[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Pluvia's other account]

Nah,the fact he was only in one game that was 12 years ago,and wasnt even mentioned until the discussion of Brawl characters.
He did make a VERY small cameo is M&L:SSS though,and I mean small(He was a doll that tought you hwo to play a minigame),but that doll wasnt named Geno,or even given a name,so eh.

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Ness, Lucas, Dr Mario?

And he was mentioned on Sakurai's Poll, he was like second or something, meaning Nintendo knows he's popular.

The "one game" argument is not a good reason.

 

[Darkwashu]

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Ness, Lucas, Dr Mario?

And he was mentioned on Sakurai's Poll, he was like second or something, meaning Nintendo knows he's popular.

The "one game" argument is not a good reason.

The people you listed also dont deserve to be in Smash also =/
But Ness was in Mother 3 also,he appeared as a cameo and was mentioned.
Making nit-picking correct shuns are fun!

Sakurais poll,doesnt that count as "and wasnt even mentioned until the discussion of Brawl characters",like I said in my earlier post?

 

[Pluvia's other account]

The people you listed also dont deserve to be in Smash also =/
But Ness was in Mother 3 also,he appeared as a cameo and was mentioned.
Making nit-picking correct shuns are fun!

Sakurais poll,doesnt that count as "and wasnt even mentioned until the discussion of Brawl characters",like I said in my earlier post?

That's personal opinion. And we can cross out Ness then if you want, but that still leaves the rest of them.

And how does Sakurai's Poll not count? You can't just say "That doesn't count because I can't find anything to negate it".

That was a poll to Nintendo, Nintendo knows he's popular now, and seeing as though they included most of the characters wanted in Melee, in Brawl, it means they'll most likely look to that poll for SSB4.

 

[Darkwashu]

That's personal opinion. And we can cross out Ness then if you want, but that still leaves the rest of them.

And how does Sakurai's Poll not count? You can't just say "That doesn't count because I can't find anything to negate it".

That was a poll to Nintendo, Nintendo knows he's popular now, and seeing as though they included most of the characters wanted in Melee, in Brawl, it means they'll most likely look to that poll for SSB4.

Oh,I must have used my words wrong,I said it did count,sorry.

Also,why doesnt the "one game" argument work?
Isnt Smash bros about Nintendo All-Stars fighting it out?
How does some side character who appeared in a single game 12 years ago make him a "all star"?

 

[KoJ]

You did lie, and I have seen it outside this board. Lyn DOES have the popularity (especially in the West), importance, and uniqueness. She is not a clone of another Lord in any way.

Stalker...

Seriously, how the hell would you have seen me outside of this board?

Also, Geno doesn't deserve it. Mario already got in. We don't need two Mario RPG reps (And Paper Mario would make more sense anyway, due to him being the MAIN CHARACTER of 3 games).

 

[Kiyosuki]

I bet Nintendo has a lot more of an ability to use Geno regardless of what SquareEnix says than people realize, but like the Koopa Kids...he's simply not used for some reason.

He is very popular though, even among Japanese websites. I'm aware that quite a few on Japanese speaking sites were saddened that the results of that poll were basically ignored.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Also,why doesnt the "one game" argument work?

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario. That's proof that the one game argument doesn't work.

Isnt Smash bros about Nintendo All-Stars fighting it out?
How does some side character who appeared in a single game 12 years ago make him a "all star"?

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario, Sonic, Snake.

 

[Darkwashu]

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario. That's proof that the one game argument doesn't work.

Dr.Mario was in more than one game...
Also,Sheik was one of the people who greatly helped Link in OoT,by teaching songs to get through the game,OoT being the huge hit it is,and she is the alter ego if the Zelda,the main character of close to every Zelda game(Hell,the series is NAMED after Zelda),Sheik is SOMEWHAT important,not on the same level of Mario or Link,but still.

Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario, Sonic, Snake.

Exceptions,not the rule.

 

[Pieman0920]

The one game argument doesn't work for people who stared in that one game. ICs, Lucas, and Ness were the stars of said game. Dr. Mario's has actually had quite a few games, and was just a clone. Sheik was included to give Zelda that unique transformation, and in any case, is still Zelda.

Geno didn't star in his game. He was just a party member. He made a very small cameo in one other game. Every time SE and Nintendo have teamed up, they have not brought Geno back. (And they even brought in some SMRPG music in one of their latest team up games, but no Geno)

He's not going to be playable.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Dr.Mario was in more than one game...

So he was, yet that still leaves the rest.

Also,Sheik was one of the people who greatly helped Link in OoT,by teaching songs to get through the game,OoT being the huge hit it is,and she is the alter ego if the Zelda,the main character of close to every Zelda game(Hell,the series is NAMED after Zelda),Sheik is SOMEWHAT important,not on the same level of Mario or Link,but still.

Geno helped Mario greatly throughout the adventure, heck, you even got to play as him, a feet that even Sheik never achieved. And Sheik was still only in one game. You can't start calling Sheik, Zelda. Zelda in Brawl is clearly based off of her Twilight Princess incarnation.

Exceptions,not the rule.

Which debunks Geno how?

The one game argument doesn't work for people who stared in that one game. ICs, Lucas, and Ness were the stars of said game. Dr. Mario's has actually had quite a few games, and was just a clone. Sheik was included to give Zelda that unique transformation, and in any case, is still Zelda.

Sheik's not Zelda. Zelda is clearly based off her Twilight Princess incarnation. They could have easily took out Sheik, who didn't even appear in Twilight Princess.

Geno didn't star in his game. He was just a party member. He made a very small cameo in one other game. Every time SE and Nintendo have teamed up, they have not brought Geno back. (And they even brought in some SMRPG music in one of their latest team up games, but no Geno)

I can't find any other Square and Nintendo made RPGs. And Sheik never starred in her game, she wasn't even playable, unlike Geno.

 

[Darkwashu]

Geno helped Mario greatly throughout the adventure, heck, you even got to play as him, a feet that even Sheik never achieved. And Sheik was still only in one game. You can't start calling Sheik, Zelda. Zelda in Brawl is clearly based off of her Twilight Princess incarnation.

It was optional to play as Geno,once you got Bowser or Peach(Whoever you get first) you never have to play as Geno again.
I know Sheik wasnt in TP,but her design still got changed,like you can see her braid,and she looks more feminine.

Which debunks Geno how?

Just stating that you used exceptions tot eh "All-star" rule.
We have many more all-stars like Luigi,Mario,Peach,Pikachu,Kirby,Zelda,Link,Bowser,Fox,Wario,etc,compared to characters who are minor in their franchise,like Geno.

 

[Pieman0920]

Oh, and since I missed it, one more thing.

Third party characters like Snake and Sonic are mega stars, not side characters from a 10 year old game. They are very popular, even outside of Nintendo's usual audiance, and thus can bring in new customers. Geno can't do that. Anyone who'd want Geno in this game likely would but it if he's in it or not, since Geno's fans are essentially Mario fans. Thus, there isn't enough reward for all the litigation with SE, and it'd make more sense for the two companies to choose someone that actually matters as a third party rep.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

It was optional to play as Geno,once you got Bowser or Peach(Whoever you get first) you never have to play as Geno again.
I know Sheik wasnt in TP,but her design still got changed,like you can see her braid,and she looks more feminine.

You never get to play as Sheik. And even though her design got changed, for all we know Geno could've almost been included in Mario Galaxy, therefore changing his design. Thing is we'll never know, like we'd never know that Sheik was supposed to be included in TP, if it never said on the Dojo.

Just stating that you used exceptions tot eh "All-star" rule.
We have many more all-stars like Luigi,Mario,Peach,Pikachu,Kirby,Zelda,Link,Bowser,Fox,Wario,etc,compared to characters who are minor in their franchise,like Geno.

So basically, it doesn't.

 

[Darkwashu]

You never get to play as Sheik. And even though her design got changed, for all we know Geno could've almost been included in Mario Galaxy, therefore changing his design. Thing is we'll never know, like we'd never know that Sheik was supposed to be included in TP, if it never said on the Dojo.

But he wasnt in Galaxy
Geno has yet to get his design changed,at all.

So basically, it doesn't.

..What?

 

[Pieman0920]

You don't really "play' as Geno though. You play as Mario. Its like saying that in each Pokemon game, you are playing as the Pokemon, rather than the trainer.

Also you quoted him but said my name. >_>

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Oh, and since I missed it, one more thing.

Third party characters like Snake and Sonic are mega stars, not side characters from a 10 year old game. They are very popular, even outside of Nintendo's usual audiance, and thus can bring in new customers.

I only mentioned Sonic and Snake to debunk that "Nintendo All-Stars" thing. Plus from what I've seen, neither Sheik or the Ice Climbers are that popular outside of Smash, thus almost definitely wont bring in new customers.

Geno can't do that.

Either could Sheik. Or the Ice Climbers come to think of it.

Anyone who'd want Geno in this game likely would but it if he's in it or not, since Geno's fans are essentially Mario fans. Thus, there isn't enough reward for all the litigation with SE, and it'd make more sense for the two companies to choose someone that actually matters as a third party rep.

Or someone whose popular. E.G. Geno.

 

[Darkwashu]

Geno is only popular to people who are interested in Smash Bros. <_<

...Speaking of which,why is Geno considered so much for the game over Mallow,the other character whoa appears in that game?
I could never figure that out.

 

[Pieman0920]

I only mentioned Sonic and Snake to debunk that "Nintendo All-Stars" thing. Plus from what I've seen, neither Sheik or the Ice Climbers are that popular outside of Smash, thus almost definitely wont bring in new customers.

Sheik and Ice Climbers were added because of the new mechanics that they both brought. (Transfomarion and double teaming) They also don't suffer from being third party at the same time/not staring in their one game or being basically the main character in a costume. Geno might have moves that look different from other people's but he isn't original like those two are.

Or someone whose popular. E.G. Geno.

He's not popular though outside of that group who'd already buy the game. There aren't people who won't buy a smash game because Geno isn't in it. He doesn't bring any new audiances. You completely missed the point.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

But he wasnt in Galaxy
Geno has yet to get his design changed,at all.

You never get to play as Sheik. And even though her design got changed, for all we know Geno could've almost been included in Mario Galaxy, therefore changing his design. Thing is we'll never know, like we'd never know that Sheik was supposed to be included in TP, if it never said on the Dojo.

..What?

I asked how does that debunk Geno. You said:

Just stating that you used exceptions tot eh "All-star" rule.
We have many more all-stars like Luigi,Mario,Peach,Pikachu,Kirby,Zelda,Link,Bowser,Fox,Wario,etc,compared to characters who are minor in their franchise,like Geno.

So basically, it doesn't.

 

[Darkwashu]

You never get to play as Sheik. And even though her design got changed, for all we know Geno could've almost been included in Mario Galaxy, therefore changing his design. Thing is we'll never know, like we'd never know that Sheik was supposed to be included in TP, if it never said on the Dojo.

But he WASNT
Mallow could have bene in Galaxy making him far more important that Geno!
Hell,Sheiks design was updated more than Mario's!

I asked how does that debunk Geno. You said:



So basically, it doesn't.

The characters you said "Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario, Sonic, Snake." are atleast teh stars of their games,save Sheik,the exception.
Geno is not,and be thrown out of your party forever,never to be playable again,once you get Bowser or Peach.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Sheik and Ice Climbers were added because of the new mechanics that they both brought. (Transfomarion and double teaming) They also don't suffer from being third party at the same time/not staring in their one game or being basically the main character in a costume. Geno might have moves that look different from other people's but he isn't original like those two are.

That doesn't explain why they have a chance at getting in the game over Geno. Especially Sheik. Mewtwo brought a whole new completely unique fighting style to the game, but look what happened to him. He's even more popular than Sheik too.

He's not popular though outside of that group who'd already buy the game. There aren't people who won't buy a smash game because Geno isn't in it. He doesn't bring any new audiances. You completely missed the point.

I highly doubt Sheik, Ice Climbers and maybe even Pit are that popular outside of the group of people who'd already buy the game.

Even Lucas, his game has only been released in Japan.

 

[Darkwashu]

Even Lucas, his game has only been released in Japan.

Lucas is very popular to Mother/Earthbound fans,because Earthbound has a cult following.
Him being in Smash is a way for Sakura to tease everyone else"You arent getting Mother 3,nyah nyah nyah nyah nyah nyah!"

Or did I misread your post wrong?

 

[Pluvia's other account]

But he WASNT

Either was Sheik in TP.

Mallow could have bene in Galaxy making him far more important that Geno!
Hell,Sheiks design was updated more than Mario's!

Of course Mallow could've. But he wasn't, just like Sheik. Updated design means nothing too, loads of characters were updated, if Geno appears in SSB4, there's a pretty high chance that his design will be updated.

The characters you said "Sheik, Ice Climbers, Lucas, Dr Mario, Sonic, Snake." are atleast teh stars of their games,save Sheik,the exception.
Geno is not,and be thrown out of your party forever,never to be playable again,once you get Bowser or Peach.

Sheik's the exception. So how does that disprove Geno's chances?

Lucas is very popular to Mother/Earthbound fans,because Earthbound has a cult following.

And Ice Climbers and Sheik?

 

[Darkwashu]

Either was Sheik in TP.

Geno could have been in Galaxy,where are you getting with this?

Of course Mallow could've. But he wasn't, just like Sheik. Updated design means nothing too, loads of characters were updated, if Geno appears in SSB4, there's a pretty high chance that his design will be updated.

Of course his design will most likely be updated,but Nintendo has shown little interested in making Geno know to people of this generation/Smash Brothers fans.

Sheik's the exception. So how does that disprove Geno's chances?

Exceptions arent as likely.

And Ice Climbers and Sheik?

Icyes having a cult following,no.
LoZ series,yes.

Also,Pit was in a cartoon in the late 80's and early 90's,so Nintendo showed more interest in Pit than Geno.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

For some reason it wont let me quote you.

The Geno could've been in Galaxy part was us talking about design. You said his design hasn't changed therefore he doesn't deserve to be in, I pointed out that his design could've changed, we just don't know about it.

EDIT:

And we know from the characters in Brawl that Nintendo showed interest in what characters the fans wanted in, (in Melee). Fans wanted Geno in Brawl. And Sheik doesn't count for the whole LoZ universe. Sheik counts for Sheik. It's like saying Zangoose is likely cause the Pokemon universe is popular.

And even though exceptions aren't as likely, it doesn't mean they are completely debunked. Geno is popular, Nintendo knows that now.

 

[darkserenade]

I think Geno just doesn't fit in Smash. Think of Geno as the current Sonic-he doesn't fit in. Also, Pluvia, not to be mean, but why are you protecting someone you're not a fan of?

 

[flyinfilipino]

Geno might be implemented as a WTF character, and definitely be unlockable or something along those lines, not a frontrunner for the next game. However, I wouldn't be surprised if he wasn't, since it looks like Nintendo's been ignoring his cult following.

 

[Darkwashu]

The Geno could've been in Galaxy part was us talking about design. You said his design hasn't changed therefore he doesn't deserve to be in, I pointed out that his design could've changed, we just don't know about it.

....I must have used my words wrong,but I meant that his design not being updated shows Nintendo has no interest in him outside of Smash Bros.,not that his design not being updated means he isnt Smash worthy.

Hell,then Mario doesnt deserve to be in Smash,hes been using that same hat for years!

I think Geno just doesn't fit in Smash. Think of Geno as the current Sonic-he doesn't fit in. Also, Pluvia, not to be mean, but why are you protecting someone you're not a fan of?

Snake REALLY doesnt fit.
Atleast Geno is Nintendo-ish.

 

[Pluvia's other account]

I think Geno just doesn't fit in Smash. Think of Geno as the current Sonic-he doesn't fit in. Also, Pluvia, not to be mean, but why are you protecting someone you're not a fan of?

I'm just debunking the silly reasons that people say that means he wont be in. I'm not a Geno fan, I couldn't care less if he was in SSB4 or not.

I absolutely hate Tingle. But Tingle fans could quite easily debunk all my arguments for why he wont be in, as ultimately they'll come down to personal opinion.

I could say that I don't want Tingle in SSB4, but saying that he wont be in is just plain stupid.

 

[flyinfilipino]

I could say that I don't want Tingle in SSB4, but saying that he wont be in is just plain stupid.

No, because he might not be playable at all. It's just as stupid as saying he will be, or might be; none of us knows, and it's not up to us.

 

[Darkwashu]

Instead of hearing reasons why Geno shouldnt be in SSB4,lets hear some reasons why he should.

I really wanna hear this to,to bad we dont have many Geno enthusiast viewing this thread....

 

[Pluvia's other account]

No, because he might not be playable at all. It's just as stupid as saying he will be, or might be; none of us knows, and it's not up to us.

Exactly .

Instead of hearing reasons why Geno shouldnt be in SSB4,lets hear some reasons why he should.

I think it's to do with popularity, the same reason why Lucario made it.

Strangely I'm a Lucario fan.

 

[Darkwashu]

No, because he might not be playable at all. It's just as stupid as saying he will be, or might be; none of us knows, and it's not up to us.

Of course we cant choose who will be in SSB4,this topic is mainly for speculation or discussion.

I think it's to do with popularity, the same reason why Lucario made it.

Strangely I'm a Lucario fan.

I never heard of Geno untill I got into SSBB.

Lucario is popular?
He was in what,one movie?

 

[flyinfilipino]

Of course we cant choose who will be in SSB4,this topic is mainly for speculation or discussion.

Of course, I was just letting Pluvia know that it's not stupid to say anything in here, unless it's just plain wrong or you're saying that you're boycotting Smash.

EDIT: Lucario's movie is most likely not the reason he got into Smash. He is a representative of the current generation of Pokemon at the time of release (as was Pichu), and is obviously being pushed by Game Freak as a really darn special Pokemon in the games.

 

[Darkwashu]

Of course, I was just letting Pluvia know that it's not stupid to say anything in here, unless it's just plain wrong or you're saying that you're boycotting Smash.

Im boycotting Smash will we get 5 Earthbound reps....:******:

Lucario's movie is most likely not the reason he got into Smash. He is a representative of the current generation of Pokemon at the time of release (as was Pichu), and is obviously being pushed by Game Freak as a really darn special Pokemon in the games.

Correct me if im wrong,but wherent Bonsly and Munchlax the first 4th gen Pokemon seen?
So Lucario is basically in SSBB because hes "the latest fad" <_______<

 

[flyinfilipino]

Im boycotting Smash will we get 5 Earthbound reps....:******:

Erm, can't say anything about Earthbound except it's highly unlikely, but WE DON'T CARE IF YOU BOYCOTT SMAAAAAASH!!!!

EDIT: I think you're right about Bonsly and Munchlax, they made their debuts early in the anime and games I believe.

And yes, that is pretty much why Lucario is in. From here on out, his inclusion will most likely be based on his Smash popularity.

 

[Darkwashu]

Erm, can't say anything about Earthbound except it's highly unlikely, but WE DON'T CARE IF YOU BOYCOTT SMAAAAAASH!!!!

BAWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
WHY CANT YOU GIT ME
___
The only Earthbound reps left are Kumatora,Paula,Ninten,Pokey and Masked Man.
With Pokey being the most "popular" then Paula/Kuma,then Masked Man/Ninten..

You know I was kidding,right?

 

[Pluvia's other account]

Lucario is popular?
He was in what,one movie?

Of course he's popular, otherwise he wouldn't have so much fans, or gotten in Brawl.

Im boycotting Smash will we get 5 Earthbound reps....:******:

Some Mother reps are actually quite cool, just look at Masked Man. AKA

Spoiler

Lucas' brother, Claus.

(He actually doesn't have a right hand, it was replaced by a gun, they just forgot to add that in the picture).

He even has robotic wings I think. You have to admit, he'd be a good fighter, plus he came 4th on Sakurai's Poll.

 

[Darkwashu]

Masked Man could be the only fighter from EB that wouldnt use Psi,save for Pokey.

But considering how LAZY they where with Lucas,HE DOESNT EVEN USE A STICK HAS A WEAPON DAMMIT,HE USES POLES AND RODS!
/rant
Meaning Paula has a higher chance than Kuma.

 

[flyinfilipino]

You know I was kidding,right?

Derrrrrr!

He even has robotic wings I think. You have to admit, he'd be a good fighter, plus he came 4th on Sakurai's Poll.

He does look cool, but he's only in Mother 3, right? Since the Mother series has ended (hasn't it?), do you think he'd make a good representative villain for the entire series?