Our Expectations.

[Jaedrik]

Sorry, I don't get the cake analogy tbh. I never did.

It is like you're doing something that, to some, is impossible, and by all fair language and laws of physics, it is impossible. It is impossible.

Yet, since it is not an actual cake, it is possible, it is like doing something that others would consider impossible yet it is plausible. That's in this case.

Most of the other cases it's used to illustrate 'you can't do this, because it's simply not possible', as pertained to having a cake, which is nice, you can use it for other things or have it whenever you want, and eating it at that same moment you'd not 'have' your cake, or keep it. Instant gratification, which I normally revile as a self-defeating display of being undisciplined, is not possible without the side-effects. But here, this philosophy gives you all these things normally split among groups.

Usually, being hype is reserved for the group that gets bummed out if things go poorly, usually, not getting bummed out or hurt because things didn't turn out as you expected is reserved for the group that goes far the other way and, once again, reviles and rages at the creators or fate or free will and what have you.
But you can, in this case, have the best of both worlds (the different possibilities of having a cake and eating it), and it works out for the better for everyone, you don't really affect anyone negatively, including yourself.

Just, don't expect and be happy, it's the best course.

 

[Holder of the Heel]

I have some perverse desire to be a contrarian, but I just can't because I used to say to people not to expect anything either and I can't reasonably change that view, no matter how much sophistry I try to come up with.

Dang it..

But yeah, unfortunately people are still going to expect things no matter what you say here.

Edit: Just realized that remark is my defeated contrarian desires trying to slither out hahaha

 

[DxBOY15]

Well, yeah, but I don't see more than one or two cuts. Quite frankly I think every character in Brawl should stay, and there aren't a lot of potential necomers who I'd say are important enough to warrant curring vets.

with the exception of Rob lol

 

[Robert of Normandy]

with the exception of Rob lol

ROB is here to stay. I don't see any reason to cut him.

 

[volbound1700]

I think we get at least 12 new characters, you have to include new characters to sell the game. Without new characters, there is no hype. Sakurai should know this. We also need big name characters to provide the hype (a la Megaman). Sonic sold Brawl to people taht would otherwise not have bought it.

I am just hoping for no cuts.

 

[The Good Doctor]

None, I have zero expectations.
No one will understand my complete disappointment with Brawl, and how many nights I stayed up for Dojo updates (every single one).

Melee4life

 

[Jaedrik]

None, I have zero expectations.
No one will understand my complete disappointment with Brawl, and how many nights I stayed up for Dojo updates (every single one).
Melee4life

I'm sorry bro =( I stayed up almost every night too.

I have some perverse desire to be a contrarian, but I just can't because I used to say to people not to expect anything either and I can't reasonably change that view, no matter how much sophistry I try to come up with.
Dang it..
But yeah, unfortunately people are still going to expect things no matter what you say here.
Edit: Just realized that remark is my defeated contrarian desires trying to slither out hahaha

We all get that urge to argue just to argue, thanks for beating it back! <3
It's starting to feel like more and more philosophizing and theologizing and semanticizing is frowned upon in general society. . . for example, in my Government and Humanities classes, the chilluns don't seem to like it, but the teach is fine with it :3

 

[nessokman]

I don't think you understand how business to consumer relations work. Sakurai isn't making smash 4 out of the kindness of his heart. I have nothing to be grateful for anyway. The most generous thing he could do is leave and let somebody who has beliefs on competitive gaming that are consistent with reality takeover and fix his mess.

Nintendo in general is all for casual gaming! They made freaking nintendoland! Smash was never meant to be competitive in the first place! Smash 64 wasn't very competitive.Melee being competitive was a mistake on sakurai's part!He prooved that when he fixed it in making brawl casual.

If anyone but sakurai made it, it would not be a smash.i would boycott it.either way smash bros is sakurai's baby, he will always be in charge.

Also, sakurai never made a mess of smash.Brawl was incredible. Until smash 4 you can just:

 

[The Good Doctor]

Nintendo in general is all for casual gaming! They made freaking nintendoland! Smash was never meant to be competitive in the first place! Smash 64 wasn't very competitive.Melee being competitive was a mistake on sakurai's part!He prooved that when he fixed it in making brawl casual.

Also, sakurai never made a mess of smash.Brawl was incredible. Until smash 4 you can just:

Everyone has their opinion, but I'll take my video games with a side of skill please. Also saying "Sakurai fixed Smash by making it casual" is the worst single sentence I've ever seen on SWF that from a non-troll. GG.

I'm not going to reply to anything you say btw.

 

[nessokman]

Everyone has their opinion, but I'll take my video games with a side of skill please. Also saying "Sakurai fixed Smash by making it casual" is the worst single sentence I've ever seen on SWF that from a non-troll. GG.

I'm not going to reply to anything you say btw.

i know you won't reply, but-
Melee was not meant to be competitive.He fixed it when he made brawl by taking smash where it was meant to be. Take a look at tournament brawl mattches.They aren't as hardcore, but they do take skill.Especially at high level. BRawl was made casual like it should be/

 

[Holder of the Heel]

I didn't stay up late to see the Dojo updates, I went to bed and used it as an excuse to jump out of bed without complaint for school each morning. It was a useful tool. Zero shame.

We all get that urge to argue just to argue, thanks for beating it back! <3
It's starting to feel like more and more philosophizing and theologizing and semanticizing is frowned upon in general society. . . for example, in my Government and Humanities classes, the chilluns don't seem to like it, but the teach is fine with it :3

Ahhh.. the delectable feeling of reading something thoughtful and going:

"Unfortunately it would seem you are ignorant, for you see~ [insert philosophical bull****]"

Hahah, but seriously, yeah you're right. Partly due to our culture that either values doing things just because one feels like it or because we have some platitudinous vague statement to explain our views. Also partly because most aren't familiar with those things so it's easy to undervalue. Both of these sources perpetuate the other and ultimately create a general lack of taste and even further, a growing distaste, for those kinds of things.

 

[Kink-Link5]

Smash was definitely made to be competitive to a degree and to some level. Sakurai's thoughts on how to make that are just really bizarre. Relevent paraphrases regarding the discussion:

-Sakurai wanted smash to have combos, but for them to be improvised and specific to a situation
-Sakurai wants the game to be approachable so that new players and veterans both have equal access to executable maneuvers
-Sakurai finds "character balance" to be made by having a character be hard to use, but reap exponentially great rewards.

All three are echos of what goes into making a solid competitive game: Situational awareness, Approachable gameplay to facilitate further learning more easily, and a balanced roster, but the way he goes about approaching these subjects is really particular.

Smash was, however, very definitely made to support competition, regardless of whether it succeeds at it or not.

 

[ZelDan]

I don't exactly see what's wrong with a stamina system myself, as long as the interval characters start getting exhausted at isn't random every time and the characters don't start running out of breath, like, 2 seconds into dash-dancing.

I didn't find it to be that big of a deal in Skyward Sword or Kid Icarus Uprsising, honestly.

Other than that, I don't really have any positive or negative overall expectations for the next Smash games on 3DS and Wii U. I'm just hoping for no tripping or anything equally as stupid to be in them, and hopefully there won't be any dominant characters like Meta-Knight again.

 

[Isprayaxe]

My expectations:

-This **** better be worth buying a Wii U for.
-Nothing.
-

Pretty much yea

 

[volbound1700]

Wii U will have other good games then just Smash. I thought Galaxy for Wii was as fun as Smash. There were some other great games for Wii as well that made the purchase worth it.

 

[Vkrm]

I don't know if I agree that sakurai was trying to target a bigger market with brawl. I mean, how many people really thought melee was too hard to enjoy? When is picking a solitary demographic (casuals) better then trying to appeal to everybody? Never. Brawl did sell better then melee, but that's only because the wii out sold the GameCube by a lot. We can have both hardcore and casual gamers enjoy smash cant we? What about having depth do the casuals dislike?

 

[FalKoopa]

I never played melee competitively, but I loved that game.

 

[Dark Phazon]

I expect it to sell millions..

 

[Orngeblu]

You know, when I think about it. If you look at Marvel vs Campcom, think about how Sakurai could implement something like that with namco. I highly doubt it, but just imagine a Smash Bros. vs Namco. I don't know. It's just an interesting observation to me. I highly doubt this will happen anyways, and well, it will still keep it's 4-player battle royales, and not just 1v1's like Marvel vs Capcom seem to have.

When I DO look at Marvel vs Capcom (which I haven't played ANY of them, but the 1st one looks really nice, imo), I think about what Sakurai COULD do with smash 4. (Hence the word COULD, but I am sure he won't do this).

As you can see, I have high expectations, but those will probably be shattered. I don't mind Sakurai going for a casual play for people, but I'd really like him to make the gameplay similar to games like those. (I'm not asking that he makes them purely like them though.)

Like I said, I doubt any of this will happen! :3 I CAN STILL DREAM!

Don't ask how I got this, I just saw a video of MvC and it looked cool. :I

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Meh! The comparison doesn't make much sense IMHO. First: to be a Nintendo Versus Capcom it should have HALF of the roster composed by Namco characters. Second: They belong to two different kinds of fighting videogames.
But if you are talking about popularity or awesomess, YEAH! I'm expecting the SSB series to keep the same level of the MVC series, or even better. Thought, in terms of wackyness, I hope it will reach or beat Tatsunoko Versus Capcom.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Err... I meant Smash Bros. vs Namco but I wrote Nintendo Versus Capcom. What a freudian lapsus!
Still I think wackyness is the best path for the series to follow.

 

[Marioman19]

I'm not expecting all that much.

 

[grizby2]

i expect

- 50-ish characters like most people here. i don't see hows thats so ungraspable, we post character threads with great movesets all the time... so yeah XD.
- that they don't make this next installment a ground based fighter, because thats NOT what smash bros is or has ever been.
- that one final "thing" that gives us that WOW! effect. don't know what it would be though.
-better music selection options (a customizable one would be a dream).
- more charm

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

-A roster of around 45-48
-4 Third Parties

 

[Dark Phazon]

as long as its better than brawl in everyway then im happy...imo thats nor anything special either..nothing to be excited about..it should surpass brawl tenfolds at the minimum imo to be relevant at the least...i donr expect it to be better than melee though so im not gonna bash it at all when its not.

 

[IAm2Sarcastic4U]

- A better balance in characters
- No 3rd Party Characters (Not including Snake and Sonic)
- Stages taken directly from game series not inspired ones
- Keep the My Music feature

 

[IAm2Sarcastic4U]

Sonic sold Brawl to people taht would otherwise not have bought it.

So you're saying that people were willing to spend $50 on a game because Sonic the Hedgehog was a playable character?

 

[majora_787]

So you're saying that people were willing to spend $50 on a game because Sonic the Hedgehog was a playable character?

That doesn't actually surprise you, does it? I mean there are people on this forum who would never TOUCH the game to save their families if someone like Ridley/Krystal/Girahim/Potato was placed on the roster hypothetically.

And Sonic is popular. So.

 

[IAm2Sarcastic4U]

That doesn't actually surprise you, does it? I mean there are people on this forum who would never TOUCH the game to save their families if someone like Ridley/Krystal/Girahim/Potato was placed on the roster hypothetically.

And Sonic is popular. So.

It does suprise me a bit because I never really payed much attention to the Sonic franchise so I'm not aware of his popularity. Also saying someone wouldn't buy a game because a character they dislike is included in the roster is a bit too much, unless you've read/seen situations like that.

 

[majora_787]

I have read and seen more than enough people stating exactly such opinions on things. And one person I know refused to play Brawl until last year because of R.O.B. People are most definitely petty enough to decide their purchase of a fighting game on one character. It's kind of amusing.

 

[TreK]

I don't mind not having combos, but I do mind not being able to land a KO until 220. Bring back Melee's survivability.

And the game will be great if we have some kind of way to laglessly land on a platform again. Melee has the waveland, Brawl has the platform cancel. Techniques like that make the game much more interesting.

 

[Kink-Link5]

This one guy that I know is Canadian and has schizophrenic tendencies.

Therefore Canadians are mentally ill


Don't treat your isolated anecdotal examples as being a standard for other people's tendencies.

 

[majora_787]

... What I'm saying isn't along the lines of that as much as it's along the lines of, "This one guy I know is canadian and schizophrenic tendencies. So Canadians with schizophrenic tendencies exist."

I don't know why you thought I was under the impression that every human being on earth is on the verge of buying or not buying SSB4 based off a single roster slot.

 

[Kink-Link5]

With the type of person being such a minority representation, it goes back to the idea that Sonic "sold" Brawl is what I mean. When the number of people that bought it just because it has Sonic is in no way measurable, and the argument supporting it is that there are a couple of guys that didn't buy the game because of R.O.B., the entire argument is on shaky grounds.

 

[majora_787]

I think you're entirely missing my point. My whole commentary was in response to the sentence,

"So you're saying that people were willing to spend $50 on a game because Sonic the Hedgehog was a playable character?"

I don't think Sonic is responsible for Brawl's success in its entirety. Probably not even a large chunk really. But I know there are definitely people out there who would spend 50 dollars because a character was or was not playable, and there are people out there who would just not buy a game regardless of quality because a character was or was not playable.

 

[Kink-Link5]

I guess, but there's people that will or won't buy the game just because it's Nintendo or just because it's a Fighter or just because it's a video game. They aren't really the kind of people that matter regarding anything on the topic because they account for such a minute number of the audience.

 

[majora_787]

... Any topic except for the topic of whether or not they, you know. Exist. Which was literally the entire point, that they exist. In some number over one in the world at any given time. Somewhere.

 

[Jaedrik]

Please, please, gentlemen, every man has a different goal or ends in which they value some means over another to achieve, and rightly so when they value goods of a lower order. Few are those that value goods of a higher order, fewer still the men that know how to use them to create those lower ordered things which are so precious to other men, let the marketing decisions be made by them, concern yourself not with their intent or reasoning for including Sonic or Snake, for man's intent is unique to himself and is not subject to the universal, and many men are aligned under the banner of 'Nintendo' and 'Sakurai', as well as 'Sega' and 'Kojima'. The will plays a significant role in the human psyche, the most significant role by far in my estimate and experience, with reference to blessed Fulton J Sheen. The only abnormal and unhealthy human is the one who has no goal, or rather, the one who bases their decisions not in the will and right reason, but on whatever whim or impulse or emotion they have, this is a truly destructive mindset, let us then also acknowledge this characteristic of economic calculation: David Ricardo's law of Comparative (and by extension 'Competitive') Advantage, and in doing so resign ourselves with humble trust, then our angst and anxieties will fly from us. Is my philosophical and economic 'bias' showing? Good, I have an agenda to fulfill; may you all have a day of peace, joy, and enlightenment.

 

[FalKoopa]

Please, please, gentlemen, every man has a different goal or ends in which they value some means over another to achieve, and rightly so when they value goods of a lower order. Few are those that value goods of a higher order, fewer still the men that know how to use them to create those lower ordered things which are so precious to other men, let the marketing decisions be made by them, concern yourself not with their intent or reasoning for including Sonic or Snake, for man's intent is unique to himself and is not subject to the universal, and many men are aligned under the banner of 'Nintendo' and 'Sakurai', as well as 'Sega' and 'Kojima'. The will plays a significant role in the human psyche, the most significant role by far in my estimate and experience, with reference to blessed Fulton J Sheen. The only abnormal and unhealthy human is the one who has no goal, or rather, the one who bases their decisions not in the will and right reason, but on whatever whim or impulse or emotion they have, this is a truly destructive mindset, let us then also acknowledge this characteristic of economic calculation: David Ricardo's law of Comparative (and by extension 'Competitive') Advantage, and in doing so resign ourselves with humble trust, then our angst and anxieties will fly from us. Is my philosophical and economic 'bias' showing? Good, I have an agenda to fulfill; may you all have a day of peace, joy, and enlightenment.

I understand that you are a 'MonK' but I could not comprehend your preaching...

 

[Jaedrik]

I understand that you are a 'MonK' but I could not comprehend your preaching...

Well. . . it's a call to ease of mind in the trivial matters being discussed above, and in an attempt to show their matters something to not be worried over I harkened to certain laws of economics and. . . philosophy/psychology. That was the initial and whole objective of this thread, my other posts, I hope it helped people put themselves into a good mindset for not disparaging and getting riled up over small things or inconsequential things or useless things when you can simply be excited without having expectations.
The economic being from '"Life of Fred: Pre-Algebra II with Economics" by Stanley Scmidt,and the second philosophical/psychological is based in Fulton J Sheen's telecast titled: "How To Psychoanalyze Yourself" which I might add is very difficult to find on the internet. These are just two examples of the broader range, and I encourage you to check them both out if you wish a deeper understanding, my words aren't as good as theirs.