i probably am confusing terms, i was sure wavebounce was when you reverse the b move with momentum, and b reversal, was just reversing the b move with no momentum at all
Yeah, you're getting them mixed up. The reverse B is without momentum changes and the B-reversal reverses momentum. In case you forget, you can actually remember which term means which by just going through the order in which you execute the inputs for each tech. A reverse B involves you pressing the opposite direction and releasing right
before you press B, hence the "reverse" being before the "B" in "reverse B". A B-reversal involves you pressing B and then
immediately afterwards pressing the opposite direction, hence the "B" being before the "reversal" in "B-reversal."
A) thinks that another character having vaguely similar options is justification for another character having his
Assuming you're referring to spacees, if that other character is already the best, even without these "vaguely similar options," then why not? We're trying to achieve balance after all. Why does Lucario have to take the hit?
B) Justifies Lucario by citing Sonic
I can cite any character I want. Sonic being a badly designed character does not exclude him from this, and neither does being a bad character.
C) thinks that "adding options" is sufficient reasoning
We already talked in person about this (twice actually, once on stream) and we came to the conclusion that we disagree on this. You dislike characters being given additional options for the reason of "just because," and you even said yourself that Sonic's recovery is too good and does not need all those options.
I like characters being given additional options because it gives these characters added depth, flexibility, and room for different styles to be developed between different users of the character. There's really no point in discussing this point any more, tbh.
D) Thinks that keeping walled stages super important is ok because ike does too
Walled stages have been important ever since Mario had his SJP WJ and scar jumping became a thing. Come to think of it, offstage wall jumps, in general, made walled stages very important, as they opened up avenues to more complex maneuvers and ways to edgeguard someone or recovery unexpectedly. Lolz, even tethers alone made walls important in Melee. No reason not to expand on that in P:M.
E) Claims that Lucario is not a freak if nature (Or as Law and Order puts it, the insanity plea)
Do not misquote me.
I said that Lucario isn't a "freak of nature" any MORE than a bunch of characters are. Make this "bunch of characters" a large enough group and Lucario isn't even a freak anymore. He's just a normal Smash char.....like most everyone else.[COLLAPSE="THIS was what I said"]
Lucario's two built in traits do not make him a "freak of nature" any more than a character (actually two characters) that has a frame 1 move that is JCable on (maybe before) frame 4 and also has completely lagless projectiles or a char with SA-like armor on several moves that breaks shields for fun. Oh, and let's not forget that random bizarro that gets less cooldown when he hits a shield, breaks shields for fun, barely has weak sourspots, kills at all %'s, and also gets to WJ several times out of his recovery.
[/COLLAPSE]
F) I can 5 stock in a 6 stock match
Pfft, don't be so conceited. You've never done more than 2-stock me when I was even mildly trying with bad characters. The only exception was that one time I played ROB at, like, 2 AM right before I had to leave with Ben because you wanted to play it again for some reason. I consistently take you to last stock when I play serious, and I've even taken more than a few games off you...........oh yeah, and with characters I don't play.
Just wait until you find yourself trying to explain to bubbaking why he's wrong an online medium. Trust me, it's far less exhausting just to insult him.
You guys are just taking the easy way out. If you don't want to have a discussion, then don't come here and post your opinions and expect other people not to do the same. Not to mention, a bunch of times I tried to drop the last argument we had and you just kept steamrolling on like a blind bull. A bunch of people also mentioned that you weren't exactly replying to the points I was bringing up either.
In case you haven't noticed, I'm fine with being wrong, but that doesn't mean I'm just gonna back down every time someone disagrees with me. I don't even see why you feel the need to throw insults when I rarely say anything offensive or derogatory (first).
