Oh, I was going by the developer rather than the genre. As far as the genre goes, you do have a good point but I don’t think it is necessarily a hard rule that only the most iconic character per genre is chosen. I can’t really think of any examples other than Terry that contradict this but you already addressed that. The other examples are first party characters like Min Min and Pyra getting in over more iconic third party options but there is an obvious reason for that, being primarily a Nintendo crossover. Still, I don’t believe it is a wasted effort to support less iconic characters for Smash. If we can generate enough support for the characters we love, it could be enough to overcome the hurdle of lesser sales.
Of course! There's lots of reason for characters to be included, and i don't see how "less recognizable" characters aren't deserving of being included. My point is only directed towards historical importance as an argument for first inclusion in any genres.
Just because a character isn't the absolute oldest possible option in their genre doesn't mean history didn't play a part in their inclusion.
There are a lot of games that didn't start a series but become the turning point that change the way people talk about it, Final Fantasy VII being one.
So given that these games are the "turning point" as a result of attaining mainstream recognition by their own merit, isn't it clear that the former is the key reason for inclusion, rather than historical importance being the sole factor for these kind of things?
I was going to say this. Doom might not be the oldest, that’s Wolfenstein (even though it’s made by the same developer), but Doom has both Legacy for bringing the genre of FPS mainstream and and absurd amount popularity for decades now.
While i do not disagree with Doom's general recognizability, my point has largely been clear that doom's "historical legacy" has always been overly exaggerated as a plus point given the past patterns we've had with the first inclusions from each genre.
Of course, that's not your point - but it's clear that doom is not the most recognizable or iconic FPS in the mainstream. And that goes back to my point that Nintendo has a clear tendency to heavily favor the biggest IPs and the most iconic entries from each genre
first.
That does not mean that lesser known titles cannot be included later - far from it. But people automatically assuming the former being the clear frontrunner for a potential FPS rep (and to be honest, the genre is so unknown in japan we might not even see any) is pretty baffling.
Especially when you consider other factors into the mix.
And with Cloud and FF7 having both of those, I don't see why that's used as an example.
It's not whether or not Doom Slayer is playable, it's how much Sakurai values a series legacy and influence. Though in that case, you don't even need Doom to see that, as Sakurai would talk about how much of an influence other series such as those by SNK are and Fatal Fury got in before the much more well-known Tekken series had a playable character.
But still, despite being from the more "recognizable" series, Dragonborn is still a Mii costume, no different from Doom Slayer. Plus, both were in the same pass, so it's not like his series recognition gave him any kind of special treatment over Doom Slayer anyway. Also, again, like I said, Doom Slayer has become a popular pick among the Smash fanbase. Him being a Mii costume would likely increase his popularity even more.
Because 7 is not the "historical legacy" nor the "nintendo connected" entry compared to FF1 (which, you know, would fit your described profile) or anything from 1-6 (released on nintendo consoles). So yea, they went for the most recognizable entry over any other of the factors you mentioned as important.
And tekken isn't even the same subgenre as any SNK 2D fighting game (and even if you view it as the "fighting game genre", take heed they went for Street fighter 2 over all other fighting games. They still went for the most recognizable title in the genre first).
Lastly, even if you're trying to equate skyrim/doom as having the same chance due to their mii status (which is fallacious) well....i never did say either felt likely to begin with. Plus you didn't answer my initial point of of doom being completely irrelevant to japan compared to skyrim. Also assuming that miis can result in a boost in popularity seems pretty flawed too - many miis from smash 4 never saw inclusion in ultimate and its entirely likely as well that Nintendo sees it as sufficient rep for the entries.
DarthEnderX I think it's you that has the bad take on this. Essentially, you don't want the #1 character on the MegaSmash Poll and a character people really hyped and people both within and outside of Smash really would like to see because you want to...punish a AAA company for having horrible people do horrible things? You do realize that's what the court of law is for, right? That isn't our job, nor is it Nintendo's job. Nintendo's job is to make and sell games and gaming-related products. Glad to know you are the kind of person who would punish the many for the actions of a few. We've hit a new level of gatekeeping characters, but somehow we didn't gatekeep Dragon Quest when the composer is the Japanese equivalent of actually believe the 'Hitler did nothing wrong' meme and completely disowns very similar acts done on a way more massive scale during war time.
