As much as I don't like Ganondorf (he scares me, okay) I don't think they should kick him out of Brawl being that he completes the Triforce along with Link and Zelda. And I'm just saying that Zant and Midna might have a chance of appearing in Brawl, being that they're both two new characters and there's a TP level confirmed. Even that Ogre guy (forgot his name) appears as an NPC in the level... And coolness aside, Tingle might even be in the game (I hope just as an AT and not a playable character.)
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Official ZANT Discussion Thread (TP spoilers)
- Thread starter WR3K
- Start date
Paranoid_Android
Smash Lord
Pitiful villain, uninteresting character, appeared in a single game. Not worthy of Brawl, except maybe as an Assist Trophy.
Ogre_Deity_Link
Smash Lord
Well, let me put it to you this way. If he does appear in game, I won't complain, but no matter what, Ganon pwns Zant.
P.S. I know Ganon's scary. Why do you think he's so bad ***?
P.S. I know Ganon's scary. Why do you think he's so bad ***?
Ogre_Deity_Link
Smash Lord
So sad...
*shakes head*
Then again, Zant's "chop repeatedly while running around like a chicken with his head cut off" attack wasn't much better either.
*shakes head*
Then again, Zant's "chop repeatedly while running around like a chicken with his head cut off" attack wasn't much better either.
Good movelist on the first post. I would indeed like Zant to be in the game in some form, though I won't be disappointed if he becomes an Assist Trophy; because shooting off the magic blasts of pure crazy would be awesome, even if only for a moment.
Wyvern
Smash Journeyman
I don't get why everyone loves Zant so much. I thought he really killed the atmosphere of that game. I mean, who does he think he is, Kefka? Ha! Zant's not even fit to polish Kefka's shoes...
There are many better and more likely options for Zelda characters. I feel that Midna would be a much better choice, and aside from her, I think they're more likely to start taking characters from the "Young Link" line of games (like Vaati, for example).
There are many better and more likely options for Zelda characters. I feel that Midna would be a much better choice, and aside from her, I think they're more likely to start taking characters from the "Young Link" line of games (like Vaati, for example).
Everybody loves him!? Are you kidding!? From what I've seen over 75% of Twilight Princess fans despise him! He may have been an odd character, but he'll definately be one to remember weather people like him or not. And from what I've heard Ganondorf used Vaati as well (even if he's more of a fan favorite), so there both practically in the same boat, but Zant being the newer villian for a game that I beleive sold more than Minish Cap might get him a better chance... And I think he did fine in the game, despite his lack of badass-ness; he was a unique character that definately added a sense of humor to the game.
...and sorry if I sound angry, I'm just tired of people hating on him just cause he wasn't badass or cool like most people thought the other villians were. -_- But think about this, would Tingle be a better choice? (I think not.)
Ogre_Deity_Link
Smash Lord
.....
Anyone...I mean ANYONE would be better than Tingle. SOMEHOW, SOMEWAY, even TINGLE himself would be better than TINGLE, and that's not physically possible.
So yeah, in comparison, Zant > Tingle.
Anyone...I mean ANYONE would be better than Tingle. SOMEHOW, SOMEWAY, even TINGLE himself would be better than TINGLE, and that's not physically possible.
So yeah, in comparison, Zant > Tingle.
So you agree Diety Link? Tingle does creep me out. Why, WHY did he have to get his own game. Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland!? What kind of title is that!? Adds more to the Michael Jackson feel about him and the game's cover just screamed 'Burn me'...
Tingle: "I never got to have a childhood and people say I should act my age, but I'm a fairy, I swear it. *flies around* Woo-hoo, I'm Peter Pan! Kaloo-limpah!"
Skull Kid and Young Link can be seen hiding behind something in Clock Town...
Both (to Tatl): "Is it okay to come out; is he gone?"
I hope I didn't disturb anyone on this Tingle comment... o_o
Tingle: "I never got to have a childhood and people say I should act my age, but I'm a fairy, I swear it. *flies around* Woo-hoo, I'm Peter Pan! Kaloo-limpah!"
Skull Kid and Young Link can be seen hiding behind something in Clock Town...
Both (to Tatl): "Is it okay to come out; is he gone?"
I hope I didn't disturb anyone on this Tingle comment... o_o
Wyvern
Smash Journeyman
I feel like I've seen a lot more "zomg Zant is so unique and interesting" comments than "zomg Zant is teh suck and should die" comments since the game was released. Maybe it's just me, though.
His presence in the game just did not work for me at all. I didn't find him as being unique, because as I mentioned before, he's basically the lame version of Kefka of FFVI (who, incidently, was awesome). If he had had a cohesive personality throughout the game, maybe they could have made it work better. But with what they did, it just felt like it was supposed to be the token "what a twist!" moment without any real thought put into how it should impact the story or atmosphere.
Also the fight was really dull. Yeah, go ahead and keep on doing that one attack over and over again, Zant! One of those little shadow darts might hit me someday! You never know!
(Oh, and by the way, I'm not particularly pro-Vaati or anything. He's not really anything special either. I just think there's a decent chance they'll want to give the "Young Link" series some representation alongside the "Adult Link" series, since there have been a bunch of those kinds of games since Melee.)
But if it makes you feel any better, yeah, he would be better than Tingle. Though to be fair, I'd probably place the Happy Mask Salesman, the Old Man Who Gives You the Wooden Sword, and That Little Brown Dog Who Shows Up at Night in Hyrule Castle Town a notch or two above Tingle as well.
(Seriously though, he was totally my favorite dog.)
As much as I'd hate to drag this lecture on I just can't help but defend one of my favorite Zelda characters...
First of all, most people who hate him don't like to post on this board for the fact that people may think they like him and be made fun of for it. While others like to pretend he doesn't exist in general. Compared to the other villians, he has a very small (but loyal) fanbase...
I understand that the Young Link games like Windwaker should get some representation, but I seriously think Zant would be a nice addition to Brawl as well. My sister, even my sister agrees and she even said that she'd play as him over Midna--now that's saying something. He may not be as great as this Kefka guy, but his fight was definately one I'll remember throughout the Zelda series.
He was a comical and funny character who had his own reasons for what he did. Upset and angry about the fact that his dream of being King was taken away from him. And the fact that the Twili's ancestors where chased from the light world didn't help any either. Maybe it was those reasons why he is crazy. Even if he mad a lame villian; he still would make an awesome character for Brawl.
And as a note: I've seen a couple pictures of Kefka; Zant looks nothing like him.
Sorry if this sounds like complaining, but nothing is going to change my opinion on him...
Wyvern
Smash Journeyman
Never played Final Fantasy VI?! How tragic. It's probably the best one (though I still like IV better...).
But anyway, I suppose if you were to narrow your scope to JUST the Legend of Zelda series without considering external influences, he might start to look better. After all, the Zelda series isn't exactly known for having diverse and interesting casts of characters, especially villains. In fact, they're usually not too heavy on storyline period (well, except for Wind Waker). Characters like Zant and Midna make Twilight Princess seem a lot more animated than most other games in the series. I suppose I can understand his appeal from that perspective...though he still doesn't work for me personally. When it comes to storyline, I just tend to value a well-designed and continuous atmosphere above interesting and unexpected plot events, especially in genres that are less plot-heavy than true RPGs.
(Oh, and the comparison with Kefka wasn't meant to be aesthetic. Kefka is an insane villain too, you see. But he's crazy from the very start of the game, so he's designed to fit in smoothly with the cast and atmosphere rather than being a plot twist.)
But anyway, I suppose if you were to narrow your scope to JUST the Legend of Zelda series without considering external influences, he might start to look better. After all, the Zelda series isn't exactly known for having diverse and interesting casts of characters, especially villains. In fact, they're usually not too heavy on storyline period (well, except for Wind Waker). Characters like Zant and Midna make Twilight Princess seem a lot more animated than most other games in the series. I suppose I can understand his appeal from that perspective...though he still doesn't work for me personally. When it comes to storyline, I just tend to value a well-designed and continuous atmosphere above interesting and unexpected plot events, especially in genres that are less plot-heavy than true RPGs.
(Oh, and the comparison with Kefka wasn't meant to be aesthetic. Kefka is an insane villain too, you see. But he's crazy from the very start of the game, so he's designed to fit in smoothly with the cast and atmosphere rather than being a plot twist.)
FFVI is one of the Final Fantasy games I haven't played; I've played VII to X and my sister has the 5th one for GBA. Sorry if I took the comparison as aesthetic, but for a second, that's what I though you meant (I didn't know that Kefka was insane). Anyways, one reason why I love the Legend of Zelda series so much is I grew up playing the first two games for NES and Link has always been one of my childhood heroes of the video game world.
Midna
Smash Apprentice
although Midna would be cooler, Zant would still be awesome. we need a spastic character like that.
heck, if people complain about too many Zelda characters, just trash Sheik and Young Link.
heck, if people complain about too many Zelda characters, just trash Sheik and Young Link.
chaos_Leader
Smash Lord
In all likelihood, Zant's chances are slightly less than some other frontrunners. However, He is among some of the quirkiest vilans I've seen or heard of. I won't be terribly disappointed if he doesn't make the cut, but I'd be pleased to see him in nonetheless.
Pieman0920
Smash Master
Hmm, I don't think Zant has a chance over Midna. I really don't. But he would be a interesting character, I'll give him that. I think I'll make a moveset for him later today, but I'm still not sure what his Final Smash should be. All I know is that I want it to automatically change the stage that he is fighting in, after it's done. (Say he starts off in Smashville, he teleports the stage to say the lava pit from his fight, flips the pit, and then teleports over to Eldin Bridge to continue the fight.)
Well I do agree that Midna should get in before him, being she's the main character and very unique for a princess. But after her Zant would definately be a nice addition and it would be good for another villian (and a recent one too) to reperesent the Zelda series. But I don't think he should be able to change the stage, though it would go with what he does in the game, I just couldn't see it happening. Maybe for his Final Smash, make one up that fits him well. I'll need to think of a moveset for him too, I got good ideas it's just hard to write it all down. I'm just giving Zant more support than Midna because she already has enough popularity and fame, so why not give it to someone less popular. Hopefully Sakurai might aknowledge these two and put them in Smash, they'd both make very great additions as playable characters.
Pieman0920
Smash Master
Well I will be making one later in the afternoon. That's for sure. 
And it's a Final Smash! You can do some crazy things. A stage warp seems like something no other character could do, and it's Zant's big thing in his own fight. The actual attack would be at a specific place that Zant makes (Death Mountain lava pit, that Zant flips over, and the characters have to try to not fall into the pit, for example) and then somewhere else. I think it would be cool, but it would definitely make his FS bannable in tournaments.
And it's a Final Smash! You can do some crazy things. A stage warp seems like something no other character could do, and it's Zant's big thing in his own fight. The actual attack would be at a specific place that Zant makes (Death Mountain lava pit, that Zant flips over, and the characters have to try to not fall into the pit, for example) and then somewhere else. I think it would be cool, but it would definitely make his FS bannable in tournaments.
That brings back memories of fighting him. I should fight him again to understand what his moveset would be. That won't be too hard, since I always have a file that leads straight to him. But if the stage-changing was in Brawl as his FS, it would definately be banned in tournaments. XDWell I will be making one later in the afternoon. That's for sure.
And it's a Final Smash! You can do some crazy things. A stage warp seems like something no other character could do, and it's Zant's big thing in his own fight. The actual attack would be at a specific place that Zant makes (Death Mountain lava pit, that Zant flips over, and the characters have to try to not fall into the pit, for example) and then somewhere else. I think it would be cool, but it would definitely make his FS bannable in tournaments.
Pieman0920
Smash Master
I had to use youtube to remember that, since I don't have a save file that goes to that fight. 
But like I said, I've got ideas already, so my super in-depth specials report will be on its way later. >=D
But like I said, I've got ideas already, so my super in-depth specials report will be on its way later. >=D
I just created a form for any character's full moveset. Now all I need is to put in the information. I play the game often so I remember a lot about Zant, especially the fight. (I beleive I've fought him over 5 times.)I had to use youtube to remember that, since I don't have a save file that goes to that fight.
But like I said, I've got ideas already, so my super in-depth specials report will be on its way later. >=D
Pieman0920
Smash Master
La di da~
Neutral B: Zant starts to contort his body to side, as he charges up, and once released, starts to spin with his swords out like a top. If the attack is uncharged, the duration of the spin is a little shorter than the Ice Climber’s spin. If fully charged though, it goes on much longer. The form is a bit hard to control, but Zant can move from left to right, and even make little hops. Be careful though, as like a top he can fall down, if he gets unbalanced.
Forward B: Zant puts his arms forward, and fires three quick bursts of dark energy, at around the same size and speed, as the ones Mewtwo uses in his back throw. They do moderately good damage, but don’t have much knock back. About two to three more can be added by pressing B quickly. Zant has a bit of lag when only the normal amount is fired, and when more are fired, he takes a rest, making him more tired. That energy shoots high and low, since Zant has a bit of a hard time controlling it, but it generally is in the direction of the opponent.
Up B: Zant temporarily turns into a cloud of twili energy. In this form he can float, helping him recover, and looks much like a cloud. He only stays in this form for about 2 seconds though, and once he comes out, he takes a half second to get his head back together, leaving him open if to close. You may want to get close those as the cloud though, as when you cover a opponent in this form, they are slowed down, and their percentage goes steadily up, unless blocking.
Down B: Zant starts to run rush forward, swinging his swords one after another, like he does in his final fight. He covers a good distance, and the move his very good for hacking away at shields. If timed right, he can be stopped by a frontal attack, but this is nearly impossible to do. He is vulnerable from the back, since he does not slash there, and player controlling Zant can’t change direction while Zant is in this charge.
Final Smash: Well I’ve said this before, but I like this one. Zant has loads of potential FSes, but this one I just like. Zant teleports all the fighters to his own unique stage in Death Mountain. The stage is basically one flat surface, with a large lava pit below. Zant starts to stomp on one end, making the whole arena flip over, as Zant tries to dump his opponents off the stage. The other characters can potentially come out of this unscathed, if they can move quickly, and get on the opposite side, before they fall down into the pit. After this, I’d like the stage to be changed to a different one from the original one they were fighting in, but that’s not all to tournament friendly. Instead I guess it can go back to the old stage that it was just in. Zant can take damage, but no one can stop him from stomping and flipping the stage over. Zant can’t fall in.
Neutral B: Zant starts to contort his body to side, as he charges up, and once released, starts to spin with his swords out like a top. If the attack is uncharged, the duration of the spin is a little shorter than the Ice Climber’s spin. If fully charged though, it goes on much longer. The form is a bit hard to control, but Zant can move from left to right, and even make little hops. Be careful though, as like a top he can fall down, if he gets unbalanced.
Forward B: Zant puts his arms forward, and fires three quick bursts of dark energy, at around the same size and speed, as the ones Mewtwo uses in his back throw. They do moderately good damage, but don’t have much knock back. About two to three more can be added by pressing B quickly. Zant has a bit of lag when only the normal amount is fired, and when more are fired, he takes a rest, making him more tired. That energy shoots high and low, since Zant has a bit of a hard time controlling it, but it generally is in the direction of the opponent.
Up B: Zant temporarily turns into a cloud of twili energy. In this form he can float, helping him recover, and looks much like a cloud. He only stays in this form for about 2 seconds though, and once he comes out, he takes a half second to get his head back together, leaving him open if to close. You may want to get close those as the cloud though, as when you cover a opponent in this form, they are slowed down, and their percentage goes steadily up, unless blocking.
Down B: Zant starts to run rush forward, swinging his swords one after another, like he does in his final fight. He covers a good distance, and the move his very good for hacking away at shields. If timed right, he can be stopped by a frontal attack, but this is nearly impossible to do. He is vulnerable from the back, since he does not slash there, and player controlling Zant can’t change direction while Zant is in this charge.
Final Smash: Well I’ve said this before, but I like this one. Zant has loads of potential FSes, but this one I just like. Zant teleports all the fighters to his own unique stage in Death Mountain. The stage is basically one flat surface, with a large lava pit below. Zant starts to stomp on one end, making the whole arena flip over, as Zant tries to dump his opponents off the stage. The other characters can potentially come out of this unscathed, if they can move quickly, and get on the opposite side, before they fall down into the pit. After this, I’d like the stage to be changed to a different one from the original one they were fighting in, but that’s not all to tournament friendly. Instead I guess it can go back to the old stage that it was just in. Zant can take damage, but no one can stop him from stomping and flipping the stage over. Zant can’t fall in.
Okay, so here's what I got so far, it's not much, but these are some ideas I have thought up for him.
Zant (Legend of Zelda) - Moveset
` Character Stats
Power: *** (From the game, he took 1/2 heart out of Link at best; his attack would be average.)
Speed:**** (Definately the most speedyest Zelda character. Quite hyper during battle too.)
Weight: ** (I'm quite convinced by his hands that he is skinny.)
Jumping: **** (Just take a look how high he can jump the Ice stage of his fight.)
Falling: *** (Seems like a character who would fall at regular speed.)
` Regular Moves
Not very good at thinking up the regular moves. I'll leave other people to think these up. Same goes for throws.
` Special Moves
Regular B: Shadow Salvo -- Shoots rapid shadow blasts like he commonly does during his boss battle, like Falco's laser, but a little faster. However he is still vulnerable to attack despite this and the attack has little knockback.
Smash B: Twili Tornado -- Zant unleashes the spin attack he does in the game, it's a bit difficult to control, however has fair damage and knockback. Use it too much and it takes two seconds for Zant to get himself back to normal.
Up B: Shadow Warp -- A move that works like Mewtwo's teleport, however draws nearby foes close and hurts them with twilight energy dealing minor damage. A good way to make it to the ledge before others.
Down B: Dark Shockwave -- Zant creates a shockwave of shadow energy around himself that inflicts little damage and knockback to foes nearby if not charged. Charge it for better results, when fully charged it will have the power of a fully charged Smash attack.
` Final Smash
I'll think of one...I just need some time.
-- And as for minor details... --------------
` Color Choices
Blue -- His regular outfit. Same as in the original game.
Red -- Dark Red robes with gold twilight runes on them.
Green -- Dark Green robes with light green twilight runes.
Alternative -- Black with red twilight runes (Omg! So sinister!)
` Victories & Taunt
Battle Taunt: Does his high-pitched laugh. (Refer to the 2nd phase of his battle.)
Victory 1 -- Shoots simultaneous dark blasts left and right, laughing like his usual psychotic self.
Victory 2 -- Hovers and charges up a dark sphere looking toward the screen.
Victory 3 -- Spins around and points at the screen, much like he does in the game.
Zant (Legend of Zelda) - Moveset
` Character Stats
Power: *** (From the game, he took 1/2 heart out of Link at best; his attack would be average.)
Speed:**** (Definately the most speedyest Zelda character. Quite hyper during battle too.)
Weight: ** (I'm quite convinced by his hands that he is skinny.)
Jumping: **** (Just take a look how high he can jump the Ice stage of his fight.)
Falling: *** (Seems like a character who would fall at regular speed.)
` Regular Moves
Not very good at thinking up the regular moves. I'll leave other people to think these up. Same goes for throws.
` Special Moves
Regular B: Shadow Salvo -- Shoots rapid shadow blasts like he commonly does during his boss battle, like Falco's laser, but a little faster. However he is still vulnerable to attack despite this and the attack has little knockback.
Smash B: Twili Tornado -- Zant unleashes the spin attack he does in the game, it's a bit difficult to control, however has fair damage and knockback. Use it too much and it takes two seconds for Zant to get himself back to normal.
Up B: Shadow Warp -- A move that works like Mewtwo's teleport, however draws nearby foes close and hurts them with twilight energy dealing minor damage. A good way to make it to the ledge before others.
Down B: Dark Shockwave -- Zant creates a shockwave of shadow energy around himself that inflicts little damage and knockback to foes nearby if not charged. Charge it for better results, when fully charged it will have the power of a fully charged Smash attack.
` Final Smash
I'll think of one...I just need some time.
-- And as for minor details... --------------
` Color Choices
Blue -- His regular outfit. Same as in the original game.
Red -- Dark Red robes with gold twilight runes on them.
Green -- Dark Green robes with light green twilight runes.
Alternative -- Black with red twilight runes (Omg! So sinister!)
` Victories & Taunt
Battle Taunt: Does his high-pitched laugh. (Refer to the 2nd phase of his battle.)
Victory 1 -- Shoots simultaneous dark blasts left and right, laughing like his usual psychotic self.
Victory 2 -- Hovers and charges up a dark sphere looking toward the screen.
Victory 3 -- Spins around and points at the screen, much like he does in the game.
...I still need some time thinking; I'll add more to this post eventually...
Pieman0920
Smash Master
Blarg, I still like my specials better. ~_~
They both sound like good movesets to me. Well, I sure hope Zant and Midna make it into Brawl. I have this feeling that Sakurai pays attention to to the fans' requests too... >_> Weather he and Midna make into Brawl or not lies in Sakurai's decision so we'll never know until the game is released or they're mentioned in the updates.
Pieman0920
Smash Master
If he's not, Zant will probably have his spinning top attack in AT form. :O
*100th post*
*100th post*
I just hope Sakurai doesn't totally forget about him, that would make me sad not even being able to see him in Brawl, though as I said before I would like him as a playable character. And congrats on your 100th post.
Kashimaru
Smash Apprentice
I would like to see Zant as a playale char, but i think it will make it only as an AT -__- !
That is a typo right, 'cause Zant is a he. I shouldn't be complaining though, cause when first I saw my friend playing Twilight Princess I asked if Midna was a guy or girl. *head-desk* I can't beleive I asked that. I'm so stupid sometimes.
Kashimaru
Smash Apprentice
Lol, of course i knew is a "he", my bad
goodkid
Smash Lord
Does Zant float?, because he would be a unique character for Brawl.
Isn't this game going to be E for everyone? Zant is kinda... Not worthy, and be better if he was an assistant trophy, and would use that one spin attack when you fight him in the last match. Do you recall this attack?
He can float, but doesn't really rely on it till certain stages of his fight, like the first phase he floats over the poisonous water and shoots beams at you. And I beleive in the Ice phase of his battle he jumps up, hovers and then attempts to squash you. (Be a wolf and run around on the ice; it'll take him forever to drop.) No one can stay in the air that long unless they're floating.
@Zoinkslls: I think the game's going to be rated T. Blame Wario's fart move and Snake's explosives for that one. And Zant is definately worthy of Brawl, he's the main villian in Link's latest adventure and if it wasn't for him, Link probably would've never met Midna.
Hmm, I don't know. All it says on the Brawl site is Rating Pending, but I don't think parents would be happy with an E-rated game that has a castle under seige (war), some guy who farts for a weapon (crude humor), and someone carrying explosives. Umm... *takes a look at Melee's case* Wait. Melee is rated T so Brawl is probably going to be the same too. Twilight Princess is the first Zelda game to be rated T as well.
Dynamism
Smash Lord
true to that...but the world should lighten up a little ****IN *******S!!!!!
jeez
jeez
I think Zant would be a great addition to Brawl.
True, his boss battle in Twilight Princess wasn't great but neither was Ganondorf's (In my opinion Argorok was the best boss battle of the game). he had a great character which contributed a great deal to TP.
Despite this he had a great character which contributed a great deal to TP, and I could really see Zant as a character in Brawl as opposed to other character suggestions. The move sets suggested seem decent enough and as a Final Smash the idea of him filling the screen with dark energy balls would be a great FS.
100% for Zant in Brawl.
True, his boss battle in Twilight Princess wasn't great but neither was Ganondorf's (In my opinion Argorok was the best boss battle of the game). he had a great character which contributed a great deal to TP.
Despite this he had a great character which contributed a great deal to TP, and I could really see Zant as a character in Brawl as opposed to other character suggestions. The move sets suggested seem decent enough and as a Final Smash the idea of him filling the screen with dark energy balls would be a great FS.
100% for Zant in Brawl.