Robin Patch Notes - 1.1.0 - AND THEN THERE WAS BUFFS

[XXII FOOL]

Speaking as a main with throw combos:

Have any of you guys tried looking into footstool stuff out of Dthrow? If its super low I'd imagine there is a percent range where it could land, and then hit them with Dair right afterwards during their footstool bounce off of the stage floor (like how Ike can). Follow ups after that Dair might be possible as well. When Ike does it at low percents, he can wrack up some 40+% damage.

I can't look into it myself, I don't have the patch yet.

EDIT: or foostool out of Arcthunder maybe, follow that one up with the dair and see if there are any combos that can happen after?

Robin has no known jab locks which makes footstools much less useful... and levin dair is pretty laggy, such that she cant really follow up a down air low to the ground fast enough. The only thing i could ever see anyone using is down throw --> arcthunder --> immediate footstool and throwing an arcfire right on top of them so that when invincibility ends they get hit.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Our Dair is complete *** and doesn't auto-cancel. Might be worth looking into, but I wouldn't expect anything revolutionary.

Your Levin Sword Dair hits before Ike's Dair does (13 vs 16 frames), so landing it should be no problem. You only have a few more frames of landing lag as well from what I could see by digging through Kurogane and has the same sort of "autocancel" time of after frame 48.

From what I understand on the Ike side of things, you guys should be able to get something I would think. *shrugs*

 

[Mr. Johan]

Ragnell is longer than the Levin Sword though, so Ike can snag the hit he's looking for with some leeway, right?

The opponent can't do anything out of Footstool if he hits the ground, so the timing is totally on the Robin and Ike. Even if Robin gets his out faster, because he "autocancels" at the same time as Ike, he experiences 3 frames more downtime than Ike does, which gives the opponent three additional frames to DI and escape. Combine that with the lesser range, and Robin is left with a very precise window to properly capitalize a Dair ground spike compared to Ike.

Only time we'd ever use Dair from Arcthunder is directly out of Arcthunder itself, at the ledge.

 

[•Col•]

Your Levin Sword Dair hits before Ike's Dair does (13 vs 16 frames), so landing it should be no problem. You only have a few more frames of landing lag as well from what I could see by digging through Kurogane and has the same sort of "autocancel" time of after frame 48.

From what I understand on the Ike side of things, you guys should be able to get something I would think. *shrugs*

It's impossible to land dair off of a footstool with Robin. It has to do with his floatiness/jump speed.. Literally the only move Robin has that he can use to hit someone from a footstool (other than throwing/dropping tomes), is Elwind. That being said, Footstool->Elwind is a guaranteed spike if you input it fast enough..

Dthrow->Footstool->Elwind spike could perhaps be a thing you can do near the edge of the stage.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Hrm

Well, at least you guys have two new ledge traps out of this patch then? (Dthrow -> Footstool -> Elwind, and Arcthunder an offstage target -> Dair)

 

[Sidhe Sí]

So what aerials does DThrow go into now? I know UAir is possible at certain percents, but i've not messed about with Robin yet, so i'm not sure about his FAir/NAir ect.

 

[theyellowflash26]

So what aerials does DThrow go into now? I know UAir is possible at certain percents, but i've not messed about with Robin yet, so i'm not sure about his FAir/NAir ect.

You can do anything your dreams can dream off of it. Literally there's p much no limit. You can do aerials, frame traps, projectiles, baits, and setups. Whatever you want man. It's great. I now have an actual reason to go for grab after arcthunder or arcfire. I almost never used grab before except for a shield grab situation and even then I'd just back throw to get them away. But now I have this godlike stuff to play with. I just got done playing with a friend and I was able to pull off arcthunder>grab>d throw> u air a couple times. It felt great killing like that.

 

[Sidhe Sí]

Well that's just lovely! At least he has another way to throw out his fantastic aerials without having to risk a shield grab or follow up too much, given that they are arguably one of the best sets of aerials in the game.

 

[ShadowKing]

hes/her gotten a lot of good buffs but from experience his/hers arcfire comes out faster

 

[Sidhe Sí]

hes/her gotten a lot of good buffs but from experience his/hers arcfire comes out faster

It does feel like it, to be honest. Although it seems any moves that look faster are still the same, to my knowledge at least.

 

[XXII FOOL]

It does feel like it, to be honest. Although it seems any moves that look faster are still the same, to my knowledge at least.

Still can't do arcfire to dair so yeah, most likely unchanged

 

[theyellowflash26]

I'm pretty sure arcfire is still the same frame wise.

 

[Sidhe Sí]

I'm pretty sure arcfire is still the same frame wise.

Damn, that sucks. I was kinda wishing it was faster.

 

[Moydow]

Exact numbers for Thunder + d-throw frame data changes, from here:

Robin's Thunder total frames reduced by 3 frames, from 42 -> 39 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Elthunder total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 54 -> 44 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Arcthunder total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 54 -> 44 (this excludes minimum charge which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Thunder+ total frames reduced by 3 frames, from 52 -> 49 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Elthunder+ total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 64 -> 54 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Arcthunder+ total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 64 -> 54 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Speed Thunder total frames reduced by 3 frames, from 36 -> 33 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's Speed Elthunder total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 48 -> 38 (this excludes minimum charge time)

Robin's Speed Arcthunder total frames reduced by 10 frames, from 48 -> 38 (this excludes minimum charge time which would add 7 frames)

Robin's down throw total frames reduced by 6 frames, from 43 -> 37.

 

[sunfallSeraph]

Exact numbers for Thunder + d-throw frame data changes, from here:

10 whole frames off all Elthunder and Arcthunder variants, we're zapping fools like now.

 

[Sidhe Sí]

My boy Robin is lookin' like Raiden with all these thunder buffs xD

 

[TheBlueBlur]

I don't know about you, but I'd say having Down-Throw combos is a pretty significant buff.

wow... 1 combo... robin now is op...
cmon...

 

[TheBlueBlur]

Lol.

How could you possibly think our aerials need LESS lag?

We only take 2/4 frames on soft/hard landing because of autocancels. It's literally godlike.

Robin is not the only one who needs less ending or landing lag in his aereals(Or maybe reduce ending lag of arcfire). Look ganondorf, they gave him more power that doesn't need

Like i said: ornament buffs

 

[Raziek]

Robin is not the only one who needs less ending or landing lag in his aereals(Or maybe reduce ending lag of arcfire). Look ganondorf, they gave him more power that doesn't need

Like i said: ornament buffs

I..... don't know how you could possibly be more wrong, and the fact that you don't immediately see why tells me you probably won't get it.

 

[XXII FOOL]

Robin is not the only one who needs less ending or landing lag in his aereals(Or maybe reduce ending lag of arcfire). Look ganondorf, they gave him more power that doesn't need

Like i said: ornament buffs

Sorry, but a combo throw she previously didn't have that leads to amazing damage options and guaranteed kill options is a significant buff. Less endlag on arcthunder and it's new ease in giving you grabs / followups also makes her much more of a threat in neutral.

We can't all have sheik aerials.

 

[drogoth232]

Dantarion accidentally took down the mastercore dump, but he'll also be putting up article information.

I'll report the info as soon as I see it. Unless someone else posted it already lol

 

[Raziek]

Honestly even the ELTHUNDER endlag buff (10 frames) is HUGE for our neutral game.

 

[TheBlueBlur]

Sorry, but a combo throw she previously didn't have that leads to amazing damage options and guaranteed kill options is a significant buff. Less endlag on arcthunder and it's new ease in giving you grabs / followups also makes her much more of a threat in neutral.

We can't all have sheik aerials.

I understand what you are saying but you can not depend on 1 combo

 

[theyellowflash26]

I understand what you are saying but you can not depend on 1 combo

Its not one combo. It's the option to even have combos. Its the option to set stuff up, to get more damage or even a kill. If you don't think thats beneficial I don't think anyone can help...

 

[sunfallSeraph]

What we should probably be looking into now is what our most optimal combos are for damage and kill potential. I'm thinking Wind Jab, Utilt, and obviously Uair will be the bread and butter followups from Dthrow with Ftilt, Nair, and Fair serving as mixups. What about Arcthunder? I'd think the most reliable combo would be Arc -> Dthrow -> % dependent followup since you don't have to be close to get the grab. Obviously point-blank Arc has anything you want, but it will be harder to land that consistently. I'm guessing the most damage will come from smashes in that situation, provided you don't need Nos heals. Thoughts?

 

[theyellowflash26]

What we should probably be looking into now is what our most optimal combos are for damage and kill potential. I'm thinking Wind Jab, Utilt, and obviously Uair will be the bread and butter followups from Dthrow with Ftilt, Nair, and Fair serving as mixups. What about Arcthunder? I'd think the most reliable combo would be Arc -> Dthrow -> % dependent followup since you don't have to be close to get the grab. Obviously point-blank Arc has anything you want, but it will be harder to land that consistently. I'm guessing the most damage will come from smashes in that situation, provided you don't need Nos heals. Thoughts?

Arcthunder to grab has been a pretty good punish for me so far. I'm liking it a lot since I end up getting big dmg off it. But I do agree that optimal stuff is pretty important since we want all the dmg we can get.

 

[Nah]

We got endlag reductions on Thunder and Eltunder in addition to Arcthunder too?

Sakurai was hella generous to us this patch

 

[Moydow]

Rolls and spot dodges were universally nerfed.
Robin now becomes vulnerable on frame 19 of a spot dodge (formerly 20), and on frame 20 of a forward or back roll (formerly 21).

 

[drogoth232]

Alright, these changes are probably already listed, but I'm gonna list them again in case someone missed 'em.

Thunder got a damage increase by 1.5%
Elthunder got the same buff
Arcthunder got the same buff
Thoron got the same buff

His rolls were all reduced by 1 frame, which we know is universal
One of his throws (not his u throw), most likely his dthrow got a cd reduction
from 44 to 38
Then the rest of the data should be his specials and I believe their customs, as well. For sure it's his specials, but I can't conclusively determine if it includes customs.

Again, you guys probably tested this to death and this is kinda more for reassuring myself that he got some pretty damn good buffs!

 

[941]

This might move Robin from high D-tier all the way to low C-tier.

 

[theyellowflash26]

Thoron got a damage buff too?? Nice.

 

[XXII FOOL]

This might move Robin from high D-tier all the way to low C-tier.

Yeah... robin is really player dependent. Can't get consistent results like sheik or other high tiers without dedication and knowledge. Any improvements she receives are nice, though.

 

[Nah]

Preeeeeeety sure that Thoron does the same damage it's always done

 

[Raziek]

This might move Robin from high D-tier all the way to low C-tier.

*rolls eyes*

Robin is definitely top 20 right now, possibly even top 15.

 

[XXII FOOL]

*rolls eyes*

Robin is definitely top 20 right now, possibly even top 15.

Agreed. When played smart and to the fullest, robin is more than capable of standing toe to toe with high tiers.

 

[theyellowflash26]

*rolls eyes*

Robin is definitely top 20 right now, possibly even top 15.

Wow. You think so?

 

[941]

That seems pretty optimistic to me, but even so, top 20 out of 55 isn't that great.

 

[RevolverTurtle]

Really happy about these buffs, Robin deserves it because of all the hard work people have to put into this character since he's so complicated to play properly. Still nothing brain dead though which makes him really fun to play and mega satisfying when you completely outplay your opponent.

Also, Thoron buff?? I always opt for Arcthunder before Thoron but is the change in knockback significant because of the damage buff?

 

[Pegasus Knight]

Wait, does d-throw actually combo? Every time I go for stuff they just jump out. Or rather, anything I go for other than jab/utilt can be escaped. Arcthunder, etc. are not combos in my experience? What am I doing wrong?

 

[PK Gaming]

*rolls eyes*

Robin is definitely top 20 right now, possibly even top 15.

I think it's a little early to make any definitive declarations on his tier placement. Robin is a lot better than before and we should all be very thankful for that, but it's still too early to call a tier placement for her.