PM 3.5 Stats List (Still WIP) Wavedash ranks added!

[1MachGO]

Ratings of chars based on stats. Inspired by M2K's statistic thread.
Index

---Weight
---Walking Speed
---Running Speed
---Spot Dodge List
---Full Hop Heights (INCOMPLETE)
---Short Hop Heights (INCOMPLETE)
---Air Mobility
---Running Jump Air Speed
---Max Air Speed
---Falling Speed
---Fast-Falling Speed
---Jump Start-Up Speed
---SHFF Speed
---Standing Grab Ranges
---Pivot Grab Ranges (INCOMPLETE)
---Wavedash Ratings


Weight

Spoiler

Super Heavyweight:
1) Bowser [118]
2) DK [114]
3) DDD [112]
4) Yoshi [111]

Heavyweight:
5-6) Samus/Charizard [110]
7) Ganon [109]
8) Wario [107]
9) ROB [106]
10-11) Snake/Ike [105]

Middleweight:
12-13) C. Falcon/Link [104]
14-16) Mario/Lucario/Luigi [100]
17) Mewtwo [97]
18) Ness [94]

Welterweight:
19-22) Peach/Zelda/Sheik/Olimar [90]
23) Ice Climbers [88]
24) *Marth [87]

Lightweight:
25-30) Diddy/Ivysaur/Roy/ZSS/Toon Link/Wolf [85]
31-32) Squirtle/Sonic [82]
33-36) Falco/Lucas/Pikachu/Pit [80]

Featherweight:
37-38) Fox/G&W [75]
39) Kirby [74]
40) MK [70]
41) Jigglypuff [60]

*All characters lighter than this weight fall down from Fox's shine

Walking Speed

Spoiler

-This list shows from fastest to slowest characters' top walking speeds. I have not included acceleration differences. So certain characters who have the same speed may accelerate to that speed faster than another character.

1-2) Marth/Fox [1.6]
3-6) Falco/Ike/Roy/Sonic [1.4]
7) ZSS [1.35]
8-9) Lucario/Wolf [1.3]
10) Diddy [1.25]
11) Pikachu [1.24]
12) MK [1.22]
13-16) DK/Link/Sheik/Toon Link
17) Pit [1.18]
18) Yoshi [1.15]
19-22) G&W/Luigi/Mario/ROB [1.1]
23) Ivysaur [1.05]
24-25) Mewtwo/Samus [1.0]
26-27) DDD/ICs [0.95]
28-29) Olimar/Squirtle [0.9]
30) Snake [0.875]
31-34) C. Falcon/Kirby/Peach/Wario [0.85]
35) Ness [0.84]
36) Lucas [0.82]
37) Zelda [0.8]
38) Ganon [0.73]
39-40) Charizard/Jigglypuff [0.7]
41) Bowser [0.65]

Running Speed

Spoiler

-This list shows from fastest to slowest characters' top running speeds. I have not included acceleration differences. So certain characters who have the same speed may accelerate to that speed faster than another character.

1)Sonic [4.0]
2) C. Falcon [2.3]
3) Fox [2.2]
4) MK [2.1]
5) Charizard [2.07]
6) ZSS [2.05]
7) Wolf [2.0]
8) Diddy [1.9]
9) Lucario [1.85]
10) Pit [1.82]
11-14) DK/Marth/Pikachu/Sheik [1.8]
15) Lucas [1.725]
16) Bowser [1.65]
17-18) Olimar/Roy [1.61]
19-21) Ness/Toon Link/Yoshi [1.6]
22-26) Ike/ROB/Samus/Snake/Wario [1.55]
27-31) Falco/G&W/Ivysaur/Kirby/Mario [1.5]
32) Squirtle [1.45]
33-34) ICs/Mewtwo [1.4]
35-36) Ganon/Link [1.35]
37) Luigi [1.34]
38) Peach [1.3]
39) Zelda [1.275]
40) DDD [1.21]
41) Jigglypuff [1.1]

Spot Dodge List - incomplete

Spoiler

The first value is the starting invincibility frame, the second is the last invincible frame, and the final value is total frames

Category 1) Falco/Fox/Link/Luigi/Mario/Pikachu/Sheik/Wolf/Sonic/Pit/Diddy/ZSS/Lucario [2-15 (22)]

Category 2) Ike/Lucas/Marth/Ness/Peach/Snake/Zelda/ROB/Mr. G&W [2-18 (27)]

Category 3) Charizard/Ivysaur/Squirtle [2-17 (25)]

Category 4) Toon Link (2-15 (25)]

Category 5) Ganon/Wario/King DDD [2-20 (32)]

Category 6) C. Falcon [3-20 (32)]

Category 7) DK [2-23 (37)]

Category 8) Bowser [4-24 (42)]

Category 9) Jiggs [2-15 (27)]

Full Hop Heights

Spoiler

-The following is a list of grounded full hop heights from highest to lowest.

-I had to measured the heights using this formula: total height = Initial V velocity - gravity * current frame (repeated until frame of apex). I am not sure if this is 100% accurate, but the results seem good and some discrepancies might be explained by animations.

1) Falco [51.35]
2) Lucas [47.25]
3) Luigi [42.93]
4) Charizard [42.78]
5) C. Falcon [38.5]
6) Diddy [38.48]
7) DK [37.7]
8) ROB [37.65]
9) Lucario [36.875]
10) ZSS [36.3]
11) Sonic [35.991]
12) Ness [35.96]
13) Marth [35.025]
14) ICs [35]
15) Yoshi [34.846]
16) Samus [34.452]
17-18) DDD/Pit [34.23]
19) Sheik [34]
20) Ike [32.747]
21) Toon Link [32.5]
22) Pikachu [32]
23) MK [31.75]
24) Bowser [31.52]
25) Peach [31.32]
26) Fox [31.28]
27) Zelda [31.245]
28) Mewtwo [31.03]
29) Roy [30.936]
30) Olimar [30.78]
31) Wolf [30.4]
32) Ivysaur [30.015]
33) Link [29.64]
34) Squirtle [29.624]
35-36) G&W/Mario [28.925]
37) Snake [28.65]
38) Wario [27.738]
39) Ganon [27.3]
40) Kirby [26]
41) Jigglypuff [20.8]

Short Hop Heights

Spoiler

-A list of the heighest to lowest short hops. Calculation method is identical to full hop heights.

1) Samus [22.734]
2) Sheik [20.14]
3) Yoshi [18.27]
4) Squirtle [17.154]
5) ROB [17.154]
6) Charizard [17.05]
7) Peach [16.8]
8) Zelda [16.731]
9) Diddy [16.38]
10) Ganon [16.32]
11) Ike [15.687]
12) Luigi [14.861]
13-14) C. Falcon/Kirby [14.8]
15) Ivysaur [14.427]
16) Lucario [14.2]
17) Marth [13.965]
18) Pikachu [13.94]
19) ZSS [13.8]
20) Sonic [13.6935]
21) DK [13.6]
22) MK [13.6]
23) Ness [13.23]
24) DeDeDe [12.665]
25) Snake [12.036]
26-27) Falco/Wolf [11.44]
28) Lucas [11.375]
29) Wario [11.31]
30) Mewtwo [11.178]
31-32) G&W/Mario [11]
33-34) Link/Toon Link [10.95]
35) Bowser [10.57]
36) Roy [10.53]
37) ICs [10.5]
38) Fox [10.45]
39) Pit [9.6]
40) Jigglypuff [9.108]
41) Olimar [8.7]

Air Mobility

Spoiler

-This is defined as a character's ability to shift their momentum in the air. i.e. weaving like Jigglypuff or Wario
-Special thanks to Magus for telling me that I had not included a second value when making this list. I have revised it and here are the new results.

1) Wario [0.33]
2) Jigglypuff [0.28]
3) ZSS [0.1]
4) Ivysaur [0.095]
5) Lucas [0.087]
6-9) Fox/Lucas/Squirtle/Wolf [0.08]
10) Pit [0.075]
11-12) Falco/Peach [0.07]
13-22) C. Falcon/Charizard/Diddy/Ganon/Link/Mario/Ness/Sheik/Toon Link/Zelda [0.06]
23-32) Bowser/DDD/G&W/Ike/Luigi/Marth/Mewtwo/Olimar/Pikachu/Roy [0.05]
33) Yoshi [0.048]
34) ICs [0.047]
35-36) ROB/Sonic [0.045]
37-38) DK/Kirby [0.04]
39) Lucario [0.035]
40) Samus [0.0325]
41) Snake [0.03]

Running Jump Air Speed

Spoiler

-The following list is based off how much speed a character can apply to a running jump. It may also apply to Ike's JC'd quick draw, or DK's JC'd dash attack.
1-2) C. Falcon/Wolf [2.1]
3-4) Sonic/Squirtle [2.0]
5-7) DK/Ganon/Pikachu [1.8]
8) Ike [1.75]
9-11) Diddy/Falco/Fox [1.7]
12) Pit [1.55]
13-20) Charizard/G&W/Kirby/Lucas/Mario/MK/Ness/Yoshi [1.5]
21-22) Ivysaur/ZSS [1.45]
23-26) ICs/Mewtwo/Sheik/Wario [1.4]
27) Jigglypuff [1.35]
28-29) Olimar/Samus [1.3]
30) Lucario [1.25]
31-34) Link/Marth/Roy/Toon Link [1.2]
35-38) DDD/Peach/ROB/Zelda [1.1]
39-40) Bowser/Snake [1.0]
41) Luigi [0.75]

Max Air Speed

Spoiler

-The following list is based off of the maximum velocity a character can travel horizontally and is also the amount of speed a character can apply to their mobility. This is why Fox and Falco are considered to have "low airspeeds" even though their "mobility" is high. Most characters can apply more speed to their momentum changes than they can.

1) Jigglypuff [1.35]
2-6) Mewtwo/Squirtle/Wario/Wolf/Yoshi [1.2]
7) C. Falcon [1.12]
8) Sonic [1.1092]
9-11) DK/Olimar/Peach [1.1]
12) Ness [1.05]
13-23) Charizard/Diddy/G&W/Kirby/Link/Lucario/Lucas/MK/Pit/Toon Link/ZSS [1.0]
24) Zelda [0.98]
25) Snake [0.94]
26) Ike [0.925]
27-30) DDD/Marth/ROB/Roy [0.9]
31) Samus [0.89]
32) Ivysaur [0.88]
33) Mario [0.86]
34) Pikachu [0.85]
35-36) Fox/Falco [0.83]
37-38) Bowser/Sheik [0.8]
39) Ganon [0.78]
40) ICs [0.7]
41) Luigi [0.68]

Falling Speed

Spoiler

-This is an ordered list of fastest to slowest falling speeds. Ratings assume maximum and don't factor in acceleration rates.

Fast-fallers:
1) Wolf [3.2]
2) Falco [3.1]
3) C. Falcon [2.9]
4) Fox [2.8]

Semi-fast-fallers:
5) Diddy [2.55]
6) MK [2.45]
7-8) DK/Roy [2.4]
9) Lucas [2.3]
10) DDD [2.25]

Semi-floaties:
11) Marth [2.2]
12-14) Link/Sheik/Toon Link [2.13]
15) Snake [2.12]
16-17) Ike/ZSS [2.05]
18-19) Ganon/Lucario [2.0]
20) Yoshi [1.92]
21-25) Bowser/Olimar/Pikachu/Pit/Sonic [1.9]

Floaties:
26) Wario [1.85]
27) Ness [1.83]
28-32) Charizard/G&W/Ivysaur/Mario/Squirtle [1.7]
33) ROB [1.65]
34-36) ICs/Kirby/Luigi [1.6]
37-38) Mewtwo/Peach [1.5]
39-40) Samus/Zelda [1.4]
41) Jigglypuff [1.3]

Fast-Falling Speed

Spoiler

-List of fastest to slowest fast-falling speeds. This would be helpful in determining who has quick shffls.
1-2) Captain Falcon/Falco [3.5]
3-4) Fox/Wolf [3.4]
5) DDD [3.3]
6-8) Link/Sheik/Toon Link [3.0]
9) DK [2.96]
10) Diddy [2.95]
11) Yoshi [2.93]
12-13) Ike/Roy [2.9]
14) Snake [2.89]
15) MK [2.85]
16) Charizard [2.8]
17) ZSS [2.75]
18-19) Lucas/Pikachu [2.7]
20) Ganon [2.6]
21-24) Bowser/Lucario/Marth/Squirtle [2.5]
25-28) Pit/ROB/Sonic/Wario [2.4]
29-32) G&W/Mario/Mewtwo/Samus [2.3]
33-35) Kirby/Ness/Olimar [2.2]
36-37) Ivysaur/Zelda [2.15]
38-40) ICs/Luigi/Peach [2.0]
41) Jigglypuff [1.6]

Jump Start-Up Speed

Spoiler

-This the amount of frames it takes for a character to become airborne. Characters are in the air on the next frame. This is useful for knowing how quickly a character can begin a WD/ OoS option or how hard they are to short hop with. Special thanks to The Devicer for compiling the following information.

1-10) Fox/ICs/Kirby/Lucario/MK/Pikachu/Samus/Sheik/Sonic/Toon Link (3 frames)
11-23) C. Falcon/Charizard/Diddy/G&W/Luigi/Mario/Marth/Ness/Olimar/Roy/Squirtle/Wolf/ZSS (4 frames)
24-37) DK/Falco/Ike/Ivysaur/Jigglypuff/Lucas/Mewtwo/Peach/Pit/ROB/Snake/Wario/Yoshi/Zelda (5 frames)
38-40) DDD/Ganon/Link (6 frames)
41) Bowser (8 Frames)

​

SHFF Speed

Spoiler

-This is the total amount of frames it takes a character to jump, short hop, and fast-fall ASAP. First value is total frames while the second value is jumping speed.

1) Samus [37 + 3] (40 frames)
2-3) Peach/Zelda [30 + 5] (35 frames)
4) Luigi [30 + 4] (34 frames)
5-7) Yoshi/ROB/Ivysaur [28 + 5] (33 frames)
8) Charizard [27 + 4] (31 frames)
9-10) Kirby [27 + 3] Ganon [24 + 6] (30 frames)
11-15) Sheik [26 + 3] Squirtle/Marth/Ness [25 + 4] Ike [24 + 5] (29 frames)
16-17) Diddy [24 + 4] Mewtwo [23 + 5] (28 frames)
18-21) DK/Jigglypuff/Snake [22 + 5] DDD [21 + 6] Bowser [19 + 8] (27 frames)
23-25) C. Falcon [22 + 4] Pikachu/Sonic [23 + 3] (26 frames)
26-32) Lucario/MK [22 + 3] ZSS/G&W/Mario [21 + 4] Wario [20 + 5] Link [19 + 6] (25 frames)
33-35) ICs [21 + 3] Lucas/Pit [19 + 5] (24 frames)
36-37) Roy/Olimar [19 + 4] (23 frames)
38-39) Falco [17 + 5] Toon Link [19 + 3] (22 frames)
40) Wolf [17 + 4] (21 frames)
41) Fox [15 + 3] (18 frames)

Standing Grab Ranges - incomplete

Spoiler

-Lists standing grab ranges amongst the cast from largest to smallest, note that I haven't added tether grabs yet
-All ranges were calculated by adding the largest x-offset with the radius of the grab collision

1) King DeDeDe
2) Bowser
3) DK
4) Marth
5) Charizard
6) Snake
7) ROB
8) Wario
9) Diddy
10) Sheik
11) Pit
12) Puff
13) Zelda
14) Luigi
15) Falco
16) Lucario
17) Ike
18) Wolf
19) Ganondorf
20) Fox
21) G&W
22) Peach
23) Mario
24) C. Falcon
25) Ness
26) Pikachu
27) Sonic

Pivot Grab Ranges -incomplete

Spoiler

-Lists pivot grab ranges amongst the cast from largest to smallest, note that I haven't added tether grabs yet
-All ranges were calculated by adding the largest x-offset with the radius of the grab collision

1) King DeDeDe
2) DK
3) Charizard
4) ROB
5) Bowser
6) Marth
7) Snake
8) Sheik
9) Luigi
10) Lucario
11) Zelda
12) Ganondorf
13-14) Wario/Wolf
15) Puff
16) Peach
17) Mario
18) Ness
19-20) Fox/Ike
21) Falco
22) Mr. G&W
23) C. Falcon
24) Pikachu
25) Pit
26) Sonic

Perfect Wavedash Ratings

Spoiler

-Lists perfect wavedash (nearly perfect horizontal angle) from largest to smallest distances
-Fun fact: A single wavedash from Luigi is nearly as long as the worst four wavedashes combined

1) Luigi [84.1]
2) Squirtle [80.22]
3) ICs [58.3]
4) Mewtwo [52.03]
5) Lucas [49.42]
6) Marth [41.56]
7) Diddy [37.33]
8-9) Roy/Yoshi [36.16]
10-13) G&W/Ivysaur/Mario/Samus [35.11]
14) Ness [33.37]
15) Bowser [32.68]
16) ZSS [32.51]
17) Pit [31.31]
18) Fox [31.1]
19) ROB [30.25]
20) Charizard [30.04]
21) Falco [29.62]
22) DDD [29.33]
23) Ganon [28.55]
24) Snake [28.31]
25) Olimar [27.61]
26) Sonic [27.31]
27-30) DK/Ike/Sheik/Toon Link [27.16]
31-33) C. Falcon/Kirby/Zelda [25.34]
34-35) Pikachu/Wolf [25.33]
36) MK [24.19]
37) Wario [24.15]
38) Lucario [23.5]
39) Jigglypuff [22.45]
40) Link [22.01]
41) Peach [20.27]

​

 

[1MachGO]

reserved just in case

 

[metroid1117]

Wow, awesome work Mach! Thanks for doing this, this is a lot of useful information .

 

[Bryonato]

Great job! lot's of awesome information here. Thanks so much

 

[SpiderMad]

Where have u been

 

[Oasys17]

Charizard's wavedash feels TINY. Are you sure it's that high on the list? This COULD be because I'm a marth main, though >.> xD

 

[Magus420]

Some things I remember noticing are G&W's ground dodge is and was [2-18 (27)] not [2-12 (32)]. There was also a lot off about the standing grab range list so I'd recheck those, though the method you mention for measuring them is correct.

 

[Oasys17]

Some things I remember noticing are G&W's ground dodge is and was [2-18 (27)] not [2-12 (32)]. There was also a lot off about the standing grab range list so I'd recheck those, though the method you mention for measuring them is correct.

So sorry for being horrendously off topic, but WHAT is happening in the first gif of your sig? I'm DYIN! xD link pleece~!

 

[1MachGO]

Thank you Metroid and Spiffy! and @Spider Mad, yeah, I kept putting off posting this thread for too long haha

Some things I remember noticing are G&W's ground dodge is and was [2-18 (27)] not [2-12 (32)]. There was also a lot off about the standing grab range list so I'd recheck those, though the method you mention for measuring them is correct.

Thanks Magus, I fixed the spot dodge data. And yeah, I'll definitely check what my results again for the grabs.

 

[metroid1117]

Bumping this because I support informative and useful threads.

I know that people have busy lives, but when will the OP be updated with the correct/checked information? Again, I think this is extremely important info and I'm honestly sort of disappointed that this hasn't gotten more community support.

 

[Burnsy]

I frequently reference this guide, but I'm not sure what I could do to support it. I'm really surprised it hasn't been stickied.

 

[1MachGO]

I am glad you guys like this thread. I'll try and update it soon (Particularly completing the sections I noted as incomplete)

If you have any other suggestions, let me know

 

[XalchemistX]

Very interesting statistics

 

[Ima_Ninja_Snack]

This may be a dumb question but how do you find all this data do you use in-game testing and if you do how do make it so accurate?

 

[standardtoaster]

Why did you quote the entire first post? He probably did like half of those findings in game and the other half by looking at the attributes (physics) in each character's file.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Charizard's wavedash feels TINY. Are you sure it's that high on the list? This COULD be because I'm a marth main, though >.> xD

The larger the character, the smaller their wavedash will appear relative to their body. Toon Link moves quite a distance for his small frame, while Charizard, even though he moves more, appears to have a smaller wavedash than he really does.

 

[Nausicaa]

What's a 'frame' ???
Bowser has a sexy Wave-Dash. I like to spam (it and other stuff).

 

[Oasys17]

What's a 'frame' ???
Bowser has a sexy Wave-Dash. I like to spam (it and other stuff).

So, videos(and thusly, video games) are expressed in frames, as a passage of time. So you'll hear the term "frames per second" tossed around a lot. What that means is, every second, x (USUALLY 60) amount of frames(singular... Moments in time?) are passing. It's basically just a rate of time. I can't really describe a frame... It's like, if you were to pause, whatever is happening on the screen is what is happening that frame. If you were to unpause and pause again in 1/60th of a second(assuming 60 fps), you would see what would happen on the next frame.

I hope that clears things up.

 

[9bit_alt]

lol

 

[Nausicaa]

http://www.twitch.tv/gytnews/b/258471132

 

[KingClubber]

Are you going to update this thing?

 

[Paradoxium]

Very informative, and very helpful.
I'm surprised this isn't supported more.
Maybe if more people start supporting this then we can include damage, knock back, range, ect.

 

[1MachGO]

Just an FYI, I will be updating this/ redoing this when 3.0 comes out

 

[PastLink]

please and thank you. I can't wait!

 

[Xebenkeck]

Awesome, will be very useful when you do.

 

[regal68]

Did some ceiling height testing with the new stages and I thought it might belong here unless there's some specific stage thread.

http://smashboards.com/threads/did-some-star-ko-testing-with-the-new-ceiling-heights.343674/

 

[JOE!]

*Mega bump*

This thread should be stickied, would be incredibly useful as a resource for individual character guides and such

 

[B.W.]

It should also be updated

 

[1MachGO]

I will make it my mission to finish it this weekend. I actually had almost everything done at one point (this was prior to smashboards saving drafts) and then my computer died. Ever since, my motivation has been unforgivably low.

EDIT: Also, does anyone know a reliable calculation for jumping heights?

 

[SpiderMad]

How did your computer die? die permanently or just crash once?

 

[1MachGO]

How did your computer die? die permanently or just crash once?

Abrupt power outage while I was editing the OP with 3.0 data :'(

I have most of the core stats in excel files. However, losing all of the tedious work of putting everything in the OP just killed my motivation to do it again; I'm chipping away at it now, though (Weight, Walking Speed, Running Speed are all up to date)

I also wised up and bought a battery back up lol.

 

[1MachGO]

Most info is updated so bump

 

[Vashimus]

Much appreciated. :]

 

[DrinkingFood]

Toon Link [19+3] (21 frames)
22=21

 

[1MachGO]

Lol oops, thanks for the catch. I fixed it

 

[Spiffykins]

Wait, there's no way Wolf falls faster than Fox. Have them jump next to each other and it's super obvious Fox falls faster. Fox's jump is bigger but he'll still land earlier, or at least earlier than he would if he fell slower. What gives???

 

[RKM]

Wait, there's no way Wolf falls faster than Fox. Have them jump next to each other and it's super obvious Fox falls faster. Fox's jump is bigger but he'll still land earlier, or at least earlier than he would if he fell slower. What gives???

The rankings are based on maximum fall speed, so most likely Fox accelerates to his max fall speed faster, but wolf could fall faster if given the space to get up to max speed.

 

[Spiffykins]

The rankings are based on maximum fall speed, so most likely Fox accelerates to his max fall speed faster, but wolf could fall faster if given the space to get up to max speed.

ah yeah I guess that makes sense

 

[1MachGO]

What RKM said. Fox has the highest fallspeed acceleration in the game by a significant margin.

 

[metroid1117]

Wow, this is amazing.