Project M Social Thread

[Comeback Kid]

Before you get overwhelmed Brand, understand that most smash techniques are just movement options.

Once you break down what your character can do it really isn't that complicated.

The game isn't Guilty Gear, it's pretty easy to learn just hard to master.

 

[BrandX]

Well this all makes sense now. I might play around with Project M for a bit then, since I got plenty of time before my SkullGirls online tournament.

Just one last question, is there a character I should start out with, or can I just pick any character and learn?

Cause I wanted to pick up Snake and ZSS (Lol I either go for the badass looking dudes or the hot woman)

Btw Guilty Gear is a hard game to master and get into lol

 

[Hylian]

Snake and ZSS are fine. Snake has a pretty grab centered game that involves some pretty sick combos and ZSS is very mobile and bursty but easier to kill.

 

[BrandX]

Snake and ZSS are fine. Snake has a pretty grab centered game that involves some pretty sick combos and ZSS is very mobile and bursty but easier to kill.

Alright, thanks for the heads up! I guess I'll go lurk their character specific boards.

 

[iLink]

Well this all makes sense now. I might play around with Project M for a bit then, since I got plenty of time before my SkullGirls online tournament.

Just one last question, is there a character I should start out with, or can I just pick any character and learn?

Cause I wanted to pick up Snake and ZSS (Lol I either go for the badass looking dudes or the hot woman)

Btw Guilty Gear is a hard game to master and get into lol

Are the skullbats today? I've wanted to join one of those but I always end up being busy on the day they have them.

But in terms of characters, snake shouldn't be too bad of a starter character. If you are pretty green at the game, I suggest you learn how to short hop super consistently first. This is something that not a lot of new players really think about but it is essential for hitting your opponent with aerials low to the ground. You should also be using X or Y (assuming you use a gamecube controller) to jump and not the control stick, as that gives you me freedom in your movement while you jump.

Once you have that down, the most important technique I think you should learn is L-Canceling. It's hard to do consistently if you are just barely getting into the game but is definitely you definitely need to learn. You will know when you do it correctly in Project M because they added a flash to your character to indicate when you do it correctly.

 

[BrandX]

Are the skullbats today? I've wanted to join one of those but I always end up being busy on the day they have them.

But in terms of characters, snake shouldn't be too bad of a starter character. If you are pretty green at the game, I suggest you get learn how to short hop super consistently first. This is something that not a lot of new players really think about but it is essential for hitting your opponent with aerials low to the ground. You should also be using X or Y (assuming you use a gamecube controller) to jump and not the control stick, as that gives you me freedom in your movement while you jump.

Once you have that down, the most important technique I think you should learn is L-Canceling. It's hard to do consistently if you are just barely getting into the game but is definitely you definitely need to learn. You will know when you do it correctly in Project M because they added a flash to your character to indicate when you do it correctly.

Yes SkullBats is happening today, it would be great if you joined!

And I see. To be honest, before your post, I was seeing if I could Wave Dash. Wave Dashing doesn't seem too hard to do (I think I'm doing it at least, Snake is doing some doctor doom diagonal down like dashes lol), but I need to try and learn it consistently.

Hops I'll practice though since a lot of you guys say it is very important. Yes I use a gamecube controller.

I guess after hops, I'll learn L-Canceling.

 

[iLink]

Yes SkullBats is happening today, it would be great if you joined!

And I see. To be honest, before your post, I was seeing if I could Wave Dash. Wave Dashing doesn't seem too hard to do (I think I'm doing it at least, Snake is doing some doctor doom diagonal down like dashes lol), but I need to try and learn it consistently.

Hops I'll practice though since a lot of you guys say it is very important. Yes I use a gamecube controller.

I guess after hops, I'll learn L-Canceling.

The thing about wavedashing is that it has different timing for each character and isn't anything super necessary to learn unless your character has ways to take advantage of it. Not to say that every character can't use it to their advantage, but some characters it just isn't as necessary to do all the time.

Short hops can be character specific too, but you don't generally have to switch your timing like you would for wavedashing. This is because a short hop happens if you release the jump button before your character leaves his prejump animation, and every character has different prejump frames. However, if you can do it with the fastest prejump character, that exact timing will work for everyone else.

Wavedashing is different because you have to wait for your character to actually leave his prejump animation before you can do it, which varies from character to character.

I believe this was posted earlier

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4n4s5yB7ZkE

This series is definitely a great tool for getting started. It's what originally got me into the game.

 

[BrandX]

The thing about wavedashing is that it has different timing for each character and isn't anything super necessary to learn unless your character has ways to take advantage of it. Not to say that every character can't use it to their advantage, but some characters it just isn't as necessary to do all the time.

Short hops can be character specific too, but you don't generally have to switch your timing like you would for wavedashing. This is because a short hop happens if you release the jump button before your character leaves his prejump animation, and every character has different prejump frames. However, if you can do it with the fastest prejump character, that exact timing will work for everyone else.

Wavedashing is different because you have to wait for your character to actually leave his prejump animation before you can do it, which varies from character to character.

Hm, that makes sense. Can I do L-Cancelling training against just a regular training dummy? And how do I use short hops specifically, like I know they are important in making movement faster, but what can they really be used for? Extending combos?

EDIT: yes that video does seem useful.

 

[iLink]

Short hops basically give you access to a whole other section of your moveset. Instead of just using your grounded attacks, you can short hop and use an aerial against a grounded opponent, or an opponent just above you on a platform.

Short hop aerials can be used as an approach option, used defensively to keep your opponent at a distance (for example, Marth's forward aerial has a lot of range while being fairly fast), or to extend combos.

Short hops with L-canceling will be your bread and butter for just about every character. It'll help you stay safer and just give you more options in terms of how you can use your moveset.

As for practicing short hops and L-canceling, you don't necessarily have to even do them on a dummy. Just go into training mode and fiddle around with it. I practiced it by just playing against lvl 3 cpu back in the day.

 

[`dazrin]

Yes, you can practice L-Canceling on your own with a training dummy. Short-hops are amazing for using your aerials to combo grounded targets. Things like SHFFLing NAirs with Fox or juggling an opponent low to the ground with Captain Falcon come to mind.

If someone hasn't already linked it already, I suggest you check out Wak's Advanced How to Play Melee Video Guides for some further explanation.

 

[BrandX]

Short hops basically give you access to a whole other section of your moveset. Instead of just using your grounded attacks, you can short hop and use an aerial against a grounded opponent, or an opponent just above you on a platform.

Short hop aerials can be used as an approach option, used defensively to keep your opponent at a distance (for example, Marth's forward aerial has a lot of range while being fairly fast), or to extend combos.

Short hops with L-canceling will be your bread and butter for just about every character. It'll help you stay safer and just give you more options in terms of how you can use your moveset.

As for practicing short hops and L-canceling, you don't necessarily have to even do them on a dummy. Just go into training mode and fiddle around with it. I practiced it by just playing against lvl 3 cpu back in the day.

Wow, thanks for giving me a better understanding. So I"m guessing with those 2, those are basically the essentials to help me start facing other people, and other techniques are there to help me get more advanced?

Yes, you can practice L-Canceling on your own with a training dummy. Short-hops are amazing for using your aerials to combo grounded targets. Things like SHFFLing NAirs with Fox or juggling an opponent low to the ground with Captain Falcon come to mind.

If someone hasn't already linked it already, I suggest you check out Wak's Advanced How to Play Melee Video Guides for some further explanation.

Ah, well I guess that does make them useful then.

 

[DrinkingFood]

For wavedashes/wavelands, if you're seeing your character do a triangle jump like thing, you're doing it wrong. Or rather, imperfectly. Triangle jumps have a place too, but a perfect wavedash doesn't appear to show your character leaving the ground, and a perfect waveland doesn't show your character moving until he lands.
Have you had any ideas on who you want to main, BrandX?

Also I would suggest watching a lot of high level gameplay videos of recent tournies, apex 2013 should be a good place to start.

 

[BrandX]

For wavedashes/wavelands, if you're seeing your character do a triangle jump like thing, you're doing it wrong. Or rather, imperfectly. Triangle jumps have a place too, but a perfect wavedash doesn't appear to show your character leaving the ground, and a perfect waveland doesn't show your character moving until he lands.
Have you had any ideas on who you want to main, BrandX?

Also I would suggest watching a lot of high level gameplay videos of recent tournies, apex 2013 should be a good place to start.

Hm, guess that was wrong. I thought I was doing it right, but I guess I was wrong XD Stupid me, I wave dash with fillia in SkullGirls, I should know what the hell a wave dash is.

Like I said before, I'm mostly thinking Snake and ZSS, mostly because I like those characters and playing around with them a bit, I find them really fun.

Watching some high level would probably do me some good lol

 

[iLink]

Yeah I would say those are the essentials to getting started. Short hopping is just so versatile to most characters and L-Canceling is something that goes hand in hand with it. Some of that stuff even branches out into other stuff. For example, you can jump out of your shield, which bypasses your shield drop animation. If someone hits your shield and your character has a fast aerial, you can short hop out of your shield and hit them with your fast aerial if they didn't do something entirely safe. Of course sometimes its better to just do a shield grab (press A while shielding and you will cancel the shield into a grab animation, good for punishing bad approaches) or wavedash out of your shield depending on the situation, but you get the idea.

Like I said, stuff like wavedashing is helpful for every character, but not essential unless you play a pretty technical character like fox or someone with a really great wavedash like Luigi.

 

[JCaesar]

http://www.twitch.tv/JCaesar

We're starting the tourney now! Ryoko vs Nintendude up first.

 

[Zef]

anyone here have that really old cool project m falco shine graphic

 

[GHNeko]

So I got to meet chillindude, redd, smash g0d, ct zero, xzax, and boss today @ this tourney. lol

oh and cyain.

 

[BJN39]

Double zelda PMS2.5 finals

Happening right nao!

http://www.twitch.tv/JCaesar

Time to start respecting zelda's power yo!

 

[BrandX]

Hey so I have a question about L-Cancelling. So I saw videos and such of how to do the L-Cancelling, but I have no clue what I'm doing wrong. Someone said that in Project M, there was a special flash that shows you did an L-Cancel, but I can't get it to happen.

I'm trying to do it with snake btw lol.

 

[NeoZ]

Hey so I have a question about L-Cancelling. So I saw videos and such of how to do the L-Cancelling, but I have no clue what I'm doing wrong. Someone said that in Project M, there was a special flash that shows you did an L-Cancel, but I can't get it to happen.

I'm trying to do it with snake btw lol.

Try it with Snake's bair(back aerial), just wait until he's right about to touch the floor, and remember, you can do it with L, R or Z.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Try it with Snake's bair(back aerial), just wait until he's right about to touch the floor, and remember, you can do it with any button that's set to "shield".

Fixed this.

 

[BrandX]

Alright then, I'll try that out then later! Thanks!

 

[DrinkingFood]

By the way, I didn't feel the need to make a new thread for something so small, but I am able to tech with Z, which should be a light shoulder button input+A rather than full press+A input. Just kind of annoying knowing that for every tech I accidentally perform after getting punished for a whiffed grab, I'm also missing one for the same reason.

 

[NeoZ]

Fixed this.

Good point, I always forget that you can change your button config.

 

[Beorn4200]

Did the tournament Jcaes held not get recorded? I just looked for the recording on his channel ...

 

[MonkUnit]

The Project M Invitational at APEX2013 was recorded. The matches will be uploaded to his channel soon.

 

[abcool]

Alright so i have a question for Magus. In Melee when Falco repeatedly hits you with his shine or some characters repeatedly hit you with the same attack over and over you go into this hitstun cancel state. How come this isn't in PM? I think this is what is making Falco go from great to God tier. There is also that instance where some strong moves reset characters off the ground like jab resets are REALLY good this time around.

 

[`dazrin]

Monk- I think he was talking about PMS 2.5. JC held a mini 14 man singles bracket and a doubles round robin at his place yesterday.
I believe the results were: 1st:Ryoko 2nd:ZHime 3rd:Strong Bad / and for doubles: 1st:Nintendude+Strong Bad / 2nd: JCaesar+cmart / 3rd: ZHime+Remo

I could be totally wrong, though lol.
--also, Mango won a PM tournament at sweet IX. Dunno the results yet, but it was a 23 man tourney so Im curious as to how that turned out.

 

[bubbaking]

Most awesome thing GHNeko said about my ROB: "Ugh! You tilt just like JCaesar! "

Iota is a little Reflex. Dude's crazy.

 

[GHNeko]

It was mad annoying lol.

Just tilts everywhere.

Which is what JC does in CQC situations.

It was a terrible experience.

2/10 would not want to play again.


Kappa.

 

[bubbaking]

Ahhh, so that's the "emo avatar"?

Every character wrecks spacies that don't play smart, even in Melee.

Every character wrecks any character that doesn't play smart.

This is just simply not true. Fox gets to be dumb and get away with brainless nairshines against a lot of characters, like Ivysaur for example. Snake happens to be lucky to have a Samus-like upB that also combos into anything in the world he could possibly want. He can also punish him for stupid pressure by pulling out a 'nade beforehand and shielding so Fox blows himself up on it. Not every character gets to be that fortunate.

CT Zero has a mean P:M Fox, but I was taking it out most of the time the night before the tourney we both went to yesterday when I went Snake against him. I couldn't reliably beat him with any other character, though.

That said, time to post/lurk more on the char-specific threads.

 

[GHNeko]

His P:M Fox is his Melee fox. It's not really all that different lol.

 

[bubbaking]

Well isn't that how it's supposed to be? That's the whole premise of leaving Fox exactly as is, right?

And his Melee Fox is pretty crazy. There's a reason we beat Smash G0d and Redd in teams, and I tell you, it wasn't me.

 

[BrandX]

I should check out the archive for the tournament you guys are talking about >w>

Soundes hype.

 

[DrinkingFood]

Alright so i have a question for Magus. In Melee when Falco repeatedly hits you with his shine or some characters repeatedly hit you with the same attack over and over you go into this hitstun cancel state.

This has nothing to do with benig hit repeatedly. You're probably confusing the effects of land canceled hitstun or crouch canceling with being hit multiple times by the same move. The only thing being spammed on causes is damage decay, and by extension, knockback decay.

But about jab resets, they said they haven't perfected multi hit jab resets yet but afaik regular resets work just fine. I think you're imagining things. If a really strong move has a weak hitbox just before it, I imagine it could jab reset, like fox/falco's uair initial hitbox can.

 

[metroid1117]

I should check out the archive for the tournament you guys are talking about >w>

Soundes hype.

In case you or anyone else is curious, here's the link. I'm going to update it with three (four if Strong Bad posts the results for JCaesar's tournament) more tournaments hopefully by the end of today.

 

[bubbaking]

I'm looking back to yesterday and I'm feeling a little happy with myself today. The night before a Melee/vBrawl/P:M tournament in VA yesterday, I converted Xzax (top vBrawl Falco player) to P:M and he picked up Ike. The next morning, he enters the P:M tournament with this 'day 1' P:M Ike and does fairly well. I was watching his friendlies and 'seriouslies' and he was doing things and performing techs I couldn't believe or even dream he could do. The night before, he couldn't even WD or WL properly. The next day, I see him doing those and more, taking on good players and holding his own against them. I felt proud, like I'd just raised a baby to become the president of the US or something.

#PapaBubba

 

[Gimpel]

drinkingfood, I think he was talking about that glitch in melee that happens when you hit someone with an (electric?) attack that sends straight up while they're about to land on the ground during tumble, not teching. I don't know what exactly causes that glitch but you can easily recreate that glitch with falco, repeatedly shining someone from the ground in melee. The character getting hit is sent up, but as far as I know, he is not in hitstun (they're in their normal aerial state animation) and any follow-up is not a combo. Which is also why I don't get why he wants it back, it's a glitch that doesn't benefit falco as far as I can tell.
Hope I got it right lol. I'm not sure about this one

 

[MonkUnit]

Sounds like kb stacking/momentum stacking or w/e it is?

 

[abcool]

Ok, since people don't know what i mean. Put in Melee, pick falco fight a level 9 fox and keep trying to shine, dair and watch fox escape it. Then try it in PM and notice you never go into that type of reset. The thing is it may have been a glitch, but it prevented some really broken combos.