Not Everyone from Brawl/Melee will return... few 3rd party characters

[Johnknight1]

Nothing in there said anything about cut characters, just cutting down. Look at Spire's last post for information on what "cutting down" in regards to character can look like. If you want a link for said quote, click here.

Also, notice they cut down the stage quality to mostly texture imports from other games. The Spirit Train stage from Zelda: Spirit Tracks literally has the same graphics, background, etc. that said area had in Spirit Tracks. The same is true with the 3DS graphics of Gerudo Valley (Ocarina of Time 3DS), the Fire Emblem Areana (Fire Emblem: Awakening), and the Nintendogs stage. Y'all need to chill out. They're trying to condense as much memory without effecting both games and without needed to use DLC. But if they need DLC, they will likely use it.

Also, if you digitally download Smash 3DS, I doubt you'll have this issue. As for Smash Wii U, the Wii U discs hold 25GB of memory single-layered (compared to the 3DS' 8GB cartridge capacity), so we're good there, and there's no reason to complain there. At worst that game is double-layered for approximately double the space, which by no means will Sakurai and Namco Bandai be able to fill that.

>lucas
>Wolf
>Lucario

>>>Clones

The smasher that JOE! is quoting went full ******.

 

[Zajice]

People thinking Jigglypuff might get cut are crazy. There is no way any of the original 12 from 64 are ever going to get taken out.

 

[lordvaati]

so potential casualties are Toon Link and Zss.

I'm starting to worry about Falco as well(they could have gave his moveset back to Fox, who didn't use his blaster or shine in any vids).

 

[Artsy Omni]

How did people know they woukd be cuts? Sakurai knew PeePz hated that he cut chars from Melee to Brawl? Why would he purposly do it again?

This is a fighting game. Characters get dropped. When rosters get as big as Smash's it happens. And it always makes people mad—that isn't a reason not to do it. When it happens, it's because it was necessary for one reason or another, and no amount of fan whining would stop that. Expecting otherwise is setting yourself up for disappointment.

 

[Dark Phazon]

This is a fighting game. Characters get dropped. When rosters get as big as Smash's it happens. And it always makes people mad—that isn't a reason not to do it. When it happens, it's because it was necessary for one reason or another, and no amount of fan whining would stop that. Expecting otherwise is setting yourself up for disappointment.

Well they didnt add no one in brawl i cared about anyway i was just saying.

Hehehe i got a feeling that the 35 Guests viewing this thread are more angry than us about what happened....

 

[GreenKirby]

People aren't really understanding the perspective. The 3DS game can hold 8Gb of data. To put that into perspective, you can store 5 Vita games on an 8Gb memory card. Brawl's size was around 7.9 Gb. And that was due to fact of a ****ton of music and FMV Subspace cutscenes.

Also this quote:

So we're forced into the situation where we may need to reduce some characters to a certain degree

That doesn't sound like cutting. That sounds like revamping (for example, there can only be 1 Ice Climber on screen, Olimar can't call as much Pikmin, any possible Final Smash changes) so I wouldn't blow the worry horn yet. Especially on clones considering how easy they're made.

And if by the off chance the roster doesn't increase that much? That what usually happens in fighting games.

 

[Artsy Omni]

I'll honestly be surprised if the roster is larger than 40... Just saying.

 

[UltimateLoser]

I'll honestly be surprised if the roster is larger than 40... Just saying.

hopefully it is larger than 40

 

[TheTuninator]

How could there be only one ice climber? That would kinda kill the point of the character. Anyways, if ZSS is problematic, I have an easy solution. Make her a separate character already!

Even having characters reduced in flashiness because of the 3DS would be really lame.

 

[SmashChu]

It should be noted that Sakurai says that they might reduce the number of characters but they will try and add as many as they can. But don't worry all. Smashchu did his homework.

Super Street Fighter IV: 3D Edition has 35 characters where Tekken 3D: Prime Edition has 41 characters
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Street_Fighter_IV:_3D_Edition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tekken_3D:_Prime_Edition

Both games are on 2GB cards (Note that they may be smaller than that)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=456554

Currently, 3DS cards are able to go up to 8 GB
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2010/12/3ds_game_cards_could_reach_a_mighty_8gb

As a reminder, Brawl was a dual layered disc which mean it could go up to 8 gigs (though it uses just under 7).
http://allisbrawl.com/blogpost.aspx?id=146520

They shouldn't have trouble having 45-50 characters.

 

[Toph_87]

I just want Mewtwo to return in some form. That's all I ask for. I'm not sure about Ganondorf. Smash typically likes to focus the characters on the previous main console games and Ganon wasn't on it. Lord Ghirahim and Demise are very popular and I can't see one of them not being on this game. We'll have to see.

 

[Mr. Mumbles]

Please give me a source on this. People keep saying and nobody has ever been able to provide a source. It's all just hearsay provided via the fans.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQD1yJinzeQ Skip to 1:18 for the quote. There! Now we can finally stop thinking crazy things like ssb4 will have 45 characters... and we can cry because that would have been so much more awesome. Q-Q Oh well. We still love you Sakuria!

EDIT: FAIL! My bad. I misheard WiiU as Wii. I wonder if anyone else has made this same mistake, as it seems like I wasn't the only one to believe the number of characters would be the same as Brawl.

 

[Johnknight1]

^^^^ Ummm, yeah. He was talking about adding new characters. We're not getting 17 or 18 new characters again like in Brawl.

More proof that I'm right guys that we shouldn't worry. Thanks SmashChu.

But still, most of the stuff is the massive stages, the adventure mode locations, all the songs, and the freaking story mode stuffs.

 

[GamerGuy09]

Here is my Likelyhood of getting Cut List:

Zero Suit Samus = Likely (Don't see much use of her, Wii Fit Trainer seems to be way to similar to her)

Zelda/Shiek = No Way

Yoshi = No Way

Peach = No Way

Ice Climbers = Not Likely (They've been with the games since Melee)

Wario = No Way (One of the most notable characters)

Ike = Likely (Will probably be replaced by Chrom)

Pokemon Trainer = Likely (However might get replaced by newer version with newer pokemon)

Diddy Kong = Unlikely (Donkey's Buddy)

Meta Knight = Unlikely (Highly Recognizable)

King Dedede = Unlikely (Highly Recognizable)

Lucas = Likely (He is a huge clone of ness, would work better as an alt costume)

Olimar = Unlikely (Pikmin 3 is almost out)

Ness = No Way (OG)

Captain Falcon = No Way (OG)

Luigi = No Way (OG)

Jigglypuff = No Way (OG)

Marth = No Way (Ever since Melee he was popular)

Falco = No Way (Has been popular, especially from smash bros melee)

Lucario = Likely (Will probably be replaced by newer pokemon)

R.O.B. = LIkely (Not many people know who he is)

Ganondorf = Unlikely (He is the Bowser to Link, you think they would get rid of him?)

Mr. Game & Watch = Unlikely (Has been here since Melee)

Toon Link = Probably (Clone of Link)

Wolf = Unsure (He ain't a true clone, but he is less popular. Could go either way.)

Snake = Possibly (Snake hasn't been on a Nintendo console since forever)

Sonic = Unlikely (New Sonic Exclusive Game)

 

[Johnknight1]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Ummm... why=???

Edit: That's it, I'm done with this thread.

 

[Deleted member]

Hmm, when did he say that?

Here's Sakurai's quote regarding the roster for those who are begging for a source:

"It isn't a matter of ‘If the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough… There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of playable characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive."

He implies that clones may not return this time. There may be replacements. Sonic and Snake were guest characters from Brawl, so there's a possibility that they'll drop. Although people say Sonic will return. Each character may have a unique playstyle this time around. Sakurai's main focus is to balance the roster, not adding too many filler characters. He doesn't like a roster of 60+ characters because it takes longer to balance the whole roster. Characters are chosen whether they are appropriate for Smash.

 

[GamerGuy09]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Ummm... why=???

Edit: That's it, I'm done with this thread.

Wii Fit Trainer looks REALLY similar to ZSS. Ike, Pokemon Trainer, and Lucario will probably get replaced with another series representative. Toon Link and Lucas are big clones. Not many poeple know ROB. And Wolf and Snake are up in the air.

If most of those characters got replaced by more interesting newer characters I wouldn't be to made. (With the exception of Snake and Wolf, those two are badass.)

 

[Johnknight1]

Wii Fit Trainer looks REALLY similar to ZSS. Ike, Pokemon Trainer, and Lucario will probably get replaced with another series representative. Toon Link and Lucas are big clones. Not many poeple know ROB. And Wolf and Snake are up in the air.

1. Who cares if the WFT and ZSS look s imilar.
2. Not representatives. WE DON'T PLAY AS REPRESENTATIVES, WE PLAY AS CHARACTERS!!!
3. I DON'T GIVE A CRAP.
4.

 

[GamerGuy09]

1. Who cares if the WFT and ZSS look s imilar.
2. Not representatives. WE DON'T PLAY AS REPRESENTATIVES, WE PLAY AS CHARACTERS!!!
3. I DON'T GIVE A CRAP.
4.

Over reaction much? ZSS is JUST a naked samus with a laser whip aka Samus and ZSS ARE the same character, so if they used a CHARACTER slot for a NEW CHARACTER instead of the SAME CHARACTEr i would be okay with that. Lucas and Toon Link are USELESS clones. I want Wolf, ROB, and Snake to stay. If I had to choose between Ike and Chrom, Chrom would win. And finally Pokemon Trainer and Lucario would be replaced will never versions of themselves if anything, which would be fine in my opinion.

 

[Johnknight1]

Over reaction much? ZSS is JUST a naked samus with a laser whip (aka Samus and ZSS ARE the same character). Lucas and Toon Link are USELESS clones. I want Wolf, ROB, and Snake to stay. If I had to choose between Ike and Chrom, Chrom would win. And finally Pokemon Trainer and Lucario would be replaced will never versions of themselves if anything, which would be fine in my opinion.

After reading this level of stupids, I have decided to abandon this thread forever.

 

[GamerGuy09]

After reading this level of stupids, I have decided to abandon this thread forever.

You know that all of the characters I just said don't NEED to be there, especially ZSS, Lucus, and Toon Link.

 

[hydrokyogre]

Here's Sakurai's quote regarding the roster for those who are begging for a source:

"It isn't a matter of ‘If the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough… There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of playable characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive."

He implies that clones may not return this time. There may be replacements. Sonic and Snake were guest characters from Brawl, so there's a possibility that they'll drop. Although people say Sonic will return. Each character may have a unique playstyle this time around. Sakurai's main focus is to balance the roster, not adding too many filler characters. He doesn't like a roster of 60+ characters because it takes longer to balance the whole roster. Characters are chosen whether they are appropriate for Smash.

Saying that he doesn't want a huge amount of characters =/= saying that the roster will be the same size as the last game...

Also, he does not 'imply that clones may not return'. If anything the whole "fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive" thing and the emphasis on balancing characters suggests that they will simply be tweaked and balanced to not be clones anymore.

 

[GamerGuy09]

Saying that he doesn't want a huge amount of characters =/= saying that the roster will be the same size as the last game...

Also, he does not 'imply that clones may not return'. If anything the whole "fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive" thing and the emphasis on balancing characters suggests that they will simply be tweaked and balanced to not be clones anymore.

I hope to see the half clones be more original, such as Luigi, Ganon, Falco, and Wolf. If the true clones were thrown out I wouldn't mind. (Toon Link and Lucas)

 

[TheTuninator]

It should be noted that Sakurai says that they might reduce the number of characters but they will try and add as many as they can. But don't worry all. Smashchu did his homework.

Super Street Fighter IV: 3D Edition has 35 characters where Tekken 3D: Prime Edition has 41 characters
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Street_Fighter_IV:_3D_Edition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tekken_3D:_Prime_Edition

Both games are on 2GB cards (Note that they may be smaller than that)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=456554

Currently, 3DS cards are able to go up to 8 GB
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2010/12/3ds_game_cards_could_reach_a_mighty_8gb

As a reminder, Brawl was a dual layered disc which mean it could go up to 8 gigs (though it uses just under 7).
http://allisbrawl.com/blogpost.aspx?id=146520

They shouldn't have trouble having 45-50 characters.

I hope you're right!

Here's Sakurai's quote regarding the roster for those who are begging for a source:

"It isn't a matter of ‘If the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough… There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of playable characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and have them all feel distinctive."

He implies that clones may not return this time. There may be replacements. Sonic and Snake were guest characters from Brawl, so there's a possibility that they'll drop. Although people say Sonic will return. Each character may have a unique playstyle this time around. Sakurai's main focus is to balance the roster, not adding too many filler characters. He doesn't like a roster of 60+ characters because it takes longer to balance the whole roster. Characters are chosen whether they are appropriate for Smash.

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't he say this BEFORE he had the entire Namco team at his disposal?

 

[GamerGuy09]

I hope you're right!



Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't he say this BEFORE he had the entire Namco team at his disposal?

I don't know about that, however that part where he says "50 that would be enough" makes me REALLY happy. I thought we would only get 45 max. And now that they are cutting not-so original characters like Lucas or Toonlink we will get even more original characters! :D

 

[SureNsync]

I hope to see the half clones be more original, such as Luigi, Ganon, Falco, and Wolf. If the true clones were thrown out I wouldn't mind. (Toon Link and Lucas)

... Lucas wasn't a clone.

 

[Rayopuff]

People thinking Jigglypuff might get cut are crazy. There is no way any of the original 12 from 64 are ever going to get taken out.

Pretty much, if Jigglypuff was ever in danger of being taken out, Sakurai would have done it in Brawl, she survived Brawl and ended up in the game (albeit not part of the Subspace Emissary and unlocked late) but she was still there, I think her role in this game will be expanded, she's more relevant now than she was during Brawl's release due to her fairy upgrade and being on Pokemon Conquest.

 

[Curmudgeon]

I hope to see the half clones be more original, such as Luigi, Ganon, Falco, and Wolf. If the true clones were thrown out I wouldn't mind. (Toon Link and Lucas)

Ganondorf is more of a clone than Lucas

 

[GamerGuy09]

... Lucas wasn't a clone.

Oh come on now. Wolf Isn't a clone since his normals are all different. Luigi isn't a clone because he has 2 special moves that are different from mario. Ganon isn't a clone because his speed and power is so much different from captain falcon. Lucas on the other hand is a clone. His specials are so similar to Ness's but with such minor tweaks that I could barely tell the difference. I hope Lucas returns as a costume or something for Ness.

 

[UltimateLoser]

I hope to see the half clones be more original, such as Luigi, Ganon, Falco, and Wolf. If the true clones were thrown out I wouldn't mind. (Toon Link and Lucas)

Lucas is a clone? The only moves they really share are PK Thunder, and the forward smash, and maybe PK fire even though they function differently

 

[Curmudgeon]

Oh come on now. Wolf Isn't a clone since his normals are all different. Luigi isn't a clone because he has 2 special moves that are different from mario. Ganon isn't a clone because his speed and power is so much different from captain falcon. Lucas on the other hand is a clone. His specials are so similar to Ness's but with such minor tweaks that I could barely tell the difference. I hope Lucas returns as a costume or something for Ness.

Using your logic, Lucas isn't a clone since his normals are all different (except fsmash).

 

[GamerGuy09]

Using your logic, Lucas isn't a clone since his normals are all different (except fsmash).

Eh. I guess. I still see him more disposable than the other "Similar" characters.

 

[Artsy Omni]

Oh come on now. Wolf Isn't a clone since his normals are all different. Luigi isn't a clone because he has 2 special moves that are different from mario. Ganon isn't a clone because his speed and power is so much different from captain falcon. Lucas on the other hand is a clone. His specials are so similar to Ness's but with such minor tweaks that I could barely tell the difference. I hope Lucas returns as a costume or something for Ness.

Hate to break it to you, but Ganondorf is way more of a clone. Specials are the only thing that Ness and Lucas have in common, and even they operate way more differently than Ganondorf to Falcon. Ganondorf is just a slow Falcon with some slightly different animations and some quirky effects.

Your opinion of his being "disposable" is just a subjective opinion. Don't argue subjectively. =P

 

[The World Warrior]

If they're removing clones, Ganon TL Lucas Falco Wolf Lucario and most likely Ike will get replaced.

Unless they completely revamp their moves. Though I don't know how it would go over with those characters' fans/users. I don't use Ganon but I hope he doesn't get cut.

 

[GamerGuy09]

Hate to break it to you, but Ganondorf is way more of a clone. Specials are the only thing that Ness and Lucas have in common, and even they operate way more differently than Ganondorf to Falcon. Ganondorf is just a slow Falcon with some slightly different animations and some quirky effects.

Your opinion of his being "disposable" is just a subjective opinion. Don't argue subjectively. =P

I guess your right. However, if Lucas or Ganon do appear in the next game. I want there specials to a be a little bit more unique.

 

[Curmudgeon]

Eh. I guess. I still see him more disposable than the other "Similar" characters.

The only reason people like you think Lucas is more of a clone than say, Ganondorf, is because he kinda looks like Ness (height, striped shirt, big head, shorts).

 

[Artsy Omni]

I guess your right. However, if Lucas or Ganon do appear in the next game. I want there specials to a be a little bit more unique.

Yes. Please. Though after 2 installments of Ganondorf being a clone/near clone, I dunno how likely it is that Sakurai would rework them entirely. Though one could argue that reworking them entirely is essentially the same as cutting them and including a different character in their place. =P

I WANT it to happen, but I suspect if they're included, they'll largely be the same.

 

[Serris]

Zero Suit Samus isn't getting cut. Samus used the Zero Laser in the trailer. We all know what happens after that.

 

[UltimateLoser]

Zero Suit Samus isn't getting cut. Samus used the Zero Laser in the trailer. We all know what happens after that.

Maybe they changed it so that Samus doesn't lose her suit after the laser

 

[GamerGuy09]

Zero Suit Samus isn't getting cut. Samus used the Zero Laser in the trailer. We all know what happens after that.

Do we though? We never see the final smash end or her changing into ZSS. I think it is very possible that Sakurai cut her because of two reasons.

1) They want people who love playing Samus not be discouraged to get the smash ball to change the character completely.

2) Even though ZSS is samus without her suit, she is still samus. That would make having a character slot kind of redundant. So they took a character (Wii Fit Trainer) and give her a similar gameplay style to ZSS.