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No Crying Until the End: Ninten for Smash Ultimate!

Patwhit01

Smash Cadet
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71
I've been reading through this thread and the support thread for Porky in Smash and honestly, I can't help but feel a little bit hype seeing all the potential evidence that's built up that points towards even the smallest chance of this franchise getting more rep. I don't care if it's Porky or if it's Ninten, I just want to see one of those two make it in.

I kinda lean more towards wanting Ninten, though. Porky is a solid idea because of the apparent Heroes vs. Villains theme that's going on, so if there was ever a time where they would be planning on adding him, this would seem to be it. But on the other hand, I really want Ninten just because it feels so incomplete not having all three protagonists in the game.

My only fear is Nintendo not realizing his solidity as a standalone character, taking the lazy route and making him an echo fighter. That would honestly break my heart, since he's got plenty of options that would make him unique.

Though I think I'm really hype for whatever characterization they would give him. I really liked seeing how expressive all the fighters were in Ultimate, so I hope that if they add him, they give him his own sort of personality as well, especially since there are scattered, somewhat obscure materials out there that show that Itoi did have something in mind for Ninten that, at least in my opinion, really sets him apart in terms of personality from the other protagonists.

A taunt involving him needing his inhaler would be a given, or at least it should be.
honestly at this point i vehemently despise the idea of porky or another mother 3 rep getting in, mostly because of people forcing down my throat that "porky is a 100% lock to be dlc it's FACT GET READY" no he isn't. i don't think ninten will get in either, but i sure as hell would take ninten over porky's fat ass literally any day of my entire life.

maybe it's pent up anger from being harassed by mother 3 elitists for years because i dare to like earthbound beginnings the best out of the franchise and dare to find flaws in "god's perfect game from heaven that is mother 3". most of these people that only want more m3 reps in and ignore mother 1 are probably those same people who say mother 1 is a horrible game because they suck at it. "mother 3 should get another rep because its more liked" that line of reasoning is complete bull, shut your mouth, mother 1 needs a rep for fair representation of the series. it's a trilogy, not a duology.

/late night rant over
 

TheBeastHimself

No time for tea, uncle, gotta capture the Avatar!
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honestly at this point i vehemently despise the idea of porky or another mother 3 rep getting in, mostly because of people forcing down my throat that "porky is a 100% lock to be dlc it's FACT GET READY" no he isn't. i don't think ninten will get in either, but i sure as hell would take ninten over porky's fat *** literally any day of my entire life.

maybe it's pent up anger from being harassed by mother 3 elitists for years because i dare to like earthbound beginnings the best out of the franchise and dare to find flaws in "god's perfect game from heaven that is mother 3". most of these people that only want more m3 reps in and ignore mother 1 are probably those same people who say mother 1 is a horrible game because they suck at it. "mother 3 should get another rep because its more liked" that line of reasoning is complete bull, shut your mouth, mother 1 needs a rep for fair representation of the series. it's a trilogy, not a duology.

/late night rant over
I can understand where you're coming from. From what I have observed, it seems that EarthBound would be 50% of the fanbase's favorite game, Mother 3 would be 40% of the fanbase's favorite game, and EarthBound Beginnings would be 10% of the fanbase's favorite game. Not sure if I worded that correctly so that it makes sense, but that's what I've seen at least. I'm sure for most RPG franchises that started out on the NES, the original versions would be leaning towards least popular in their respective fanbases. It makes sense that fans of EarthBound and Mother 3 would try to sway Mother 1 fans to their side because logically, sequels are supposed to bring improvements and a higher quality. Though, it's not fair for people to be acting rude towards other for preferring a certain game in a series. Opinions are just opinions, and at the end of the day everyone's opinions about anything are completely meaningless in the grand scheme of things, so I don't really see why it's worth the effort to attack others over them.

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Now that we're on the topic of Mother and this is a Ninten thread, I want to give my overall thoughts on EarthBound Beginnings because I don't think I really have here:

Like a good portion of people, Mother was the last game I completed in the series. It also happens to be my least favorite game in the series. I'm not sure if it's because I played its sequels first so there's some sort of bias thing-a-ma-jig going on, but let me elaborate on my thoughts. I know that for a lot of people, graphics are meaningless when compared to gameplay, but for me, graphics mean a lot. They allow you to immerse yourself into the world of whatever game you are playing, and factors such as lighting and imagery can invoke emotions in players when utilized properly. That's why it's important to me; I enjoy immersing myself inside of the game. And for Mother, it's hard for me to do that since the graphics are rather... basic. The one thing it does accomplish is getting its basic point across, albeit in a very simple way. It's not the game's fault or anyone involved on the project, it's just because it was produced for a low-powered console with limited gadgets and gizmos to work with.

But let's dive more into the meat and potatoes: gameplay. Because it's an RPG, the central focus of the gameplay should be around battling. Similar to the overworld, the battle graphics when using attacks and PSI is basic. PSI is just a flashing color on the screen and nothing more. And the background is dull and uninteresting because it's just black no matter who you're fighting. If you look at another JRPG on the NES, Final Fantasy, at least they did something to spruce up the battle backgrounds:



Combat, however, can be a lot of fun when you're equally matched with your opponent. I always appreciated that Mother stuck with the original JRPG formula and didn't include a rolling HP counter, because receiving immediate damage is what always keeps you on your toes and makes battling a lot more exciting. However, battling is also a double-edged sword in my eyes. EarthBound and Mother 3 are a walk in the park compared to the tough and sometimes cruel opponents you come across in Mother. In some ways, this could be fun because the game presents more of a challenge when compared to the other games in the series. But at the same time, enemies can just be unfair. Especially at the beginning. While certainly not impossible, it's rather unfair to be fighting such tough enemies when you're just leaving your house at Lvl. 1/2.

Besides that, the overall world of Mother just didn't draw me in the way EarthBound and Mother 3 did. I'm trying my best not to compare Mother to its sequels, but the basic nature of the game carries over once again to its world and characters. I know that a lot of the main characters like Ninten, Ana, Loid, Teddy, George, Maria, and Giygas are expanded upon in outside sources, but I feel that they should have been expanded upon in the game itself, the primary and main source. Ninten has a single line, Ana has a couple, and Loid has quite a few. They don't tell us that much about the characters besides minimal surface level stuff, and it always bothered me that Loid never really had a motive to join Ninten at all. Ninten was naturally gifted with PSI and destined to defeat Giygas, Ana wanted to save her abducted parents, Teddy wanted to avenge his parents, but Loid is just kinda like "oh cool you gave me a rocket now I'm gonna help you blow up the boulder blocking the train tracks and then silently follow you".

One last little nitpick, I don't like how you get Loid and Ana at Lvl. 1 and you have to go through battle after battle in Magicant just to get them up to speed with the rest of the party. It's fun for a little but gets boring for me quick.
 
D

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I think I will give my opinions about Mother 1 too.

I started the series with Earthbound, then played Mother 1, then Mother 3. I love all 3 games very much.

A lot of people don't like Mother 1 because of the battle system, the graphics, not being able to see your enemies, and having to grind a lot. While this does make the game hard, it makes the game what it is, what you distinctly remember it by, and I love it for that.

The characters are something I love about the game too. Some people see Ninten as an RPG protag in a blank state, but he has personality, something all 3 Mother protags have. Ness is the happy one, Lucas is the sad one, and Ninten is the angry, determined, go-for-it kid. The characters remind you of Charlie Brown. I don't know about ya'll, but I rarely get the feeling of a video game reminding me of a movie or TV show. It's something I love about Mother 1.

The grinding is something a lot of people don't like about the game, but I like it because it's one of the ways I remember the game from the first time I experienced it. And, while it can be tedious, it can be fun imo.

Ana, Loid, and Teddy all have different attributes and attitudes. Ana is the careful and kind, but, at the same time, willing to help her friends take on evil with her PSI powers. Loid is a kid in elementary school who gets bullied, but uses him smarts to help his friends on his journey. Teddy is the tough dude who needs to avenge his parents. He has a purpose. Gieugue is the inspiration for Mewtwo. He is as an infant, but grows to become stronger throughout the first 2 games of the Mother series. He goes to war with humans, but has a soft spot for some of the people he is going up against.

I love Mother 1 and the Mother series as a whole, and I want to see Ninten as DLC in Super Smash Bros Ultimate.
 
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The Anigriffin

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Gonna be honest, the only reason why Mother 1 is the least favorite is because it's an NES game. Of course the sequels are going to be more expansive. That's like comparing Ocarina of Time to the NES Zelda. Not a fair comparison.

Also I firmly believe that if Mother 1 was remade in the style of Mother 3, I'd be the best game in the series. At least to me. The lore of this game is directly tied to the main protagonist and I love that **** so much. Everything feels so natural compared to EB at least.

Please remake EB0 I'd buy 6 copies.
 
D

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Guest
Gonna be honest, the only reason why Mother 1 is the least favorite is because it's an NES game. Of course the sequels are going to be more expansive. That's like comparing Ocarina of Time to the NES Zelda. Not a fair comparison.

Also I firmly believe that if Mother 1 was remade in the style of Mother 3, I'd be the best game in the series. At least to me. The lore of this game is directly tied to the main protagonist and I love that **** so much. Everything feels so natural compared to EB at least.

Please remake EB0 I'd buy 6 copies.
A remake of Mother 1 would fix the problems most people have with it. I like the things like the random battles, the battle system, and the grinding because that's how I love and remember Mother 1.

I would love a remake of it so much
 

FerrousFarron

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Gonna be honest, the only reason why Mother 1 is the least favorite is because it's an NES game. Of course the sequels are going to be more expansive. That's like comparing Ocarina of Time to the NES Zelda. Not a fair comparison.

Also I firmly believe that if Mother 1 was remade in the style of Mother 3, I'd be the best game in the series. At least to me. The lore of this game is directly tied to the main protagonist and I love that **** so much. Everything feels so natural compared to EB at least.

Please remake EB0 I'd buy 6 copies.
Mother 1 may not be my favorite title from the series, but I agree, kinda. I don't know what our odds of getting a remaster of that caliber would be, but I'd enjoy it just as much, if not more, than the original.

That being said though, I can't really pick a favorite between 2 and 3, though I suppose I have a bit of bias towards 2 because that's where I started, and I started there because I mained Ness from Melee and onward and had no idea who he was when I first started using him back then. So I guess, TL;DR, I have a nostalgia bias because of Ness, but that's besides the point here honestly

To be honest, while I would have liked more of the game's lore to have been...well, in the game itself, I liked that there was a lot of other extra bits of information you could pick up by digging for outside content, like that whole novel that was written for Mother 1 and overseen by Itoi, apparently. I think someone was in the process of translating that from Japanese to English years ago, but I don't think it was ever finished. But there are some excerpts translated, and it's enough that we have a bit more background knowledge on Ninten that just further differentiates him from Ness. There's quite a lot of interesting stuff you can find when you look around.
 
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The Anigriffin

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Messages
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And now LaxChris is going to make a video on how "Brave" is most definitely Sora because of the dataminer damage controlling.

I want to blow my brains out.
 

Mad Duck

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Mother 2 is my favorite but the first game comes very close,I love both of them so much. I love Mother 3 too,imo one of the best GBA RPGs but it's the one I like the least.
 

The Anigriffin

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: Deep breaths : Gonna try to ignore most of the new speculation as it’s clear to me that the Smash fandom just wants to be right and are now taking opinions from dataminers as gospel when that’s how the Style Savvy/Monster Hunter/Ninten and Kumatora were cut echos nonsense started up. I guess I’m just sorta giving up on convincing people otherwise is what I’m saying here.

I’ll still be here though if I have updates. Fandom is just giving me an anurism again.
 
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D

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Yeah, speculation can be pretty annoying.

We should stay positive about Ninten though :)
 

FLGibsonIII

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: Deep breaths : Gonna try to ignore most of the new speculation as it’s clear to me that the Smash fandom just wants to be right and are now taking opinions from dataminers as gospel when that’s how the Style Savvy/Monster Hunter/Ninten and Kumatora were cut echos nonsense started up. I guess I’m just sorta giving up on convincing people otherwise is what I’m saying here.

I’ll still be here though if I have updates. Fandom is just giving me an anurism again.
One of the data miners have been proven to be flat out using the wrong numbers. I think it's clear to anyone without bias that the actual stats in the code allow for ninten. Height 100% matters now.
 

FLGibsonIII

Smash Journeyman
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Nov 29, 2018
Messages
237
Yeah, it is anywhere from the height of Lucas and ness to a smidge smaller than Mario. Its honestly the perfect range from ninten since he should be slightly taller than ness from what I know.
 
D

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Yeah, it is anywhere from the height of Lucas and ness to a smidge smaller than Mario. Its honestly the perfect range from ninten since he should be slightly taller than ness from what I know.
Really? I think Ninten and Ness are about the same height

Yes, a smidge shorter than Mario is as tall as Ness and Lucas
 
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Mad Duck

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Really? I think Ninten and Ness are about the same height

Yes, a smidge shorter than Mario is as tall as Ness and Lucas
According to the Encyclopedia Mother Ninten is 152 cm tall,I think there is no official height for Ness so I guess they might have around the same height,maybe Ness a little bit taller? He is one year older though and maybe some growth spurt kicked in
 

FLGibsonIII

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Messages
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According to the Encyclopedia Mother Ninten is 152 cm tall,I think there is no official height for Ness so I guess they might have around the same height,maybe Ness a little bit taller? He is one year older though and maybe some growth spurt kicked in
I found that height for ninten but couldn't find one for ness as well. Some people said ness was 5 feet tall as well on reddit which is equal to ninten, but I didn't see evidence backing it up. I think I thought ninten was taller because of the 3d models I saw of ninten. Regardless, I would guess ninten and ness are the same height.
 

The Anigriffin

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Looks like no matter which way you slice it, Ninten fits the height category and well as the others.Hell, Ness and Lucas are around the same height in SSBU so even if Ninten is a smidge taller or shorter I don't think it's going to be extremely important especially considering Olimar is canonically an inch tall. I think they'd make him around the same height to give a sense of unity between the three. Either way. He still fits the stats.

In other news I had a realization that hit me like a ****ing truck.

The Flying Men are representative of bravery and courage correct?
 
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D

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Looks like no matter which way you slice it, Ninten fits the height category and well as the others.Hell, Ness and Lucas are around the same height in SSBU so even if Ninten is a smidge taller or shorter I don't think it's going to be extremely important especially considering Olimar is canonically an inch tall. I think they'd make him around the same height to give a sense of unity between the three. Either way. He still fits the stats.

In other news I had a realization that hit me like a ****ing truck.

The Flying Men are representative of bravery and courage correct?
I think so
 

The Anigriffin

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>Mii costume for Smash 4
>Spirit order confirms him as a Flying Man from EB0
>Spirit battle has all five protecting a Ness (In this case it's probably a Ninten)
>Symbolizes courage and bravery

...Welp...

Yes,they represent Ninten or Ness' courage.
Also when you check a FM grave in EBB it says this:
'To [Ninten's] horror and dismay, the brave soldier Flying Man rests here'
Thank you for telling me this, as I hate having the Flying Men die since they're my fave NPCs. So I never killed any in EB0.
 
D

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Guest
Both pretty sure.
.....

.....I don't know what to think anymore either..........................................................................................................................................................................
 

The Anigriffin

Smash Lord
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.....

.....I don't know what to think anymore either..........................................................................................................................................................................
It is a Mother 1 Flying Man in Ultimate/Smash 4 though. So if he's referencing a character, it's gotta be Ninten.

Everything cycles back to the music and the Flying Man I swear to god.
 

Mad Duck

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Man,now I want them to announce who the frick is Brave. Sorry if this sounds pessimistic but I won't get my hopes up unless I see Ninten with my own eyes. But that thing with the height annoys me,it can't be a DQ Hero because they are not short (one is,but I doubt they include him)
The only one who might fit the stipulated height (a bit shorter than Mario) is the DQ7 Hero,he is the one at the front in this pic. But I doubt it's him,he is not as relevant as other heroes.

This is getting interesting,I don't know what to think.
 
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The Anigriffin

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Praying for a February direct. I really don't expect a January direct anymore at this point. Maybe Brave/Hero will get announced around when PP gets announced? Lucas did get announced before Mewtwo was technically released so I dunno.

Basically just the waiting game now.


If Ninten is in I get bragging rights.
 

FerrousFarron

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Actually, if we're getting Ninten as DLC, I'm not really expecting him in the next announcement. Not that I wouldn't be hype if that happened, but I'd be more expecting him to be announced sometime in or near July, once the 30th anniversary rolls around.

Unless they just go ahead and announce the DLC we'll be getting and when, that is. This is just me assuming they plan to announce DLC one at a time.
 
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D

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Praying for a February direct. I really don't expect a January direct anymore at this point. Maybe Brave/Hero will get announced around when PP gets announced? Lucas did get announced before Mewtwo was technically released so I dunno.

Basically just the waiting game now.


If Ninten is in I get bragging rights.
You aren't alone. I need the brave reveal and if Ninten is in I'm going to brag too lol

Actually, if we're getting Ninten as DLC, I'm not really expecting him in the next announcement. Not that I wouldn't be hype if that happened, but I'd be more expecting him to be announced sometime in or near July, once the 30th anniversary rolls around.

Unless they just go ahead and announce the DLC we'll be getting and when, that is. This is just me assuming they plan to announce DLC one at a time.
I'm thinking that or he will be announced, and then ready to play by July
 
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