This will be concise:
CACTI:
- His governing ability
#856 – Macman. Good point to make. How was Cacti sure of Kevin’s claim? Is this good town use of the governing ability to not be certain of the governee’s alignment. This is a very strong point to make. It’s not about Cacti protecting Kevin because he was a doctor, because he didn’t know that.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8986975&postcount=856
Yeah I did. Right when he got lynched, he said this:
You guys lynched the Doc good job like.
Which is why I chose to protect him.
However...
#1349 – Cacti. Shows up early on the Day. Says he governed the town doc. Bolds it. Why is this a plausible scumtell? WIFOM supported by the fact he had no idea Kevin was a town doc at the time. It is a clear contradiction. Mentos gives a good case here, but his failure to pursue it and pursue me instead only grew my concerns on Mentos unfortunately.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9228851&postcount=1349
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9232363&postcount=1361
I just thought that it was something that would be bad for mafia to do. The doc is an important town role.
- Connections to Gheb/Rockin and insight into their interaction:
I studied the connections between Cacti and the other 2 scum... they mention each other a lot surprisingly, moreso than other players in the game. NOTE: this has nothing to do with breadcrumbing, but has everything to do with the way they want to convey their relationship amongst each other. This takes place throughout all Days.
#215 – Pay specific attention to the end – Gheb mentions Rockin, Chaco, Cacti/Swords, though goes for Swords instead of Cacti, effectively leaving the other 3.
In Cacti’s defence – “he’s still alarmingly scummy” but more credible
In Rockin’s defence – “still got my eyes on him” though given the benefit of the doubt.
NOTE: the similarity in the way Gheb directly refers at them.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8738241&postcount=215
Riddle did this to me too; he said that he was very suspicious of Swords and I, yet always voted Swords, but not me... And you're Riddle! Wait, so this must mean that you're protecting me, and if I'm scum... That means that your protecting me as a scumbuddy, and you're scum!
Or, maybe mafia had a plan to try to make subtle connections to a player, so when they die, eyes go to that player. Riddle was doing this too, before you replaced into him, showing more evidence that they have been doing that.
#251 – Rockin’s post. NOTE: ties with #215.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8755474&postcount=251
#303 – Gheb’s suspicions on me begin. Note – he diverts attention from Cacti and Swords. He does this in earlier posts also. He’s adamant they are not to be focused on today. A contrast to #215 when he says he’s ‘alarmingly scummy’.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8773133&postcount=303
mmhm. Maybe more like Gheb putting Swords and I in reserve for a backup lynch (as he tried to push for Swords D2), while at the same time making connections. As Swords flipped not-mafia, this reinforces my argument about mafia trying to connect themselves to people, for the times Gheb did this. This "evidence" that you bring up is just more mud to sling at me in your pbpa.
I think that a pbpa could probably be used on anyone to make them scummy; I could probably make one on everyone in the game (even the dead ones) to make them "scummy" by twisting actions to suit your lynch-picks. Town doesn't know mafia; sometimes they're wrong, and when they are, it is just more ammo for mafia to use. Meanwhile, mafia know everything, so they can connect themselves to people to take them down with them, take good stances on people they know are town, and distance themselves from buddies. Mafia can do all the right, townie things while town blunder searching for scum.
<From around #196 Cacti disappears and appears at #322>
#322 – Starting to think Riddle is scum i.e. now that the attention is away from him, Gheb has cleverly exaggerated Riddle’s case, giving room for townies and the scum Cacti to follow. Cacti also attempts to tie Swords with Riddle. A 2 in 1 connection – not good. The case was terrible and reaching. #324 rebuttal by Macman – sweet, concise, to the point.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8774457&postcount=322
#334 – Rockin is defending Cacti yet again with vague reasoning this time. Just for clarification, Rockin finds Riddle scummy at this point.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8775488&postcount=334
It wasn't really a case. I was just stating some possibilities, putting it out there. I really don't see how Gheb has "cleverly exaggerated Riddle's case". All he said was that Riddle's case was stupid, and Macman always plays like that, which is true, even though he is scum. You are the one that is reaching with this point, just trying to add some more stuff to your attempt to score a mislynch.
<Gheb and Cacti disappear… as does Rockin>
#541 – Gheb. Pay attention to his first sentence – switching on and off between Cacti. Showing subtle support for Cacti here, again. Yet another contradiction to #215 where Gheb was clear on Cacti's position.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8814618&postcount=541
Yeah, subtle support... Like creating a subtle connection. Also, he jumped off my wagon because it's what Gheb was doing as scum; he rode wagons against town and when he started to see people oppose them, he hopped off and got on the new one. He did this first with me, then Swords, then finally Sinz.
#552 – Rockin. Pay attention to the last part. "I already agree with Cacti." Indirect support here.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8815937&postcount=552
Yay for more mud slinging with the connection wifom.
Uh, okay.
#679 – Cacti. Funny, Rockin and Cacti drop in around the same time. Their first entrance this Day is marked together, indicates coordination. Funny, he also directly attacks Gheb. There are posting habits and patterns here. In Day 1 we see them referring to each other, in Day 2 this consistency is the norm.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8876702&postcount=679
Uh... Or maybe we're in similar timezones. Posting after similar school endtimes. This is really reaching and just added in to make your case look bigger. Oh, and because I "directly attacked Gheb", which I didn't, I just called him out for answering first, directly against KevinM's requests. Macman did this too, so wait... That must mean he's scum! Guys, Macman's a mafia that flips town when he dies!
#695 – Cacti. Going for Riddle, sharing a common interest with Gheb here. Distancing from Rockin. This is important – why? It’s clear their fluctuating thoughts are a good sign of scum outside communication. I cannot find any connection at this point that links Gheb and Rockin to Riddle in the same way I can with Cacti.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8884357&postcount=695
Sure, I'm distancing from Rockin! You're interpreting my words in a way that makes me look scummy. If we're going to instantly assume that I'm distancing from Rockin in every time I say he's scummy, then why not also instantly assume that whenever Gheb went for Swords instead of me, it was helping his mafia buddy... Wait. It is what you're assuming! Was Gheb helping his mafia buddy every time he stated his support for somebody? Was everyone in the game distancing from Rockin whenever they implied a suspicion to him? No.
Yeah. And I was scummy every other time I agreed with a case, wasn't it, and as I'm mafia, everyone I've ever agreed with is mafia too. I'm never allowed to agree with anyone ever again, am I? Or I'll be pinned as scum somehow when somebody picks it up to mislynch me.
Pinning Rockin as scum now with misinterpreted evidence? Wait, no, I can't say that. Now I'm buddying with him. Oh no!
#738 – Cacti. Same time as Rockin, lovely! It’s so inherently scummy how the consistencies I’ve brought to show a Gheb/Rockin/Cacti subtle in thread interaction is brought to life in this quote so vividly when Cacti actually answers the question to Rockin that Gheb was meant to answer.
Really, in what games has anyone ever played in (this is to you too, Pierre) that mafia actually posted at the same time consistently. Again, we might also be in the same timezones, just be a coincidence, many other things could explain this.
How is this directly reinforcing
my thoughts on Riddle? This is a blatant mis-interpretation (as in mis-lynch, when I say mis-interpretation I mean a scum nudge to make the town interpret things wrong) used to make me scummy. That just looks like him nudging the whole town on a Riddle lynch. I do not see in any way how that directly nudges me. This is actually more of a towntell for me. Why would mafia need to reinforce another mafia buddy's thoughts? This point doesn't even make any sense.
I don't see how he's directly expressing his deep concern for me in that one-liner post. Why would mafia even do that? They want as little connections, maybe even anti-buddy (I don't know how to say this, where they're connected by saying each other are scummy. disconnections, i think) connections as they can with each other. If a mafia makes a connection to another person, that's probably just them making a subtle connection to pull someone down with them. Why would they make a connection that would cause a mafia buddy to get lynched, when they are lynched.
#819 – Cacti. Random to drop a vote on Rockin. Where did this come from? What does it mean? Rockin was currently not as suspicious as others at the time… the only logical reason is that Cacti has already predicted the lynch will be a townie. He knows Rockin is scum. This doesn’t place him on the wagon. A great random vote to enable WIFOM later on.
Actually, this is a bit after when I realized that Swords was just stupid townie. After that, I looked that Rockin's only consistent target was Swords so far, and to me it looked like scum doing a mislynch. Probably should have explained the vote, around then was the time I kind of lost a bit of interest in the game.
How is it that the "only logical reason" is that I've predicted that the lynch will be a townie, and I've placed my vote on Rockin to distance myself? That's the "only logical reason" from your point of view, if you were town. This doesn't even do anything to convince Pierre, the decider, now that we've crossvoted. This is just here to try to make it seem less that I voted a mafia member, and kept my vote on him until the lynch, which is a towntell, and more like distancing, misconstruing it into something that will make me look scummy.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8957388&postcount=819
#910 – Cacti. This is his first post in the Day. What pro-town attitude is there here? Again, driving at Riddle – Again, shows common interest in lynching Riddle along with Gheb and Rockin.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9009807&postcount=910
This was also during my period of lost interest... But it shows evidence of how my mind switched him from scum to dumb town, which gives proof for my reason for voting Rockin.
#913 – Gheb. Marshy/Riddle/Rockin, why are you lurking? Where exactly is Cacti here despite being the biggest lurker. #933 now states Cacti, but this is an inconsistency from before – why is Gheb switching thoughts between Cacti like that quite mechanically?
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9018489&postcount=913
Are you serious? Why do you keep on pushing this "Gheb flip-flopping on me"? If anything, it just reinforces my belief that he is alternating from making connections with me to try to take him down with him, and looking at me as a possible mislynch target when there's no one else good. He didn't list me as a lurker because as you can see, he's asking for lurkers to speak up and give their top three suspects, which I did three posts ago.
#950 – Gheb. Great to be suspicious of both Rockin and Cacti. A vote on Cacti quite suddenly due to the turn of events – It’s interesting because voting me at the time of my joining is something I consider an unfair vote considering the time of the Day itself. Gheb had to rethink this point and vote for the next logical ‘pro-town’ choice, which was unfortunately his scum buddy Cacti. He’s still very much on the Riddle lynch in terms of his thoughts though.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9043199&postcount=950
I have a different interpretation of these events - Gheb's subtly covering his mafia buddy, you, and voting someone else, even though retaining "suspicion" for you, not really voting you, and voting the other person instead.
did u c wut i did thar?
#992 – Cacti. Comes out from lurking. NOTE the @s. @Gheb, @Rockin, though doesn’t address anything to Mentos and everyone else is grouped together. The post itself is very inherently scummy I can spot a number of things. A lack of consistency in his reactions – earlier we had him arguing a lot in D1, he was wary of people voting him. Now notice his reaction to Gheb’s vote – no sign of aggression, just casual questioning. It’s all very mechanical, very staged. Then of course there’s my case on him regarding his point on Mentos – why lynch one of Mentos’ reports? Why not let Mentos carry on with his business? Ties with his reaction to voting #141
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9052447&postcount=992
On D1, I was much more aggressive because I knew I couldn't die - if I was lynched, then I could claim governor before, and then protect myself, and probably be docced through the night. When I joined, mind you, this was one of my first games still. In Simpsons mafia, my first, I got lynched for playing stupidly day one, and developed a fear of being called out as "scummy" for saying something. In other games that I joined, I lurked so I wouldn't get called out on some thing I said that was "scummy", but in this one, I had no fears as I could not be lynched. After I saved Kevin, I got less aggressive (and active, as part of a reason), so I wouldn't be lynched. I know, it's bad play, but I'm trying to not do that anymore.
Or maybe I truly didn't understand the case. I said this about the case on KevinM's case too, was I protecting him?
#1337 – Tell me when to hammer. Trying to get town confirmation so he doesn’t look bad for hammering. Very interesting… that and he’s prolonging Gheb’s death. Killing 2 birds with 1 stone here Cacti, nice play.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9172746&postcount=1337
Twisting my actions. This is just what I say. You can read in any game I'm in, and I'll probably have posted this very line. You can check Monster Mafia for good examples of this, it's easy, just look at the end of days.
- Lurking
This is pretty self-explanatory. I'm not "kind-of" right, I am right! Cacti has been a big lurker with little valued opinion throughout the whole game. The only Day he was active was Day 1 and that's because of his argument with Swords... now:
#712 – Cacti. Table tennis argument with Swords. Remember Omis' theory? Disconnections… Cacti showed particular interest. Swords was apparent in having little connections. Assumption: Cacti prolonged the argument with Swords and is his way of keeping close to the disconnected, it's a very interesting thing to do to make people view his potential Day lynch as nothing valuable in terms of information.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=8906959&postcount=712
What? I don't know what you're saying here.
But about the disconnection method, I still think that it is not very good. Scum can decide to disconnect themselves with other scum, connect themselves with town, or anything of the sort
because they know who the town are. Known scumtells like that should be taken with a grain of salt, because when any scumtells are known, they become tinged with a drop of WIFOM.
He rides the opinions of the more popular players in the game: "I agree with this person" etc etc etc.. I can bring up countless examples if need be, but he doesn't put a lot of his own opinion into town matters.
I admit to this, but does that really make me scum? If someone has a meta to doing something scummy, then it's bad, as it messes up people's scumdars, but does it mean that they're mafia in every game they play in? No. It just means that they tend to stumble into common scumtells such as buddying, bandwagoning, and the sort as a result of how they play.
- Scum Inquisition:
#992 – Cacti. Along with #1007. Asking about the mechanics of a role, but it’s very obviously done so in a way to question about what mafia should do in this situation – note he mentions the roleblocker, he mentions questions on ‘how’ and ‘why’. After lurking, and now asking these, it’s an indication he wants background information on roles unfamiliar to him. Weigh up the scum and town merits of these:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9052447&postcount=992
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9055973&postcount=1007
I come from epicmafia, where there are no such thing as non-recruiting masons, other then cops together, which were not called "cop masons". They were a foreign concept to me.
- Voting Patterns:
Cacti your vote on Rockin came from when you had greater suspicions on other players. I now see this as a bus vote.
You see it however you want to see it, so it is in your favor, because you're pushing a mislynch on me. I know that at the time, my suspicions simply changed, but I did not see why. A scumtell I don't like that much is flip-flopping. I really don't see what's so scummy about it. Sometimes, people's minds change, but people are discouraged to announce a different fos, because people will call them scummy.
As for Gheb it's pretty obvious your appeal to town on when to hammer is very standout scummy. Why would you seek approval for a hammer?
I get called scummy either way. If I don't hammer him, I get accused of protecting a scumbuddy, if I do, I get accused of making a move to try to put me in a clear. This is why I don't like scumtells like this.
The point itself is just not good enough Cacti - this will not be Newbie Mafia x2. I believe you now 'losing interest' is a last ditch attempt to excuse some of the decisions you made.
