Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

He'll never match Scarm/Bliss (depends on main attack stat) or Talonflame, but he'll never face them, so what's it matter?

A STABbed base 135 attack Outrage without a +attack nature is pretty much a guaranteed 2-hit KO on Bold Blissey. No chance of it Softboiling that damage off, but it should be noted that Blissey can learn Ice Beam.

For Skarmory though, it can easily shake off a Thunder Punch (doesn't come close to halving its max HP), and then clobber Mega Sceptile with Brave Bird, assuming that Mega Sceptile's base defense is still 65.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

You cannot tell what tier something is going to be in before we even see the stats.

When we first saw Mega Pinsir and Mega Kangaskhan (who also can't break rocky helmet skarm and are revenged by Talonflame!), people were excited for new monsters to unleash upon UU at a first glance- and that was even AFTER we saw stats. Mega Kanga is currently sitting in Ubers if you don't recall, and Mega Pinsir is among the top 5 megas in OU.

I think if Sceptile gets a GOOD stat spread (155 atk + 140 spe, or 165 SpA + 140 spe and some extra movepool) it'll end up OU, but ofc we just don't know.

Also pls get with the times, Blissey is irrelevant, Chansey is queen.

Where's your Mega Pinsir data? I know he's high, but I'm pretty sure he's not fifth...

Those numbers are not going to happen, be reasonable, and if they did he'd probably be even more frail, which is a dead sentence against anything with Priority.

And Chansey's pretty risky with all the stray Knock-Offs flying now-a-days, that's why they're only 1 position different on usage. She's still winning, but she's less Queen and more co-ruler.


That said, you're right, but his stat spread is the thing we can give the most accurate guesses for and they don't go that well, it's his move set that'll decide his tier position. For all we know he could get 145 Sp.A with Earth Power, Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse and Vacuum Wave as new moves... then he'll happily skip up the tiers with his ludicrous coverage.

A STABbed base 135 attack Outrage without a +attack nature is pretty much a guaranteed 2-hit KO on Bold Blissey. No chance of it Softboiling that damage off.

For Skarmory though, it can easily shake off a Thunder Punch (doesn't come close to halving its max HP), and then clobber Mega Sceptile with Brave Bird, assuming that Mega Sceptile's base defense is still 65.

When did I say Bliss would wall a physical Sceptile? I mentioned that it's dependant on the stat; Special Sceptile can 2HKO Skarm with Focus Blast... before Mega.

 

[UltiMario]

Where's your Mega Pinsir data? I know he's high, but I'm pretty sure he's not fifth...

http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/xy-ou-viability-ranking-thread-v2.3502428/

A fairly accurate list of what the best pokemon in the OU metagame. Pinsir is classified in the 2nd highest tier, A+.

http://sim.smogon.com:8080/Stats/2014-05/ou-1825.0.txt

Out of the Pokemon that are used exclusively for their Mega, Pinsir comes in at #4. I'm too lazy to analyze the other data for MTar/MSciz/MChomp, but from experience I'd say MSciz is probly higher in usage and MTar/MChomp are lower as megas, putting it at the #5 mega. You can go double check this yourself if you care.

Those numbers are not going to happen, be reasonable, and if they did he'd probably be even more frail, which is a dead sentence against anything with Priority.

He wouldn't be more frail. Those stats still leave room to buff defenses, especially the 165 SpA variant. Being weak to priority is bad, but even if you gave Sceptile all the defenses in the world it wouldn't matter because he's still 2x weak to Flying and 4x weak to Ice, those forms of priority still rip him apart. Being able to tank a Sucker better isn't going to help as much as giving him the raw stats to actually compete in OU. Will we get those? Only time will tell. Maybe we'll get some awful spread and he's stuck in UU. Nobody knows, but I'm saying there's some potential for him to be OU with the right tools.

And Chansey's pretty risky with all the stray Knock-Offs flying now-a-days, that's why they're only 1 position different on usage. She's still winning, but she's less Queen and more co-ruler.

| 13 | Chansey | 14.53686% | 190794 | 3.950% | 148411 | 3.873% |
| 59 | Blissey | 2.15062% | 256459 | 5.309% | 192083 | 5.013% |

1 position? I don't think so. Seven times the usage. Blissey isn't even OU anymore. That's a pretty solid Queen to me.

Also, whenever people bring up Knock Off, they forget the part where there isn't a single Knock Off user in OU that doesn't outright kill Blissey. Just a thought.

That said, you're right, but his stat spread is the thing we can give the most accurate guesses for and they don't go that well, it's his move set that'll decide his tier position. For all we know he could get 145 Sp.A with Earth Power, Flamethrower, Dragon Pulse and Vacuum Wave as new moves... then he'll happily skip up the tiers with his ludicrous coverage.

145 SpA on a mega is... laughable. Remember that Megas skip out on boosting items, and Sceptile lacks a boosting ability, which means that it needs a ludicrously high attacking stat to get stuff done.

 

[Malkior7]

Gen was is my least favorite gen but I love the region

 

[dimensionsword64]

He wouldn't be more frail. Those stats still leave room to buff defenses, especially the 165 SpA variant. Being weak to priority is bad, but even if you gave Sceptile all the defenses in the world it wouldn't matter because he's still 2x weak to Flying and 4x weak to Ice, those forms of priority still rip him apart. Being able to tank a Sucker better isn't going to help as much as giving him the raw stats to actually compete in OU. Will we get those? Only time will tell. Maybe we'll get some awful spread and he's stuck in UU. Nobody knows, but I'm saying there's some potential for him to be OU with the right tools.

But he's inevitably going to get some points in his second attack stat, and probably more than 10 for his defenses. I also doubt they would focus on his physical attack when his special attack is higher currently.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

But he's inevitably going to get some points in his second attack stat, and probably more than 10 for his defenses. I also doubt they would focus on his physical attack when his special attack is higher currently.

Tell that to Mega Charizard X, as its base attack went from 84 to 130. Likewise, Mega Lucario has a higher base attack than base special attack, despite the fact that it's the complete opposite for normal Lucario.

To finish up, most Dragon-types strongly excel at physical attacks, so I wouldn't be surprised if Mega Sceptile received a 50 point buff to its base attack stat.

 

[ImaClubYou]

Tell that to Mega Charizard X, as its base attack went from 84 to 130. Likewise, Mega Lucario has a higher base attack than base special attack, despite the fact that it's the complete opposite for normal Lucario.

To finish up, most Dragon-types strongly excel at physical attacks, so I wouldn't be surprised if Mega Sceptile received a 50 point buff to its base attack stat.

I don't know how concrete the Charizard argument is since it has 2 mega's and because the fact this only happened cuz he's popular.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

and Sceptile lacks a boosting ability

Sceptile does yes, but Mega-Sceptile has Lightning Rod.


As for the usage stats, fair play, I was looking at a month by month list, I guess there must've been a Blissey fan last month.

 

[UltiMario]

I'm on phone so this is a short post but

Lightningrod is not a boosting ability. I mean how the megas with lower attack abd weaker coverage are able to get by with Huge Power, Aerilate, Tough Claws, etc, making their effective attack much much higher than their actual attack. Sceptile lacks this, which is why he needs something like 155 or 165.

Also I assure you, Chansey vs Blissey stats have looked like this month's for this entire year. The only chance of them being close would be if you were looking at Gen 5 stats.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

@ UltiMario : In case you haven't noticed, Lightningrod raises the user's special attack whenever an Electric-type move targets it. You could compose a double/triple battle strategy that way.

 

[UltiMario]

How many times do I have to say that I mean boosting ability as in an ability that literally says "boost your attack by 30/50/100%"

 

[dimensionsword64]

Tell that to Mega Charizard X, as its base attack went from 84 to 130. Likewise, Mega Lucario has a higher base attack than base special attack, despite the fact that it's the complete opposite for normal Lucario.

To finish up, most Dragon-types strongly excel at physical attacks, so I wouldn't be surprised if Mega Sceptile received a 50 point buff to its base attack stat.

That's because Mega Charizard X is the counterpart to Mega Charizard Y. One is a physical attacker, one is a special.

Lucario's special attack and physical attack are almost the exact same, so you could classify it as a physical or special attacker, and it didn't matter which one they increased.

You can't just say, "Lots of dragons are physical attackers," and use that as evidence that Sceptile will be. There are plenty of special dragons too.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

Mega-Sabeleye has Magic Bounce, more Defense and Special Defense, more Sp.A, and less speed.

Standard Sabeleye:
HP: 50
Attack: 75
Defense: 75
Sp.Atk: 65
Sp.Def: 65
Speed: 50


What sort of stat distro do you think we'll get? And how do you think he'll play?


Personally I could see him just shuffling his offensive stats to boost his purely defensive stats and non-damaging moves.

HP: 50
Attack: 45
Defense: 135
Sp.Atk: 95
Sp.Def: 125
Speed: 30



I could also see him staying in his standard form quite a bit in the match to make use of prankster, only switching to mega if something's set up. I also think his first turn +1 could be quite useful for getting a quick wil-o and increased defense in one shot, or throwing out a priority recover as you mega setting yourself up to properly tank. I don't know if this'll be much better than regular sabeleye, but I think that it'll have enough of a niche for both to be used and therefore make it harder for your opponent to work out which one you're carrying.



It's interesting to note that this stat line can wall Mega-Kangaskhan, which could be the intended purpose

Vs: Mega-Kangaskhan

Switch in on PuP, priority burn and mega-evolve. Mega-Kanga can only 22-26% (against standard special defensive sableye, less with defensive investment) with EQ. If you bring him as revenges and he's already +2 he'll be doing 43.7-51.6% though so I could see mega-sableye getting some defense investment. That said if you can survive two you can use Torment to lock him down as his other moves can't hurt you unless he's running EQ and Fire-Punch like an idiot. If you survive you can double recover between EQs completely walling him. With 52 defense EVs you are safe from 2HKO so this becomes a valid strategy.
Against Drain Punch variants he completely walls and fire punch variants are even less effective.

Even if the Kanga decides not to mega so as to use Scrappy she still can only win if she's of the Drain Punch variety. And Wish/Protect Mega-Kanga is an infinite stall.


He's completely destroyed by Mega-Mawile though...



Move suggestions:

Recover (on anything)
Torment (on pure walls)
Wil-O-Wisp
Calm Mind
Night Shade (decent damage for walls)
Knock-Off (low damage, but item utility)
Foul Play (vs physical attackers)
Taunt (stops set-up and recovery moves)
Mean Look (probably not useful, but as he's quite capable in 1v1 it might have some uses? I'd have to test it out, but worth considering.)
Shadow Ball/Dark Pulse (attack moves using his Sp.A)
Dazzling Gleam (for Mega-Absol)



If they waste a chunk of the bonus 100 on his Sp.A though I can't see him being very powerful at all.

 

[IsmaR]

I actually think they're going to give it a superfluous Sp. Atk boost to contrast Mega Mawile (and compliment Calm Mind).

It'll be a shame if/that the no HP boost "rule" for Mega Evos will really hold it back. Without priority Taunt (or Trick Room I guess) it'll be set-up bait for a lot of things. Namely Mega Absol (with Magic Bounce/Swords Dance/Play Rough) and to lesser extents Charizard X/Blaziken, as well as Mold Breaker Taunt users. It'll excel in stall, and probably be a staple utility/spin blocker.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

Yeah, you're right, it says on the website he gets a boost to Sp.A, but I'm hoping it'll just be a reshuffle of the Attack stat (post updated to reflect this).

I didn't think about Calm Mind though, that could be pretty powerful, that's also worth looking into.


If his Sp.A is high enough Dazzling Gleam could be good for Mega-Absol, but yeah, Mold Breaker taunters would beat out a wall version, though I feel that's a non-issue as you could just switch; it's not like a baton pass chain, where taunting kills the strategy. Fire-Types are dangerous to him in general, but you can still priority taunt on the first turn rather than use Will-O, with some SR damage wracking up it might be enough to take it out with a special move as they set-up. Also with Rain Support Mega-Blaziken might not be that big a threat as you can just tank him and attack back with special attacks.



His biggest threat still looks like Mega-Mawile to me, as he can stil 2HKO through the burn without needing to set-up. Especially as the Bulky Fire types that make for it's best walls really don't do too well if you run rain support...

 

[IsmaR]

I figured Mega Gardevoir be just as threatening on wall sets, though it obviously wouldn't want to risk getting Shadow Sneak'd (even from its piss poor offenses, or alternatively taking a Calm Mind boosted Shadow Ball). Short of Foul Play/Knock Off/Calm Mind, Sableye has to rely on status moves to take out the majority of its opponents, meaning it can't do much more than annoy most things, making it a lot like an inverted Mega Banette (**** defenses, wasted offenses, trading a crappy ability for a fantastic ability that doesn't take effect until AFTER Mega Evolving). In similar vein, it's going to require a lot of mindgames/predictions with its abilities/timing, but at least it has much more options since it starts out with Prankster and switches to an arguably better ability.

Anything that resists Toxic or doesn't mind status is equally annoying. As I said, it'll shine in stall, not so much elsewhere.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

Hah, I keep forgetting Mega-Gardevoir exists, I've still never fought one so I don't really know what they can do... Yeah, she could be even more threatening.

To be honest Sableye already needs a lot of prediction and mindgames, so I think it's fitting they've found a way to keep it's character intact. It could well be the number 1 stall Mega, and it could be a decent bulky Calm Mind, but it's a mega that's going to need a team built around it rather than the slap-on and done styles like kanga and marwile. I kinda like it more like that, it looks like it could be really useful (if the stats are right), but doesn't look like it'll feel cheap to use. I guess it depends on what his Special is, as if that's high enough he might be quite capable to dishing out damage without status (if not Gliscor will also poop all over him)... either way I think Will-O will be more common than Toxic personally, but I guess we'll see.



And gah, I hate Mega-Banette! Don't say that name around me....

It probably doesn't help that in my tabletop adventures game we gave Banette an amazing ability which reversed (and halfed for balance reasons) the effects of all healing and draining on the battle field while he was out (ie. Lefties, Recover, Drain Punch [and most dangerously stuff that could do 66% heals (and thus 33% damage in cursed room) like sun boosted Moonlight, new moves like Dynamotor [on third and subsequent consecutive uses], and edited moves like Heal Order [on first use, consecutively weaker], and the draining effect of the new move Needle Spikes] all hurt the user, while Life Orb and Curse healed; Statuses, Recoil and Attacks where counted as damage and not effected). I knew full well nothing would be as cool, and arguably broken, as that, but anything less won't impress me after the fact.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

That's because Mega Charizard X is the counterpart to Mega Charizard Y. One is a physical attacker, one is a special.

Mega Charizard X can also be used as a special attacker though, so it's not like it's a 100% physical sweeper, even with Tough Claws.

 

[UltiMario]

I'm thinking maybe like, 50/75/125/105/100/5 assuming they try to min/max sableye without lowering his attack (just going off the site, here). You really don't need speed when you have Magic Bounce and already underspeed everything except Conkeldurr (who you don't even want to burn) and Ferrothorn (who can't do anything vs you) anyways.

BTW, for Mega Sableye possibly having a purpose to counter mkan... you're missing the part where normal Sableye is the only reliable counter for MKhan to begin with. Just saying.

 

[Cheezey Bites]

I'm thinking maybe like, 50/75/125/105/100/5 assuming they try to min/max sableye without lowering his attack (just going off the site, here). You really don't need speed when you have Magic Bounce and already underspeed everything except Conkeldurr (who you don't even want to burn) and Ferrothorn (who can't do anything vs you) anyways.

BTW, for Mega Sableye possibly having a purpose to counter mkan... you're missing the part where normal Sableye is the only reliable counter for MKhan to begin with. Just saying.

Only if it hasn't set up yet, and if it hasn't set up yet then it can stay regular and waste it on a switch in. Sableye is not a reliable counter, just the most reliable we've got; mega would actually be a truly reliable counter.

But you're right, a base 5 speed would be insanely good, I'm just sceptical they'd go that far... 105 Sp.Def seems kinda low to me, but with Calm Mind and a more important role walling Physical attackers than Special it would make sense.

 

[dimensionsword64]

Mega Charizard X can also be used as a special attacker though, so it's not like it's a 100% physical sweeper, even with Tough Claws.

Yeah, but Game Freak intended it to be physical, so they put physical investment.

 

[UltiMario]

Only if it hasn't set up yet, and if it hasn't set up yet then it can stay regular and waste it on a switch in. Sableye is not a reliable counter, just the most reliable we've got; mega would actually be a truly reliable counter.

It counters every set except Facade Kangaskhan that hasn't already gone mega 85% of the time.

That fits under the definition of "reliable counter" imo

 

[dimensionsword64]

Here's a moveset for Mega Sableye that I think will work (we don't know stats yet, so I'm not going to do EV's).
Ability: Prankster (Magic Bounce)
Calm Mind/ Nasty Plot
Recover
Shadow Ball
Dazzling Gleam

So, on the first turn you still have Prankster as you mega evolve, so you get off a priority Calm Mind or Nasty Plot. Then, you can just dominate with Shadow Ball and Dazzling Gleam, which together, have near perfect neutral coverage (only Litleo and Pyroar resist it), and if it looks like you're going to get knocked out, you use recover. And thanks to Magic Bounce, you can't be poisoned or anything. For this set, though, I'm kinda counting on it getting a massive boost in it's defenses so it can take hits extremely well and the low speed doesn't matter.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Some thoughts on Mega Sableye's base stats...

HP: 50
Attack: 75
Defense: 135
SP ATK: 115
SP DEF: 85
Speed: 20
Total: 480

Following what Serebii.net stated, the defense and special attack stats are boosted, while speed takes a plummet. Special defense does receive a 20 point boost during the process.

 

[IsmaR]

We'll have to wait and see. "A boost in Sp. Atk" doesn't mean it'll automatically get the biggest boost. Remember stuff like Absol, Gyarados and Banette got very minor Sp. Attack boosts as well. If anything I expect +30 to both it and Sp. Def, and +40 or 60 to Defense depending on how low the Speed drop is.

The standard set will probably be:

Recover
Will-O-Wisp/Toxic/something dumb like Swagger
Fake Out/Protect (to Mega Evolve safely) or Trick Room/Taunt/Calm Mind depending on your team
Knock Off/Foul Play/Shadow Ball/Shadow Sneak

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Maybe not, but we've seen the attack and special attack boosts that Mega Garchomp received, so anything is possible. The same also applies to Mega Abomasnow, who's also slower than its normal state (30 points slower than normal Abomasnow to be exact).

 

[IsmaR]

I just meant that it's probably not going to be as game-changing as we anticipate. People are still going to use it like regular Sableye, even if they buff its Special Attack to be its greatest stat. Your average player will wonder "why use it over Mega, or even regular Gengar?"

 

[Aurane]

I'm kind of disappointed they lowered his speed, but besides that, Sableye's Mega Evolution looks promising.

I'm just gonna go ahead and leave some movesets for mega sableye that I feel may be of use:

Sableye@Sableyenite (?)
Ability: Prankster -> Magic Bounce
Nature: Modest/Quiet
EVs: 252 HP/Sp.Att, 6 Def
Nasty Plot/Calm Mind, Shadow Ball, HP Fighting/Etc., Recover

Sableye@Sableyenite (?)
Ability: Prankster -> Magic Bounce
Nature: Bold (Calm)
EVs: 252 HP/Def, 6 Sp.Def (Defensive EVs are switched depending on nature)
Will-o-Wisp/Toxic, Recover, Foul Play, Protect/Metal Burst

That's all for now. I want to wait and see if he gets any new moves in this game. I wouldn't mind aura sphere, just saying

 

[mood4food77]

It counters every set except Facade Kangaskhan that hasn't already gone mega 85% of the time.

That fits under the definition of "reliable counter" imo

sableye is ghost...why does it care about the facade set?

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

sableye is ghost...why does it care about the facade set?

Scrappy bypasses the Ghost-type's type immunities, enabling Facade to hit Sableye.

 

[mood4food77]

ohhhhhhh, forgot about regular khan kinda being a thing

 

[ImaClubYou]

5 Speed?

Time to crank out my Trapinch with no Trick Room support!

 

[kylexv]

I just realized that because we got Primal Groudon and Kyogre that there is a slight chance Primal Dialga from the Mystery Dungeon games will be in OR/AS

 

[IsmaR]

I doubt we'd get anything other than Primal Rayquaza.

Though Mega Diancie does make me think we'll be getting form upgrades for the legendaries if they ever make an X/Y sequel/3rd version.

 

[Tepig2000]

Check my signature.

My work here is done.

 

[Malkior7]

http://www.gonintendo.com/s/232734-...super-secret-base-and-share-it-with-the-world

they're back! and they will be awesome!

 

[ImaClubYou]

I was excited when I saw a thumbnail on GameXplain. On my phone it looked like Mega Golem but oh well.

 

[Fluttershy]

so what happens if someone has the same exact location as you for a secret base..?

 

[ImaClubYou]

so what happens if someone has the same exact location as you for a secret base..?

IIRC from the original versions you just don't get them, lol.

 

[Mega Hawlucha]

Mega Metagross Confirmed