Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[NintenRob]

Close enough. Welcome back, Zeku Streetfighter.


Okay, now talk about what he's been up to in Dread.

He started a modelling career and started posing for photos

 

[fogbadge]

New item idea: Glow Seed. pick one up throw it at a foe upon impact it will turn into Glow Pikmin who will latch on and attack

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

New item idea: Glow Seed. pick one up throw it at a foe upon impact it will turn into Glow Pikmin who will latch on and attack

Now everyone can play like Olimar.

 

[fogbadge]

Now everyone can play like Olimar.

just like how the fire flower lets everyone play bowser

 

[SPEN18]

On that note, there's nothing stopping them from making any Pikmin type an item. They just spawn in the ground and picking them up plucks them out; you carry them like any other item and then press the button again to throw. Olimar's still the only one who can have multiple Pikmin ready to throw at once, can spawn them any time he wants, can call them back, etc.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

New item idea: Glow Seed. pick one up throw it at a foe upon impact it will turn into Glow Pikmin who will latch on and attack

it could also be used when the Pikmin 4 Protagonist joins with Oatchi although that’s a boring answer.

 

[CosmicEternity44]

Here is something I wish to say...

In terms of popular characters, I wonder, while it is not wrong inherently to root for such characters to get into a Smash Bros. game, is it wrong to cast less popular (but not necessarily hated) characters aside in favor of the popular characters and go as far as to pick on those who want characters that are not popular? I mean, even the less popular characters, like say Wart from Super Mario Bros. 2 USA and Captain Syrup from Wario Land, could make good characters, which not everyone knows. Those two are just examples, of course, but I feel that not many who don't know who such characters are realize their potential, and those people who want more popular characters and pick on others who want the less popular ones are not being good sports and are not being friendly and are just mean, especially when such characters could play in interesting ways, probably more so than the popular characters themselves. There may be popular picks, but not every character has to be popular to be in Smash and work well.

I posted this on the last page, but had no response. If this makes any sense, would anyone be willing to give any thoughts on this?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Fire Emblem Engage was added to the Nintendo Music app this week.

 

[ninjahmos]

I really want the next game to feel…different. I want there to be a lot of clear differences and little to no similarities to previous games. Not only do I want there to be cel-shaded graphics, but I also don't wanna hear anymore orchestral music. I think orchestral scores have run their course for Smash. I keep saying this, but I think the music direction for the next game should switch to rock and jazz-funk/fusion.

 

[CosmicEternity44]

I really want the next game to feel…different. I want there to be a lot of clear differences and little to no similarities to previous games. Not only do I want there to be cel-shaded graphics, but I also don't wanna hear anymore orchestral music. I think orchestral scores have run their course for Smash. I keep saying this, but I think the music direction for the next game should switch to rock and jazz-funk/fusion.

No orchestra scores? That sounds good to me. I don’t mind them but I am more so up for something new.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Fire Emblem Engage was added to the Nintendo Music app this week.

Alongside this, Sacred Stones is also getting added to GBA NSO.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I really want the next game to feel…different. I want there to be a lot of clear differences and little to no similarities to previous games. Not only do I want there to be cel-shaded graphics, but I also don't wanna hear anymore orchestral music. I think orchestral scores have run their course for Smash. I keep saying this, but I think the music direction for the next game should switch to rock and jazz-funk/fusion.

I mostly agree but I also don't think orchestra should be completely ditched.

It's nice to see some songs just go completely out of whatever the game's direction is. It makes them feel fresh. So having a rare orchestral song would only benefit the game.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

New item idea: Glow Seed. pick one up throw it at a foe upon impact it will turn into Glow Pikmin who will latch on and attack

For some reason I thought this was going to be a Pokémon Mystery Dungeon item.

I mostly agree but I also don't think orchestra should be completely ditched.

It's nice to see some songs just go completely out of whatever the game's direction is. It makes them feel fresh. So having a rare orchestral song would only benefit the game.

I'm assuming they mean the Smash original tracks. Otherwise we'd have to get rid of most, if not all of Fire Emblem and Xenoblade Chronicles's music, which would be a crime.

 

[ninjahmos]

I mostly agree but I also don't think orchestra should be completely ditched.

It's nice to see some songs just go completely out of whatever the game's direction is. It makes them feel fresh. So having a rare orchestral song would only benefit the game.

Yeah, you're right. A stage like Final Destination (or even a stage based on an RPG like Fire Emblem or Xenoblade) probably wouldn't feel right without orchestral music.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I'm assuming they mean the Smash original tracks. Otherwise we'd have to get rid of most, if not all of Fire Emblem and Xenoblade Chronicles's music, which would be a crime.

I figured it was a mix of original tracks and remixes because yeah, removing that much and the few Mario Galaxy songs we have would be insane.

Not to mention nearly every Smash original track outside of the ones from Smash 64. New game getting FD but none of the previous FD songs as options would feel wrong.

Yeah, you're right. A stage like Final Destination (or even a stage based on an RPG like Fire Emblem or Xenoblade) probably wouldn't feel right without orchestral music.

I do agree leaning into jazz, rock or ideally both would give a fresher feel overall. I just think orchestral can't be fully ditched.

With that said, Smash 4 did have a fully rock version of Final Destination and it slapped. The orchestral version still is the one that feels the most "right", if that make sense, but the idea of a rock remix as an option was still cool.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Yeah, you're right. A stage like Final Destination (or even a stage based on an RPG like Fire Emblem or Xenoblade) probably wouldn't feel right without orchestral music.

For Final Destination, it kind of depends on the stage's vibe and execution. Neither Super Smash Bros. or Super Smash Bros. Melee have orchestral Final Destination tracks.

Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds/Wii U had a rock version of it's Final Destination theme. It's...kinda bad, but the vibe is at least there. It can work.

 

[ninjahmos]

For Final Destination, it kind of depends on the stage's vibe and execution. Neither Super Smash Bros. or Super Smash Bros. Melee have orchestral Final Destination tracks.

Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds/Wii U had a rock version of it's Final Destination theme. It's...kinda bad, but the vibe is at least there. It can work.

I mean, Melee's Final Destination theme was kind of orchestral. It was just a remix of the Smash 64 Credits theme.

I don't really remember what Smash 4's rock version of its Final Destination theme sounds like though. I may have to go back and listen to it again.

EDIT: I just listened to Smash 4's Final Destination Ver. 2, and I think it sets a pretty good example of what I wanna hear for a majority of Smash's original music and remixes.

 

[Dukefire]

Alongside this, Sacred Stones is also getting added to GBA NSO.

The memories of playing that game thanks to 3ds ambassador promo. Now, I can play it on the switch

 

[DarthEnderX]

I really want the next game to feel…different.

I don't.

More of the same with some slight tweaks please.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I dunno. Smash is smash. There’s really nothing else like it on the market as much as other people have tried. Changing it dramatically would feel like a big loss of a key player in a genre of its own.

 

[Dukefire]

I dunno. Smash is smash. There’s really nothing else like it on the market as much as other people have tried. Changing it dramatically would feel like a big loss of a key player in a genre of its own.

Honestly, some people did treat smash bros's next character reveals as an all or nothing mentality. It did cause potential crash out after certain amount of reveals.

Don't get me wrong, predictions are fun. Just try not to get too invested.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I dunno. Smash is smash. There’s really nothing else like it on the market as much as other people have tried. Changing it dramatically would feel like a big loss of a key player in a genre of its own.

But if they just stick to the same ol' schtick, that might also risk making it fall apart because "why would I play this game with a smaller roster when I can also play Ultimate on the same console?"

The next Smash does need some shakeups to justify however many cuts it'll get from Ultimate when it's gonna be on a console where Ultimate is also playable. It should still be the same game at its core, yes, but I don't think it can get away with just being Ultimate II in terms of gameplay because no matter how much they polish that game's gameplay for the next one, it'll still feel like "Ultimate but worse" to most people solely because of the cuts.

Just look at Mario Kart. It's still the same at its core but it's got a lot of stuff added which gives it different vibes than Mario Kart 8 like the wall riding or changing underwater driving for boat time. That's what I think Smash should aim for. As an example, maybe instead of air dodges, we get air dashes which lack the invinciblity but can really up the offense?

 

[Thegameandwatch]

That's what I think Smash should aim for. As an example, maybe instead of air dodges, we get air dashes which lack the invinciblity but can really up the offense?

Maybe a new type of move since there hasn’t been a universal new type of move since Brawl’s Final Smashes.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Don't Change:

• Ring-Out System
  • % Damage Instead of Health
• Items that Create Chaotic Scenarios
• Simple Control Scheme
• Wacky Stages

Other than that, the only thing I'd avoid is making the game play like any of the other platform fighters out there. So making systems that are too similar to Nickelodeon All Star Brawl 2's Slime Meter, or Fraymakers's Assist mechanic is a no go, but with a good imagination you can do pretty much anything to spice things up.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Well I beat Bravely Default. Good game though it had some frustrating parts.

That aside Nintendo seems to really like the IP. They've had two games on 3DS, they helped advertise the Switch game and now a remake of the first one is going to be a launch title for the Switch 2. Nintendo seems heavily invested in the IP.

Do you think it may be considered for Smash?

 

[superprincess]

I'd say Mario Kart World proves Nintendo is working hard to showcase how their flagship franchises can evolve past the Nintendo Switch. World may not have close to 100 racetracks like 8 Deluxe did, but the stunning open world that you can freely explore, the missions and unlockables that encourage said exploration, and new mechanics such as rail grinding and wall riding offer a breath of fresh air to a series that needs it. The game might still have flaws, but I really like their approach here. Instead of doing more of the same old stuff or going full on scorched earth with it, they're trying to find a happy medium.

I think Smash will follow a similar trajectory. New art style, new mechanics to freshen up the gameplay experience, letting go of some long running series traditions, probably an ambitious new mode, and yes, the quantity of characters would have to take a hit to accommodate the truly new content. But I don't think anyone would mind if what is there offers a completely new experience that makes up for a slightly smaller roster.

 

[cashregister9]

Well I beat Bravely Default. Good game though it had some frustrating parts.

That aside Nintendo seems to really like the IP. They've had two games on 3DS, they helped advertise the Switch game and now a remake of the first one is going to be a launch title for the Switch 2. Nintendo seems heavily invested in the IP.

Do you think it may be considered for Smash?

I remember a time when Agnès was considered a shoe-in for Smash 4. I still think she'd be pretty cool, Edea and Magnolia would be other cool options.

I have no opinion on Bravely Default 2 because I never played it and I don't know anyone who did.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

I think Smash will follow a similar trajectory. New art style, new mechanics to freshen up the gameplay experience, letting go of some long running series traditions, probably an ambitious new mode, and yes, the quantity of characters would have to take a hit to accommodate the truly new content. But I don't think anyone would mind if what is there offers a completely new experience that makes up for a slightly smaller roster.

Bolded part is untrue. People are absolutely gonna mind any and all content loss.

The goal is to make the new content enticing enough for people to get the game despite the fact that they're upset with cuts.

Even if the new content "makes up for the losses", people could still be upset about said losses. Especially since the idea of "does it make up for what's lost?" is an entirely subjective question. Like, if you're a very avid supporter of EIH2, then any cut is not worth any content, for example.

 

[fogbadge]

Well I beat Bravely Default. Good game though it had some frustrating parts.

That aside Nintendo seems to really like the IP. They've had two games on 3DS, they helped advertise the Switch game and now a remake of the first one is going to be a launch title for the Switch 2. Nintendo seems heavily invested in the IP.

Do you think it may be considered for Smash?

it’s always possible but my instinct is they may go for other SE franchises instead

 

[Thegameandwatch]

it’s always possible but my instinct is they may go for other SE franchises instead

I always assumed it would have been either Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest (very popular in Japan) if it’s about which SE IP will join first before the announcement of Cloud.

The ones mentioned by the community or at least here back then were generally Sora, Black Mage and Geno.

 

[ninjahmos]

Quoting myself from another thread:

I think Smash could also use some more rhythm game representation (Rhythm Heaven, Dance Dance Revolution, Beatmania, GuitarFreaks & DrumMania, PaRappa the Rapper, etc.)

 

[DarthEnderX]

But if they just stick to the same ol' schtick, that might also risk making it fall apart because "why would I play this game with a smaller roster when I can also play Ultimate on the same console?"

Well there's a simple solution for that. Don't make the roster smaller.

Well I beat Bravely Default.

You get the real ending?

Good game though it had some frustrating parts.

Love the Job system and music. Dislike the art style. I think what they do with the late-game is...lazy, but interesting.

World may not have close to 100 racetracks like 8 Deluxe did, but the stunning open world that you can freely explore, the missions and unlockables that encourage said exploration

Which will probably be less fun than having 100 racetracks.

and new mechanics such as rail grinding and wall riding offer a breath of fresh air to a series that needs it.

This at least seems really cool. New methods of traversal is always welcome.

I'm not sure how I feel about losing underwater driving for boating...

But I don't think anyone would mind if what is there offers a completely new experience that makes up for a slightly smaller roster.

I have no opinion on Bravely Default 2 because I never played it and I don't know anyone who did.

I did. It's still good. Basically just more Default and Second.

it’s always possible but my instinct is they may go for other SE franchises instead

Nier seems like the one SE would most want to push after FF, DQ and KH.

 

[Will]

Well I beat Bravely Default. Good game though it had some frustrating parts.

That aside Nintendo seems to really like the IP. They've had two games on 3DS, they helped advertise the Switch game and now a remake of the first one is going to be a launch title for the Switch 2. Nintendo seems heavily invested in the IP.

Do you think it may be considered for Smash?

I talked about Tiz a handful of times during Ultimate’s speculation. I like the charm of the games, not sure if the rest of the gaming world has a palette for RPG McGuy.

You could switch it up and use Agnes, but we’d be missing Tiz’s peak second game design.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Quoting myself from another thread:

I mentioned once making Don-Chan from Taiko drum master an assist and i still think that would be neat.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Dislike the art style.

Yeah I think optimizing for the 3Ds kinda killed the game's artstyle. It's not ugly, but it looks like Chibi Fire Emblem Awakening, which is known for being a little wonky, especially given that no one has feet.

This at least seems really cool. New methods of traversal is always welcome.

I'm not sure how I feel about losing underwater driving for boating...

The rail grinding is funny because it doesn't look all that special because they're doing a terrible job of showing it off. It wasn't until they showed a clip of Birdo chaining rail grinding into wall driving into another rail grind into what could have been a continuation of that top route in Salty Salty Speedway that I saw the vision.


The boating looks about as OK as underwater driving was, but it does seem to come at the cost of tracks that relied on the latter mechanic. Wario's Shipyard looks like it was gutted. People seem to have positive opinions about it anyway so maybe my opinion about it will change, but it will definitely present a challenge with some Mario Kart 7 and 8 courses.

EDIT: For example, I can't really see tracks like Cheep Cheep Lagoon or Water Park working at all in the current engine since what's underwater is the only thing making them mildly interesting.

 

[Will]

Quoting myself from another thread:

Breakdancing Bowser Final Smash

 

[DarthEnderX]

Yeah I think optimizing for the 3Ds kinda killed the game's artstyle. It's not ugly, but it looks like Chibi Fire Emblem Awakening, which is known for being a little wonky, especially given that no one has feet.

BD2 uses the same art style though, despite being made for Switch/PC.

The rail grinding is funny because it doesn't look all that special because they're doing a terrible job of showing it off. It wasn't until they showed a clip of Birdo chaining rail grinding into wall driving into another rail grind into what could have been a continuation of that top route in Salty Salty Speedway that I saw the vision.

I saw potential immediately, because I thought, "Oh, instead of bouncing off a wall when I don't quite make a turn, I can wallride it, or hop on top and grind on it, depending on how high it is."

The boating looks about as OK as underwater driving was

Mechanically perhaps. But visually, going underwater was way more interesting.

 

[Will]

Yeah I think optimizing for the 3Ds kinda killed the game's artstyle. It's not ugly, but it looks like Chibi Fire Emblem Awakening, which is known for being a little wonky, especially given that no one has feet.

People who are new to Bravely probably don’t know that the chibi models were hardware-limited versions of more lifelike proportions shown in the 2D art style and 3D CG cutscenes from the original duology

It isn’t like the Fire Emblem Awakening and Fates characters in Smash are forced to be their chibi 3DS model variants.

Sometimes I think the Bravely development team forgot about it being a limitation rather than an intentional design choice as they moved on to Switch games

 

[DarthEnderX]

Bravely Default's art style just looks like Final Fantasy Tactic's art style in 3D.

And I don't like FFT's art style. Because everyone looks like kids.

 

[AlRex]

I agree with the “Next Smash should be a fresher experience” sentiment, sorry. Ultimate feels stale, even if they did minorly tweak it and add other characters (there’s mods for that ) and I don’t really want Smash to go the “EA Sports/CoD but also over-bloated” route. Would help at least if there was more variety in what you can do, though. It’d be nice for folks to keep the roster, I guess, but there’s at least 15 characters on there I wouldn’t be particularly fussed about parting ways with, though that’s just me, and I acknowledge that’s not a majority opinion. EA Sports and Call of Duty games do sell, for one thing. I guess this is also the Brian Wilson VS Mike Love conundrum with The Beach Boys, in one particular aspect. Very odd comparison, I know.

I’d not even mind a roughly Brawl-size roster even but make them strong, distinctive choices, having varied gameplay modes, a more unique atmosphere, and offer a lot of customization options. Granted, I don’t think they will do that. Pokémon has the misfortune of being very stale and relatively amateur for a billion dollar series and also controversially cutting a lot, so I’m not sure I fully trust that we won’t get kind of a repetitive game either way.