Rex Drives into Battle! (...As Pyra's Final Smash!!)

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Again? Is it just a revolving door? What more is there to be said?

Things are so slow right now that even the RTC thread ran out of new topics to talk about. That says a lot.

 

[Arthur97]

Things are so slow right now that even the RTC thread ran out of new topics to talk about. That says a lot.

I imagine they would have ran out of stuff to talk about anyway. Unless the next one is an AT, it seems unlikely they'd shatter speculation after Min Min.

 

[Lamperouge]

I'm not interested in other people telling me what his odds are.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I imagine they would have ran out of stuff to talk about anyway. Unless the next one is an AT, it seems unlikely they'd shatter speculation after Min Min.

The next announcement will shake things up without resorting to that, I'm pretty certain. There's something that just bugs me about current insider rumors.

Not that it gives the RTC thread any worth in any case.

In the meantime, all that we have to go on from right now is Sak giving Rex particular attention by Mii standards. Whether it means he'll sneak him in or he gave up on him for this game is what's uncertain.

 

[SharkLord]

Again? Is it just a revolving door? What more is there to be said?

After Min Min, we did a fixed schedule for all the major candidates.

All of them.

None of us really realized how long this would go on for and like half the thread is just abstaining until we get it all over with while silently giving nominations (Though quite frankly, I don't think you should be able to nominate if you abstain from rating).

If it helps, I've started doing intro writeups for lesser-discussed characters like Andy, so hopefully I can at least get people sold on the character themselves, if not their likelihood.

 

[fogbadge]

Things are so slow right now that even the RTC thread ran out of new topics to talk about. That says a lot.

give it time, im working on a character who hasnt been done before

 

[Arthur97]

The next announcement will shake things up without resorting to that, I'm pretty certain. There's something that just bugs me about current insider rumors.

Not that it gives the RTC thread any worth in any case.

In the meantime, all that we have to go on from right now is Sak giving Rex particular attention by Mii standards. Whether it means he'll sneak him in or he gave up on him for this game is what's uncertain.

I don't know how much anyone would really shake it up that much otherwise. At this point, third parties aren't special, they're expected.

What insider rumors?

I'm not interested in other people telling me what his odds are.

Especially by a group of people that may or may not have it out for him.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I don't know how much anyone would really shake it up that much otherwise. At this point, third parties aren't special, they're expected.

What insider rumors?

Recently, some have implied or claimed that Super Mario RPG is coming back in some form.

It doesn't matter who gets revealed next, some discussion will happen. I mean, for the longest time people thought would never happen, yet that caused a buzz. So if the third-party in question was heavily requested on this board or elsewhere, at least one person out there will be excited for them.

Also, we'll definitely get a shake-up if simply because we're nearing the end of 2020 and we've yet to even see much progress in the pass.

Every character will be unexpected to some degree to various people. We just don't know who's coming next, exactly.

 

[Arthur97]

Recently, some have implied or claimed that Super Mario RPG is coming back in some form.

It doesn't matter who gets revealed next, some discussion will happen. I mean, for the longest time people thought would never happen, yet that caused a buzz. So if the third-party in question was heavily requested on this board or elsewhere, at least one person out there will be excited for them.

Also, we'll definitely get a shake-up if simply because we're nearing the end of 2020 and we've yet to even see much progress in the pass.

Every character will be unexpected to some degree to various people. We just don't know who's coming next, exactly.

Hmm, I also heard of a potential sequel, but I wouldn't put much stock in that for the time being. Even if it led to Geno, I don't think that would really affect Rex. Though, I'd be relatively happy to see him.

Excited, sure, but I'm talking something that would seriously impact the perceived "rules" like Min Min did.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Hmm, I also heard of a potential sequel, but I wouldn't put much stock in that for the time being. Even if it led to Geno, I don't think that would really affect Rex. Though, I'd be relatively happy to see him.

Excited, sure, but I'm talking something that would seriously impact the perceived "rules" like Min Min did.

Depending on who's coming next, there would be at least one "fan rule" that gets broken by their inclusion alone. Some hypothetical examples:

Rex: Mii costumes can't join.
Shantae: Indies can't join.
Rayman: Western third-parties that sell poorly in Japan can't join.

It doesn't need to be a particularly big rule, so when someone gets in, some subset of naysayers will be proven wrong.

That said, we don't know what's going to happen, and when it does, things will shake simply because it's been quiet for so long.

 

[fogbadge]

Depending on who's coming next, there would be at least one "fan rule" that gets broken by their inclusion alone. Some hypothetical examples:

Rex: Mii costumes can't join.
Shantae: Indies can't join.
Rayman: Western third-parties that sell poorly in Japan can't join.

It doesn't need to be a particularly big rule, so when someone gets in, some subset of naysayers will be proven wrong.

That said, we don't know what's going to happen, and when it does, things will shake simply because it's been quiet for so long.

even then they might say that they are the exception for some reason

 

[Arthur97]

Depending on who's coming next, there would be at least one "fan rule" that gets broken by their inclusion alone. Some hypothetical examples:

Rex: Mii costumes can't join.
Shantae: Indies can't join.
Rayman: Western third-parties that sell poorly in Japan can't join.

It doesn't need to be a particularly big rule, so when someone gets in, some subset of naysayers will be proven wrong.

That said, we don't know what's going to happen, and when it does, things will shake simply because it's been quiet for so long.

Or it could be someone who breaks no "rules." Which, honestly, would probably be most of them.

Also, I don't think Shantae is indie. Small studio sure, but I didn't think WayForward was an indie developer.

 

[fogbadge]

Or it could be someone who breaks no "rules." Which, honestly, would probably be most of them.

Also, I don't think Shantae is indie. Small studio sure, but I didn't think WayForward was an indie developer.

the phrase indie is used very losely these days anyway

 

[Arthur97]

the phrase indie is used very losely these days anyway

Even for a company that's been operating since at least the GameBoy (Color?) days apparently. Though, can't blame them too much. Up until recently I thought the same.

 

[fogbadge]

Even for a company that's been operating since at least the GameBoy (Color?) days apparently. Though, can't blame them too much. Up until recently I thought the same.

yep, people make assumptions all the time

 

[RawkHawk2010]

I don't know what the difference between XC2's and ARMS's original exclusions even is aside from the fact that the former was made by Sakurai to seem like a far bigger deal. I guess ARMS didn't get music, but both games notably got two Mii costumes each and I don't think "Spring Man and Ribbon Girl are already playable!" played a role in later roster decisions like some people seem to think is a barrier for Rex.

 

[SharkLord]

I don't know what the difference between XC2's and ARMS's original exclusions even is aside from the fact that the former was made by Sakurai to seem like a far bigger deal. I guess ARMS didn't get music, but both games notably got two Mii costumes each and I don't think "Spring Man and Ribbon Girl are already playable!" played a role in later roster decisions like some people seem to think is a barrier for Rex.

On one hand, ARMS was stated to be too complicated for the base roster, but Sakurai only said that after we actually got an ARMS character. Before Min Min, the cast of XC2 and ARMS were pretty much in the same boat, save for the fact that ARMS is an ensemble cast and has more leeway with it's potential reps.

 

[PSIGuy]

I don't know what the difference between XC2's and ARMS's original exclusions even is aside from the fact that the former was made by Sakurai to seem like a far bigger deal. I guess ARMS didn't get music, but both games notably got two Mii costumes each and I don't think "Spring Man and Ribbon Girl are already playable!" played a role in later roster decisions like some people seem to think is a barrier for Rex.

XC2 stuff could be lumped in with existing XC content, but you can't really do the same for ARMS. The stakes aren't quite the same. ARMS being a launch title that Nintendo probably wants to treat as evergreen compared to RPGs which tend to be quite frontloaded might play a role as well.

 

[I.D.]

ARMS being a launch title that Nintendo probably wants to treat as evergreen compared to RPGs which tend to be quite frontloaded might play a role as well.

Xenoblade 2 had (has?) unusually long legs for an RPG, essentially doubling its initial month sales over the course of the years. I also don't see ARMS receiving any significant amount of promotion over XB2 from Nintendo.

 

[fogbadge]

I don't know what the difference between XC2's and ARMS's original exclusions even is aside from the fact that the former was made by Sakurai to seem like a far bigger deal. I guess ARMS didn't get music, but both games notably got two Mii costumes each and I don't think "Spring Man and Ribbon Girl are already playable!" played a role in later roster decisions like some people seem to think is a barrier for Rex.

it most people who dont want rex who say these things

 

[Arthur97]

So, it seems to have come up on the speculation thread (along with a weird conversation about "flatness") but what alterations do you think they might make to Pyra's design if any to get her in?

 

[GolisoPower]

So, it seems to have come up on the speculation thread (along with a weird conversation about "flatness") but what alterations do you think they might make to Pyra's design if any to get her in?

I'm...not too sure, tbh. I mean, they didn't alter her artwork for her Spirit (With Mythra being another story), but I don't know of the extent of how risque a 3D model can be in Smash, but I know Bayonetta is the most...well, provocative, for the game's rating. Pyra's most likely not gonna change.

 

[Arthur97]

I'm...not too sure, tbh. I mean, they didn't alter her artwork for her Spirit (With Mythra being another story), but I don't know of the extent of how risque a 3D model can be in Smash, but I know Bayonetta is the most...well, provocative, for the game's rating. Pyra's most likely not gonna change.

I don't know, from behind, well, those shorts are pretty low. Not sure what they might do about her back though. Mythra's new design covered it up, but TP Zelda had a backless dress. Granted, she had hair covering it a lot.

 

[PLANTMAN]

So, it seems to have come up on the speculation thread (along with a weird conversation about "flatness") but what alterations do you think they might make to Pyra's design if any to get her in?

Just tights for her leggings+back and nothing else

Somthing like this
I made a little censor edit of her
sry about it being a link. The photo would take up so much

 

[Arthur97]

Just tights for her leggings+back and nothing else

Somthing like this
I made a little censor edit of her
sry about it being a link. The photo would take up so much

Access is restricted. Come to think of it though...why did Mythra get tights? Legs alone don't seem to be a problem.

 

[PLANTMAN]

Access is restricted. Come to think of it though...why did Mythra get tights? Legs alone don't seem to be a problem.

Spoiler

Got it working now

 

[PSIGuy]

The problem CERO has is with the possibility of upskirts, so characters with bare legs need something to cover up. That’s my understanding of it.

 

[Xelha]

So, it seems to have come up on the speculation thread (along with a weird conversation about "flatness") but what alterations do you think they might make to Pyra's design if any to get her in?

All they have to do is make her shorts slightly longer. Something like Samus's and it wouldn't really be that different.

Access is restricted. Come to think of it though...why did Mythra get tights? Legs alone don't seem to be a problem.

So she's CERO safe for her future inclusion in SSBU of course.....

Spoiler

I genuinely think this has to be it because I can't think of any other reason that makes sense for her Spirit to be changed like that.

 

[PSIGuy]

Spoiler

I genuinely think this has to be it because I can't think of any other reason that makes sense for her Spirit to be changed like that.

CERO has to rate all content in the game. They've removed minor content because of it before, like Tharja's trophy in the 3DS version of Smash (seen here in a leak).

In Mythra's case, they decided it was better to change her design rather than exclude her entirely (considering she's one the main characters of XB2 and excluding her spirit would be very questionable).

 

[Arthur97]

Yeah, the skirt is probably the main difference compared to ZSS and Bayonetta. Though...they may have gone a bit overboard on the actual model they made for XC2 since it covers just about everything but her hands and head.

That does actually bode better for Pyra. Though, even I would say her shorts might be hanging a little too low.

 

[Xelha]

That's a 3D model that can be rotated and viewed from multiple angles. Mythra is a flat image, and her design is no worse than any other character with a skirt.

She's the only Spirit to get an official redesign by the original artist and have it become an official costume to be used in bother her games.

That just seems like an awful lot of work for a single image most people will probably never see. Unless they plan to do more with that design....

 

[PSIGuy]

I'm not CERO so I can't tell you what goes on in their decision making process. But changing the design so it passes for a lower rating is an immediate, practical reason to do so. Everything else that might come from it is just making the best of it. Monolith are no strangers to adding things that most players won't care about or experience.

In other words, whether or not she gets into Smash has literally nothing to do with the design being changed.

 

[Arthur97]

That's a 3D model that can be rotated and viewed from multiple angles. Mythra is a flat image, and her design is no worse than any other character with a skirt.

She's the only Spirit to get an official redesign by the original artist and have it become an official costume to be used in bother her games.

That just seems like an awful lot of work for a single image most people will probably never see. Unless they plan to do more with that design....

That is an anomaly, but it might be explained away by the original artist doing it who may have intended to have it put into XC2 as well so it was made for a 3D space as well. Or, they just wanted the tights themself if they had to redo since most either get cut or don't get changed.

 

[RawkHawk2010]

I can't wrap my head around the hypothetical that right prior to Ultimate's release a NPC Nopon named "Brobro" showed up in Argentum after XC2 was supposed to never get updates again and referenced Mythra's Spirit's Smash involvement using Driver Combo wordplay only for XC2 to never be fully represented the second it's afforded the opportunity. For that not to seem like a total violation of the laws of the universe you have to mentally enter a world where you actually see the Rex Mii costume as Rex proper and can watch that one Enel vid and think it's serious.

 

[Arthur97]

It...is an awful lot poured into a reference for seemingly nothing, but at the same time I won't say it means he's getting in. Maybe the devs feel shafted too and wanted to throw that in, or maybe they were hopeful. Though, Mythra's redesign on closer inspection does seem a little....peculiar.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Perhaps the length of the skirt is the issue.

 

[I.D.]

I can't wrap my head around the hypothetical that right prior to Ultimate's release a NPC Nopon named "Brobro" showed up in Argentum after XC2 was supposed to never get updates again and referenced Mythra's Spirit's Smash involvement using Driver Combo wordplay only for XC2 to never be fully represented the second it's afforded the opportunity. For that not to seem like a total violation of the laws of the universe you have to mentally enter a world where you actually see the Rex Mii costume as Rex proper and can watch that one Enel vid and think it's serious.

It's a decent point. I've seen people argue that Sakurai's statement means nothing and that ARMS and Xenoblade 2 were never actually into consideration (somehow...) but for that costume to happen before Ultimate even released there had to be some sort of communication/cooperation between Sakurai's team and Monolith beyond "Can we use your characters artworks?" "Yes."

 

[max_0888]

I really don't see how Sakurai would say to all the Xenoblade 2 fans, I know you want Rex but we didn't have enough time as the game was too recent, then announce 6 more fighters and not include Rex. I have a lot of difficulty believing a scenario where Rex would'nt be in.

 

[PSIGuy]

but for that costume to happen before Ultimate even released there had to be some sort of communication/cooperation between Sakurai's team and Monolith beyond "Can we use your characters artworks?" "Yes."

I don't think it's that complicated. Obviously they'd have to resolve the artwork issue before the game goes gold so Monolith Soft know about it and Smash well in advance. Their options are let someone else fix the art work, fix it in-house or let it get cut. They picked the second option and sent it off. That's everything relating to Smash Bros done - their talks with Sakurai are over.

Everything after that point though? Purely Monolith Soft acting on their own.
"Hey, we should add it to the game proper as a tie-in! We can already do costumes."
"Yeah, we'll have the NPC in XB2 that gives it to you make tons of Smash references!"
"And we can make the Torna NPC that gives it to you dance like beloved gaming icon Tatsu, as a hint to who the Xenoblade character in Fighter Pass 2 will be in 3 or so years!"

Make it, ship it, soak up more of the Smash attention and curb the inevitable censorship complaints (Xenoblade X got hit with so many that Takahashi had to explain in an interview that he didn't mind the changes, so they definitely know how people feel about it).

 

[I.D.]

I don't think it's that complicated. Obviously they'd have to resolve the artwork issue before the game goes gold so Monolith Soft know about it and Smash well in advance. Their options are let someone else fix the art work, fix it in-house or let it get cut. They picked the second option and sent it off. That's everything relating to Smash Bros done - their talks with Sakurai are over.

Everything after that point though? Purely Monolith Soft acting on their own.
"Hey, we should add it to the game proper as a tie-in! We can already do costumes."
"Yeah, we'll have the NPC in XB2 that gives it to you make tons of Smash references!"
"And we can make the Torna NPC that gives it to you dance like beloved gaming icon Tatsu, as a hint to who the Xenoblade character in Fighter Pass 2 will be in 3 or so years!"

Make it, ship it, soak up more of the Smash attention and curb the inevitable censorship complaints (Xenoblade X got hit with so many that Takahashi had to explain in an interview that he didn't mind the changes, so they definitely know how people feel about it).

Why is Monolith the one in charge of censoring in your scenario? Why would they be involved with Smash development at all? That's what I'm getting at, not the costume appearing in the original game.