T-block
B2B TST
It was more of a joke. Could easily have been a typo =P
vote: Gova
vote: Gova
-
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Pizza Mafia - Over! Who lived happily ever after in the land of Tito's refrigerator?
- Thread starter #HBC | Nabe
- Start date
Gova
I'm goin' for it!
lolololololololololol
Did you see the scum team??? It was Roxy and Glyph, both of which were inactive and no help to the scum mate doing the work lol. There was no way they suggested Joey to claim vig imo. Joey doesn't have the balls to claim vig unless he actually was one lol, which he is.
Theres no proof that you aren't mafia either so what? Are you really using this line of thought in a case?
Nope, the playerslot only went against it once as far as I know. There was no clear indication who I was supposed to shoot N3. Glyph flipped scum and I had taken into account that you wanted Glyph dead.
Don't take credit where it isn't due. You did nothing to make sure that I had no wiggle room N2. Sure you made have said "I'll get you lynched" but that doesn't actually mean anything and you're riding Ghebs coattails.
This paragraph is like you admitting to bussing Glyph.
Is it illogical to shoot someone I thought was scum? Is it illogical I didn't shoot you because of your advocation of Glyph dying who flipped scum?lol, This whole arguement is invalid on the basis that Roxy was a roleblocker. All I would have had to do is claimed I was roleblocked and voila, I wouldn't have to shoot Roxy if I were mafia and then I could kill someone and then not claim that kill.
T-block
B2B TST
Why not? I don't see why they couldn't be slightly more active behind the scenes. Roxy is smart with this stuff too (doc claim in DKR).
Only showing that there is no reason to clear you as not mafia. Calm down
Hmm...
Original pitch.
T-block agrees.
Gheb implicitly agrees.Alright then ... so we're basically waiting for Tery to CC or not CC.
Asdioh RESTATES.
Included your post - just to show that you did post after the plan was formed.
July is on board.
Asdioh restates again.
Zen seems to be on board? It's Zen.
Tery is on board.
Asdioh, Zen, July, Terywj, T-block, Gheb. All agree.
Glyph flipped scum.
You are the only one remaining who didn't say anything. It wasn't clear who you were supposed to shoot? Are you serious?
I am of the opinion that if Gheb's post was the only one directing you, you would have been able to justify killing someone else. But who the hell cares who gets credit for that? Why are you even bringing that up? Point is that you had no wiggle room. Done.
If I were bussing Glyph, I would have pushed his lynch a lot harder. D3 there were others who took a much firmer stance on Glyph.This paragraph is like you admitting to bussing Glyph.
The way you chose to shoot certainly is illogical if you are town. Again, there was a town consensus on a plan that you conveniently chose to ignore. I am more of an unknown than Zen was. Zen could have been godfather, but he was less likely to be scum than I was. You chose to leave the bigger unknown around. What's more, the fact that you chose to go against the town plan without saying anything about it beforehand is illogical. It is obviously going to put the spotlight on you the next Day, which is not what town needs if you are town.
True, you could have done that. However, Gheb had already stated Roxy should be vig'd, and if Roxy didn't die, it was pretty clear he would have pushed Roxy's lynch the next Day, and he probably would have gotten it. Why not kill Roxy instead and gain town cred while validating your claim?
Gova, why didn't you weight in on the Glyph lynch AT ALL when it was being discussed?
Gova
I'm goin' for it!
Ok, you're missing the fact that I chose not to shoot you because of your push on Glyph. And, since Glyph flipped scum I didn't feel I needed to shoot you. It's pretty funny though that you find me as scum because I didn't shoot you lol. When did the Glyph discussion take place? I might not have been here for it. This is silly anyways. If you think I'm scum, I can only be SK, not mafia.
Gova
I'm goin' for it!
Also, no one would kill their own scum mate willingly unless of course you're J.
Gova
I'm goin' for it!
Also, that doc claim in DKR was stupid. If he had gotten CC'ed it would have been a free mislynch for scum.
Gova
I'm goin' for it!
I have to be cooked to 160F in order to avoid bacterial contamination whether it be natural after purchase. If my contamination gets on other products they would have to be trashed. I basically bleed on people to kill them.
T-block
B2B TST
Glyph discussion was...basically all of D3? x.x
Why do I get the impression from this post that you were fully aware of town's plan before N3, just that you didn't feel you needed to follow it? Just to clear things up, do you admit to being aware of our plan before N3?
To be totally honest, the fact that Gova instantly listed a specific way to kill pretty much confirms him as vig or SK to me. Do you think all the mafia members (peppers, onions) were explicitly told the ways that they kill? I'm sure Roxy had flavor behind his roleblocking, but I seriously doubt the killing aspect was explained.
Meh, he could've easily made that up. Pretty sure T-block is mafia and Gova SK though. As long as Asdioh can protect me and scum can't kill July the mafia can't outnumber us anymore anyway ... it's just a question whether we lynch one or the other first.
T-block
B2B TST
For real? x.x
Gheb, Gova is not SK because Roxy would have roleblocked him. How is this not sound?
July
Smash Apprentice
Read over the T-Block/Gova dialogue. I still cannot see Gova as mafia, T-Block's points are alright on the sirface but I think that Gova fought back against them pretty well and really I have a hard time believing that he would have seen it necessary to nk Roxy to prove anything.
I'm a protected cheese of origin, and the EU is my protector. Their legislation keeps me safe from corruption and ensures that I am a perfect combination of sheep's milk and goat's milk produced in Greece. I cannot be corrupted at Night, only thrown out during the Day.
T-block
B2B TST
You think he fought back well? ._.
The only point of mine that I felt he responded to well was the point about Roxy being roleblocker. What else did he do?
He said Roxy/Glyph wouldn't be helpful behind the scenes - speculation. He feels the need to say there's no proof I'm not mafia either, which is true, but also attempts to represent the lack of proof as part of my evidence against him, even though I was bringing it up not so much to help the case itself, but to show that the case was justified. He claims ignorance of the plan we set out yesterDay. He attacked me for taking credit for solidifying the vig, when credit is completely irrelevant.
He has also chosen not to respond to the meat of my most recent post.
So July, where is he responding well? My points are all right on the surface... how are they flawed "deep down" then?
The only point of mine that I felt he responded to well was the point about Roxy being roleblocker. What else did he do?
He said Roxy/Glyph wouldn't be helpful behind the scenes - speculation. He feels the need to say there's no proof I'm not mafia either, which is true, but also attempts to represent the lack of proof as part of my evidence against him, even though I was bringing it up not so much to help the case itself, but to show that the case was justified. He claims ignorance of the plan we set out yesterDay. He attacked me for taking credit for solidifying the vig, when credit is completely irrelevant.
He has also chosen not to respond to the meat of my most recent post.
So July, where is he responding well? My points are all right on the surface... how are they flawed "deep down" then?
T-block
B2B TST
...and by "most recent post", I meant 1723. Specifically the part where I seriously doubt he did not know we all wanted him to vig me.
T-block
B2B TST
And WHY can't you see him as mafia?
Works for me.
Roxy/Glyph/T-block
or
Roxy/Glyph/Terywj
I'm gonna reread and see if either of these makes more sense. Tery's lack of activity lately is frustrating, and T-block's apparent towniness is frustrating, but I think he could be using the fact that he was supposed to be NKed, but wasn't, to appear as town as possible
![Terywj [태리]](/data/avatars/l/71/71007.jpg?1555906021){kind=avatar}
Terywj [태리]
Charismatic Maknae~
What exactly must I be commenting on? I find T-Block most probable as a final member of Mafia simply off of my reads and the way he has posted lately, but I'm okay with my own lynch if this helps proves T-Block's slot. However, that would wander us into mislynch and lose, since Asdioh is going to be targeted tonight anyway. Of course, this helps determine Gova somewhat, as two kills should occur, as long as Gova is not Mafia. Hmm.
T-block
B2B TST
Sigh... are you guys even reading my posts? Or are you just dismissing it as T-block trying to seem town?
Asdioh, my "apparent towniness"? You know what that says to me? That it doesn't matter what I say - if I seem scummy, I'm scum. If I seem townie, I'm scum trying to appear townie. How about you look at the fact that I have brought up solid points instead of worrying about my motivation behind making them?
Tery, I'm calling you out. Your scum read on me exists only because Gheb accused me of being scum. You yourself don't have a reason to believe I'm scum. Prove me wrong.
Asdioh, my "apparent towniness"? You know what that says to me? That it doesn't matter what I say - if I seem scummy, I'm scum. If I seem townie, I'm scum trying to appear townie. How about you look at the fact that I have brought up solid points instead of worrying about my motivation behind making them?
Tery, I'm calling you out. Your scum read on me exists only because Gheb accused me of being scum. You yourself don't have a reason to believe I'm scum. Prove me wrong.
T-block
B2B TST
I mean seriously... read my posts against him, and pretend Gheb was making them. Where is the logic unsound?
T-block, how many scum are left and who are they?
I strongly strongly feel that Gova is more likely vig than SK... and far more likely SK than mafia. So the points you're trying to bring up against him seem forced to me.
Gheb is definitely the cop, as there was a miller and he's gone uncc'd.
July is almost definitely town, as she was protected on the night of a no-town kill, and also claimed BP.
I am definitely the doctor.
That leaves you and Tery. Both claimed VTs. One is broccoli, one is shrimp, neither of which I would want on pizza but I digress.
Isn't it obvious that one of you is scum? I should probably do my reread now, but I don't see what else could be the case :/
Tery has an inno, but could be godfather so that's null. T-block hasn't been investigated, also null. I suggest the two of you make cases on each other, as trying to convince me that Gova is mafia isn't going to get you anywhere.
Anyway, I'm done doing stuff in other games, I'll try to reread this one some more now and see what I find.
I strongly strongly feel that Gova is more likely vig than SK... and far more likely SK than mafia. So the points you're trying to bring up against him seem forced to me.
Gheb is definitely the cop, as there was a miller and he's gone uncc'd.
July is almost definitely town, as she was protected on the night of a no-town kill, and also claimed BP.
I am definitely the doctor.
That leaves you and Tery. Both claimed VTs. One is broccoli, one is shrimp, neither of which I would want on pizza but I digress.
Isn't it obvious that one of you is scum? I should probably do my reread now, but I don't see what else could be the case :/
Tery has an inno, but could be godfather so that's null. T-block hasn't been investigated, also null. I suggest the two of you make cases on each other, as trying to convince me that Gova is mafia isn't going to get you anywhere.
Anyway, I'm done doing stuff in other games, I'll try to reread this one some more now and see what I find.
T-block
B2B TST
I'm not going to push a Tery lynch just because you guys think it's me or Tery -_-
Most likely is Gova mafia. No other scum.
Next is Gova SK, Tery mafia.
Could be Tery mafia, with Gova vig, but I think this is highly unlikely.
Gheb is clear. I am now comfortable clearing July as well. I also consider Asdioh town, not so much because of doc, but because Glyph flipped town.
You are letting your predispositions interfere with your evaluation of my points. You said "I think vig > SK > mafia, SO the points seem forced". How does that make any logical sense? "Wait, this guy is suggesting Gova is mafia? His points must be forced." No, it should be "Hmm...this guy's points seem forced. I will not change my thoughts on Gova". Toss that aside and actually look at what I'm saying.
Can you respond to every point in 1712 and 1714 please, Asdioh? How do you justify his not following the plan we set out?
Most likely is Gova mafia. No other scum.
Next is Gova SK, Tery mafia.
Could be Tery mafia, with Gova vig, but I think this is highly unlikely.
Gheb is clear. I am now comfortable clearing July as well. I also consider Asdioh town, not so much because of doc, but because Glyph flipped town.
You are letting your predispositions interfere with your evaluation of my points. You said "I think vig > SK > mafia, SO the points seem forced". How does that make any logical sense? "Wait, this guy is suggesting Gova is mafia? His points must be forced." No, it should be "Hmm...this guy's points seem forced. I will not change my thoughts on Gova". Toss that aside and actually look at what I'm saying.
Can you respond to every point in 1712 and 1714 please, Asdioh? How do you justify his not following the plan we set out?
T-block
B2B TST
EBWOP: ...but because Glyph flipped scum.
meh
Ok.
Would scum have likely gone after the claimed vig on N1? I think so, thus why I protected him, thus (probably) why only the Vig's kill went through. N1 is the hardest to read, as J/AM/July/Gova could all have been mafia targets that Night, and we won't know until the game is over.
N2? Someone, I think Zen, said T-block was the likeliest NK target... I thought about it, and was thinking between July/T-block/Gheb/Gova ... chose July as she seemed the towniest, yet least discussed for potential NKs and the like, so I thought I could outguess the mafia in that regard. I was probably right. Roxy, the mafia roleblocker, was killed. The mafia probably didn't try to kill Gova on N2 because (speculation) they had already tried N1, and failed, so they thought the doctor might protect him again. That's why they went after July. I really really doubt that Gova killed his own scummate, because there just wasn't enough for him to gain by doing so. He could have claimed to be roleblocked, and then we would have lynched Roxy, and it would be like "oh hey, roleblocker, he really was roleblocked!"
Besides, are mafia even allowed to NK each other?
N3: mafia probably assumed Gheb was getting a protect, if there was a doctor, so they were more likely to go after someone such as me/Gova, since July claimed BP. I protected Gova, since I figured he was the biggest threat to mafia (Gheb also said this) and I figured a vig shot wouldn't go through if mafia killed him, and I wanted to see what T-block flipped, since it was agreed that the vig would target him. Thing is, if T-block were scum, he would definitely want to kill the vig, or else he'd simply lose the game at this point. I protected Gova, and Gova... chose the wrong target. I can understand his reasoning, and Zen was a decent choice as I would have had to decide between Tery/Zen toDay if T-block had been vigged and flipped town. But yeah... Zen was vigged, and no mafia kill yet again.
That was long-winded, but basically I'm saying that the lack of 2 NKs was more likely due to my protects, rather than "gova being mafia"
It sucks, I'll admit. However poor Joey's choice was, I think he was being honest about it.
Disagreed. You said you'd go with whatever Gheb said, then Gheb said in no uncertain terms that Roxy NEEDED to be the vig target. If you disagreed at that point, it would be hella scummy on you, so you agreed. This is one of the biggest reasons I think you're scum. Tery kept saying Roxy needed to die, or Glyph. If I recall, you also said Glyph needed to die/be vigged, and that's cool and all, but remember how Glyph was just a goon and Roxy was the roleblocker. Of course they were the two scummiest players that needed to be vigged, and of course you would prefer to not lose your PR. But man... it really sucks to be in a position where your two scummates are inactive to an extreme, doesn't it?
And this is around the point where I think you are scum that's amazed to find yourself still alive, so you're going to use the chance while you have it and look as ridiculously town as possible. I've never seen a "You didn't kill me, you're scum!" case before, hehe. Don't you think Gova has some points, though? I personally thought the plan was mostly "vig T-block if Glyph flips town" but then he flipped scum. I can't really argue for him, but I see where he's coming from.
I don't know who Roxy chose to roleblock. I don't know if vig/...
Actually... Mafia order of operations... would a vig kill outprioritize a roleblock? Would a SK kill outprioritize a roleblock? >_>
Anyway, I think the fact that Roxy flipped RBer helps support the case for Gova not being mafia. They would have agreed that he would claim to have been roleblocked, Roxy would have been the most likely lynch D3, he'd flip RBer, people would go "ohhh Gova was telling the truth" and that's that.
Honestly, since nobody else has claimed to have been roleblocked, the fact that Roxy was killed when he obviously should have RBed Gova kind of makes me wonder if Gova is SK, because as far as I know, SKs have a higher priority than vigs. I'll need someone like Gheb to answer this for me though.
ok, this part actually got me to start considering. He says he'd probably be roleblocked, but he wasn't.
Holy hell, what if Gova was RBed N1, and mafia killed J or AM? O_o
*thinks hard*
No mention of Glyph? Gova really wants to use the JTB wagon to find scum, and Glyph/Roxy were conveniently not on it. Though his playerslot (Joey) was...
I lost my train of thought. I'll just post this and then speculate on what should be done in terms of lynching/night killing.
Asdioh
July
Gheb_01
Terywj
Gova
T-block
Let's consider T-block's scenario. T-block, I'm assuming you think Gova is the third mafia member, and the only remaining scum in the game, correct? If you're right, then we can afford a mislynch. We lynch you, direct Gova to NK Tery, and if the game continues, lynch Gova to win.
However, I don't think you're right, so let's consider a worst-case scenario: SK and mafia remaining. We lynch you... if you flip town, Gova has been directed to NK Tery. If both of you flip town, which you probably won't, we then lynch Gova.
Bleh... thing is, there could be 2 NKs if there are two scum left. The cool thing is that they know I'm the doctor, I'll be portecthing Gheb, and that July is BP, so their kills might overlap, meaning the scum could both target me, or target each other, or something.
goodnight x_x
July
Gheb_01
Terywj
Gova
T-block
Let's consider T-block's scenario. T-block, I'm assuming you think Gova is the third mafia member, and the only remaining scum in the game, correct? If you're right, then we can afford a mislynch. We lynch you, direct Gova to NK Tery, and if the game continues, lynch Gova to win.
However, I don't think you're right, so let's consider a worst-case scenario: SK and mafia remaining. We lynch you... if you flip town, Gova has been directed to NK Tery. If both of you flip town, which you probably won't, we then lynch Gova.
Bleh... thing is, there could be 2 NKs if there are two scum left. The cool thing is that they know I'm the doctor, I'll be portecthing Gheb, and that July is BP, so their kills might overlap, meaning the scum could both target me, or target each other, or something.
What kind of typo is this?
goodnight x_x
T-block
B2B TST
I'm glad you're actually reading my posts now. I'll respond tomorrow.
Can you please point out the post(s) that suggest the plan was to vig me if Glyph flipped town?
What are the implications of Gova being blocked N1, and mafia killing J/AM? Would it just be coincidence then that Joey happened to target J?
Can you please point out the post(s) that suggest the plan was to vig me if Glyph flipped town?
What are the implications of Gova being blocked N1, and mafia killing J/AM? Would it just be coincidence then that Joey happened to target J?
T-block
B2B TST
Asdioh, do you think I'm scum because I've done scummy things, or simply because I'm one of the people not cleared?
I don't know. The fact that two thirds of the mafia team is confirmed to have been ridiculously inactive makes getting reads on everyone else much harder.
T-block, remember on D1 when J and I agreed that you looked super townie? I was rereading at some point fairly recently, and the things I thought were townie could have easily been fake towniness, you know what I mean?
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12563329&postcount=290
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12563426&postcount=302
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12564362&postcount=330
Stuff like that looks hella townie, but scum could say the same things, you know? Do we have any way to confirm you as town, because that would be really helpful.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12627363&postcount=1298 stuff like this helps. You wanted Roxy and/or Glyph dead, over ES, who flipped town. That's where wifom comes in: would scumTblock want to bus his scummates, who are obviously being useless anyway, in order to appear town and make it to endgame?
Honestly, reading stuff like that makes me feel that you're town. Tery also did stuff like that though >_<
Now for the record, you really think Gova is the only scum left, right? He's the third mafia? I find that really hard to believe, simply because of what happened on N2. :/
T-block, remember on D1 when J and I agreed that you looked super townie? I was rereading at some point fairly recently, and the things I thought were townie could have easily been fake towniness, you know what I mean?
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12563329&postcount=290
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12563426&postcount=302
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12564362&postcount=330
Stuff like that looks hella townie, but scum could say the same things, you know? Do we have any way to confirm you as town, because that would be really helpful.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=12627363&postcount=1298 stuff like this helps. You wanted Roxy and/or Glyph dead, over ES, who flipped town. That's where wifom comes in: would scumTblock want to bus his scummates, who are obviously being useless anyway, in order to appear town and make it to endgame?
Honestly, reading stuff like that makes me feel that you're town. Tery also did stuff like that though >_<
Now for the record, you really think Gova is the only scum left, right? He's the third mafia? I find that really hard to believe, simply because of what happened on N2. :/
T-block is town? :/
unvote
I'm now learning that late-game mafia is a pain in the *** lol
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=12648271#post12648271
these ~10 posts look pretty good for T-block.
why am i still awake
these ~10 posts look pretty good for T-block.
why am i still awake
T-block
B2B TST
No, there's no way to confirm me as town since I'm VT =\
The posts you highlighted I agree could easily be faked by scum. Note that I NEVER linked back to those posts and said "look, this is me being townie", and I never intend to, because they don't show anything. In fact, even at the time, I showed I was uncomfortable with J's awkward town appraisal of me in my 381.
Yes, I think Gova is mafia. I would love for you all to bring up why this is unlikely, because I am confident I can find a PLAUSIBLE explanation for his actions as mafia. Nowhere can I see an action by him that tells me "okay, Gova cannot be mafia".
The posts you highlighted I agree could easily be faked by scum. Note that I NEVER linked back to those posts and said "look, this is me being townie", and I never intend to, because they don't show anything. In fact, even at the time, I showed I was uncomfortable with J's awkward town appraisal of me in my 381.
Yes, I think Gova is mafia. I would love for you all to bring up why this is unlikely, because I am confident I can find a PLAUSIBLE explanation for his actions as mafia. Nowhere can I see an action by him that tells me "okay, Gova cannot be mafia".
T-block
B2B TST
I do think SK is possible though.
His actions do not say pro-town to me though. I think vig is very unlikely, which is why I'm so sure about lynching him. Worst case scenario is SK, but we would have had to lynch him anyways.
His actions do not say pro-town to me though. I think vig is very unlikely, which is why I'm so sure about lynching him. Worst case scenario is SK, but we would have had to lynch him anyways.
July
Smash Apprentice
Catching up and reading T-block/Gova thing more thoroughly now. Massive post to be expected tonight yet :o
T-block
B2B TST
Heading to bed. I'll see you guys tomorrow.
stuff from Roxy:
Now Glyph
Anyway, that's all from Roxy/Glyph. They sure were good at covering up for their scumbuddy. Roxy says he's null on T-block, and July looks good. Glyph doesn't even mention either, and neither mention Tery at all.
What do?
g'night
Mentioned nobody but town.
not lynching town, not lynching town, weak stance on possibly lynching town, null on T-block, "cute" on town. ehh :/
:mistyface:
Now Glyph
scumread on two town, townread on two town.
Talking to Zen about how NK speculation doesn't help. Does this convince you that there is a vig/SK, or do you think it was all part of their plan?
Anyway, that's all from Roxy/Glyph. They sure were good at covering up for their scumbuddy. Roxy says he's null on T-block, and July looks good. Glyph doesn't even mention either, and neither mention Tery at all.
What do?
g'night
July
Smash Apprentice
The argument was more that Joey didn't have the balls to claim vig as sk, which I admit isn't a great argument. However, claiming vig as mafia, Day 1 when there have been no Night actions, that seem unlikely. First, he would have to think that a vig claim would have done him a lot of good and that it would be easy to forge those results, which is a pretty farsighted plan. Then he would have to have been extremely confident that there wasn't actually a vig when he claimed, which I don't see how he could have been when there hadn't even been a Night phase yet. So while Joey could have taken a leap and claimed vig as sk, I don't see what Joey as mafia would seek to gain by claiming vig.
Fair enough, there is no proof that more than one night kill has been attempted per Night, however I'm bp, we have a doc; it is very possible that mafia night kills did fail. Either way, it is best for us to assume that more than one night kill can happen per Night and speculate from there. If you think that Gova is scum, whether that is sk or mafia then you should push that, but we don't want to take the fact that only Gova's night kills have gone through for granted and get blindsided by a mafia nk.
N1 was by far the scummiest vig shot and J was not discussed or agreed on as a vig shot.
N2 I think you are going a little too far with the way you interpret what happened; we all threw out our vig choices, which were focused around Glyph, Roxy, and Tery to an extent. Gova asked Gheb for his vig targets and chose to follow Gheb's plan and very clearly stated he agreed with that plan. If he had lynched Glyph instead N2 I don't think that he would have been immediately lynched because Glyph would flip scum and he would have saved Roxy, the roleblocker, instead of a goon.
As for N3, Gova didn't clearly state that he agreed with the plan like he did before N2, and he did make it clear he believed one of the people on JTB's wagon was scum which included Zen. His shot may not have lined up with town discussion but it lined up with his personal opinion all Day, so I don't think it was anywhere near as scummy as the N1 lynch.
I still don't feel like Gova was forced to kill Roxy, he asked for Gheb's choices, which lined up with a couple other people's choices and he chose to follow it. Like I said he could have opted to aim for Glyph and not kill Roxy but he didn't.
lolololololololololol
Did you see the scum team??? It was Roxy and Glyph, both of which were inactive and no help to the scum mate doing the work lol. There was no way they suggested Joey to claim vig imo. Joey doesn't have the balls to claim vig unless he actually was one lol, which he is.
First part is speculation, second part is I think attacking T-Block for his nk speculation.
Agreed that N1 was definitely going against town choices for vig shot. N2 definitely went with the town opinion. N3 Gova didn't have much to say about the vig target and did not confirm or deny anything, and from this it seems that his personal opinion went against town opinion and at least stayed in line with his own views by taking into account his own suspicions of Zen and T-Block's support of the Glyph lynch. N3's actions are a little shaky but not as bad as N1. At worst this could point to Gova scum, but still not seeing this as points towards Gova as mafia.
I don't really care that you took credit for it, but I do agree that the N2 vig choice was strongest pushed by Gheb and his point is at least valid.
I thought this paragraph and his choice at least seem sincere. He shot someone he thought was scum and saved someone he saw town motives in. Even if I disagree with the vig choice I can understand why he would do that.This paragraph is like you admitting to bussing Glyph.
And this is I think the strongest argument from Gova; its speculation but once again the strategic logic of having Joey claiming vig if he were mafia and how he would expect that to work out just doesn't make sense considering how things have played out.
Kk so I didn't really get to dig into both posts earlier, but I did read through and the roleblocker argument was the one that stood out to me. Reading more thorough his defense may not have been a great response, but it was a good enough response to deal with the speculation that he is mafia rather than vig or even sk.
Some of your points are good for why Gova could be sk (basically the parts where you point out general anti-town behavior) but the parts trying to convince us he is mafia I do find flawed and I explained why above.
However:
From this I do see that you are at least sticking with your top scum pick and not forcing a case on Tery which is good. You should give more reasons why you think Gova could be scum in general other than focusing on proving he is specifically mafia, because some of those points just lead to A LOT of speculation.
That's all for now, that was hella distracting from me cleaning and packing lol.
T-block
B2B TST
Dropping the points about Joey's claim and no NKs. They were not presented as evidence, but as reasons why you should read the case. They're being distracting now, and I agree with what you guys have said on them.
Now consider this: where has Gova been? He had a strong enough town read on me to leave me alive. Shouldn't he have known that I would be under heavy fire going into toDay by leaving me alive? Why isn't he defending me more, his town read? Isn't this strictly anti-town behaviour, no matter how you spin it?
At the very least, lynch him for being SK and we'll see. Do you really think I'm more likely to be mafia than he is to be SK after all this?
July, why am I scum? I haven't heard anything about that from you except for "this question/plan could have scum motives".
Yes, he could have, and we would have been like "oh good job gova. you went against what gheb said, but you hit scum so cool". And then what would have happened? We would have lynched Roxy the next day. That leaves them in exactly the same spot, but with Gova worse off. Not to mention it's possible that Glyph would not be lynched the next Day, unlike Roxy.
No, he never stated it, but did you consider that he didn't state it because he never intended to obey it? Claimed ignorance should not be a clear by any means. In fact, it makes me wonder where the hell he was when we were discussing the plan.
Now consider this: where has Gova been? He had a strong enough town read on me to leave me alive. Shouldn't he have known that I would be under heavy fire going into toDay by leaving me alive? Why isn't he defending me more, his town read? Isn't this strictly anti-town behaviour, no matter how you spin it?
I think you're not giving enough weight to the fact that it was extremely likely that Roxy would be lynched the next Day. Read Gheb's post again (1362) - "Roxy absolutely NEEDS to be vigged toNight". If Gova killed Glyph, we'd probably be okay with it. But wouldn't Gheb or someone else push the Roxy lynch the next Day? Then when Roxy flipped roleblocker after Glyph flipped goon, don't you think Gova would then see a little questioning about his choice?
Once again, why is he allowing me, the townie, to be lynched now? He could at least push Tery, no? His actions are inconsistent.
Hmm... this has shown me that the weakest point in my case is certainly "why would joey claim vig in the first place?". I'll think about this.
Responded to the flaws - interested in hearing your response.
At the very least, lynch him for being SK and we'll see. Do you really think I'm more likely to be mafia than he is to be SK after all this?
July, why am I scum? I haven't heard anything about that from you except for "this question/plan could have scum motives".