Patch 1.1.6 Released: Bayonetta Hit With Nerf Hammer

Late Thursday evening, Nintendo released what could possibly be the final patch for Smash 4. The patch notes had been leaked ahead of time by Twitter user @RandomTBush, revealing that only one major change had occurred within the game: Bayonetta had been nerfed as hard as any other character in the history of Smash 4.

PG | ESAM takes a look at Bayonetta's re-worked specials
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Apparently Nintendo had heard the very vocal voices in the community calling for Bayonetta nerfs and decided to rework the character in a major way. The changes seem to be specifically designed to prevent her from setting up and pulling off her ladder combos, which could be devastating for the character. Her D-tilt has had its hitbox significantly reduced. Both Witch-Twist as well as After-Burner Kick have had their SDI multipliers doubled, which should make it significantly easier for opponents to escape. Also worth noting, is that her hitboxes for several iterations of these moves have been shrunk. Her D-air has also received a nerf in the form of a reduction in knockback growth. You can find the full patch notes here.

Top Smashers seem to be going in both directions on whether or not Bayonetta will remain a top-character:

This nerf to Bayonetta was great. I think she is still a really good character. The best? Probably not.

— NAKAT (@darknakat) May 20, 2016

Bayonetta is not top tier anymore. Like, not even close. MAAAAYBE top 20.

— ESAM (Stride Esports) (@imESAM) May 20, 2016

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Bayonetta nerfed a bunch. Still one of the better characters, but nothing like before. I think Rosa/ZSS/Diddy are the best rn, then sheik.

— Jason Zimmerman (@MVG_Mew2King) May 19, 2016

deer nintendoo

i payed 5.99 for bayonetta and you've ruined her

i would like a refund please

yours truely

kuroganne gammsr

— Kurogane Hammer (@KuroganeHammer) May 20, 2016

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What do you think of the impending Bayonetta nerfs? Will she still be viable? Are you disappointed that no other characters were changed? Is this the final Smash 4 patch? Let us know in the comments below.

 

I was a little bit disappointed that Bayonetta was the only character nerfed, but it is actually a good thing, too, since it will barely change the meta game. Except for her, of course.

 

Now, I don't use Bayo and do think he's super powerful prepatch, but it seems these nerfs got slightly out of hand. Though that's just my opinion.

 

I don't have any good, convincing words other than...well...Bayonetta is no longer Bayonetta... They didn't nerf her; they burned her like any other witch on a steak... It's like I'm watching the Ridley hangings from the 50-fact Extravaganza all over again~

 

I wonder why nobody got that pity for Sheik like this too....
In 1.1.5 she got the biggest nerf in the game second to, well, only to this one, and putting all the patches together, Sheik was, by far, the most nerfed character in the game.... bar none.
What is with that pity for the witch all of the sudden?

 

I wonder why nobody got that pity for Sheik like this too....
In 1.1.5 she got the biggest nerf in the game second to, well, only to this one, and putting all the patches together, Sheik was, by far, the most nerfed character in the game.... bar none.
What is with that pity for the witch all of the sudden?

I really REALLY hate this counter argument. Why nobody felt pity for Sheik? Cause she was too safe/dominating and even after the nerf they didn't change her core playstyle, just exactly what needed to be changed, some slight Fair range and the 50/50, nothing else. She still has the tools, frame data and godlike neutral to keep dominating (just not as hard) and she got a Dsmash buff to at least try to compensate. Bayo got none of that, no frame data to rely on, no godlike neutral and no compensating buff, only more nerfs even to things that no one asked for (Dtilt nerf). She did need some changes but this might've been overkill...But only time will tell. I will give her 2 weeks to see what people come up with.

 

Sakurai after the patch:

1. Pretty iritating that they pick one character we can vote on, then make her seemingly unplayable.

2. Nice profile pic. Maine's totally the best freelancer

 

I've been messing around with the new version and though I admit Im only a kid I did notice the following:
: His hitbox is a million times better and is probably stronger.
: Is the new speedy powerhouse, his speed has drastically increased but he lost his ultra sweetspot.
: Down throw is now the ultimate setup for powerful aerial and the hit box for his fsmash is crazy good.
: Fthrow's lag is next to nothing to set up for a dash attack but is otherwise still pathetic.
: Air Speed is much better so now Mac has a chance to recover.
: Hit boxes are a lot better but still don't know much.
: You might as well consider her a combination of puff and Sonic, Absolutely pathetic both her and her teammate and is balls light.
: My girl's strength in some attacks, noticably her dragon fang shot is weakened again but her counter has improved and has a shorter sweetspot in fsmash. It's also a little bit harder for her to hit anyone.
That' purdy much all I know got anything else?

 

I like to think these patches come in two distinct flavors in terms of the severity of nerfs.

There's characters who have received insane amount of nerfs just to try and level the playing field and reduce the bullcrap factors of characters, yet still retain the flavor of the characters style. Characters that come to mind for this are Sheik and Diddy, both nerfed heavily yet are both still very much the same in much of their combos and "style", just less polarizing and have all the tools and frame data necessary to win obviously, just requires much more work which makes it more rewarding. Luigi could also fall into this. They've really worked hard on removing overly abused one shot type moves where a few inputs can cost a stock whereas now it's a lot more read based and not so much "oh dang he read the 50/50".

Then there's characters like Bayonetta and Meta Knight who I feel lost so much reward off what they previously had to the point it's a little silly. Meta Knight in that his up air strings to the up special finisher was incredibly precise and involved multiple factors in play like staling, percent per characters the mains of him had to crank out and still didn't fully know, how to react to the DI. And with that hard nerf along with his already hard to win neutral, it makes him significantly less rewarding as a result in my opinion. Not to say Bayonetta didn't deserve some tweaks, but even from a glance some of these might have been extreme. SDI multiplier of 2? Jeez.

Oh, and the hidden third category where your character goes patches upon patches scotfree with nothing but light slaps to the wrist worth of nerfs. Rosalina, please.

 

I've been messing around with the new version and though I admit Im only a kid I did notice the following:
: His hitbox is a million times better and is probably stronger.
: Is the new speedy powerhouse, his speed has drastically increased but he lost his ultra sweetspot.
: Down throw is now the ultimate setup for powerful aerial and the hit box for his fsmash is crazy good.
: Fthrow's lag is next to nothing to set up for a dash attack but is otherwise still pathetic.
: Air Speed is much better so now Mac has a chance to recover.
: Hit boxes are a lot better but still don't know much.
: You might as well consider her a combination of puff and Sonic, Absolutely pathetic both her and her teammate and is balls light.
: My girl's strength in some attacks, noticably her dragon fang shot is weakened again but her counter has improved and has a shorter sweetspot in fsmash. It's also a little bit harder for her to hit anyone.
That' purdy much all I know got anything else?

I haven't don't any testing myself but I've seen that Bayonetta was the one affected... There's no way everyone missed 8 changes.

Im going to say this is a troll, you said Rosaluma was "pathetic"

 

Again I'm only a kid how the hell was I suppose to know about all of these changes plus there is undoubtly more, All of you guys focus on Bayonetta the Umbra Witch (Normally I'd call her something that rhymes with her entitlement witch yet given her treatment and her HUGE deficet, I was a hair more lenient) that you forget the others try them out see what I see.

I couldn't make this up especially if I wanted too try out RosaLuma you'll see what I mean

 

Again I'm only a kid how the hell was I suppose to know about all of these changes plus there is undoubtly more, All of you guys focus on Bayonetta the Umbra Witch (Normally I'd call her something that rhymes with her name yet given her treatment and her HUGE deficet, I was a hair more lenient) that you forget the others try them out see what I see.

It's not just testing, people have datamined the 1.1.6 update and the first message in this thread (by STOB) even stated Bayo was the only one affected. Excuse my blutness here, but I'm going to trust the crowd of dataminers over someone who discredits himself.

Unfortunately, im unable to try 1.1.6 for myself at the moment, so I'll try them out then. But you should know, RosaLuma is top tier and far from pathetic

 

Watch pete, In a few weeks RosaLuma will end up in Bayo's position, or at least close to it. How do you datamine I want to prove that those changes exist.

 

I've been messing around with the new version and though I admit Im only a kid I did notice the following:
: His hitbox is a million times better and is probably stronger.
: Is the new speedy powerhouse, his speed has drastically increased but he lost his ultra sweetspot.
: Down throw is now the ultimate setup for powerful aerial and the hit box for his fsmash is crazy good.
: Fthrow's lag is next to nothing to set up for a dash attack but is otherwise still pathetic.
: Air Speed is much better so now Mac has a chance to recover.
: Hit boxes are a lot better but still don't know much.
: You might as well consider her a combination of puff and Sonic, Absolutely pathetic both her and her teammate and is balls light.
: My girl's strength in some attacks, noticably her dragon fang shot is weakened again but her counter has improved and has a shorter sweetspot in fsmash. It's also a little bit harder for her to hit anyone.
That' purdy much all I know got anything else?

You didn't even try. Low quality bait.

 

Watch pete, In a few weeks RosaLuma will end up in Bayo's position, or at least close to it. How do you datamine I want to prove that those changes exist.

You're trolling. Any Mods please?

 

Wow you two really don't believe in me do you, I'm right about these changes maybe it's not the bait it's the low quality fish! I won't give in to this fact not now not ever!!!

Read this text... I AM RIGHT

 

Again I'm only a kid how the hell was I suppose to know about all of these changes plus there is undoubtly more, All of you guys focus on Bayonetta the Umbra Witch (Normally I'd call her something that rhymes with her entitlement witch yet given her treatment and her HUGE deficet, I was a hair more lenient) that you forget the others try them out see what I see.

people datamined nintendo's servers.

Literally the ONLY thing that had something changed was bayonetta.

People have the tools to find these types of things kid, each patch they can compare files from old versions, to the new ones, and pinpoint when a character was changed, and often exactly what. The fact that literally the ONLY files changed were all from bayonetta, it's pretty much 100% confirmed that no one else had anything happen.

You're experiencing the placebo effect.

 

people datamined nintendo's servers.

Literally the ONLY thing that had something changed was bayonetta.

People have the tools to find these types of things kid, each patch they can compare files from old versions, to the new ones, and pinpoint when a character was changed, and often exactly what. The fact that literally the ONLY files changed were all from bayonetta, it's pretty much 100% confirmed that no one else had anything happen.

You're experiencing the placebo effect.

Thanks

 

It's one big frigging nerf for sure, but there's definitely not going to be anything holding back honest players from learning her new game. Personally, the only two things that irk me so far is that they could have upped her ground and air speed so that she could have better juggling. Nonetheless, she still has what it takes to be a good character.

 

Please stop with the trolling. As was said before, it has been proven by data miners that the only changes in the recent update were to Bayonetta.

http://smashboards.com/threads/1-1-...n-read-the-first-post-before-replying.436806/

https://twitter.com/KuroganeHammer/status/733534623607586817

 

I don't believe this no one is convinced, I've seen these changes right before my eyes, well gaming hands, point being if you want to say Bayo was the only one changed fine, but I'm right about these changes I won't give in to that fact.

 

I don't believe this no one is convinced, I've seen these changes right before my eyes, well gaming hands, point being if you want to say Bayo was the only one changed fine, but I'm right about these changes I won't give in to that fact.

You can live in ignorance or accept what everyone is agreeing upon. Either way, you already got a warning, so tread carefully.

EDIT: better yet, you could start a new thread somewhere where you support your beliefs, but it'll likely just get taken down by these wonderful Mods (no sarcasm. They're truly underappreciated).

 

If I agree as to what everyone is saying about me "trolling" and accept that I am one, will you all be happy and move on?

 

The discussion here is not if there are other changes with the newest patch; the contents of the patch have been confirmed. Whether or not a person believes the facts is not the topic of discussion. Please stay on topic.

Also. please refrain from double posting. Use the edit button if you wish to add something more.

 

Great maybe people will stop talking about banning her

 

It's one big frigging nerf for sure, but there's definitely not going to be anything holding back honest players from learning her new game. Personally, the only two things that irk me so far is that they could have upped her ground and air speed so that she could have better juggling. Nonetheless, she still has what it takes to be a good character.

I haven't tried her out yet, but it looks like her combos are gone too, or at least mostly. Since she was intended as the ultimate combo fighter, I can't say she'll be a good character. All she has for me, until i try her out, is witch time

 

Ok, maybe perhaps I assumed these changes occured, I guess I'll never know if this patch is believable with just one change or not.

Aww man why me, I knew I should have used Loser as my gamertag, oh well no use talking about this nonsense anymore.

 

The way I see moves with increased SDI is an added incentive to reserve them for surprises. Witch Twist still gives good combo opportunities if not escaped properly, same with Afterburner Kicks. You just can't use them all the time, nor extend too much as that'll increase the likelihood of them doing so.

Basically, Witch Twist and Afterburner Kick are still good moves, but you can't spam them or use them predictably. The only non-negociable nerf is the divekick, but then it's also truer to source material as landing one in Bayonetta leads to... another low-damage divekick, maybe. The risk-reward is appropriate now, frankly.

Bandwagoners and pockets will be scared off for sure, but the dedicated players will likely find ways to overcome these nerfs and can still succeed, but they'll have to use everything they've got.

 

"vocal voices"

 

Ill be quiet now...

 

I think we should take this whole Bayonetta drama as a lesson and learn from it. Ever since Smash 4's release, people have moaned and complained about the lack of "real" combos and that "D Throw > FAir > FAir" was the only type of combo seen. Then, Sakurai throws Bayonetta, a character filled with legit combos and the ability to reliably 0-death, at us. Yet, everyone complains that she's too OP for these reasons, causing her to get what might be the biggest nerf to any character so far.

Long story short, be careful what you wish for. It might not be as great as you think it will.

People keep bringing this up, but you all forget the fact that one character =! the whole cast or the game, so making one character combo heavy and nobody else was not what anyone asked for, why do people keep trying to twist it this way?

 

They didn't touch Witch Time because Witch Time is not a particularly good move. And because they nerfed it in 1.1.5.

Their solution to get rid of easy to kill combos was to simply get rid of the combos in and of themselves as opposed to just making it so they weren't easy to kill.

Her most important move, dive kick, appears to be worthless.

Her few approaches are all telegraphed.

Witch Twist seems to be so unsafe you're just as likely to put yourself into a worse position (and probably a KO) depending on the circumstance. Characters can DI below her now. If ZSS didn't win the matchup before, she does now.

She still has her edgeguarding tools and what used to make her "combo heavy character" now makes her a "keep away character". Only she also doesn't have the damage output to really do that, and she gets extra lag if she uses too many moves in the air to get away.

What I'm seeing does not follow the design philosophy outlined in her developer video.

Witch time is not a good move? Hahah, it is the best counter of the game

 

Witch time is not a good move? Hahah, it is the best counter of the game

It's only a counter in that it requires the other character to attack when using to activate. You can spam counter. You cannot spam W.Time.

It's far closer to Wario's waft, and even then would be the lesser of the two. A single whiffed W.Time is significant and, unlike waft, just because you connected it doesn't mean you'll be in a proper position to capitalize on it at all with a follow up.

 

It's only a counter in that it requires the other character to attack when using to activate. You can spam counter. You cannot spam W.Time.

It's far closer to Wario's waft, and even then would be the lesser of the two. A single whiffed W.Time is significant and, unlike waft, just because you connected it doesn't mean you'll be in a proper position to capitalize on it at all with a follow up.

Id put Witch Time above Wario Waft. You can use witch time more often, plus, it's easier to connect. Even if they're not at kill percent, you can get a quick spike or at least rack up damage.

 

If every character played like Bayonetta, Smash 4 would be a pretty exciting game. No offense but this nerf heavy mantra just creates a watered down game. Take away all the exciting stuff please. I want a game where characters are either good at comboing but have poor kill setups, or good kill moves but poor combos. Sounds like they're out to frustrate players from the get go. Why not just make everyone awesome?

Not to mention how they release paid characters that over perform, knowing that it spikes sales because of it's brokenness, while having every intention of nerfing it after making a buck. Sakurai living that dishonest life. I don't respect it.

 

Not to mention how they release paid characters that over perform, knowing that it spikes sales because of it's brokenness, while having every intention of nerfing it after making a buck. Sakurai living that dishonest life. I don't respect it.

Sakurai left after Bayo and Corrin released, and Sakurai's tried distancing himself from Corrin's inclusion, so take that as you will.

 

Hello Bayo, welcome to Nerf Town, also known as Mid Tier. My name is and these are my friendsand. I hope you enjoy your stay, cause your never leaving this place, pal.

 

Hello Bayo, welcome to Nerf Town, also known as Mid Tier. My name is and these are my friendsand. I hope you enjoy your stay, cause your never leaving this place, pal.

Lol greninja is the only one there who is actually mid tier, tho

Also, i actually didn't want Bayonnetta to get nerfed yet as a matter of fact. I wanted to see if the community actually got to learn the matchup and see if the witch could be beaten legitimately. I'm not against the nerf, but i just wanted to wait a little longer for it. But this is definitely better than a ban so hopefully people would stop complaining about the game from now on since im about 90% sure this is the final patch

 

In Smash 4, Sakurai and friends did an excellent job with the new movesets in terms of design. This round of new characters - a whole lot of them! - all largely feel very faithful to their source material.

This does not mean they always translated to being that great in gameplay terms (Robin, for example), but they were unique and still felt like themselves!

Pre-patch Bayonetta was a very cool reimagining of her home game into Smash, and it's too bad that it ended up coming off as several notches too strong in Smash rules for it to stay as-is.

Given the choices Nintendo had to make about a huge amount of outcry that could have damaged the tournament scene, and however much time/resources were left to get another patch going, it seems they decided they had to play it safe and either fix the perceived problem now, or never. If they chose "never," who knows what would've happened with the tourney scenes from there with so many serious talks about bans...?

I would've been in the "wait a bit longer for meta to develop" camp, but I don't think it was an option on Nintendo's end, given further development was supposed to have ceased as of February (that's when Corrin and Bayonetta dropped, right?).

Things are what they are, and I'm just glad we got supported for as long as we have so far.

 

I think a damage increase shoulda come with all this considering her combos are now much shorter

 

I'm confused as to how anyone's saying Bayonetta's "unplayable" now, have you fellows ever played a Bottom Tier character before? They are clouted with weaknesses and their strengths are outshone, and I personally don't think you can say the same thing about Bayonetta. She racks up damage very well, edgeguards wonderfully, has a insane recovery, and really only suffers from her weight and a perceived lack of ability to kill. Which even then there's still her B-air and edgeguarding, I feel like she's fine. These nerfs were justified, and they didn't destroy the character imo.