Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[DarthEnderX]

Was Red Faction the FPS with destructive environments? I remember a game where you could blast tunnels through walls and that name sounds familiar.

I only played Guerilla, which took place mostly on the surface and was all about demolishing buildings.

Seeing people mention spirits, how do people feel about them returning? Likelihoods, preferences etc.

Like them more than trophies, but wish they had text blurbs like trophies did.

 

[Perkilator]

Seeing people mention spirits, how do people feel about them returning? Likelihoods, preferences etc.

I dunno how likely they are to return, but I think they're a cool replacement for Trophies!

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Seeing people mention spirits, how do people feel about them returning? Likelihoods, preferences etc.

Less work to 3D render them, I say keep spirits

just add lore blurbs next time so they’re a true successor to trophies

 

[Gengar84]

Seeing people mention spirits, how do people feel about them returning? Likelihoods, preferences etc.

I vastly prefer trophies to spirits but I understand why they went the route they did. It’s much less work to put an existing static image into a game than a full 3D model. I also miss the informative descriptions of the trophies which we no longer have with spirits. I’m sad to see trophies go but I have accepted it. I always viewed both as just a nice bonus so I’m not too torn up about it either way.

 

[SPEN18]

I'd guess that they won't be called 'Spirits' and won't function the same way unless they decide to just keep the World of Light mode (WoL seems more likely to be replaced with some other kind of adventure or singleplayer mode). But I'd guess that there will still be some similar collectible that allows a vast quantity of characters to receive some form of representation in PNG format, be it as stickers, 'Spirits,' a sort of 2D trophy, or some other creative thing.

 

[AlRex]

I said a bit back to do trading cards. Not physical ones, or even ones that cost money, but you’d have a picture, then you turn it over digitally and it has a profile on the back. Combine Spirits and Trophies, I suppose. You could even have a mini-game w/them. I said this earlier, though.

 

[Chuderz]

Haha I didn't expect to start a Crash Bandicoot love circle. Yeah Actiblizzard is garbage and now that Smash is done for the foreseeable future I don't have to have any of my gamer dreams hitched to their gross organization. It's not like I was a fan before any of this mind you. I've always hated Kostick and consider him a leach. A tumor really on the entire organization but now we all know he's also a bully and a predator too! I'll leave mention of that horrifying tale to that.

Anyways yeah the IP being there is sad. Blizzard's IP + Crash and Spyro are the ones I care about. Pitfall Harry too though he doesn't really do anything anymore. If a company were to buy them I think it'd be Microsoft. It'd be just too massive of a gain in IP for them to ignore. I would just hope they'd really do something with the IP. My dream is for a World of Warcraft 2. I'd just adore a new big budget modern MMO like that. I sometimes throw out a Skyrim flavored spinoff (strictly a spinoff) for the Diablo series but the fans get a little cranky when I say that. Oh well I think it'd be neat.

Here's my Crash moveset for anybody that hasn't seen it. Warning I purposefully stuffed it silly for its own sake to demonstrate Crash is loaded with moveset potential.

Official - Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

Last night I dreamt that they added Ms Marvel (Kamala Kahn) and a generic Kangaroo to Smash. You heard it here first, folks

smashboards.com

 

[Yamat08]

I'll just repeat what I said in the Unpopular Smash Opinions thread.

I'm okay with Spirits replacing Trophies. I like the idea of Spirits serving an actual gameplay function (both as equipment and for offering different fight set-ups), and Smash is still able to reference the more obscure corners of Nintendo's vast history through them. Besides, I thought trophies really started to lose their appeal by Smash4. In Melee, they were pretty exciting because a lot of characters were making their 3D debut through them, plus I was learning so much about Nintendo's older games and Japan-only games. Nowadays, though, such information is pretty well-catalogued on fan wikis and several other sources (though I do nevertheless find it a shame that Spirits got rid of their text descriptions), and the trophies themselves were just ripping 3D models from their home games rather than original models being made.

I'd also like to add that Spirits seem like a more refined version of Brawl's stickers (particularly in the fact that you can equip them without worrying about permanently removing them). Whether Spirits are still a thing in the next game, or they decide to go with some other collectible, I just hope we can get something with similar functionality.

 

[Wonder Smash]

To be honest, I don't mind if spirits replace trophies too.

 

[AlRex]

I like seeing the profiles, but get that Spirits serve a gameplay function. At the same time, I’ve barely, if ever, used them, or Custom Moves in Smash 4, for that matter. I just usually played the game straightforward. I know I’m not everyone, though. Trading cards that combined aspects of both, along with potentially having new/original artwork, would be my ideal solution. But who knows?

 

[Shroob]

For the whole spirits vs trophies thing, I don't really care either way tbh.


If I had to pick, I guess trophies, but neither side are that important to me. I know a lot of people love looking at their trophy collections when they're bored, but once I collect them all, it's a very "Huh, neat." thing to me, and not much else.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I liked how you could create a more specific Trophy showcase in an order you want to, but that's mostly it. I do like being able to rotate them otherwise.

Spirits are easily better in the long run and less taxing, though the blurbs will be missed by some.

 

[StrangeKitten]

On the one hand, trophies are far better. Descriptions are fun to read, and it's super neat to see stuff get 3D models that otherwise wouldn't. Spirits are kind of a letdown by comparison.

On the other hand, Spirits are simply PNGs that likely take almost no work to add. Considering that the work could go into characters, a mode, or a stage, things that are more important imo... I think I prefer Spirits.

 

[Nabbitfan730]

Seeing people mention spirits, how do people feel about them returning? Likelihoods, preferences etc.

Yeah, I prefer them over Trophies as they actually have gameplay relevance instead of just being there which makes fun to collect. Adding descriptions would be nice addition to fully solidify them being better than Trophies.

But it would be weird for them to return after the Ultimate as Smash 6 will most likely have a different adventure mode and themes.

Haha I didn't expect to start a Crash Bandicoot love circle. Yeah Actiblizzard is garbage and now that Smash is done for the foreseeable future I don't have to have any of my gamer dreams hitched to their gross organization. It's not like I was a fan before any of this mind you. I've always hated Kostick and consider him a leach. A tumor really on the entire organization but now we all know he's also a bully and a predator too! I'll leave mention of that horrifying tale to that.

Anyways yeah the IP being there is sad. Blizzard's IP + Crash and Spyro are the ones I care about. Pitfall Harry too though he doesn't really do anything anymore. If a company were to buy them I think it'd be Microsoft. It'd be just too massive of a gain in IP for them to ignore. I would just hope they'd really do something with the IP. My dream is for a World of Warcraft 2. I'd just adore a new big budget modern MMO like that. I sometimes throw out a Skyrim flavored spinoff (strictly a spinoff) for the Diablo series but the fans get a little cranky when I say that. Oh well I think it'd be neat.

Here's my Crash moveset for anybody that hasn't seen it. Warning I purposefully stuffed it silly for its own sake to demonstrate Crash is loaded with moveset potential.

Official - Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

Last night I dreamt that they added Ms Marvel (Kamala Kahn) and a generic Kangaroo to Smash. You heard it here first, folks

smashboards.com

Yeah I feel for you guys, it really does suck to have your favourites stuck with such bad corporations. Content has to be put on hold indefinitely and relations and chances are shattered. Especially on the 20th anniversary

Keighley in response of backlash said that Actiblizz wont make an appearance other than awards so the apparent Wumpa League isn't coming. Think that's a real bummer

 

[MeteoRain]

If you had to choose 5 RPG characters and 5 fighting game characters and 5 platformer characters to have them playable in smash who would you choose?

RPG:

Ganon
Diablo
Midna
Gilgamesh
Geno

Fighting:

Sub-Zero
Nightmare
Scorpion
Morrigan
Filia

Platformers:

Shantae
Crash w/Coco echo
Goemon
Arthur
Marina Lightyears

Zelda games are often marked action RPG, although I disagree, I'll abuse a loophole however I see fit.

Outside of that, here's only a few I actually want, all of which sitting at the top of their trees or just behind another. Others, I simply think would be cool to see or a solid for someone else, maybe both.

Also, no love for FPS? And what would you classify Devil May Cry?

 

[Tankman from Newgrounds]

I came back and guess what?

Mii Costume predictions:
Brawler:

• King Hippo
• Tiki (Fire Emblem)
• Urban Champion
• Vectorman

Gunner:

• Mach Rider
• Slippy Toad
• Captain Comando
• Soldier (Team Fortress 2)

Swordfighter:

• Lyndis
• Conker
• Sakura (Sakura Wars)
• Boyfriend (Friday Night Funkin)

(And you know that Mii costumes always deconfirm characters, so this means no more King Hippo, Lyn and Boyfriend from Friday Night Funkin!)

 

[Yamat08]

But it would be weird for them to return after the Ultimate as Smash 6 will most likely have a different adventure mode and themes.

Not necessarily. Remember, they introduced Spirit Board before revealing that there'd be an Adventure Mode tied to them.

 

[Wunderwaft]

In regards to Spirits and Trophies, I understand why the latter won't come back due to how time consuming it is. The problem with the former though is that it's....boring I guess? There's only so much you can do with a png picture......unless you turn it into a trading card game

Huh that's actually a great idea! Gwent from Witcher 3 was such a well beloved addition that it managed to even generate a spin-off based on the card game. I can see this working with Smash, though they'll have to actually hire TCG people who know what they're doing to create it. I dunno about you all but I think a TCG mode that you can play with friends and strangers is a much better addition that gives a stronger drive to collect em all.

 

[Lenidem]

I prefer trophies, because they're nicer to look at and they have a description. I understand why they're not a thing anymore though. If the Spirits each had a good description, I would be satisfied.

I don't care the slightest about the gameplay changes from the Spirits : I never use them, except when I have to (World of Light).

 

[Wonder Smash]

I do like the descriptions and the details of the trophies. However, I also like looking at the spirits' artworks from the games they come from and just the name of the series too. That's good enough for me. Even now, I just can't help but look at all these different artworks from those games. Some of them taken from old games, some from more recent ones, some are sprites. I wouldn't mind seeing that again. Plus, it kind of reminds me of Melee where all the trophies did seem like they were based on their series' designs too.

 

[Tankman from Newgrounds]

Actually, if Spirits were meant to return, I would give them description entries to male it more interesting.

 

[Yamat08]

I do like the descriptions and the details of the trophies. However, I also like looking at the spirits' artworks from the games they come from and just the name of the series too. That's good enough for me. Even now, I just can't help but look at all these different artworks from those games. Some of them taken from old games, some from more recent ones, some are sprites. I wouldn't mind seeing that again. Plus, it kind of reminds me of Melee where all the trophies did seem like they were based on their series' designs too.

I just wish the artworks used could be a lot less uniform. Like, most of the Super Mario Spirits pull from their modern day 3D incarnations, barely a single hint of their 2D artworks (which were more prominent pre-N64 but still appear on various products to this day). Why couldn't more series and characters get a throwback Spirit like Link and Pit did? And of course, there's pretty much all the Pokemon using their Global Link art (though considering the Pokemon depicted in the Brawl stickers had a similar problem, all of them being Battle Revolution stillshots, I get the feeling this is just The Pokemon Company being strict).

As an aside, while the decision to expand on Spirits through free updates was interesting, I do find it a little off how there could suddenly be at least 3 different Spirits representing one game (ex. Super Mario Party), yet entire eras from a particular series' history may be lucky to even get one Spirit.

 

[Tankman from Newgrounds]

If we had Trophies in Smash 6 again, the game will rise again.

But it will be small rule with adventure mode, where Trophies must be unlocked by Trophy Battles (Spirit battles, but with Trophy steps).

 

[Dan Quixote]

You guys keep asking for spirits with the trophy descriptions, but iirc aren't the descriptions the reason for this whole problem in the first place? A huge amount of the trophies from the previous games were pulled right from their games, so the Smash team didn't actually put that much work into 3D modeling. SSBU has to be translated into over a dozen languages, and even if the description is just a paragraph that would still be approaching a thousand trophy descriptions that need to be translated. Sakurai himself said that was the reason for dropping trophies, didn't he?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

You guys keep asking for spirits with the trophy descriptions, but iirc aren't the descriptions the reason for this whole problem in the first place? A huge amount of the trophies from the previous games were pulled right from their games, so the Smash team didn't actually put that much work into 3D modeling. SSBU has to be translated into over a dozen languages, and even if the description is just a paragraph that would still be approaching a thousand trophy descriptions that need to be translated. Sakurai himself said that was the reason for dropping trophies, didn't he?

I thought it was the rendering, I seem to recall that at least.

 

[Trevenant]

The rendering may not have been the issue tbh since that implies that creating models was the issue... When it obviously wasn't since trophies practically never had original models aside from a few of the really old school character trophies in melee... Posing maybe but eh... Nothing was directly confirmed, or nothing that can at the very least be put down to the translations being different in the case of the direct where spirits were actually confirmed..

 

[Will]

Actually, if Spirits were meant to return, I would give them description entries to male it more interesting.

It wasn't that trophies themselves missing was bad, it was the flavor text. I'd spend the ten hours it takes to read all of the flavor text for thousands of png files. Just like how I binged them all for the past five games

 

[Dan Quixote]

As much as I thought the trophy descriptions were super fun, I know it's right to prefer the game can be translated to more languages so more people can play the game.

Still, they could at least list the debut game and one extra appearance for spirits like they did before...

 

[SPEN18]

The cost and licensing would probably still be too prohibitive, and the upside is maybe limited, but it would be cool to see original art drawn for each "Spirit"/Sticker character. I imagine it would be easier than the full 3D models for Trophies at least.

 

[Will]

The cost and licensing would probably still be too prohibitive, and the upside is maybe limited, but it would be cool to see original art drawn for each "Spirit"/Sticker character. I imagine it would be easier than the full 3D models for Trophies at least.

Some of the image choices for Spirits are confusing. Luigi and Daisy for example are outdated as hell.

I understand Nintendo typically remasters these types of poses for a new era, which they have; these two are just outdated.

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

I understand why they replaced Trophies with Spirits, and Spirits are pretty cool in their own right, but

man cutting Trophies lost a LOT of the video game history museum feel the previous games had and not in a way I can see being easily rectified tbh
I like both, but give me a choice and I will take Trophies in a heartbeat

 

[Yamat08]

I guess here's another thing to consider about Spirits over Trophies: Ultimate represents a LOT of franchises among its playable Fighters alone. Surely, they'd have to represent a decent amount of content from each one, and Spirits easily allowed for just that (granted, FF7 hid theirs behind a paywall, and still a shame about Pac-Man). Hell, it's pretty much why each DLC character could get their own Spirit Board featuring at least 8 collectibles each. Meanwhile, Smash4's DLC characters (of which there were only 3 from a new franchise) could barely get much outside of their own basic, Alt, and Final Smash Trophies (though I guess Bayonetta came out with a pretty decent amount, but Street Fighter only got Ken and FF7 got nothing).

EDIT: Oh, damn. Looking back on it, Fire Emblem's Trophy representation was an absolute joke. I mean, people think the Jugdral saga has it bad now? Brawl and WiiU had pretty much nothing outside of Tellius (and Lyn), and Smash 3DS is ALL Awakening. Meanwhile, Melee had absolutely nothing outside of the two playables.

 

[chocolatejr9]

I guess here's another thing to consider about Spirits over Trophies: Ultimate represents a LOT of franchises among its playable Fighters alone. Surely, they'd have to represent a decent amount of content from each one, and Spirits easily allowed for just that (granted, FF7 hid theirs behind a paywall, and still a shame about Pac-Man). Hell, it's pretty much why each DLC character could get their own Spirit Board featuring at least 8 collectibles each. Meanwhile, Smash4's DLC characters (of which there were only 3 from a new franchise) could barely get much outside of their own basic, Alt, and Final Smash Trophies (though I guess Bayonetta came out with a pretty decent amount, but Street Fighter only got Ken and FF7 got nothing).

EDIT: Oh, damn. Looking back on it, Fire Emblem's Trophy representation was an absolute joke. I mean, people think the Jugdral saga has it bad now? Brawl and WiiU had pretty much nothing outside of Tellius (and Lyn), and Smash 3DS is ALL Awakening. Meanwhile, Melee had absolutely nothing outside of the two playables.

At least FE finally got the respect it deserves...

 

[Paraster]

I'd like if they kept the character-specific Classic Mode routes, but gave them little story scenes between matches like in other fighters. You could either play this up as a replacement for Adventure Mode (would probably need some additional flourishes in that case) or just keep them simple and play them for absurdity.

 

[Perkilator]

I'd like if they kept the character-specific Classic Mode routes...keep them simple and play them for absurdity.

That sounds like fun! What scenarios would play out in this case?

 

[Paraster]

That sounds like fun! What scenarios would play out in this case?

For example's sake, I'll show what stories could have been given to some of Ult's Classic Modes.

Wii Fit Trainer: Trainer keeps talking about helping her opponents get in shape. Said opponents are either befuddled or angered.
Incineroar: Hammy pro-wrestling skits.
Lucas: Trains in magical skills with his opponents after beating them, growing in confidence along the way.
Meta Knight: Believes the Dimension Mirror is creating evil clones, so he attempts to locate it.
Bowser: Show how the obsession implicit in the route's premise (all red characters) is affecting Bowser's personality.

 

[Perkilator]

For example's sake, I'll show what stories could have been given to some of Ult's Classic Modes.

Wii Fit Trainer: Trainer keeps talking about helping her opponents get in shape. Said opponents are either befuddled or angered.
Incineroar: Hammy pro-wrestling skits.
Lucas: Trains in magical skills with his opponents after beating them, growing in confidence along the way.
Meta Knight: Believes the Dimension Mirror is creating evil clones, so he attempts to locate it.
Bowser: Show how the obsession implicit in the route's premise (all red characters) is affecting Bowser's personality.

Those are some pretty cool ones! Here are some others I thought of:

• Donkey Kong: Comedy road trip kind of scenario
• Cloud: Trying to rest somewhere to handle his motion sickness, only to encounter Sephiroth...again

 

[Þe 1 → Way]

In terms of spirits vs trophies, I am wholly mixed.

Spirits are way less time consuming and actually can be used with gameplay, but it is so much fun collecting and gawking at trophies.

I guess I’d pick spirits in the end, just because their lower dev time allows a lot more to be made and as consequence more series represented.

 

[Wonder Smash]

This reminds me; I like how the OoT artwork that Young Link's Classic Trophy in Melee is based on would eventually be used as his Spirit in Ultimate.

 

[Chuderz]

I prefer trophies, because they're nicer to look at and they have a description. I understand why they're not a thing anymore though. If the Spirits each had a good description, I would be satisfied.

I don't care the slightest about the gameplay changes from the Spirits : I never use them, except when I have to (World of Light).

Sakurai said that they were a significant investment in development. My guess is the insane amount of stages and Everyone is Here were chosen over them as in all the development trophies could have had went to those concepts instead.

I for one MUCH prefer that and I really don't want trophies to come back. I'd rather all that development went to character reworks, new and returning stages, new and returning modes, extra moves and the like.