Path of Radiance: Ike Guide and Strategy Discussion

[Dinotard]

I started using Ike in Brawl after playing Path of Radiance (a few months ago. August I believe). I felt comfortable with him but he was nowhere near the level of my real mains. He feels a lot better now in smash 4, though.

Aside from learning Ike's combos, what you really need to do is understand smash in general. How to approach, how to edge guard, how to space, how to make it back on the stage safely (recovering low, high, or side B right onto the ledge while saving your second jump), and how to read in general.

I could say I probably have a small amount of basic knowledge of smash techniques but I tend to just play and not think, That's my biggest issue in Smash and FG's in general. I don't really read and I just play without thinking. How exactly would I be able to practice patience in order to acheive good reads?

 

[Oblivion129]

I could say I probably have a small amount of basic knowledge of smash techniques but I tend to just play and not think, That's my biggest issue in Smash and FG's in general. I don't really read and I just play without thinking. How exactly would I be able to practice patience in order to acheive good reads?

Try to predict what they'll do. For example if the opponent is hanging on the edge, you could predict their ledge attack or jump, and you could go for a Fair. Or if your opponent is in the air trying to land, you can charge an Up-smash and wait to hit him after he air dodges.
These are just basic examples but you should incorporate reading in pretty much every part of a match.

I guess you can start by trying to see what attack your opponent normally does. Like Roll, shield-grabs, dash attacks, projectiles, etc. If you know someone is a roller, you can try to punish that. At high level play, though, they'll normally mix it up and be harder to read.

 

[san.]

For me, if I reallly want to attack at a certain time, I just decide not to and see what happens. If my opponent lets me get close enough for a free grab or dtilt pressure, I will oblige. If I feel threatened, I can just dash away or retreating bair.

http://www.twitch.tv/battlebuddiesgaming/profile/past_broadcasts
Look up SmashGiving (dunno why it's so split up) and find any parts with Ryo's Ike. He fights a variety of opponents. It'll help you understand what kinds of things to do in many different scenarios.

 

[Dinotard]

I think I see what you mean, I remember dabbling in it a little bit but It wasn't a constant, My reflexes arent too great as I've seen some of my replays and I realize I need to work on punishing better.

 

[Dinotard]

For me, if I reallly want to attack at a certain time, I just decide not to and see what happens. If my opponent lets me get close enough for a free grab or dtilt pressure, I will oblige. If I feel threatened, I can just dash away or retreating bair.

http://www.twitch.tv/battlebuddiesgaming/profile/past_broadcasts
Look up SmashGiving (dunno why it's so split up) and find any parts with Ryo's Ike. He fights a variety of opponents. It'll help you understand what kinds of things to do in many different scenarios.

I'll look into that, I saw the couple youtube links you sent me in a different thread of Ryo's Ike, he's real good with him.

 

[FuRy Smash]

Thank's I'll start trying to do that, I just joined smashboards a couple days ago, but I can see how helpful the site and the community can be. Ive seen a couple vids of Ryuga and I watched Moon monkey's guide on ike this morning so I learned a bit, I've also had a few helpful replies from san,
I'm going to have to start playing a lot more.

Luckily I work right by nintendo world so I can practice Smash 3ds with anybody I find there, but I'm still in the process of looking for a place in NYC where I can play Sm4sh with people.

where in nyc you live man?

 

[-RedX-]

NYC is REALLY active right now tourney wise. Every Sunday, Nebulous hosts Smash4. This is where I'll usually be competing and to get experience.

 

[Dinotard]

where in nyc you live man?

I live in Jamaica but I work in Manhattan traveling isn't an issue. Just don't know where to go to play

 

[Dinotard]

NYC is REALLY active right now tourney wise. Every Sunday, Nebulous hosts Smash4. This is where I'll usually be competing and to get experience.

I Really want to attend but I get out of work at 3, which is when the smash 4 tourneys start so I won't be able to make it

(sorry for double post)

 

[-RedX-]

Well, I believe they alternate times every 2 weeks or so where Smash4 starts at 4pm and PM at 3pm.

 

[Dinotard]

Well, I believe they alternate times every 2 weeks or so where Smash4 starts at 4pm and PM at 3pm.

Really? Alright that sounds awesome. I'll Definitely try to make it

 

[LionMagnus]

Great work San, reading this guide help me understand Ike's options much better. The combos info are really helpful.

 

[Robin1613]

I live in Jamaica but I work in Manhattan traveling isn't an issue. Just don't know where to go to play

What part? I'm in the Laurelton/Springfield area, hopefully we can meet up soon!

 

[Dinotard]

I live in woodhaven right by the j train

 

[SimplyClutchh]

What do you guys do against Sonics that spam blue balls? I've seen pivot grabs work sometimes, but what else is there?

 

[Deleted member 269706]

What do you guys do against Sonics that spam blue balls? I've seen pivot grabs work sometimes, but what else is there?

Power shielding, counter, and nair to catch the rolls. Keep your cool, and don't be aggressive against him, it's too easy for him to punish you.

 

[Nidtendofreak]

Shield, punish after. They can do a lot out of spin dash, the ones I faced couldn't grab out of spin dash and I don't believe they can quickly shield grab out of spin dash either.

 

[Arrei]

When is a good time to try NAir? The input for it feels so awkward to me that I wind up rarely using it on any character, but several characters I like to use need it as part of their repertoire. But it doesn't help that Ike's in particular feels so unsafe to use.

 

[Dinotard]

When is a good time to try NAir? The input for it feels so awkward to me that I wind up rarely using it on any character, but several characters I like to use need it as part of their repertoire. But it doesn't help that Ike's in particular feels so unsafe to use.

I know how you feel, I always try to throw nairs out there but I get punished too. But when I hit people with it it's great. IT can work if they are below you or in front of you, the hit box has some distance. I'm Still a noob myself but its just something I've observed

 

[Deleted member 269706]

When is a good time to try NAir? The input for it feels so awkward to me that I wind up rarely using it on any character, but several characters I like to use need it as part of their repertoire. But it doesn't help that Ike's in particular feels so unsafe to use.

I think Nair is one of my most used moves. I use it while short-hopping towards/over the opponent. The attack is great for catching people who are rolling because it hits in front of, underneath, and behind you. It's also a nice way to zone your opponents. It's really all about the spacing when using Ike. I would recommend messing around in training mode to figure it out. One great technique to use is dash > short-hop > Nair. It'll teach you how to carry forwards momentum while using an attack other than Fair or Uair. There's this guy Moon Monkey on YouTube who has some great Ike gameplay, I'd recommend watching some of his videos and just note how he uses Nair. Here's one link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQ5MN4nKakc Well I hope this helps a little, good luck out there!

 

[critter17]

So I just learned something the other day and it's called Perfect Pivoting. Anyone else know about this technique and is it useful for Ike to use at all? For example you could jab1, perfect pivot, then jab 1 again from a (small) distance. But I don't know, it doesn't seem too useful.

 

[Deleted member 269706]

I'll have to look into that perfect pivoting technique, though I'd imagine it'd have some applications in game play.

I've been messing around with a technique new to myself where you Quick Draw over the opponent at the proper height (where the attack auto-cancels), then doing an extremely quick short hop > Bair. It's a great baiting strategy because no one expects Ike to recover AND attack that fast. The timing isn't even that hard to figure out, way easier than a lot of his other combos. Plus, if you feel that it's too risky, you can always use the auto-cancel to escape rather than go in for the hit. I find that it's great for making a return to the stage; after you receive some decent knock back and go way out there, use it, but instead of just going for the ledge, go over their head. Works wonders for me.

By the way, congrats on the mod status @ san. ! (This is new right? If not I never noticed before )

 

[san.]

Thanks @Rawkstar

Perfect pivoting is quite good for dtilt. Basically, you just dash dance and press C-stick down (tilt stick) at the right time. No need to return the stick to neutral if you time it right.

 

[critter17]

Thanks @Rawkstar

Perfect pivoting is quite good for dtilt. Basically, you just dash dance and press C-stick down (tilt stick) at the right time. No need to return the stick to neutral if you time it right.

I'm just now playing with it and it's amazing! I'll definitely use this in my competitive play. Also congrats on the mod status! :D

 

[XDaDePsak]

"
Almost every Brawl AT that has not been listed is likely to be present in Smash 4.
"

such as.?

 

[-RedX-]

More tournament matches incoming:
Vs. Sonic: http://youtu.be/wLLjvw8CqiU
Vs. Peach: http://youtu.be/aO0b4mhKfh4
Vs. Diddy: http://youtu.be/3o5EPaOT2SE

Got 7th at this one, really feel like I can get at least top 4 at these locals right now, just gotta practice more.

 

[Robin1613]

I'll see you this sunday Red. Keep up the good work man.

 

[-RedX-]

May or may not show up this Sunday since finals are coming and whatnot.

http://youtu.be/nFF5RzEkwXY
At around, 11:50-ish, Ryo very cleary mispaced his Nair on Nairo's shield, Nairo shieldgrabs and it just whiffs for seemingly no reason. What's up with that?

 

[critter17]

May or may not show up this Sunday since finals are coming and whatnot.

http://youtu.be/nFF5RzEkwXY
At around, 11:50-ish, Ryo very cleary mispaced his Nair on Nairo's shield, Nairo shieldgrabs and it just whiffs for seemingly no reason. What's up with that?

Ryo spot dodged. I paused the video at the right time and saw that Ryo spot dodged just in time. Then Nairo got the grab the second attempt.

EDIT: Whoops, nevermind. I saw that totally wrong. I'm not quite sure what happened.... Sorry for double comment post.

 

[san.]

Grab missed because Ike ducked under it. Happens often with Ike's grab against landing animations.

 

[-RedX-]

Didn't think grab hitboxes were that bad. Jeez lol

 

[san.]

Derp, nevermind. That was just the regrab timer because of the grab break a few seconds ago. Grabs do sometimes get ducked under more often than you'd like, though.

 

[Zapster]

First off, Ike's DACUS is godly and I great way to nail people trying to flee into in the air.

Also, I don't know if this is the right place to post this or not but am I the only one who thinks Ike would seriously benefit from being made capable of wall jumping by using his Side-B into a wall? I see Shieks recover from the abysss below the stage just by wall clinging... Asking for Ike's Side-B to wall jump would give Ike a better recovery comparable to other characters like Fox or Falco.

Seems fair and would be fun to do.
Call me crazy but I believe in a world where every character is given unique characteristics and made more reasonably capable of recovery. I mean I do appreciate that Side-B, if it hits in the air, doesn't make Ike free fall anymore!

Speaking of which, does Ganon's/ Falcon's Down-B in the air refresh their double jump like in the days of old? I can't tell, my character usually does when I use Down-B in the air, but I don't really play a either much and wasn't sure if it was possible when recovering from a ridiculously high place

 

[Robin1613]

DACUS can still be performed??
And AFAIK ganon and falcons second jump don't restore after down b.
Ike had that option to walljump from sideb in project m and it was amazing. I really do miss it.

 

[san.]

DACUS can still be performed??
And AFAIK ganon and falcons second jump don't restore after down b.
Ike had that option to walljump from sideb in project m and it was amazing. I really do miss it.

DACUS cannot be performed, but you can perform a dash attack cancelled item toss with the same input and item in hand. A very slightly upward frontal diagonal throws the item forward, and the area is stricter than Brawl.

I think I'm fine with the recovery distance. I just wish Ike had better IASA frames on his aerials so I can use them more to swat people away offstage. Still, first world problems since we have good autocancel frames to make up for them on fair and bair.

I'm finally getting accustomed to the timing of fair and I'm liking it a lot more now. Before, I conditioned myself to slightly delay the fast fall of a fully hopped fair, but now I attempt the fast fall whenever possible. Fully hopped fair can almost link into other aerials and even itself, and you can instantly follow air dodges. You could do this before, of course, but now there's no thinking about the fastfall timing, making it better on whiff since you just fall ASAP.

 

[Rango the Mercenary]

What do you guys think of pivot FTilt? Gamechanger? I faced a Mario who rolled a good bit and it seems legit as a punishment tool. Seems effective as well against players who roll back onstage.

Here's what I've been working on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p77XlhaqSFU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP2-9zt2_hg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAsfbeNUT8Q

 

[san.]

What do you guys think of pivot FTilt? Gamechanger? I faced a Mario who rolled a good bit and it seems legit as a punishment tool. Seems effective as well against players who roll back onstage.

Here's what I've been working on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p77XlhaqSFU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CP2-9zt2_hg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAsfbeNUT8Q

Pivot ftilt is a great alternative to retreating bair. The ftilt lag was reduced, so it's pretty good against non-speedsters and you can punish if they air dodge it.


Apparently, Ike can eruption EVERY autosnap in the game. You're vulnerable on frame 1 of a ledge snap.

 

[-RedX-]

1 frame window? Ike's Eruption has to be active for more than that though, don't think I'm frame perfect and I land it often.

 

[san.]

1 frame window? Ike's Eruption has to be active for more than that though, don't think I'm frame perfect and I land it often.

At least 1 frame of vulnerability. Timing is much better than 1 frame for eruption.

Some of the invincible recoveries like Sonic's upB seems incredibly difficult to pull off, while teleportation recoveries are quite easy.

 

[MrEh]

Eruption actually lingers for quite a bit, making it extremely easy to hit telegraphed recoveries during the 1 frame window.

Not applicable in most matchups, but definitely worth learning against anyone with a telegraphed and slow UpB. (SHEIK)