Official Smash for Switch 2 - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Ivander]

If we get a Mario Party stage, I hope for either Space Land, Waluigi's Island or King Bom-omb's Mine.

 

[Louie G.]

If not a board, perhaps there's even a distinct minigame that could operate as a gimmick stage not unlike Gamer. I have no specific ideas in mind, but just another angle you could take when representing Mario Party. Sometimes the minigames transport you into distinct areas or strange obstacle courses so maybe there are a couple that are memorable or distinct enough to be worthwhile. Just kinda blanking right now.

 

[Deleted member]

If not a board, perhaps there's even a distinct minigame that could operate as a gimmick stage not unlike Gamer. I have no specific ideas in mind, but just another angle you could take when representing Mario Party. Sometimes the minigames transport you into distinct areas or strange obstacle courses so maybe there are a couple that are memorable or distinct enough to be worthwhile. Just kinda blanking right now.

I always though this minigame would make for a unique stage...

 

[Stratos]

I know I'm exaggerating, but in terms of the roster of video game characters I want as newcomers to the Super Smash Bros. series, I went from 90 to 120. But I know not all of them will come, and some will never come as newcomers. Besides, I made it more like this to pass the time. Here is the roster with these characters:
View attachment 391357

Regarding the roster I made, I can almost imagine what Kirby would look like if he took their forms, but there are a few forms of some of these characters that I have a bit of a hard time (not completely) imagining what Kirby would look like. Here are the following:

Unicycle
Laboman
Hornet
Ando Kensaku
Suezo
Sukapon
F-Type
Diskun

 

[Gorgonzales]

If not a board, perhaps there's even a distinct minigame that could operate as a gimmick stage not unlike Gamer. I have no specific ideas in mind, but just another angle you could take when representing Mario Party. Sometimes the minigames transport you into distinct areas or strange obstacle courses so maybe there are a couple that are memorable or distinct enough to be worthwhile. Just kinda blanking right now.

Oh if we ever got a minigame stage it'd undoubtedly be Booksquirm.

It's got it all; it's a very popular minigame, has intuitive and understandable rules, has a very unique setting, and would work perfectly in a platform fighter (since the only difference between Mario Party and Smash Bros in this case is that you're allowed to throw hands with the other players). Although in Smash I think a page flattening you would equate to you becoming buried, instead of instant death for obvious reasons. The book would need to be a lot taller too so the stage isn't a walkoff where you can simply stand out of the reach of the falling pages, lol.

 

[RodNutTakin]

Alright, I think I've laid out my prediction for the next game as of today. I only got two responses for what I had asked of you guys, but that's alright. I actually ended up having to go a bit over the base total that both respondees gave me, only because it was extremely tough to justifiably remove characters after a certain threshold, and my total for base game veterans ended up hovering around the character count SSB4 had post-DLC, which I feel is an acceptable benchmark veteran-wise for Smash installments going forward. Without further ado, here's the lists of veterans, newcomers, and echoes that I have laid out for my prediction for the next Smash installment.

Base game veterans (56 characters):

Spoiler

As a side note before I continue, I tend to not factor in the Mii Fighters in my predictions currently, as the jury's out on whether they'd still be important at all for the next system. Though I may go back and add them in, assuming backwards compatability is on the table for the next system.

Base game newcomers (12 characters):

Spoiler

Echo fighters (7 characters):

Spoiler

Now here's where things get tricky/interesting; the subject of DLC. My prediction is that there will be two types of DLC releases concerning characters: Challenger Packs, which are essentially like the ones in Ultimate, and individual characters, which are cheaper and handled more like some of the DLC releases in 4. This system is all going off the assumption that this next game will put a larger emphasis on post-launch content compared to past titles (I personally predict at least three Fighter's Passes worth of brand new characters at minimum.)

This system is mainly to address the unique situation of veterans returning as DLC. The latter category would specifically be targeted towards Nintendo's missing characters that miss the boat, but a few special cases would be in the former category for reasons that should be apparent when I list them off.

Characters that'd be sold as singular downloads (10 characters):

Spoiler

Challenger Packs (ordered by how confident I am of them out of everyone I've listed)

Spoiler

Feel free to give thoughts and feedback on my predictions here. I'm happy to explain my choices and decisions in as much detail as I can, if any of you wish to inquire. (also I may have made a goof up or two when posting this because this is a lot to double check so forgive me if any glaring oversights are present)

 

[NintenRob]

A Mario Party stage should be something like Wario Ware Inc, switches between multiple Mini games from throughout the series. So my vote for stage should be one of the side modes that focus on the MiniGames

 

[Deleted member]

I think we'll get a Ultimate Deluxe and not a Smash 6 at the end of the day because of fan demand of a Deluxe port.
But honestly speculating about Smash 6 is way more fun than speculating about a Deluxe port with an extra FP tbh, i was honestly already burned out of DLC speculation when Pyra/Mythra got released.
So yeah, basically, i think we'll get Ult Deluxe 99%, but a Smash 6 is more fun to talk about imo.

 

[DarthEnderX]

But honestly speculating about Smash 6 is way more fun than speculating about a Deluxe port with an extra FP tbh

What about a Deluxe port with an extra THREE FPs?

Gotta get to that 100th Fighter!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Spoiler: long

Ah, right, the Mario Party stage. I'd love that. There's a lot of neat locations that you could work with. Whether it's a traveling stage, or a gimmick based upon a level. Having one that minorly transforms(like Mario Party 3 does with its boards) is another way. Could even incorporate some of the various items, like teleport spots to where the Star would be(or even make those usual spots the spawn points for a character), etc.

 

[Borskaboska]

honestly id imagine a mario party stage working a lot like Clown Man's stage from MM8

 

[cashregister9]

I think they should add a Smash Version of Mario Party instead of a Mario Party stage.

Like some sort of "Smash Tour"

 

[superprincess]

I don't know how these deals work but isn't it feasible that they licensed characters for Ultimate & any rereleases of the Ultimate?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I don't know how these deals work but isn't it feasible that they licensed characters for Ultimate & any rereleases of the Ultimate?

It is. In fact, I'm willing to bet they did something similar for some of the Smash 4 vets. They probably worked on permissions for future titles for the DLC crew.

 

[superprincess]

It is. In fact, I'm willing to bet they did something similar for some of the Smash 4 vets. They probably worked on permissions for future titles for the DLC crew.

But Sakurai told us that re-licensing Cloud was difficult. I don't think there was much future proofing involved with the jump from SSB4 to Ultimate. And if there was, Squenix probably didn't accept.

Which would make Ult Deluxe with all the 3rd party characters an incredibly difficult feat.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I don't know how these deals work but isn't it feasible that they licensed characters for Ultimate & any rereleases of the Ultimate?

There's some context to how it can be done;

• A straight port that never changes is plausible. Because no other licensing is ever needed to be done. However, the chances this can work for any console are slim.
• Companies want to know details. If you can't tell them what console is next, they would be leery. It's a trust issue. You can't just give zero information to what you will do with their IP. That's the only way for true future releases to work. This is why a lot of games take forever to get a rerelease. Because companies aren't willing to pay to an unknown future early.

Basically, it's very important to know what's going to happen. Re-licensing anything for Ultimate worked because the Switch was already on its way.

Ultimate however doesn't work the same way; they couldn't do a future thing because no new console was already far enough in the works to do so. They could absolutely re-license it again(for a reasonably cheaper price) for a straight port with nothing but minor touchups, sure. But if it's a game with multiple new stuff, that means it's still new, so effectively would require a re-licensing.

As for Cloud, this is more that they could've feasibly gotten Cloud, Ryu, and Bayonetta for two games at once, but we absolutely know that the 3rd Party Mii Costumes couldn't have gone entirely the same way. It's possible they did license them for base game, but it changed. As they became DLC later on or never was going to be anything but DLC in the first place. Either way, this also means that licensing everything is much more difficult. See what I said way earlier on about how DLC is not planned for in the original project plan. Though do keep in mind this applies to paid DLC. Brawl was planned with it at some point via Stage Creator stuff(I don't remember any other kind of DLC), and 4 did not have any to start with(Mewtwo became paid later on instead of free if you buy both games).

Basically, even if they did pay to port it over, it would've been during the Pass 2 phase at best. Not when the base game originally happened. They couldn't have paid for the DLC characters yet, as there's essentially 4 or more licensing instances;

• Everything in the base game(which could've happened during 4's final DLC phase too)
• Pass 1
• Pass 2
• Sora

Special note to DLC Mii Costumes. We don't know how they were licensed at all. Also, apparently many characters were licensed at different time periods too, but for the purpose, that's mainly what we need in terms of time periods. Sora nearly didn't make it in outside of luck in that case, hence why he's separate. And as I said, the Mii Costumes aren't clear on anything at all. This isn't even thinking about Spirits, but they're often tied to the franchise or company that got in for a Spirit Board, so that one's actually very likely to be the case. Likewise, a few Costumes are directly based upon the DLC characters' related stuff, so those likely were part of the same deal.

You could go further on and probably map it out a lot better than this quick one, but yeah, licensing's a jerk. Especially when the Mii Costumes have shown to be treated so far as DLC only, which puts more wrenches into easy stuff. That said, if Smash Ultimate Deluxe was a thing but they deliberately will have zero DLC beyond balance patches(no, it's not realistic), that's the only likely case all the 3rd party Mii costumes would return outside of DLC. If that was the case, the port would be definitely be a bit more expensive. Normally, 70, but they could easily justify it being closer to 80 at that point. That way they get at least a reasonable amount of return for the re-licensing of a lot of content.

Last thing to note is that if a sequel was started not that long ago, it was likely during Pass 2. I said it in a previous message, but Steve, Sephiroth, and Sora might already be licensed for the next game as is for a bit cheaper, since it was a close enough development. Everybody else, no. Depending the total costs would also determine how much a deluxe port's main game would cost. 60 is off the table due to the immense amount of re-licensing some will, but 70 isn't too hard to believe if the deals were cheap enough. 80 is a more expected price otherwise, if only since it covers the costs better and there's enough content already there where the price isn't outright atrocious. As for a new Smash game, 70 is a pretty reasonable price on its own.

(And yes, I remember Cloud being hard to get, but it also might be because of stuff like licensing for two games as is, some Spirits, and of course, the music overall. SE in particular divides royalties up, so Cloud would've been hard to license for one or two games. It may just refer to that, and not in particular about Ultimate alone).

 

[DarthEnderX]

I don't know how these deals work but isn't it feasible that they licensed characters for Ultimate & any rereleases of the Ultimate?

If Nintendo had enough foresight, then certainly. But I'm sure that would cost extra. And the question is if Nintendo would be willing to shell out extra, unless they already knew they'd be rereleasing the game.

Which would be interesting, considering they've never rereleased a Smash game before. Smash 64 still isn't even on NSO.

 

[fogbadge]

is there much fan demand for a port of ultimate?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

is there much fan demand for a port of ultimate?

Not really. It's actually a very small set, since it's more of an Echo Chamber at best. It's actually more common to expect a new game.

You can see it mainly from some of the hardcore fanbase(which Smash caters to casuals mainly), so. It's the same kind of thing as when people talk about "extreme character changes". Same kind of fans mainly. That said, they don't entirely overlap. It's just mostly seen from that kind of fanbase, not so much that you will see it on every fan. I'm a hardcore fan, but I sure as hell don't want either.

Casuals generally are just referred to people who don't care about that stuff and just want fun options. Some will of course not like a decision, either.

 

[fogbadge]

Not really. It's actually a very small set, since it's more of an Echo Chamber at best. It's actually more common to expect a new game.

You can see it mainly from some of the hardcore fanbase(which Smash caters to casuals mainly), so. It's the same kind of thing as when people talk about "extreme character changes". Same kind of fans mainly. That said, they don't entirely overlap. It's just mostly seen from that kind of fanbase, not so much that you will see it on every fan. I'm a hardcore fan, but I sure as hell don't want either.

Casuals generally are just referred to people who don't care about that stuff and just want fun options. Some will of course not like a decision, either.

I thought there didn’t seem to be much. Sure the idea comes up a lot but most of us seem down on it

 

[Diddy Kong]

So I discovered something after seeing trailer analyses of Zelda Echoes of Wisdom. Apparently this game has a battle ready Old Impa. This is very interesting cause Old Impa has never been shown to have any sort of fighting skills up to this point. It was only shown in her younger versions.

This kinda opens up a possibility for Old Impa to be included as a fighter now. As consistency was her biggest downfall as far as likelihood to be included in Smash.

Kinda cool. I myself always wanted a younger Impa in Smash but wouldn't be objected to an elder version either.

 

[fogbadge]

So I discovered something after seeing trailer analyses of Zelda Echoes of Wisdom. Apparently this game has a battle ready Old Impa. This is very interesting cause Old Impa has never been shown to have any sort of fighting skills up to this point. It was only shown in her younger versions.

This kinda opens up a possibility for Old Impa to be included as a fighter now. As consistency was her biggest downfall as far as likelihood to be included in Smash.

Kinda cool. I myself always wanted a younger Impa in Smash but wouldn't be objected to an elder version either.

it was always open it’s just no one wanted to entertain the idea

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

it was always open it’s just no one wanted to entertain the idea

I mean, besides me? I'm the Oracles Impa supporter, after all~

She ain't young in that one, that's for sure.

But this helps too~

 

[DarthEnderX]

is there much fan demand for a port of ultimate?

shrug Who knows. People who are for it will act as though they are legion. People who are against it will be all "vocal minority!"

There's no real way to be sure.

So I discovered something after seeing trailer analyses of Zelda Echoes of Wisdom. Apparently this game has a battle ready Old Impa. This is very interesting cause Old Impa has never been shown to have any sort of fighting skills up to this point. It was only shown in her younger versions.

I saw Impa doing ninja stuff in the trailer, but didn't realize it was an Old Impa. I just assumed it was, like, a Cadence of Hyrule-style Impa.

Some fun things from the trailer being pointed out in this video:

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

 

[Shinuto]

Spoiler: long

Ah, right, the Mario Party stage. I'd love that. There's a lot of neat locations that you could work with. Whether it's a traveling stage, or a gimmick based upon a level. Having one that minorly transforms(like Mario Party 3 does with its boards) is another way. Could even incorporate some of the various items, like teleport spots to where the Star would be(or even make those usual spots the spawn points for a character), etc.

Just do smash remix's pirate land.

 

[fogbadge]

I mean, besides me? I'm the Oracles Impa supporter, after all~

She ain't young in that one, that's for sure.

But this helps too~

and me

 

[Oracle Link]

BTW it would be really cool if we got Link, Zelda, Impa and ganon from the downfall timeline as seen in the opening of echoes of wisdom!
I dont know zelda rep in smash is always focused arround the adult/ 3d Versions of them would be nice to have their 2d selves for a change!
And i mean Champion link still be in the game!

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

and me

Probably less than the Quest 64 support(thusfar), but hey, it's a start~ :D

 

[Diddy Kong]

Oracles Impa is the edgy choice that never made much sense to me honestly. I always advocated heavily for young Impa cause she's shown to be battle ready and the only consistent side character in Zelda from beginning to even recent years. Now she's fighting as an old woman that gives her more consistency.

In general I was always quite vocal about Impa and Ganon being the most consistent Zelda characters in the franchise not in Smash yet, and this new game gives us both of them. I kinda hope the new Smash reflects this in the roster. Cutting Young Link and adding Impa and Ganon whilst revamping Zelda, Ganondorf and differentiating Link and Toon Link more seems a good idea.

 

[Oracle Link]

Oracles Impa is the edgy choice that never made much sense to me honestly. I always advocated heavily for young Impa cause she's shown to be battle ready and the only consistent side character in Zelda from beginning to even recent years. Now she's fighting as an old woman that gives her more consistency.

In general I was always quite vocal about Impa and Ganon being the most consistent Zelda characters in the franchise not in Smash yet, and this new game gives us both of them. I kinda hope the new Smash reflects this in the roster. Cutting Young Link and adding Impa and Ganon whilst revamping Zelda, Ganondorf and differentiating Link and Toon Link more seems a good idea.

I meant impa from echoes of wisdom! There shes a Ninja! But you can only see her for a couple of frames!
Although I do still like oracles impa but yeah my idea for impa is being a soft revamp of sheik Like The Moveset would feel pretty familiar!
While having a couple more refrences!

 

[Sucumbio]

If Twitter is any indication (it's at least broader than here lol) there is a sense that because Mario Kart did it Smash will to, that is, have a Deluxe edition and then add new DLC.

I still think this is folly. Sakurai and Bamco and Co. should not be expected to follow the same strategy as AC or Kart, not to mention the actual differences between Smash and Kart/AC as games. Add to this backwards compatibility and it really just doesn't make sense for Smash to be re-releasing Ultimate as a deluxe edition.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Oracles Impa also was shown to be the second Impa to clearly be capable of strength feats(as shown by the artwork, she's got very powerful muscles. If not the actual first one, as we don't really see much from OOT Impa either), isn't afraid to show skin either(which means she's proud of who she is. Something that's great in design. It didn't matter that she might be considered "ugly" by some dumb standard. She wore what she wore and all. Sadly this was censored outside of JP, but even then, she's a heroic heavyset woman, and that's awesome), and there's nothing to suggest she isn't capable of battle. She's still Zelda's Protector, so it's quite implied she knows how to fight. Nursemaid too, but that just means she can take care of herself. She even goes into disguise in Seasons to be able to keep an eye on Din. Also, her strength easily sends Link to the ground with a simple slap on the back, a cutscene within the game.

The cow throwing became quite a meme quickly due to her massive strength. As Impa is a recurring character, this also was the first one to be clearly rather old as well as showing more than enough muscle(meaning she's not out of shape either). Plus, artwork does imply she knows how to use it too. Calling it an "edgy" pick is also a bit unfair. People legitimately find her interesting. Even then, the meme isn't exactly that common anyway. It's a fairly lowkey one. People just like having an actual heavyset woman sometimes because it's a good representation of different bodyshapes. But also because she's an actually well-made version, for someone who plays little role in the plot itself, too. Remember, it's not till SS she has an actual decent-sized role beyond "giving Link some direction"(which wasn't till even the CD-i games that had her finally appear in-game, respectively).

To go back to an earlier point, dismissing what people like as some edgy or whatever thing is silly. Yes, people enjoy sillier things. What's wrong with that? Nobody said it was a likely design to ever be used(it won't be, but only because Impa's already not in a great spot, but also because newcomers tend to often use some of their most latest designs. It's sometimes veterans that change it up, but even then, it's pretty rare and Zelda is one of the few franchises to represent different eras as a choice, not simply because of when a character was introduced. Fire Emblem somewhat does this too, but that's because the characters don't span multiple games as legacy characters either).

As for Impa being a replacement of Sheik, besides that not being realistic at all, they're massively different outside of OOT, which, well, why would Impa be from that game? When she's gotten way more animations to use from other games. See what I said also above about her Oracles version. It's not that it's a bad game choice, it's just easier to pull from another game that cuts a lot of development time down. That's generally the best way to add a character. The way that's easiest. Of course, a popular design can also help, but it can also depend what version feels best for Sakurai(one has to dance in his mind, after all). And since HW is a specific spin-off(of which Koei Tecmo does own some of it), that's harder to go with anyway since it's extra unnecessary licensing. That, and Nintendo may not be okay with it either, as it makes sense they'd want a Zelda character to pull specifically from their created games. It's still their character being represented, and we do know how picky they can be. In fact, it applies to every company too. While some are far less worried about it, it's still a thing. It's fine to trust other companies with a design, but when you're trusting another company to be talked to for another person to design it? Basically it's a 3rd party going to a 3rd party instead of the 1st party for accurate representation. It's too hands-off. It makes sense why these things are also reduced to minor cameos(Spirits) or even Music. Because the company who owns the core IP has less good control over it. Yes, it sucks that HW wouldn't get much recognition due to this kind of stuff, but it's far better to not have any weird issues with the IP etc.

 

[Oracle Link]

Oracles Impa also was shown to be the second Impa to clearly be capable of strength feats(as shown by the artwork, she's got very powerful muscles. If not the actual first one, as we don't really see much from OOT Impa either), isn't afraid to show skin either(which means she's proud of who she is. Something that's great in design. It didn't matter that she might be considered "ugly" by some dumb standard. She wore what she wore and all. Sadly this was censored outside of JP, but even then, she's a heroic heavyset woman, and that's awesome), and there's nothing to suggest she isn't capable of battle. She's still Zelda's Protector, so it's quite implied she knows how to fight. Nursemaid too, but that just means she can take care of herself. She even goes into disguise in Seasons to be able to keep an eye on Din. Also, her strength easily sends Link to the ground with a simple slap on the back, a cutscene within the game.

The cow throwing became quite a meme quickly due to her massive strength. As Impa is a recurring character, this also was the first one to be clearly rather old as well as showing more than enough muscle(meaning she's not out of shape either). Plus, artwork does imply she knows how to use it too. Calling it an "edgy" pick is also a bit unfair. People legitimately find her interesting. Even then, the meme isn't exactly that common anyway. It's a fairly lowkey one. People just like having an actual heavyset woman sometimes because it's a good representation of different bodyshapes. But also because she's an actually well-made version, for someone who plays little role in the plot itself, too. Remember, it's not till SS she has an actual decent-sized role beyond "giving Link some direction"(which wasn't till even the CD-i games that had her finally appear in-game, respectively).

To go back to an earlier point, dismissing what people like as some edgy or whatever thing is silly. Yes, people enjoy sillier things. What's wrong with that? Nobody said it was a likely design to ever be used(it won't be, but only because Impa's already not in a great spot, but also because newcomers tend to often use some of their most latest designs. It's sometimes veterans that change it up, but even then, it's pretty rare and Zelda is one of the few franchises to represent different eras as a choice, not simply because of when a character was introduced. Fire Emblem somewhat does this too, but that's because the characters don't span multiple games as legacy characters either).

As for Impa being a replacement of Sheik, besides that not being realistic at all, they're massively different outside of OOT, which, well, why would Impa be from that game? When she's gotten way more animations to use from other games. See what I said also above about her Oracles version. It's not that it's a bad game choice, it's just easier to pull from another game that cuts a lot of development time down. That's generally the best way to add a character. The way that's easiest. Of course, a popular design can also help, but it can also depend what version feels best for Sakurai(one has to dance in his mind, after all). And since HW is a specific spin-off(of which Koei Tecmo does own some of it), that's harder to go with anyway since it's extra unnecessary licensing. That, and Nintendo may not be okay with it either, as it makes sense they'd want a Zelda character to pull specifically from their created games. It's still their character being represented, and we do know how picky they can be. In fact, it applies to every company too. While some are far less worried about it, it's still a thing. It's fine to trust other companies with a design, but when you're trusting another company to be talked to for another person to design it? Basically it's a 3rd party going to a 3rd party instead of the 1st party for accurate representation. It's too hands-off. It makes sense why these things are also reduced to minor cameos(Spirits) or even Music. Because the company who owns the core IP has less good control over it. Yes, it sucks that HW wouldn't get much recognition due to this kind of stuff, but it's far better to not have any weird issues with the IP etc.

I mean yeah oracles impa could be a fun and cool character!
I think she would fit very well in a zelda smash that way we also can have ninja impa!
I think she was fun in the manga! And decent in the games too! Obviously shes one of the few characters who isnt done that much justice in game!
Also if shes in a fighting game she could have a palette with blue skin ala Veran Possesion!
She also gives link the wooden sword which is neat!
(also you can sleep in her bed in seasons!)

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I mean yeah oracles impa could be a fun and cool character!
I think she would fit very well in a zelda smash that way we also can have ninja impa!
I think she was fun in the manga! And decent in the games too! Obviously shes one of the few characters who isnt done that much justice in game!
Also if shes in a fighting game she could have a palette with blue skin ala Veran Possesion!
She also gives link the wooden sword which is neat!
(also you can sleep in her bed in seasons!)

I mean, yeah, both work. I'm just saying overall that it's pointless to replace Sheik when both Impas in question are widely different.

But as I also noted, replacing movesets via a character never has actually happened. Toon Link took Young Link's role as a Child Link, but didn't actually take his moveset. This wouldn't happen to Sheik either. She's only been updated visually anyway.

But putting aside having 2 different versions of Impa(which is fine), I really do like her being in. She's a great character. The way I viewed her moveset is something of a combination of multiple games(albeit, this was before BOTW even existed. SS was her latest appearance in the canon games, but otherwise we had HW, which I somewhat took into account for certain moves among the specials). I never mapped it out, but it was for Smash 4 too, so it had customs.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

Everyone I know in real life who plays Smash a lot wants Ultimate 2, if not straight up an Ultimate port with more content.

Those who are not all that much into Smash would prefer more single player content. But they're not avid Smash players at all, so they'd just play through the single player stuff and then stop to engage with the game anyways...

 

[Perkilator]

Everyone I know in real life who plays Smash a lot wants Ultimate 2, if not straight up an Ultimate port with more content.

Those who are not all that much into Smash would prefer more single player content. But they're not avid Smash players at all, so they'd just play through the single player stuff and then stop to engage with the game anyways...

And then there’s me, who doesn’t care about the exact size of the roster as long as the characters are fun and there’s sufficient single player content.

 

[RileyXY1]

If Twitter is any indication (it's at least broader than here lol) there is a sense that because Mario Kart did it Smash will to, that is, have a Deluxe edition and then add new DLC.

I still think this is folly. Sakurai and Bamco and Co. should not be expected to follow the same strategy as AC or Kart, not to mention the actual differences between Smash and Kart/AC as games. Add to this backwards compatibility and it really just doesn't make sense for Smash to be re-releasing Ultimate as a deluxe edition.

Yeah. It just doesn't make sense for them to charge $70 for a game that most of the audience you're selling to already owns and can play on the current system through backwards compatibility.

 

[Lenidem]

Oracles Impa also was shown to be the second Impa to clearly be capable of strength feats(as shown by the artwork, she's got very powerful muscles. If not the actual first one, as we don't really see much from OOT Impa either), isn't afraid to show skin either(which means she's proud of who she is. Something that's great in design. It didn't matter that she might be considered "ugly" by some dumb standard. She wore what she wore and all. Sadly this was censored outside of JP, but even then, she's a heroic heavyset woman, and that's awesome), and there's nothing to suggest she isn't capable of battle. She's still Zelda's Protector, so it's quite implied she knows how to fight. Nursemaid too, but that just means she can take care of herself. She even goes into disguise in Seasons to be able to keep an eye on Din. Also, her strength easily sends Link to the ground with a simple slap on the back, a cutscene within the game.

The cow throwing became quite a meme quickly due to her massive strength. As Impa is a recurring character, this also was the first one to be clearly rather old as well as showing more than enough muscle(meaning she's not out of shape either). Plus, artwork does imply she knows how to use it too. Calling it an "edgy" pick is also a bit unfair. People legitimately find her interesting. Even then, the meme isn't exactly that common anyway. It's a fairly lowkey one. People just like having an actual heavyset woman sometimes because it's a good representation of different bodyshapes. But also because she's an actually well-made version, for someone who plays little role in the plot itself, too. Remember, it's not till SS she has an actual decent-sized role beyond "giving Link some direction"(which wasn't till even the CD-i games that had her finally appear in-game, respectively).

To go back to an earlier point, dismissing what people like as some edgy or whatever thing is silly. Yes, people enjoy sillier things. What's wrong with that? Nobody said it was a likely design to ever be used(it won't be, but only because Impa's already not in a great spot, but also because newcomers tend to often use some of their most latest designs. It's sometimes veterans that change it up, but even then, it's pretty rare and Zelda is one of the few franchises to represent different eras as a choice, not simply because of when a character was introduced. Fire Emblem somewhat does this too, but that's because the characters don't span multiple games as legacy characters either).

As for Impa being a replacement of Sheik, besides that not being realistic at all, they're massively different outside of OOT, which, well, why would Impa be from that game? When she's gotten way more animations to use from other games. See what I said also above about her Oracles version. It's not that it's a bad game choice, it's just easier to pull from another game that cuts a lot of development time down. That's generally the best way to add a character. The way that's easiest. Of course, a popular design can also help, but it can also depend what version feels best for Sakurai(one has to dance in his mind, after all). And since HW is a specific spin-off(of which Koei Tecmo does own some of it), that's harder to go with anyway since it's extra unnecessary licensing. That, and Nintendo may not be okay with it either, as it makes sense they'd want a Zelda character to pull specifically from their created games. It's still their character being represented, and we do know how picky they can be. In fact, it applies to every company too. While some are far less worried about it, it's still a thing. It's fine to trust other companies with a design, but when you're trusting another company to be talked to for another person to design it? Basically it's a 3rd party going to a 3rd party instead of the 1st party for accurate representation. It's too hands-off. It makes sense why these things are also reduced to minor cameos(Spirits) or even Music. Because the company who owns the core IP has less good control over it. Yes, it sucks that HW wouldn't get much recognition due to this kind of stuff, but it's far better to not have any weird issues with the IP etc.

I would still prefer an OoT/SS Impa, or the Impa from AoC, but your plaidoyer for Oracles' Impa is very good.

 

[Kirbeh]

Do casuals even hate characters from IPs they don't know as some people claim in forums? My casual friends don't think anything bad of characters they don't know, On the contrary my casual friends mains Little Mac and another mains Joker, and they never heard of Punch-Out or Persona before Smash Bros.
Some people act like adding Dillon from Rolling Western, DeMille from Tomato Adventure or Beat from Jet Set Radio is going to make casuals return copies of the game lol.
Most likely they just won't care or maybe some of them end up liking them.

Generally speaking, most don't, hence the " " in my previous post. Granted there are those who do, but they're in the minority.

I was more alluding to that sentiment within the speculation scene itself. Also a minority, but more vocal. You'll see cases where in speculation the casual audience will be used as a point against more niche series and your "literal who"s.

Most casual players don't care but the "general audience" is an easy/somewhat common point to try to use against smaller franchises.

 

[Deleted member]

Everyone I know in real life who plays Smash a lot wants Ultimate 2, if not straight up an Ultimate port with more content.

Those who are not all that much into Smash would prefer more single player content. But they're not avid Smash players at all, so they'd just play through the single player stuff and then stop to engage with the game anyways...

Yeah, most people aren't ready to move on to a Smash 6 yet, this is why i'm doubting a Smash 6 this early and i'm expecting a Deluxe Port first, it just seems like a DP with extra FP will make the most money and least complains at least right now, i think Ultimate will last close to 18 years, i could see we getting a new Smash game by like 2036 or so on the Switch 2 succesor, just not now.

Look i'd prefer a Smash 6 over Ult Deluxe as i'm ready to move on from Ultimate after playing and following it for 6 years, but objectively it makes little sense when most people are asking the later and will probably bring more money, a Smash 6 is more risky right now than people think.
Ofc, i'd still rather talk about Smash 6 even if i think it's not happening in at least 10+ years, because talking about a new game brings more interesting talk from my pov.