trouble at first but I play him so much we know each others styles. Sonic is just a lot more random than ROB is.

 

[goodkid]

are u guys sure Rob beats Peach on Brinstar? I've done really well vs. Rob on this stage not even knowing that he did well on this stage. Peach can avoid a lot of his tricks, except his aerials off-stage but can DI out of them.

 

[Mr.E]

Other than being in the OP, I see no actual discussion as to why ROB would be good (or bad) against Peach on Brinstar. It's largely considered a poor ROB stage and doesn't do anything bad to Peach, so I don't see why ROB would particularly want to go there. I'd rather take her to Orpheon, because of the missing ledge, or any number of stages that take advantage of her poor jumping ability, especially Rainbow Cruise.

 

[JCaesar]

Yeah, no way would I ever take a Peach to Brinstar. FD would be my first choice, then Frigate.

 

[jjvirus]

Whoever says RC is a good CP for Wario is ****ing ********....I keep losing to Warios there <_<

The stage doesn't help to gimp him at all...

 

[Jamnt0ast]

Brinstar has become my favoirite CP by FAR. I would take ANY CHARACTER to that stage save for DK, Snake, and Toon Link

 

[jjvirus]

.....how about Wario?

 

[Jamnt0ast]

Updated to keep more recent.... nothing huge.

and yes i love taking wario there too

 

[JCaesar]

Care to elaborate why?

 

[jjvirus]

Seriously...Im lost as hell XD Also....why Lucario on Brinstar....? and why not Dk on Japes?

 

[GwJ]

DK is better than you'd think on Japes. There are better choices, like Frigate or Rainbow Cruise. DK can survive well past 200% with good DI and kills well and early too.