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PMS | Tink-er

PMS | Tink-er

fie on thee
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How do you guys feel about the idea of future smash games implementing a simple mode and a technical mode like a lot of fighters?
 
Empyrean

Empyrean

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The thought crossed my mind, actually. Wouldn't have been surprised if they announced something like that at Evo this year.
 
Comeback Kid

Comeback Kid

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Tink-er in the Kitchen said:
How do you guys feel about the idea of future smash games implementing a simple mode and a technical mode like a lot of fighters?
Click to expand...
I think that was the thought process behind the two different online modes but not taken to that degree.

I would be in favor of it but I doubt Sakurai wants to develop two different games.

If anything I see simple mode being even more dumbed down and technical mode only being slightly faster like the mode select options in Brawl but without all the technical depth people would want from it.
 
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Bleck

Bleck

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Smash probably shouldn't have a technical mode. That's kind of the whole point.
 
Soft Serve

Soft Serve

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I was just playing on a yugioh simulator and a dude got super salty that I used a staple card (I fiendish'ed his Jdragon)

it went something like
Me: lol, I'm sorry i used a card that is actually good
Saltsworn player: You're bad because you're using staples
Me: "Youre bad because you use cards that are proven to work"
Me: is litterally what you just said.
Me: Forcing artificial barriers onto yourself just because is stupid.
Salt: Well I don't have to use staple cards to win
Me: But you're not going to win
Salt: you're bad because you have to use staples to hold together your ****ty deck
He ragequit before I could provoke him further by asking him if he was trying to be clever or actually didn't know that staple has more than one meaning.

I thought about messaging him and explaining that playing sub-optimal ways just because its going against the "meta" is stupid because even if it does have its upsides, its normally less effective and consistent than the methods that are proven to work.
But then I realized he was probably an angsty teen and I decided to just let DAT L SIT ON EM.

But actually, It really frustrate me when people do sub-optimal things just because they think doing the optimal thing is lame. Its like low tier mains, some of them play low tiers because they honestly are better with the character and enjoy playing them, and the character fits better with their playstyle or whatever (perfect example is axe). Then there are the low tier mains who do stuff like "I main Roy because playing Marth is a cop out and makes you a tier queer"

Idk, people man. It doesn't matter what game, if its a competitive title, there will be people dedicated to finding the most optimal play to go about tackling it. And then there will be the people who look at those results, and give it a big **** YOU and do the opposite just because.
 
Bleck

Bleck

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I have trouble understanding why someone would choose to let their experience of a game be based entirely around a soulless pursuit of efficient victory, but I'd never decry someone for it. Live and let live.
 
Soft Serve

Soft Serve

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Bleck said:
I have trouble understanding why someone would choose to let their experience of a game be based entirely around a soulless pursuit of efficient victory, but I'd never decry someone for it. Live and let live.
Click to expand...
I feel like thats a really really narrow way to frame what i was trying to say. Obviously I'm not suggesting that people are stupid for not taking every game and playing it 100% optimally. Games are games first, and are meant to be enjoyed. Not everyone should have to start speedruning if they picked up a copy of SM64 or anything.

What I am saying that when an individual attempt to take a game to a competitive level, where the First goal is to win, but at the same time that individual forces more limitations onto themselves just for the sake of limitations, its stupid. You don't go into a track competition saying "I'm only going to wear one shoe, If you have to win with both shoes you're obviously bad at running." Or swimming competitively but without goggles or other optimal gear. That not a perfect metaphor but the same flawed logic is mirrored in both examples.
 
Pwnz0rz Man

Pwnz0rz Man

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It is kind of a silly thing to complain about, but I can sort of understand the sentiment. Not so much about single individual cards in Yugioh, but in the high tier common decks that many times take no skill to run and just rely on one strategy to finish games. I remember when Lightsworn decks were really popular and the only thing you had to do was mill through your entire deck mindlessly to win games. It's not fun to play against decks that require no thought like that. That isn't to say that you had a deck without thought, as most decks (At least when I stopped playing) had at least a few staple cards in them since they were really splashable.

I remember Blackwing decks being equally mindless too, though I did enjoy the theme.
 
Comeback Kid

Comeback Kid

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Soft Serve said:
Idk, people man. It doesn't matter what game, if its a competitive title, there will be people dedicated to finding the most optimal play to go about tackling it. And then there will be the people who look at those results, and give it a big **** YOU and do the opposite just because.
Click to expand...
The problem with Yugioh though is that if what I've heard here and elsewhere is true it seems even with so many cards on the ban list, the game is just not fun to play at a high level. If that is so the problem really is with the game's metagame and it just shouldn't be played at all rather than some scrub trying to limit you from playing in the best way possible.
 
Chesstiger2612

Chesstiger2612

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Well, their marketing strategy is: Release new really good cards that can be found in the new Booster packs (expensive; for those who really wanna win) and are the top tier cards, then a Structure Deck (not that expenisve; really good deck but not as good as the ones where you have to search your cards individually, thought for starting out competitively) that is a high tier deck. After half a year, limit/ban a few cards from the top tier deck and release a new one.
They've done that like 5 times now :/
 
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teluoborg

teluoborg

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Soft Serve said:
I feel like thats a really really narrow way to frame what i was trying to say.
Click to expand...
I have seen bleck post like 5 times in this thread and every time it was in order to spit on the competitive side of something. He's not here to have a discussion, he just wants to vent.
 
Bleck

Bleck

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Hey, hey. I've posted in this thread way more than five times. Come on, now.
 
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Hinichii.ez.™

Hinichii.ez.™

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teluoborg said:
I have seen bleck post like 5 times in this thread and every time it was in order to spit on the competitive side of something. He's not here to have a discussion, he just wants to vent.
Click to expand...
feeeelz

At the yogioh
I looked at my old deck the other day when I used to play. Almost half of those cards banned now lolol
 
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Yung Mei

Yung Mei

Where all da hot anime moms at
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i seen a video on youtube about japanese yugioh decks, and i seen a Mill deck take out zombies in like 2 turns that **** was incredibly hype
 
Darkshooter

Darkshooter

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I wonder if it'd be possible to store a Gamecube controller into one of these:

So when done playing Skullgirls, you can whip out your GC controller and play SSBM just like that... Yeah, I better settle on a fight stick soon.
 
Chesstiger2612

Chesstiger2612

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Man I'm so oldschool in Yugioh (inactice since a few years, sometimes getting interested in it for a few weeks/months), my best deck is MacroMonarch... It got shreddered as soon as people sidedecked for MacroRabbits...
 
MechWarriorNY

MechWarriorNY

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^High kicks require excellent sense of balance, and other obscure prerequisites.

Personally, I can do them since I have a background in high-movement activity(like martial arts and sports)/I'm abnormally flexible for my size, but yeah, you gotta do those in a controlled way, other wise you're going to be on your rear, lol.

teluoborg said:
I have seen bleck post like 5 times in this thread and every time it was in order to spit on the competitive side of something. He's not here to have a discussion, he just wants to vent.
Click to expand...
He's bringing up disgusting shortcomings/scummy flaws in the competitive aspect that are constantly acknowledge and never changed.

Venting about the same sorts of behaviors that Thomas Hobbes did hundreds of years ago is justified considering it's gotten WORSE since then.

Meiling said:
yeah we **** around a lot LMAO
Click to expand...
Got your drank on last night?
 
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Gamegenie222

Gamegenie222

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Chesstiger2612 said:
Well, their marketing strategy is: Release new really good cards that can be found in the new Booster packs (expensive; for those who really wanna win) and are the top tier cards, then a Structure Deck (not that expenisve; really good deck but not as good as the ones where you have to search your cards individually, thought for starting out competitively) that is a high tier deck. After half a year, limit/ban a few cards from the top tier deck and release a new one.
They've done that like 5 times now :/
Click to expand...
This is absolutely true actually and people know this. Nowadays they are doing smart things and now the ban list is every 4 months. Also the new rules take effect in another day or two so who goes first cant draw first and 2 field spells can be out at the same time. But Goyo Guardian is coming off dat list so I'm hella hype.
Pwnz0rz Man said:
It is kind of a silly thing to complain about, but I can sort of understand the sentiment. Not so much about single individual cards in Yugioh, but in the high tier common decks that many times take no skill to run and just rely on one strategy to finish games. I remember when Lightsworn decks were really popular and the only thing you had to do was mill through your entire deck mindlessly to win games. It's not fun to play against decks that require no thought like that. That isn't to say that you had a deck without thought, as most decks (At least when I stopped playing) had at least a few staple cards in them since they were really splashable.

I remember Blackwing decks being equally mindless too, though I did enjoy the theme.
Click to expand...
Welcome to Yugioh nowadays where a bunch of decks are like that.

Soft Serve said:
I was just playing on a yugioh simulator and a dude got super salty that I used a staple card (I fiendish'ed his Jdragon)

it went something like
Me: lol, I'm sorry i used a card that is actually good
Saltsworn player: You're bad because you're using staples
Me: "Youre bad because you use cards that are proven to work"
Me: is litterally what you just said.
Me: Forcing artificial barriers onto yourself just because is stupid.
Salt: Well I don't have to use staple cards to win
Me: But you're not going to win
Salt: you're bad because you have to use staples to hold together your ****ty deck
He ragequit before I could provoke him further by asking him if he was trying to be clever or actually didn't know that staple has more than one meaning.

I thought about messaging him and explaining that playing sub-optimal ways just because its going against the "meta" is stupid because even if it does have its upsides, its normally less effective and consistent than the methods that are proven to work.
But then I realized he was probably an angsty teen and I decided to just let DAT L SIT ON EM.

But actually, It really frustrate me when people do sub-optimal things just because they think doing the optimal thing is lame. Its like low tier mains, some of them play low tiers because they honestly are better with the character and enjoy playing them, and the character fits better with their playstyle or whatever (perfect example is axe). Then there are the low tier mains who do stuff like "I main Roy because playing Marth is a cop out and makes you a tier queer"
Click to expand...
LOLOLOL you should not play on DN then or take breaks doing so. Yugioh online brings out the scumminess and salt in people. It's the Marvel of TCG's for a reason and I take breaks on there for a good ass reason out of boredom outside of I dont even play this game anymore in person.
 
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Hinichii.ez.™

Hinichii.ez.™

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My smash scene sucks is balls
I want a new one :(
 
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Spiffykins

Spiffykins

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Messages
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SpiderMad said:
Marth also spins but it's hard to notice, so maybe Roy does it slower.




I'm not sure how much lag Marth had on his Nair in Brawl, but overall his aerials in Brawl weren't that laggy. The Smash 4 gif there is hard to tell if it's landing lag from an aerial or normal landing lag [auto-cancel] (which is 30 frames, but you can act out on frame 4; which they didn't it's hard to tell) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtOSf5iZhnY#

We already use autocancel for the other term, do people use Reduced land lag or like AutoLcancel instead; meaning we want reduced/low land lag in the 7-14 frame range like an L-cancel would rather than 20+.

L-cancelling isn't their biggest technical barrier, there's a lot of things it's a bucket. Fox's SH (and for other 3 frame jumpsquat characters: beyond the fact Melee checked a frame early for SH button release which they fixed in Brawl so maybe it was shoddy coding or Sakurai wanted it made even harder and then realized he was in the wrong?), their overall movement and spacing, having the fast fall on time and such. Also what Hydrone said
Click to expand...
I think Roy spins twice in PM, once for each slash. Didn't notice that Marth spins though, somehow. I'll look again to see if she spins twice.

I think the only Marth aerials that had no-L cancel-ish lag were bair and dair.
 
GP&B

GP&B

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When you actually look at what Roy does during his Nair, it's completely ridiculous. He grabs his sword with both hands, pulls in his legs, and does a 720.
 
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