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Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

chocolatejr9

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I want a 3D Donkey Kong

but not like 64, something more like Mario 3D World or Kirby and the Forgotten Land. A collection of 3D levels where the goal is to get to the end, not collect a million things.
Ever since the Crash 5 cancellation reveal, I've had this potentially really stupid idea that the next 3D Mario game could be a direct crossover with Donkey Kong. You play as one or the other with each having unique gameplay styles, and it could serve as a way to properly bridge the gap between the two since they largely keep to themselves. Plus, potential Bowser-K. Rool team-up: need I say more?
 

TheFirstPoppyBro

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By the way, for those curious, Skyward Sword got added to the music app tonight. THE GROOSE IS LOOSE

For some reason, it was only showing up via the Recent Highlights tab in your profile menu, but now it's showing up normally.

This just leaves Mario 64 and Wind Waker left in terms of the games that were in the announcement trailer.
 
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Swamp Sensei

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By the way, for those curious, Skyward Sword got added to the music app tonight. THE GROOSE IS LOOSE

For some reason, it was only showing up via the Recent Highlights tab in your profile menu, but now it's showing up normally.

This just leaves Mario 64 and Wind Waker left in terms of the games that were in the announcement trailer.
The Japanese trailer also had DKC3 in there. And apparently some newsletter mentioned Super Mario World.
 

TheFirstPoppyBro

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The Japanese trailer also had DKC3 in there. And apparently some newsletter mentioned Super Mario World.
I can't find the newsletter that mentioned Super Mario World, but DKC3 definitely was on the Japanese trailer, so back up to three confirmed at least.

That said, I also feel like none of those will be next week's addition, they've been putting more niche entries in between trailer ones like Brain Age and Wave Race 64 recently lol
 

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I can't find the newsletter that mentioned Super Mario World, but DKC3 definitely was on the Japanese trailer, so back up to three confirmed at least.

That said, I also feel like none of those will be next week's addition, they've been putting more niche entries in between trailer ones like Brain Age and Wave Race 64 recently lol
Honestly I think DKC3 has a real shot of being the next soundtrack.

But I would REALLY like more GameCube and GBA games please.
 

TheFirstPoppyBro

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Honestly I think DKC3 has a real shot of being the next soundtrack.

But I would REALLY like more GameCube and GBA games please.
Definitely wouldn't mind if they hit me with the original Rhythm Heaven OST or like even a Pokemon spin-off like Red Rescue Team. I'd also take Gen 3 for GBA just so I know Pokemon isn't ONLY going with their newest release. Superstar Saga would be nice, Kirby and the Amazing Mirror is great, any of the Gamecube Mario Party games but especially 6 because I'm biased (though I'm sure they'd start with the N64 ones and go in order), Kirby Air Ride...
 

Mamp

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Smash 6 as a launch title seems unlikely but it’s totally plausible for it to be a 2025 release, assuming Sakurai’s project is Smash, which I think is almost certainly the case. It began development proper in April 2022, meaning a December 2025 release would give it 3 and a half years of dev time, a little more than Ultimate, so it isn’t too early for it to release. Nintendo has their work cut out for them selling the Switch 2 to the 150 million Switch owners who are mostly still pretty happy with the console they have and facing a cost of living crisis. The console needs a huge launch to succeed, and nothing sells consoles like Smash does. I reckon we could absolutely see Smash in the Switch 2 reveal trailer at the very least.
 

Gengar84

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Smash 6 as a launch title seems unlikely but it’s totally plausible for it to be a 2025 release, assuming Sakurai’s project is Smash, which I think is almost certainly the case. It began development proper in April 2022, meaning a December 2025 release would give it 3 and a half years of dev time, a little more than Ultimate, so it isn’t too early for it to release. Nintendo has their work cut out for them selling the Switch 2 to the 150 million Switch owners who are mostly still pretty happy with the console they have and facing a cost of living crisis. The console needs a huge launch to succeed, and nothing sells consoles like Smash does. I reckon we could absolutely see Smash in the Switch 2 reveal trailer at the very least.
I’d like to have at least a half a year between announcement and release of Smash 6. I love the excitement of waiting for new reveal trailers and speculating who we could see. Smash could potentially be revealed with the launch of the Switch 2 and released for the holidays.
 

TheFirstPoppyBro

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Smash 6 as a launch title seems unlikely but it’s totally plausible for it to be a 2025 release, assuming Sakurai’s project is Smash, which I think is almost certainly the case. It began development proper in April 2022, meaning a December 2025 release would give it 3 and a half years of dev time, a little more than Ultimate, so it isn’t too early for it to release. Nintendo has their work cut out for them selling the Switch 2 to the 150 million Switch owners who are mostly still pretty happy with the console they have and facing a cost of living crisis. The console needs a huge launch to succeed, and nothing sells consoles like Smash does. I reckon we could absolutely see Smash in the Switch 2 reveal trailer at the very least.
I mean, Mario Kart can also do that job for the launch, and imo it's pretty likely to especially with 8 Deluxe's success as the fifth/sixth highest selling video game of all time lol
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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The console needs a huge launch to succeed, and nothing sells consoles like Smash does. I reckon we could absolutely see Smash in the Switch 2 reveal trailer at the very least.
Name one Nintendo console that had Smash as a launch title.

Trick situations aside, Nintendo can release plenty of things that can sell consoles. I mean, Breath of the Wild alone absolutely carried the Switch in its first months, and that's despite the fact that it was also a Wii U title. They could have a new Zelda or a new Mario and those could also give the Switch 2 a nice start just as much as Smash would, if not better because they are much bigger IPs.

Smash always sells consoles, but Nintendo has never needed Smash for a strong launch.
 
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The Stoopid Unikorn

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One can argue that Nintendo's best selling consoles DIDN'T have Smash as a launch title.

The only one that did underperformed.
And we can't even count that one because it missed the launch month. But it was the closest and being a launch title was the original intention.
 
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DarthEnderX

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And we can't even count that one because it missed the launch month.
I'm sorry, but that's ****ing dumb.

Games that come out a month after launch are still part of the launch. People are still buying the console for that game. A month later, kids are unwrapping Gamecubes with copies of Smash Bros. for Christmas.

Saying that's not launch is pointless semantics.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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I'm sorry, but that's ****ing dumb.

Games that come out a month after launch are still part of the launch. People are still buying the console for that game. A month later, kids are unwrapping Gamecubes with copies of Smash Bros. for Christmas.

Saying that's not launch is pointless semantics.
C'mon. Let's be real.

That's practically a launch title.
Fair enough, I guess.

But yeah, my dumbass semantics aside, I see Smash as something they'd use to maintain momentum rather than create it. Actively market it while a console's already known so they can use the Directs to drop **** like trailers and stuff.

The only way I can realistically see Smash as a launch game is if the launch lineup and the console are revealed somewhere in Janurary-March 2025 but won't release it until like November so they can do the usual Smash marketing. But that would imply holding a finished product hostage for most of a year just for character trailers and I don't think Nintendo's marketing has ever revolved around Smash being the center of the universe for an entire year.

Especially when the Switch era established Nintendo as a company that (mostly) only reveals its hand when a game's almost finished. Seems they've learned from Prime 4, TotK and Bayo 3.
 
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TheFirstPoppyBro

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The only way I can realistically see Smash as a launch game is if the launch lineup and the console are revealed somewhere in Janurary-March 2025 but won't release it until like November so they can do the usual Smash marketing. But that would imply holding a finished product hostage for most of a year just for character trailers and I don't think Nintendo's marketing has ever revolved around Smash being the center of the universe for an entire year.
Alongside this, while Ultimate's marketing was from March 2018's initial teaser to December 2018 when the game came out, a game with more than Ultimate's 6 newcomers with trailers like we're assuming next Smash would be would have to take longer because every newcomer would get a trailer.

Like Smash 4's marketing cycle went from June 2013 when it was announced at E3 to the 3DS version releasing in like September 2014.

I could MAYBE see a teaser like Inkling's where the game is unnamed or some other confirmation of a new Smash MAYBE (though I'd moreso expect that early on in year 2 aka early 2026 or maybe late 2025 depending on when the Switch 2 actually comes out), but that's about it, and I definitely wouldn't expect it to release within the launch window.
 

The Prankster 16

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The smash hype cycle, no matter how short or long, will always eat up all the speculation in the year is happens. The first year of the Switch 2 needs momentum for itself and the other launch titles, and releasing or even revealing the next smash seems like a risky move if you are trying to get you customers to try out all your other games. I think a release window similar to Ultimate (early in the year reveal, holiday release) in the second year would do much better, as not only will it draw out much hype and news, but it also could distract from a less exciting second year lineup, which will probably happen as Nintendo is likely to have a more relaxed year after a new console’s release.
 

Scrimblo Bimblo

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The smash hype cycle, no matter how short or long, will always eat up all the speculation in the year is happens. The first year of the Switch 2 needs momentum for itself and the other launch titles, and releasing or even revealing the next smash seems like a risky move if you are trying to get you customers to try out all your other games. I think a release window similar to Ultimate (early in the year reveal, holiday release) in the second year would do much better, as not only will it draw out much hype and news, but it also could distract from a less exciting second year lineup, which will probably happen as Nintendo is likely to have a more relaxed year after a new console’s release.
They can also achieve that with Smash DLC, though. They sure did last time...
 

BritishGuy54

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Does anyone have any items they really want to see in the next game? Assuming Dixie Kong gets in as a semiclone of Diddy and they aren’t built into her moveset, I’d love to see the Animal Buddy crates as an item. I think I’d go with Rambi. Squawks, Rattly, and Squitter as the rideable buddies you could get. I’d try to make the gameplay of riding them mirror how they play in DKC 2 as closely as possible. The buddies would disappear after either a set amount of time or taking a set amount of damage.
I think Xenoblade has some potential with 2’s Core Crystals. Maybe 3’s Ouroboros Stones, but that would take way too much effort to give every fighter an Ouroboros form.
So what games do you expect to see in the Switch 2's launch year?
2025:
My bets are on a new 3D Mario being THE launch title. I’ll even throw in the possibility that Monolithsoft helped on it because it sounds funny.

Animal Crossing is one in surprised isn’t talked about more often. It sold incredibly well. I think this will be our summer title.

Mario’s 40th Anniversary is in the year 2025. I can see Nintendo doing some ports. A Mario 3D All-Stars re-release with Galaxy 2 included? An NSMBDS remake? Or just NSMBWii HD?

With Pokémon hanging onto the previous system like they have always done, winter 2025 feels ripe for a new Mario Kart.

Early 2026 will continue Mario’s anniversary celebrations with Super Mario Maker 3, likely adding a Wonder style, and possibly even one of the other 2D games.

Maybe the Switch still gets some support with last minute ports? Metroid Prime 2 and 3? Wind Waker HD? Twilight Princess?

I can see Smash and Pokémon coming in late 2026, with a new Zelda, Splatoon, and Xenoblade in 2027 at the earliest.
 
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RodNutTakin

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What what Smash speculation would look like if the first thing revealed for the next game was was that every single Third Party character was cut for the next game
Very limited. I do not expect a situation like this to help out characters like Chibi Robo or Lip or Andy despite what people may think.
Especially if the natural implication that the First Party side takes major hits as well is also factored in.
 

BritishGuy54

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What what Smash speculation would look like if the first thing revealed for the next game was was that every single Third Party character was cut for the next game
Cuts would cause chaos. Third parties not being included would also cause chaos. But every third party being cut would break the internet.

Speculation would be completely flipped on its head after this ‘anything is possible’ period we’ve had after Ultimate.

It might bode well for other picks who may not have been considered otherwise. More first parties would get multiple unique characters.

It’s only something I’d expect to see in a full-on reboot.
 

Swamp Sensei

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What what Smash speculation would look like if the first thing revealed for the next game was was that every single Third Party character was cut for the next game
This decision would spark massive controversy and fans would riot.

There are too many uber popular characters to do this. Smash fans expect to see Sonic, Mega Man and a bunch of others.
 

The Stoopid Unikorn

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Alongside this, while Ultimate's marketing was from March 2018's initial teaser to December 2018 when the game came out, a game with more than Ultimate's 6 newcomers with trailers like we're assuming next Smash would be would have to take longer because every newcomer would get a trailer.

Like Smash 4's marketing cycle went from June 2013 when it was announced at E3 to the 3DS version releasing in like September 2014.

I could MAYBE see a teaser like Inkling's where the game is unnamed or some other confirmation of a new Smash MAYBE (though I'd moreso expect that early on in year 2 aka early 2026 or maybe late 2025 depending on when the Switch 2 actually comes out), but that's about it, and I definitely wouldn't expect it to release within the launch window.
Yeah, exactly!

And the marketing went on for even longer due to the Wii U version still not being out for another two months after the 3DS version came out.

There is no way they make the next Smash a launch title without sacrificing its marketability because, unless the console's release is held hostage for long enough, they wouldn't have enough time to properly showcase the newcomers which is the entire marketing appeal of Smash.

Best I can see is a new Smash revealed alongside the console in early 2025 with the game itself being either part of the second year's lineup or very late into its first year. Smash sells consoles, yes, but that's because the several months of speculations and trailers are very good at making people hyped up about the game. Make the next Smash a launch title and the entire thing could fall apart.

What what Smash speculation would look like if the first thing revealed for the next game was was that every single Third Party character was cut for the next game
That would be how World War III starts off :4pacman:
 
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The Stoopid Unikorn

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Re: characters that people would regret asking for gameplay-wise

Probably Doomguy. He could easily slot into the super mobile zoner category with all those weapons, and we all know how those characters play out in competitive settings...
Given how the Doom games will actively punish anyone who tries to camp, I doubt he would ever be a zoner.

He'd probably be a generalist with some projectiles. And even then, depending on what weapons they pick, he could still very much be focusing more on close or mid range if not outright be a rushdown character. Things like the chainsaw and the Crucible are very much not zoner tools while the shotgun could work just like actual shotguns and be far more damaging from up close, just as examples.

And if they go a more ranged fighter route with things like the rocket launcher, the devs could always force you to use melee attacks to regain ammo, forcing you to approach if you want to strike from farther away.

Master Chief is a better example of a super mobile zoner, especially after he gained a grappling hook.
 
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Jave

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Switch 2 launch will have one of Mario Kart or 3D Mario, while the other will be released a few months after launch. Both series have not had a new entry in quite a while (specially Mario Kart), so they're likely being saved as the big launch releases.

Assuming the game Sakurai has been working since April 2022 is indeed Smash 6, I think there's a good chance they might tease it before Switch 2 launches (there' a rumored big event in May for Switch 2, followed by the system's release in June/July), followed by the game's reveal in the first Direct after Switch 2 launches. This will give enough time for the speculation cycle to start over, as Smash 6 likely won't be out until mid/late 2026.
 

Gengar84

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Alright, I made a new Smash 6 roster. Like the last one, I tried to balance popular characters the general public really wanted and my own personal choices just to keep things interesting. I tried to make the choices at least semi realistic. For the base roster, I kept it to Ultimate's 84 characters but made a good deal of cuts and additions to keep it fresh even if the total roster isn't larger. I also made three Fighter's Passes to get the roster up to 100 characters by the end of the DLC. I think a slightly more realistic approach is to cut six newcomers from the base game to fill out a fourth fighter's pass so the starting roster is only 78 instead of 84.

So for the base roster, here's what I was thinking:

Base Roster:

Cuts:

Dr. Mario
Toon Link
Young Link
Jigglypuff
Pichu
Incineroar
Roy
Corrin
Chrom
Zero Suit Samus
Lucas
Duck Hunt
Wii Fit Trainer
Mii
Bayonetta
Steve
Snake

Newcomers:

Waluigi (Super Mario)
Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong Country)
Impa (Legend of Zelda)
Zoroark/Hisuian Zoraork (Pokemon)
Team Rocket (Pokemon)
Bandana Dee (Kirby)
Elfilis (Kirby)
Lyn (Fire Emblem)
E.M.M.I. (Metroid)
Octoling (Splatoon)
DJ Octavio (Splatoon)
Elma (Xenoblade)
Officer Howard (Astral Chain)
Isaac (Golden Sun)
Dillon (Dillon's Rolling Western)
Shadow the Hedgehog (Sonic)
Zero (Mega Man)
Alphen and Shionne (Tales of)
Ryu Hyabusa (Ninja Gaiden)

Smash 6 Roster 2 - Base small.jpg


For the Fighter's passes, I leaned a bit more towards my personal preferences but wanted to keep the choices at least somewhat realistic and be able to make a solid argument for each inclusion.

So here's the breakdown for the first pass:

Fighter's Pass 1:

Jinx (League of Legends)
Chun-Li (Street Fighter)
Rash (Battletoads) with Zitz and Pimple as alts
Lu Bu (Dynasty Warriors)
Midna (Legend of Zelda)
Bill Rizer (Contra) with Lance Bean as an alt

Fighters Pass 1 - New.jpg


For Fighter's Pass 2, I wanted to lead with a first party character, so I went with an iconic Pokemon and one of my most wanted characters:

Fighter's Pass 2:

Gengar (Pokemon)
Fulgore (Killer Instinct)
Magus (Chrono Trigger)
Nightmare (Soul Calibur)
Etna (Disgaea)
Sarah Kerrigan (StarCraft)

Fighters Pass 2 - New.jpg


I wanted to start off the last Fighter's Pass with a popular character and end with a big surprise that's both very popular and one that not many expect like Sora:

Fighter's Pass 3:

Yuna (Final Fantasy)
Tails (Sonic)
Kunio (River City) with Riki as an alt
Illidan (WarCraft)
Bomberman (Bomberman)
Scorpion (Mortal Kombat) with Sub-Zero as a semiclone with unique specials, taunts, and final smash

Fighters Pass 3 - New.jpg


I like to mix in a good amount of unexpected choices because I feel like it would be boring to only include the most speculated characters with no surprises. I think this final roster does a good job at bringing in a lot of expected fan favorites with characters that no one really saw coming. The final roster size of just over 100 characters post DLC might be a bit too ambitious but I don't think it's impossible, especially if you cut some characters from the base roster for one or two more fighter's passes. Ideally, we'd get cut veterans back periodically separate from the Fighter's Passes at a reduced price.

Other ideas:

I had a few ideas for game modes and other content as well. First, every character will be playable from the start without the need to unlock them but using each character in various modes will unlock alternate outfits, trophies, and other things for them. Each character will have at least one unique model alternate outfit unlocked through completing their classic mode. There will also be a color editor for outfits with limitations for third party characters that don't want certain colors edited.

New side mode: Playable bosses and assist trophies

This mode will allow players to control the game's bosses and assist trophies but they aren't balanced for competitive play. The bosses and trophies don't have any additional moves but the players can control what they do have. I loved being able to play as Master Hand in World of Light so this would be a cool expansion to that. For those wondering why Eggman wasn't on the roster, I think a new playable boss is the perfect spot for him since he wouldn't have to sacrifice the size of his huge mechs to be a normal character.

New side mode: Boss rush mode

Upgrade to Stage Builder
:

In addition to adding many more parts and backgrounds for normal stages, you'll also have the option from the start to select whether you want the stage to be a normal stage, Break the Targets, Board the Platforms, or Race to the Finish. This way players can create their own character specific mini game stages and upload them online without Sakurai having to spend too much development time on it. You'll also be able to select spawn points for each option.

New co-op adventure platforming mode similar to Sub-Space Emissary

Final Thoughts:


I admit that this is probably all a little ambitious and possibly not completely realistic but this would be what I'd consider to be my dream Smash game. It will be interesting to see how much if any of this actually becomes a reality in the next Smash. So what do you think? Would you be happy with this roster and the modes, even if they might be slightly too ambitious? I don't expect everyone to agree with my choices and I admit that a good part of this is personal bias, but that's just part of the fun for me. It would be boring if we didn't each bring our own ideas and flare to the game.
 
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Oracle Link

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What what Smash speculation would look like if the first thing revealed for the next game was was that every single Third Party character was cut for the next game
Well it does make sense to cut every third Party for the base game so that nintendo can rerelease the game more easily However i think atleast sonic, Pac and Mega and one newbie should be in a free day 1 patch!

On another Topic which Music do you wanna see in smash 6?

HEre are some tracks i wanna see:
2d Tracks: For example some dungeon themes and ganons classic one!



TOTK:

Remixes:
Zeldas Lullaby
Tarm Ruins (OOS)

Medlys
Zelda Boss Theme Medly
Dark Link Medly
Ganon Medly


 

SMAASH! Puppy

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So what do you think? Would you be happy with this roster and the modes, even if they might be slightly too ambitious?
I knew exactly who made this before I even saw the profile picture. lol

~85 characters on the base roster is straight up not happening, but in the hypothetical, I don't dislike this roster at all.
 

Gengar84

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I knew exactly who made this before I even saw the profile picture. lol

~85 characters on the base roster is straight up not happening, but in the hypothetical, I don't dislike this roster at all.
Yeah, I think the more realistic approach is to cut about 12 characters off the base roster and add two more Fighter's Passes so you'd still end up with the 100 character roster by the end, it would just take longer to get there. The template I was working with only had options for a 60 or 84 character roster so I went with 84. I think the 72 character starting roster could realistically happen and if they kept the Fighter's Passes going for the life of the Switch 2, we could get to 5 passes and reach the 100 characters by the end.
 

Gengar84

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May I ask why you cut these four in particular?
Sure, like I said, I'd much rather not cut anything at all but I was trying to be realistic. For Steve and Mii, they are both extremely resource intensive so cutting them saves up development resources for a larger number of characters. Steve is also disliked in the competitive scene on top of being a ton of work to include so his cut made more sense. Miis did provide the opportunity for various crossovers but I think we might be able to find other ways of doing that like stages, assist trophies, and other things. I was definitely on the fence of keeping them for that reason but the fact that they take the resources of over three characters for one concept made me okay with cutting them. Plus, Miis aren't really used much anymore.

Bayonetta and Snake were partially due to the status of their series. The last Bayonetta game didn't do too well and the spinoff wasn't well received either. Plus, Hideki Kamiya left Platinum Games so that might put Bayonetta in a questionable spot for the future. Snake was already cut in Smash 4 and I feel like he only came back due to "Everyone is Here" in Ultimate. It's a shame because I do like Snake in Smash but Metal Gear's future is also questionable without Hideo Kojima at Konami. Again, I'd rather keep everyone but if I'm forced to make cuts, these made sense to me. It's fine if you feel otherwise.
 
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Swamp Sensei

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Metal Gear's future is also questionable without Hideo Kojima at Konami.
I'd actually argue that this isn't the case. They're making a remake of Snake Eater and it seems to have a lot of effort and hype.
 

Gengar84

Smash Hero
Joined
Dec 9, 2009
Messages
6,760
I'd actually argue that this isn't the case. They're making a remake of Snake Eater and it seems to have a lot of effort and hype.
Oh, that's cool. I wasn't aware of that. That definitely helps his inclusion. Still, the fact that they already cut Snake in Smash once before makes me less confident in his return. The final part I forgot to mention is that some of this is also personal bias since it's partially a dream roster for me. Snake is cool but I've never really played a Metal Gear game so I'm not as connected to him. I try to be logical but that probably influenced things a bit. I've never cared for Steve, Bayonetta or Miis either so I'm sure that had something to do with it. I tried not to let my personal biases influence the roster cuts too much but it's possible that they did anyways.
 

DarthEnderX

Smash Hero
Joined
Nov 10, 2014
Messages
8,447
The smash hype cycle, no matter how short or long, will always eat up all the speculation in the year is happens. The first year of the Switch 2 needs momentum for itself and the other launch titles
Lol. "Switch 2's other games won't sell if everyone is thinkin' about Smash!"

Complete nonsense.

Alright, I made a new Smash 6 roster.
I didn't.

 
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