Official Pac-Man's Amazing Full Colour Fan Club! - Pac-Man General Thread

[Galaxian]

Gonna be honest I have no idea where I ask this, sooooo....

Special Cancelling Bonus Fruit I know is possible in the air - but I only learned now you can do it on the ground and it's cancelable into anything. While I try to get jab out of it I get grab instead.

How do I pin-down the timing to cancel it into something on the ground?

 

[Paper Maribro]

You tap r to cancel the charge and then immediately tap a to jab. If you press both at the same time you get a grab.

Make sure you don't press r too long either or you will shield and then get a grab OoS.

 

[Galaxian]

You tap r to cancel the charge and then immediately tap a to jab. If you press both at the same time you get a grab.

Oh, you just press the button? I was inputting the command to do a sidestep.

Well that makes it worlds easier. Much obliged.

 

[BSP]

I read somewhere that Abadango is picking up Rosalina. Does anyone know if that's true?

 

[Nu~]

I read somewhere that Abadango is picking up Rosalina. Does anyone know if that's true?

I heard the same thing, but I think it may have been a joke on Twitter.

If it is true, than losing rep kinda sucks. I like Chef Pac's playstyle more though

 

[Galaxian]

I read somewhere that Abadango is picking up Rosalina. Does anyone know if that's true?

ABADANGO NO

Another soul trapped by Space Elsa. Better be a joke, Abadango please don't

 

[BSP]

On a different note, if you guys saw ADHD's villager camping with the timber counter, I was thinking of ways we can shut that down.

Has anyone looked into the interaction, if any, between the timber counter sapling and our side B? I know we can take it out the equation completely with hydrant, but it'd be even better if we could heal off of it.

We could side B the Lloids, and if we're running On Fire Hydrant and Freaky Fruit, we can get a freaky key in hand to z drop on him. With default fruit, we could do key -> ledge and drop default keys on him. We could also just drop hydrants on him normally.

Or we could jump over him, airdodge through whatever he tries to do, and make sure to plant a trampoline under the ledge. Then, he can't let go without getting forced up, and if he does it too many times, trampoline KOs him. If he tries to go to the other side, the sapling is still on the first ledge.

I saw people complaining about it. It's more fun to figure out ways to beat it IMO. Some characters may be pretty screwed though.

 

[Firedemon0]

On a different note, if you guys saw ADHD's villager camping with the timber counter, I was thinking of ways we can shut that down.

Has anyone looked into the interaction, if any, between the timber counter sapling and our side B? I know we can take it out the equation completely with hydrant, but it'd be even better if we could heal off of it.

We could side B the Lloids, and if we're running On Fire Hydrant and Freaky Fruit, we can get a freaky key in hand to z drop on him. With default fruit, we could do key -> ledge and drop default keys on him. We could also just drop hydrants on him normally.

Or we could jump over him, airdodge through whatever he tries to do, and make sure to plant a trampoline under the ledge. Then, he can't let go without getting forced up, and if he does it too many times, trampoline KOs him. If he tries to go to the other side, the sapling is still on the first ledge.

I saw people complaining about it. It's more fun to figure out ways to beat it IMO. Some characters may be pretty screwed though.

It works just like any other campy Villager honestly. The sapling really does not hurt Pac-man, we can throw apples and strawberries, over the edge safely if they try to just ledge camp. We can even get fancy and launch hydrant. Our camp tools are much better. Sapling = Fruit charge.

 

[busken]

I wouldn't be so sure. Our over-reliance on items can be dertrimental at the highest level of play. Simply throwing out an aerial, airdodging, and in this MU pocketing, all are viable tools for villager to take our projectiles. In fact he can even bait it out when he is offstage by covering the end lag of slingshot with nair, and c-sticking it back. To make matters worse if he runs custom pocket he can pocket things within a wide range decreasing the timing he would need if using default. With this, we have no option to break his zone without risk. Just for the fact that all are camping tools can be reflected or stolen make our camping game worse. In his MU we be to be really smart and creative when using our items. Sending a hydrant then a fruit can bait out pocket, or hitting hydrant with side special seem like good ideas. But in general overcoming custom villager will be an uphill battle.

 

[Firedemon0]

I wouldn't be so sure. Our over-reliance on items can be dertrimental at the highest level of play. Simply throwing out an aerial, airdodging, and in this MU pocketing, all are viable tools for villager to take our projectiles. In fact he can even bait it out when he is offstage by covering the end lag of slingshot with nair, and c-sticking it back. To make matters worse if he runs custom pocket he can pocket things within a wide range decreasing the timing he would need if using default. With this, we have no option to break his zone without risk. Just for the fact that all are camping tools can be reflected or stolen make our camping game worse. In his MU we be to be really smart and creative when using our items. Sending a hydrant then a fruit can bait out pocket, or hitting hydrant with side special seem like good ideas. But in general overcoming custom villager will be an uphill battle.

If they are holding onto fruit, they can either keep refreshing the hold time by keeping it out, which allows Pac-man to throw hydrant's like candy. Or they pocket it while hanging on the ledge and we can charge a replacement. They can grab hydrant and give us two of them to exploit (very few attacks allow villager to break hydrant as fast as Pac-man) or the water from hydrant throws off the predictable flowchart ledge camping. Pac-man is not horribly blocked by using fruit if they grab it, he isn't rob, he can still use Fruit, just not when Villager has it out.

Counter timber is hilariously strong, but it just is not a problem for Pac-man, Villager without axe is easy pickings for Pac-man because of his underwhelming attack set. Also how does it help Villager if we have a percent lead? I think there is an overly large focus on aggression. It would be boring, but get a percent lead, and force an axe-less Villager to approach Pac-man. Campy villagers are horrible, he does not have the same wall like abilities that Rosalina has by a long shot. Villager goal is zoning, throwing out safe ranged attacks to slowly rack damage, then try to go for a kill with axe, bowling ball, or offstage edge guarding. His toolkit is gimped without Axe, and Counter timber is destroyed by 15 damage.

It seriously is a non issue. If you are worried about approaching, side b high (Villager cannot chase vertically effectively) hydrant down towards ledge. React to the player's avoidance choice. You wont be CQC'ing the player that would use Counter Timber to ledge camp, you rack damage and force them after you. They then are gimped offensively and they can try to get to Pac-man.

 

[busken]

Still, Villager has all the tools to win the MU. If he still you lay down a hydrant he can quickly throw the item he has to protect him. If the item is pocketed, he can still just air dodge hydrant. Not saying he is blocked by fruiting, but trying to offensively capitalize when he has one means that you are neglecting his defensive options with the fruit and hydrant. On the grounded, his zoning options are still superior has he can set up walls with Lloid Rocket and slingshot. Side Special into Lloid is not safe since they can catch your end lag, and imo either character can win by running away if they have the lead, since both character's up close options are lackluster. Even getting to the point where you have the lead still means you have to break his grounded zoning options which even Sonic has trouble doing. By playing devil's advocate and having an unbiased perspective we can analyze the MU through different views and learn more.

 

[Nu~]

Still, Villager has all the tools to win the MU. If he still you lay down a hydrant he can quickly throw the item he has to protect him. If the item is pocketed, he can still just air dodge hydrant. Not saying he is blocked by fruiting, but trying to offensively capitalize when he has one means that you are neglecting his defensive options with the fruit and hydrant. On the grounded, his zoning options are still superior has he can set up walls with Lloid Rocket and slingshot. Side Special into Lloid is not safe since they can catch your end lag, and imo either character can win by running away if they have the lead, since both character's up close options are lackluster. Even getting to the point where you have the lead still means you have to break his grounded zoning options which even Sonic has trouble doing. By playing devil's advocate and having an unbiased perspective we can analyze the MU through different views and learn more.

You don't side B into the rocket, you let the pellet hit it. This leaves you with no lag. His only grounded zoning options against is are fair and bair. Everything else is dealt with by our tools.
And sonic does not have trouble getting in on villager. There is a reason why sonic is a 30:70 matchup for villager. You are underestimating pac-man's CQC. Frame 5 ftilt and retreating fair? Lag less SH bair? Frame 6 dtilt?

Villager has an awesome nair, but that's the only thing he has against us up close.
And please stop saying fairs and bairs wall us out. Nair and fair can clash with it since its a weak projectile with low priority.

 

[Galaxian]

Wouldn't this discussion be better for the Pac-Man MUs thread?

I don't do the Pac/Villager MU due to my horrid fear of getting Key pocketed and thrown back at me but it does seem 55/45 in Villager's favor. Villager can steal fruit and camp rather well, which can be problematic, but we can still charge fruit if it's pocketed. The only time we can't charge is if Villager holds the fruit out, but that's not going to be for long because they want to use that damned slingshot.

And while Villager CAN pocket both Side-B and trampoline I wouldn't be too worried. Villager can only pocket one - though I just realized that throwing away the pellet after you try to up-b and then taking the trampoline worries me. I hope that doesn't work.

Pac can outspace just as well as Villager, but Villager does it better. Trees eat fruit too, except Key if I remember, so that has to be kept in mind too. Try to bait Pocket with hydrants and then fruits.

 

[busken]

I didn't really mean grounded options, I meant horizontal zoning. All I am saying is this, Pac-Man: a character who thrives off fruits to approach, zone, and punish will struggle against a character who has all the options to beat them out and out zone them. This MU is definitely not in our favor with or without customs.

 

[Galaxian]

I didn't really mean grounded options, I meant horizontal zoning. All I am saying is this, Pac-Man: a character who thrives off fruits to approach, zone, and punish will struggle against a character who has all the options to beat them out and out zone them. This MU is definitely not in our favor with or without customs.

It's not, but it's not horribly one sided, either.

 

[Firedemon0]

Now, while I may of lost this match, I did want to share this. This entire match, you can see that I don't really get walled out. Pocket backfired a few times on villager. I got cheeky with Side B at the end and ate a bowling ball I really shouldn't have. This is an even matchup.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr2Ez1lGXIE

 

[busken]

Not bad this is good. By pushing out the discussion fighting for who had the advantage, we got game play footage of the MU we might have never got. I'm now not sure on the MU still leaning towards villager though, but thanks for shedding light.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Oh no! Villager has a quick Nair that makes him turn into a hitbox!

Hint: We have too.

It might not be very Pac-Manish, but there's no reason not to rush Villy down with our smaxy aerials when that's his weakness.
Use Fruits to make him choose to pocket or not and then get in with Hydrant Surfing Nairs and Fairs.

We have to choose wisely if we use our projectiles or not, but he has to choose if he wants to pocket what Fruit.
You can use that to your advantage.

Just don't launch Hydrants.

 

[fromundaman]

Oh no! Villager has a quick Nair that makes him turn into a hitbox!

Hint: We have too.

It might not be very Pac-Manish, but there's no reason not to rush Villy down with our smaxy aerials when that's his weakness.
Use Fruits to make him choose to pocket or not and then get in with Hydrant Surfing Nairs and Fairs.

We have to choose wisely if we use our projectiles or not, but he has to choose if he wants to pocket what Fruit.
You can use that to your advantage.

Just don't launch Hydrants.

I actually kind of disagree with this. Charge key then just get out of his fair/bair range and launch hydrants until he pockets one. Once he has, you can now spam to your hearts content, but keep that key. The moment he drops the hydrant throw the key. It will immediately launch it and punish him for dropping it while he's still in the animation, and since his hydrant is MUCH stronger, this hurts him a lot and will force him to approach you.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I actually kind of disagree with this. Charge key then just get out of his fair/bair range and launch hydrants until he pockets one. Once he has, you can now spam to your hearts content, but keep that key. The moment he drops the hydrant throw the key. It will immediately launch it and punish him for dropping it while he's still in the animation, and since his hydrant is MUCH stronger, this hurts him a lot and will force him to approach you.

Or that...

That's so easy.

 

[BSP]

It works just like any other campy Villager honestly. The sapling really does not hurt Pac-man, we can throw apples and strawberries, over the edge safely if they try to just ledge camp. We can even get fancy and launch hydrant. Our camp tools are much better. Sapling = Fruit charge.

But healing would be better!

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Quite curious why I haven't been taking more time to chat things here, as I play this guy very extensively. There's a lot tricks shared here too.

Hey Pac-boards!

 

[WeirdChillFever]

Quite curious why I haven't been taking more time to chat things here, as I play this guy very extensively. There's a lot tricks shared here too.

Hey Pac-boards!

Hey ho!

 

[Nu~]

Quite curious why I haven't been taking more time to chat things here, as I play this guy very extensively. There's a lot tricks shared here too.

Hey Pac-boards!

Welcome to the pessimism Pac-Boards!

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Welcome to the pessimism Pac-Boards!

How weird, I still feel confident and jolly with Pac. Tier Lists and tournament shenanigans laying ya down?

 

[Nu~]

How weird, I still feel confident and jolly with Pac. Tier Lists and tournament shenanigans laying ya down?

Oh, it's not me, it's a large majority of the rest of this board. I'm one of the most optimistic persons here! loI
I still see a ton of potential in Pac-Man, and feel that he will end up in high tier as the meta progresses.

It's just that some pac-mains have already dismissed him as mid tier or lower due to their own struggles.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Oh, it's not me, it's a large majority of the rest of this board. I'm one of the most optimistic persons here! loI
I still see a ton of potential in Pac-Man, and feel that he will end up in high tier as the meta progresses.

It's just that some pac-mains have already dismissed him as mid tier or lower due to their own struggles.

That's a bit extreme, the game's just 5 months old and Pac's vast toolpool is could still use having new things discovered to hit high waters with it. Give him time still.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I found something hillarious:

When Little Mac KO Punches you if you stand on the Hydrant, the knockback of the KO Punch is cancelled by the knockback of the Hydrant.

Like, the Hydrant gets hit and knock into you, so you only get knockbacked by the Hydrant.

 

[Galaxian]

It's just that some pac-mains have already dismissed him as mid tier or lower due to their own struggles.

I know Pac has tournament potential but I've always seen him at mid. Maybe somewhere low-mid B? He's good but he's got flaws for sure.

I don't think he's bad.

I found something hillarious:

When Little Mac KO Punches you if you stand on the Hydrant, the knockback of the KO Punch is cancelled by the knockback of the Hydrant.

Like, the Hydrant gets hit and knock into you, so you only get knockbacked by the Hydrant.

**** man I remember this happening like..day 1 FG, matched up with a Mac and he KO punched my Hydrant. Hit me, instead.

Man it was nice maining Pac in the 3DS days. Macs were super easy to deal with, trampoline confused them all.

 

[WeirdChillFever]

I know Pac has tournament potential but I've always seen him at mid. Maybe somewhere low-mid B? He's good but he's got flaws for sure.

I don't think he's bad.

Where did you get that nice avatar?

 

[Nu~]

I know Pac has tournament potential but I've always seen him at mid. Maybe somewhere low-mid B? He's good but he's got flaws for sure.

I don't think he's bad.

.

You don't have to be flawless to be a high tier

 

[Galaxian]

Where did you get that nice avatar?

Mine? I just googled "pac-man galaxian" and found it a few pages down.

I thought it'd be nice since it's my name inspiration.

You don't have to be flawless to be a high tier

Of course not, Ness exists. I dunno, I love Pac but I don't see him in high tier up with Ness, Fox, Falcon, etc. He's probably the same spot Mega Man, Mario, or the others are - B, which is fine by me.

Who knows where Pac will end up? I don't think he's bottom tier, he's high-mid for sure.

 

[fromundaman]

That's a bit extreme, the game's just 5 months old and Pac's vast toolpool is could still use having new things discovered to hit high waters with it. Give him time still.

Agreed. I'm still finding something new every time I play. There's still stuff to find for sure.



Also lol @ little mac. Did you know you can input trampoline during the freeze frames of his KO punch startup when he does that little cinematic thing and trampoline will still come out fast enough to negate KO punch regardless?
Trampoline murders Mac so hard; it's hilarious.

EDIT:

Of course not, Ness exists. I dunno, I love Pac but I don't see him in high tier up with Ness, Fox, Falcon, etc. He's probably the same spot Mega Man, Mario, or the others are - B, which is fine by me.

Hold on! You think Fox and Falcon are a whole tier better than Mario?!
I mean I find it debatable that they're that much better than Pac, but Mario?!?!

 

[Nu~]

Little Mac can literally do nothing against a trampoline+hydrant set up, or simply placing a trampoline near the ledge with you behind it. If he side B's, he dies

 

[Galaxian]

Hold on! You think Fox and Falcon are a whole tier better than Mario?!
I mean I find it debatable that they're that much better than Pac, but Mario?!?!

Well you know what I mean. In that sense of tiers.

 

[Galaxian]

I've seen Abadango have Key in hand, for Z-dropping and such. May I ask what's a simple and easy way to get a z-droppable Key?

I've heard On-Fire Hydrant is a good way so if someone can explain that too that'd be nice.

 

[Nu~]

I've seen Abadango have Key in hand, for Z-dropping and such. May I ask what's a simple and easy way to get a z-droppable Key?

I've heard On-Fire Hydrant is a good way so if someone can explain that too that'd be nice.

http://youtu.be/-5ZP8AuCyBA

 

[Galaxian]

http://youtu.be/-5ZP8AuCyBA

Thanks. I'll practice this with what I can.

Does this work with any ledge?

 

[Nu~]

Thanks. I'll practice this with what I can.

Does this work with any ledge?

It works fine on FD, battlefield, and any stage with a flat side. Halberd requires you to hit the wall of the pad that opens once you start to take off.
You can also do it on smashville and town and city, but the timing is a bit different. You can see how Abadango does it in his match with Dabuz

 

[COLINBG]

Waaaaaait guys.

Is this some sort of weird semi-social thread turned somewhat competitive? I don't really get what it's supposed to be. Or is it a Q&A I've slept on since I joined o,0 ? If someone could help me on this.

And hum... assuming this isn't one, do we really not have a social pac thread?