KrystalRules
Smash Lord
here is a chart of multiple civilizations about the flood:
http://www.nwcreation.net/noahlegends.html
go down some and you will find it.
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Religion: what is it good for? Absolutely nothing! Huah!
- Thread starter PukeTShirt
- Start date
here is a chart of multiple civilizations about the flood:
http://www.nwcreation.net/noahlegends.html
go down some and you will find it.
Aesir
Smash Master
It doesn't list anything but legends of those societies, nothing concrete that would be seen as evidence. Show me historical documents that give evidence that a flood happened at these times.
KrystalRules
Smash Lord
the historical documents are at the museums
Aesir
Smash Master
Maybe you should go to them, preferable a non-Christian one so you can get an unbiased experience.
KrystalRules
Smash Lord
it will be biased still! christian are more willing to look to the other side of things then anyone else! oh and i have seen some of them and their translations and yes there are stories of the flood. not all that were mentioned are on that chart because, since your so smart you should know this, most of them are by word of mouth. apparently you've never studied the ancient cultures because if you had you would know that the stories are told.
your probably the most ignorant person! you deny facts because they go against what you believe.
Aesir
Smash Master
Please tell me I'm not the only one who found this funny?
So you admit they are stories. Okay good then.
a story can mean either fact or fiction, and since there is no evidence of such a flood ever occurring except out of a legend or story. Then it's logical to come to the conclusion that it was a false a story, probably used metaphorically.
I Know how stories are told, I'm very well versed in the bible as well.
You know how easy it is to warp things by word of mouth? High school is a testament to this.
No I'm not if I was, I wouldn't have bothered to read that link.
You've yet to bring up any sort of creditable evidence, how am I suppose to believe you when you're not even offering that? the burden of proof is on you.
Zink
Smash Champion
QFT.
I'm slightly impressed that KR had answers to the Bible verses, but there's a better way.
I want to see where this goes first, however.
Societies started by rivers. Euphrates, Tigris, Yellow River, the Nile, all of those rivers had the beginning of civilization there, in the flood plains. And what do rivers do? They flood. A lot. With flooding such a major aspect of their life, it's only logical that they'd have mythologies concerning those floods.
What answers? Posting the text of the verses I stated and saying "im gonna attempt to put these together in the order they happened."? Nice to know that it is only accurate if you interpret it correctly. What happens when you read it literally without interpretation, oh then you're not reading it correctly.
Zink
Smash Champion
Just the fact that there were answers posted, actually.
KrystalRules
Smash Lord
they were all in different books so reading it literally you should get(i know this is hard for you) the way i stated it. i have never done a study on the last words of Jesus because it so obvious.
Aesir
Smash Master
Divine books supposable written by man who got the ideas from god.
Lol.
Lol.
KrystalRules
Smash Lord
if so versed in the Bible then why do ask so many questions?
Tryptomine
Smash Journeyman
You are not. Though I'm still reeling over the earlier post when he implied that the second coming of Christ was imminent.
Still haven't answered my question, either.
Aesir
Smash Master
lolwut?
I'm not asking questions about things printed in the bible I'm simply asking how could a flood occur during the times where other civilizations made no record of it?
**** double post.
Woah. I leave the discussion for a bit and the whole topic changes?
Last I was here, Krystal posted a video of some not-so-compelling arguments in favor of creationism and against evolution. But of course, the person speaking is a well know fraud who has a fake degree and is currently serving jail time.
No response to that? Pity.
Don't take my word for it about evolution. Seriously. Go to a university and watch an experiment yourself. You can literally watch species of insects evolve within a timespan of about a week. They start out with one group of insects in an environment, then split it into two groups with different conditions. Since the insects have an extremely short lifespan, natural selection is drastically sped up and the effects apparent.
The two groups will be of completely different species after about a week. Evolution happens, go watch it for yourself.
And all this business about a flood is nonsense. A catastrophe of that magnitude does not get easily hidden in historical nor geological data. Stop trying to read the bible literally, less you feel like murdering your children for backtalking you.
Last I was here, Krystal posted a video of some not-so-compelling arguments in favor of creationism and against evolution. But of course, the person speaking is a well know fraud who has a fake degree and is currently serving jail time.
No response to that? Pity.
Don't take my word for it about evolution. Seriously. Go to a university and watch an experiment yourself. You can literally watch species of insects evolve within a timespan of about a week. They start out with one group of insects in an environment, then split it into two groups with different conditions. Since the insects have an extremely short lifespan, natural selection is drastically sped up and the effects apparent.
The two groups will be of completely different species after about a week. Evolution happens, go watch it for yourself.
And all this business about a flood is nonsense. A catastrophe of that magnitude does not get easily hidden in historical nor geological data. Stop trying to read the bible literally, less you feel like murdering your children for backtalking you.
Eight Sage
Smash Lord
In the Bible, there are relates and true facts. Genesis is a relate, the New Testament is a true fact. Don't confuse this.
What do you mean by it's a "relate". Do you mean to say that it's not meant to be taken literally? Well, that's fine and good, but who decides what part of the book to take literally and what part to take metaphorically?
Zink
Smash Champion
I SEE A PROBLEM.
Eight, what's up with that term,"relate"?
Aesir
Smash Master
Whats so true fact about the new testament? it's just a nicer version of the old testament
But your point was that all the books were consistent, even though they were written at different times. Why are you now saying they aren't consistent unless you rearrange them?
commonyoshi
Smash Hero
You misread the verses. God created Adam without Eve in Genesis 1:25-27.
Then the verses in 2:18-19 say that man needed a helper, or companion, and states that none of the animals God had created were "suitable". "Now the Lord had formed" just reiterates what God had done previously.
I looked, and I cant find anything which would even imply that God created the stars on the second day. It mentioned stars but nothing more about them
Mary and Josheph live in Nazareth. Mary and Joseph move to take part in a nation-wide census in Bethlehem where Mary gives birth to Jesus. Evil king hears about a prophetic king and fears for his own rule so he tries to kill this newborn child. Joseph receives a vision warning him so he takes his family and flees to Egypt.
Matthew 27:47- It's quite clear that from the text those were not even Jesus' last words.
You do have me at the Luke and John thing though. However, it matters of little importance. Both have to do with Jesus saying that his work was finally done.
I see no contradiction between Matt, Mark, and Luke's version with John's. So what if the others didn't mention Nicodemus? It even said Nicodemus was afraid of the Jews and acted secretly.
Paul, in Acts, used "they" as a collective term for the people in Jerusalem. vs. 27: "The people of Jerusalem and their rulers..." The teachers who conspired against Jesus, Pilate, old man down the street who cheered for Barrabas' release, and many more are all included.
Jesus made many appearances after he rose from the dead. Cephus' and Peter's were not the first. Mary is probably the first person Jesus appeared to. Both Mary's were probably grouped together in Matthew. Notice how that passage is vague about the episode. He didn't find it necessary to concentrate on that moment.
The whole point was to restart the human race. Sea animals had nothing to do with this, and land animals only got in the way of God's particular chosen way of carrying out His judgement.
The Bible never implies that it was the oldest written record of history. Genesis was written around the time of Israel's forty years of wandering. Before this, the Egyptians had been their slave masters. There had already been at least one civilization before the Old Testament even began to be written.
How would there be historical, written evidence? Everyone was dead. There wont be a historical writting.
They died.
There's no new genetic material being produced.
And I'd have to wonder about the offspring of these two groups of insects. Are they destinguishable from each other?
KrystalRules
Smash Lord
no stop manipulating my words.
Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were all written around the same time. they were written based off of what each of them heard or saw. thats why there are 4 different accounts, to get every detail. thats extremely, extremely obvious
wow it does repeat itself but so does the rest of History, but it deffinately isnt a nicer version of the old testament.
yeah i was hoping ya'll would know that. lol
he is in jail for not paying taxes because he doesnt want to support what is being taught in schools, which are full of lies and truths no doubt.
im not gonna say Darwin was a bad scientist, he was a great one! he just saw so birds of the same species with different beaks, so he assumed that if that occured over time it would change species. well he also himself knew there were problems with it. he never solved the problems before he died. no one has to be honest, they cant do it without the missing links. they cant go farther then where darwin got. also DNA proves a problem. some animals DNA is closer to animals almost completely opposities. its weird because most evolutionist say that the close raletives will have similar DNA, thats not always true in every species
and do ya'll believe in the big bang? why? "in the begining the universe was void of everything, then it exploded and created.....the earth and everything around it." that was what the most popular "Learn the Big Bang" video out there...
how do you explain nothing exploding and something coming from nothing?
well remember Job was completed before Genesis because it was written as it happened or at least written in the book form.
Tryptomine
Smash Journeyman
What is with Creationist's obsession with Darwin? Or rather, what they perceive to be Evolutionist's obsession with him. I don't get it, really, so many act like hes evolutionist's "god," he's just a scientist.
Haven't made any progress past what Darwin discovered? Since when?
Sorry, no.
Meh, it's a decent proposition I suppose, but not sure if I'd profess a true "belief," there's simply not enough to back it up (and also, it was nothing before it "Banged," it was an ultra dense ball of everything, according to the theory). Though personally I've always been amused of coupling it with the Big Crunch, making it an endless cycle of Bangs and Crunches, making even causing time to become cyclical. Still raises the same question though, when/what started the cycle? It's simply a question without an answer, and probably will always remain so. Religion has the same issue, what was before God(s)? "Always existed" doesn't work, for the same reason you'd say it doesn't for the Big Bang theory.
(Waiting still for a reply for the question I asked several pages ago.)
Krystal, are you trying to insinuate that because not EVERY facet of a particular science is known, that it must be fundamentally wrong?
Every science at one point had extremely vexing problems that didn't have an obvious solution. Yet time and time again, they are explained through the brilliant works of talented individuals. It is fallacious to claim that the entire science is incorrect on the basis that there is something, as of yet, undetermined.
It's the same thing with the big bang. All the evidence points to it. Again, even the Catholic Church has endorsed the Big Bang. The fact that there are still unanswered questions does not change the fact that all the evidence points towards the Big Bang.
For the record, I know more about physics then biology, so if you want to talk Big Bang I'm in. Otherwise I'll call Goldshadow over to talk Biology.
Commonyoshi:
I really appreciate the responses you provide. They're always to the point and make sense. Whether I agree with you on the issue or not, you provide a logically valid argument. Conversely, I have trouble deciphering what Krystal says...
Krystal:
...So you're saying that you knew that the guy in your video was a complete fraud and yet you posted it anyway? Did you hope that nobody would notice? Or do you still think that he has credibility?
Btw, why go to the trouble of typing "y'all" on a message board. You're from the south, we get it. It doesn't add to your credibility to intentionally come across as a yokel. Also, having a potential Brawl character's name only reeks of "Brawl Room Spam".
Just giving you a heads up.
EDIT: Furthermore, that blue font is like needles to the eyeballs.
Every science at one point had extremely vexing problems that didn't have an obvious solution. Yet time and time again, they are explained through the brilliant works of talented individuals. It is fallacious to claim that the entire science is incorrect on the basis that there is something, as of yet, undetermined.
It's the same thing with the big bang. All the evidence points to it. Again, even the Catholic Church has endorsed the Big Bang. The fact that there are still unanswered questions does not change the fact that all the evidence points towards the Big Bang.
For the record, I know more about physics then biology, so if you want to talk Big Bang I'm in. Otherwise I'll call Goldshadow over to talk Biology.
Commonyoshi:
I really appreciate the responses you provide. They're always to the point and make sense. Whether I agree with you on the issue or not, you provide a logically valid argument. Conversely, I have trouble deciphering what Krystal says...
Krystal:
...So you're saying that you knew that the guy in your video was a complete fraud and yet you posted it anyway? Did you hope that nobody would notice? Or do you still think that he has credibility?
Btw, why go to the trouble of typing "y'all" on a message board. You're from the south, we get it. It doesn't add to your credibility to intentionally come across as a yokel. Also, having a potential Brawl character's name only reeks of "Brawl Room Spam".
Just giving you a heads up.
EDIT: Furthermore, that blue font is like needles to the eyeballs.
Eight Sage
Smash Lord
What I mean is that the Genesis doesn't answers the "How" it answers the "Why" and the purpose of the creation.
Read this of DOGMATIC CONSTITUTION ON DIVINE REVELATION "DEI VERBUM", I prefer you to read all, but if you're in a hurry, start from CHAPTER III: SACRED SCRIPTURE, ITS INSPIRATION AND DIVINE INTERPRETATION
I Highly recommend you to read that, It clarifies A LOT about how you should take the Bible(this comes from the documents of the II vatican council)
So you just get a bunch of guys together and agree on how it should be read, and that must be how god intended? How to interpret the bible is exactly what separates a good portion of christian denominations. It's not as simple as saying "well god says my way is right". because that's what every side says.
You have to have some actual reason.
You have to have some actual reason.
Aesir
Smash Master
Then how do you know it happened? During the time this flood was suppose to happen other civilizations had begun flourishing.
They didn't they were alive and kicking during the flood. Maybe they adapted and grew gills.
I still don't like how you say its my interpretation. Are you saying that the holy translations need to be interpreted correctly. (I'm reading the KJV, BTW)
In Mathew he says "My god[...]" then yells/screams. He doesn't say "Father into thy hands[...]" or "It is finished." You can't say because he screams before dying that it isn't the last intelligible thing he said. And "It is finished" I'm sure sounds a whole lot different than "Father into thy hands I commend my spirit," even in Aramaic.
I wasn't, you said it.
I'll give you this, only because they were written fifty to seventy years after the events supposedly happened, after all these people were already dead. Its hard to get your story straight when you're writing it second, third or forth hand. But I guess that's why god made sure that they were divinely inspired and couldn't possibly be inaccurate. Oh wait...
Zink
Smash Champion
8S gets props for a Vatican source. I was familiar with the concept, but not the term.
I don't see how the fact that the gospels were written 50-70 (approx) years after the fact means anything. You can still write an extremely accurate account of WWII today.
PS Darwin was pro for landing a paid-by-the-word contract. bling bling.
I don't see how the fact that the gospels were written 50-70 (approx) years after the fact means anything. You can still write an extremely accurate account of WWII today.
PS Darwin was pro for landing a paid-by-the-word contract. bling bling.
Aesir
Smash Master
^ Because there are other texts to back up the sources and eye witness accounts to draw your information from.
new testament? not so much.
new testament? not so much.
Before you go galumphing off to read that thing from the Vatican, please know that many, many Christians do not agree with how Catholics interpret the Bible.
For instance, me. (I still haven't gotten back anything from the Franciscans, Zink. Should somebody check on them to make sure they're okay?)
Seriously, Zink, the Franciscans have failed me. Or perhaps they're so smart that they know the less I know about Catholicism, the harder it is for me to make arguments against it without going against my sense of fairness. Those cunning buggers.
For instance, me. (I still haven't gotten back anything from the Franciscans, Zink. Should somebody check on them to make sure they're okay?)
Seriously, Zink, the Franciscans have failed me. Or perhaps they're so smart that they know the less I know about Catholicism, the harder it is for me to make arguments against it without going against my sense of fairness. Those cunning buggers.
Zink
Smash Champion
I am very disappointed in the Franciscans. Tut tut. A bit of research implies they went dead in 2002. However, there IS Ask a Priest! Judging by the site, it's still alive, so give it a try. Sorry. The Franciscans just went down on my homies list.
They're not right for me. They only answer a few questions per month and they only accept short, single questions from people 18 or over, although I could easily lie about my age.
You know, I have yet to find a Catholic who has ready answers to those questions that I want answers to. This is a problem I've found in many religions, but I think it's the worst in Catholicism. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Catholics are not encouraged to read the Bible, but rather go to Mass and just do what the priests tell them to do, while the priests just say what the bishops and cardinals tell them to say. That is an excellent way to unify people under a single faith, but can anyone say "those Catholic sheep"? I'm thinking that this is why the Catholic Church has lasted as an institution for so long.
You know, I really shouldn't be insulting a religion here. Sorry.
You know, I have yet to find a Catholic who has ready answers to those questions that I want answers to. This is a problem I've found in many religions, but I think it's the worst in Catholicism. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe Catholics are not encouraged to read the Bible, but rather go to Mass and just do what the priests tell them to do, while the priests just say what the bishops and cardinals tell them to say. That is an excellent way to unify people under a single faith, but can anyone say "those Catholic sheep"? I'm thinking that this is why the Catholic Church has lasted as an institution for so long.
You know, I really shouldn't be insulting a religion here. Sorry.
Zink
Smash Champion
:/ I could answer your questions, but it's not like I made a career out of Bible study. Hint hint. What validity would my answers have, given that I'm some random teen on the internets?
It doesn't matter who you are, as long as you make good points and back them up. I would listen to a purple porcupine if it made sense. Actually, I'd probably listen to a purple porcupine whether or not it made sense.
I think that's something we all follow here: It doesn't matter who you are, as long as you have valid ideas that you can back up.
So don't be afraid to answer. Is there something about my religion that you have a problem with? Ask me, and if I can't answer, it means you win.
Zink
Smash Champion
I forgot your affiliation... iirc it was nondenominational, correct?
Also, I could have flawless logic, and still have a mistake in the assumptions.