Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Perkilator]

To celebrate the official launch of Sonic x Shadow Generations, I've decided to compile a list of 50 Sonic songs I'd like to see in the next Smash game:

Spoiler

(Italics bold denotes songs that would be remixed)

1. Green Hill Zone
2. Scrap Brain Zone
3. Emerald Hill Zone
4. Chemical Plant Zone
5. Death Egg Robot
6. Sonic Boom
7. Stardust Speedway (Bad Future) (JP)
8. Angel Island Zone
9. Big Arms
10. Sky Sanctuary Zone
11. Doomsday Zone
12. Super Sonic Racing
13. Open Your Heart
14. Unknown from M.E.
15. Live & Learn
16. E.G.G.M.A.N.
17. Escape from the City
18. Supporting Me
19. Sonic Heroes
20. Seaside Hill / Ocean Palace
21. What I'm Made Of
22. Right There, Ride On
23. I Am (All of Me)
24. All Hail Shadow
25. His World
26. Crisis City
27. Dreams of an Absolution
28. Seven Rings in Hand
29. Endless Possibility
30. Rooftop Run
31. Vs. Egg Dragoon
32. Knight of the Wind
33. Reach for the Stars
34. Planet Wisp
35. Wonder World
36. Windy Hill - Zone 1
37. The Deadly Six Theme
38. Honeycomb Highway
39. Sonic Mania Medley
40. Lights, Camera, Action!
41. Blossom Haze
42. Rogues Gallery
43. Built to Rule / Steel Cortex
44. Fist Bump
45. Sunset Heights
46. Moonlight Battlefield (Aqua Road)
47. I'm Here
48. Undefeatable
49. Break Through It All
50. Find Your Flame

Oh, btw: the game just sold over a million copies.

Sonic x Shadow Generations has sold 1 million units https://t.co/pr7FlMGNus pic.twitter.com/ul3PI8OFAG

— Wario64 (@Wario64) October 25, 2024

 

[Kirbeh]

To celebrate the official launch of Sonic x Shadow Generations, I've decided to compile a list of 50 Sonic songs I'd like to see in the next Smash game:

Spoiler

(Italics bold denotes songs that would be remixed)

1. Green Hill Zone
2. Scrap Brain Zone
3. Emerald Hill Zone
4. Chemical Plant Zone
5. Death Egg Robot
6. Sonic Boom
7. Stardust Speedway (Bad Future) (JP)
8. Angel Island Zone
9. Big Arms
10. Sky Sanctuary Zone
11. Doomsday Zone
12. Super Sonic Racing
13. Open Your Heart
14. Unknown from M.E.
15. Live & Learn
16. E.G.G.M.A.N.
17. Escape from the City
18. Supporting Me
19. Sonic Heroes
20. Seaside Hill / Ocean Palace
21. What I'm Made Of
22. Right There, Ride On
23. I Am (All of Me)
24. All Hail Shadow
25. His World
26. Crisis City
27. Dreams of an Absolution
28. Seven Rings in Hand
29. Endless Possibility
30. Rooftop Run
31. Vs. Egg Dragoon
32. Knight of the Wind
33. Reach for the Stars
34. Planet Wisp
35. Wonder World
36. Windy Hill - Zone 1
37. The Deadly Six Theme
38. Honeycomb Highway
39. Sonic Mania Medley
40. Lights, Camera, Action!
41. Blossom Haze
42. Rogues Gallery
43. Built to Rule / Steel Cortex
44. Fist Bump
45. Sunset Heights
46. Moonlight Battlefield (Aqua Road)
47. I'm Here
48. Undefeatable
49. Break Through It All
50. Find Your Flame

Oh, btw: the game just sold over a million copies.

Sonic x Shadow Generations has sold 1 million units https://t.co/pr7FlMGNus pic.twitter.com/ul3PI8OFAG

— Wario64 (@Wario64) October 25, 2024

As massive of an improvement this would be over what we have now, I still find myself thinking of songs that I feel should be there.

Even at 50 it doesn't feel like enough to me. Though honestly I'd say the same for a lot of series. There's just too much good music.

 

[SharkLord]

I got a new sig!

Whatcha think?

For the sake of Smash related discussion...

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

Ooh, 28 newcomers? That could be fun to try and spin a roster out of; Especially if I stick with my usual 60 fighters limit; That's almost half a roster of newcomers. That'd be interesting to see.

• Waluigi's already on most predictions, but Paper Mario a little less so, and King Boo is mentioned a couple times but not that often. I'd especially roll with King Boo, I haven't played Luigi's Mansion but it sounds like you could do something fun with him
• Three Zelda newcomers at once? Y'know what, sure, no more competing for the newcomer that's not another Link/Zelda/Ganon. We can have out cake and eat it too.
• Raven Beak's a smash hit of the Switch era, Bandana Dee's slowly but surely climbed his way up the ranks, and Krystal would be a pleasant surprise as a long-standing but less relevant request. I'd be pretty happy with 'em (I did put the three on the roster)
• Koraidon . Motorcycle lizard. I think he's funny. The creature .
• Tiki would be interesting to see in action; Obviously we need the dragon, but she doesn't really partially shapeshift like Corrin does, so we'd probably want a stance character or something. And since she doesn't have fancy dragon drills, her humanoid form would probably have to resort to throwing hands
• Ashley and Oatchi are also on my roster; Ashley's pretty popular and Oatchi covers Pikmin's breakout hit. Plus, we get a witch girl and a strange dog, and those are fun archetypes
• Tails... Truth be told I'd prefer Shadow, but hey, I see the appeal. Sonic's Luigi, the longstanding No. 2
• Elma doesn't seem as likely compared to Mio or Noah, but y'know what I'll let XCX fans have this. Their game is stuck on the Wii U without servers and a remake might be too much work to prioritize; I've got no stake in the Xenoblade race, but the least we can do is let them have Elma.
• Octavio will probably need to commission a smaller mech to fit on the stage, but after that I think he's got a lot of fun picks
• Ayumi would be interesting to see; I'm not sure how to spin a moveset out of the first two games, truth be told, so a lot of it might end up as freestyling
• Isaac's got a strong support base and cool earth powers, so why not? Earth in general is rarely a "protagonist" element compared to fire, lightning, or the vaguely-defined "light," so Isaac's unique in that regard
• Little knowledge regarding Rhythim Heaven or The Last Story, but I'm all for overlooked niche pulls and revivals. Let's give them a shot
• Astral Chain and Ring Fit are the Switch's biggest new IPs left fighterless, so it makes sense; I'd be pretty happy with the Legionis in particular, Astral Chain was sick
• Pheonix, Lloyd, and Crono's games all seem quite beloved and were major fixtures of their respective consoles; I've never gotten around to playing them, but I'd be down
• Pyro would be the funniest @#$%ing outcome. TF2 in Smash, but it's specifically Pyro over someone like Scout or Heavy, and also Pyro
• Shovel Knight and Sans for some indies, nice. Shovel Knight's no longer on top of the world, likely because Yacht Club opted to work on Mina the Hollower before a sequel, but he's still going steady and got some decent Nintendo cred with the Amiibos. And Sans is Sans friggin' Undertale

So y'know what? A little unorthodox, but I'll take it. It strikes a good balance of "safe," popular modern characters and more niche figures. I think your lineup has the sauce . Kinda makes me want to make my own unorthodox newcomer lineup

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

To celebrate the official launch of Sonic x Shadow Generations, I've decided to compile a list of 50 Sonic songs I'd like to see in the next Smash game:

It's already out?
I've had nothing to play for a couple of years and then they really dropped Sonic, Mario & Luigi, Banjo-Tooie and a new Zelda in the span of like two months

 

[Louie G.]

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

It doesn’t cover every single thing I want, obviously, but if I got Chorus Kids and Sans I could never complain. Octavio is a great bonus among a lot of other really fun characters - Tiki, Waluigi, King Boo, Phoenix… I’d be going out of my mind if Pyro made it against the odds. That's a real inspired choice among the mercs too, I'd be happy with any of them but you can get really silly with Pyro.

Also... it's not my intent to dogpile on superprincess, so I wanna say this in a more general sense. But I think it's interesting that Oatchi has suddenly joined the lineup of usual suspects equivalent to Waluigi or Ring Fit Trainee. Not that he's been an absolute rarity before, but a number of factors both internally on the boards and related to Nintendo's marketing have made him a more prominent topic. Prior to this, I'd say it was less common that people were convinced about Pikmin needing a second character.

And new unique Splatoon characters as well. As we open up our minds to further first party representation you see Oatchi, DJ Octavio and/or an idol team popping up more consistently. For these characters to be joining the ranks of the "same old" is a pretty good accomplishment compared to the consensus on them maybe six months ago. I guess my point in highlighting this is that the dial is always moving. The same old tired conversation points today are not the same as they were before... it was a struggle to get people to discuss Animal Crossing, Splatoon or Pikmin on equal merit to get fully unique newcomers when I first started coming back on here. Now it's par for the course. I get why it might bore people now but for me it's quite validating and rewarding to see.

 

[SharkLord]

It doesn’t cover every single thing I want, obviously, but if I got Chorus Kids and Sans I could never complain. Octavio is a great bonus among a lot of other really fun characters - Tiki, Waluigi, King Boo, Phoenix… I’d be going out of my mind if Pyro made it against the odds. That's a real inspired choice among the mercs too, I'd be happy with any of them but you can get really silly with Pyro.

Also... it's not my intent to dogpile on superprincess, so I wanna say this in a more general sense. But I think it's interesting that Oatchi has suddenly joined the lineup of usual suspects equivalent to Waluigi or Ring Fit Trainee. Not that he's been an absolute rarity before, but a number of factors both internally on the boards and related to Nintendo's marketing have made him a more prominent topic. Prior to this, I'd say it was less common that people were convinced about Pikmin needing a second character.

And new unique Splatoon characters as well. As we open up our minds to further first party representation you see Oatchi, DJ Octavio and/or an idol team popping up more consistently. For these characters to be joining the ranks of the "same old" is a pretty good accomplishment compared to the consensus on them maybe six months ago. I guess my point in highlighting this is that the dial is always moving. The same old tired conversation points today are not the same as they were before... it was a struggle to get people to discuss Animal Crossing, Splatoon or Pikmin on equal merit to get fully unique newcomers when I first started coming back on here. Now it's par for the course. I get why it might bore people now but for me it's quite validating and rewarding to see.

With Oatchi, I'd say it probably helped that King Sonnn DeDeDoo put together a high-quality moveset visualizer with a clear direction, so non-fans had an idea of who and what Oatchi was beyond "Pikmin rep 2." Though, it was also in large part because people just kept bringing him up until he slowly entered the general discourse; A mix of patience and clear moveset explainations are big helps in promoting a character

 

[Gengar84]

I know it’s not particularly likely to happen but one of the reasons I’d be hyped about E.M.M.I. as a potential playable character is that it has the ability to crawl up walls and ceilings. I think that combined with its cool looking design could make for a really fun Smash character.

I don’t think many here have played the old Aliens vs Predator shooter on the PC but the Aliens in that game were able to do the same thing and it looked like a ton of fun. I used to watch my brother play that a lot with his friend.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I got a new sig!

Whatcha think?

For the sake of Smash related discussion...

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

Mostly indifference.

Only two characters that I'd legit "want" (Waluigi and Shovel Knight), one acceptable substitution for someone I'd want (Pyro), one understandable but disappointing substitution (Tails), and someone I actively dislike (Krystal).

The rest I don't have strong enough feelings one way or the other with the best I can say about Koraidon being "at least it isn't Meowscarada".

 

[fogbadge]

I know it’s not particularly likely to happen but one of the reasons I’d be hyped about E.M.M.I. as a potential playable character is that it has the ability to crawl up walls and ceilings. I think that combined with its cool looking design could make for a really fun Smash character.

E.M.M.I. may be the only character I want in on grounds of animations. their movements were something else and that whistling sound they made.

 

[Gengar84]

E.M.M.I. may be the only character I want in on grounds of animations. their movements were something else and that whistling sound they made.

My only problem with E.M.M.I. is that its name is really annoying to type out on a phone lol.

 

[Laniv]

I got a new sig!

Whatcha think?

For the sake of Smash related discussion...

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

No Toad or Tom Nook

But on the other hand it has King Boo, Bandana Dee, Tails, Oatchi, and Elma, so it's much much more good than bad.

And Crono my GOAT

 

[fogbadge]

My only problem with E.M.M.I. is that its name is really annoying to type out on a phone lol.

yeah it’s tricky

 

[Gengar84]

Are there any games you love a lot but prefer characters over the main character? There’s almost too many to name for me. On one hand, the game getting any playable representation in Smash at all is awesome but I can never really be fully hyped if I didn’t have a strong opinion on the actual protagonist as a character. Is this just a me thing?

 

[SneakyLink]

Are there any games you love a lot but prefer characters over the main character? There’s almost too many to name for me. On one hand, the game getting any playable representation in Smash at all is awesome but I can never really be fully hyped if I didn’t have a strong opinion on the actual protagonist. Is this just a me thing?

To me, that’d be Tales of Symphonia.

While I understand Lloyd being chosen if it gets a character, I’d prefer Colette if I could choose a playable rep.

 

[Gengar84]

To me, that’d be Tales of Symphonia.

While I understand Lloyd being chosen if it gets a character, I’d prefer Colette if I could choose a playable rep.

Sheena is my favorite character from Symphonia but she’s even less likely than Colette. Sheena wasn’t the most exciting character to use since a lot of her animations looked so similar. Her summons were really cool though.

For Tales overall, I’d love to see either Velvet Crowe or Shionne. I thought both characters were great and Shionne had some great character development. Velvet would be fine solo but I love the thought of an Alphen/Shionne duo since they play off each other so well both mechanically and in the story.

 

[fogbadge]

Are there any games you love a lot but prefer characters over the main character? There’s almost too many to name for me. On one hand, the game getting any playable representation in Smash at all is awesome but I can never really be fully hyped if I didn’t have a strong opinion on the actual protagonist as a character. Is this just a me thing?

haven’t you heard me banging on about Toad all this time?

also Tails

 

[Gengar84]

haven’t you heard me banging on about Toad all this time?

also Tails

True, I guess I was more referring to games that didn’t already have a playable character in Smash but I never specified that.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Same old. King Boo and Miraidon are marginally more interesting than the rest but still picks we hear about over and over again.

Smash fans should start to think outside the box. I'm tired of the same Waluigi/Impa/Bandana Dee/Oatchi/Ring Fit lineup.

Well aside from Shadow i think my third party lineup is pretty unorthodox.

Idont know why i put Ryunosuke as an echo when ive specified i want him as an alt skin. Mostly to use the courtroom from his games as a stage.

 

[ninjahmos]

Oh, we're doing rosters again? Well, here's my rehashed roster:

Again, I know it's not great, but I tried mixing most likely with some of my most wanted characters. Anyway, tell me what you think.

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Honestly? Anything but bold!

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

I got a new sig!

Whatcha think?

For the sake of Smash related discussion...

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

You should switch Ayumi and the Chorus Kid's spots so it looks like the Chorus Kids are trying to dodge King Boo's tongue

 

[PersonAngelo53]

Are there any games you love a lot but prefer characters over the main character? There’s almost too many to name for me. On one hand, the game getting any playable representation in Smash at all is awesome but I can never really be fully hyped if I didn’t have a strong opinion on the actual protagonist as a character. Is this just a me thing?

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

youtu.be

Literally any side character from the Kiseki series I would be cool with. Also every character basically has a perfect final smash move already made in the series as shown with the super moves here.

 

[ninjahmos]

Honestly? Anything but bold!

Fair enough.

I thought that maybe just ONE Echo wouldn't hurt so I added in Daisy, but maybe I should've used Bowser Jr. instead.

 

[Louie G.]

Anyway, tell me what you think.

Pretty cool, but the glaring absences are Isabelle and anyone from Fire Emblem Awakening. For the former you're just cutting one of Nintendo's most prominent and highly marketed mascots, for the latter you're cutting the entirety of the most prominently represented FE game in the series. I get why Robin was cut to make space for a new character, although I don't agree with the decision, but I guess Lucina should at least be safe?

As for Isabelle, I just don't think anyone has any justifiable reason to remove existing Animal Crossing content. If the problem is overlap with Villager, they would sooner iterate on Isabelle to make her more unique than cut her altogether. She is far too significant of an asset to the company and is arguably more popular to play than Villager these days... at least from what I see, personally.

In general I also feel underwhelmed by this crop of first party newcomers, but it's easier to talk about the veterans that aren't here than the newcomers that I think should be. I get that it's tough when we're talking a significantly condensed roster but I dunno if this would cut it.

 

[Kirby Dragons]

Oh, we're doing rosters again? Well, here's my rehashed roster:

View attachment 395555

Again, I know it's not great, but I tried mixing most likely with some of my most wanted characters. Anyway, tell me what you think.

I think the rebalancing of series is totally fine, but there's a notable lack of newcomers. A couple rows don't even have a single new character.

 

[SharkLord]

Pretty cool, but the glaring absences are Isabelle and anyone from Fire Emblem Awakening. For the former you're just cutting one of Nintendo's most prominent and highly marketed mascots, for the latter you're cutting the entirety of the most prominently represented FE game in the series. I get why Robin was cut to make space for a new character, although I don't agree with the decision, but I guess Lucina should at least be safe?

As for Isabelle, I just don't think anyone has any justifiable reason to remove existing Animal Crossing content. If the problem is overlap with Villager, they would sooner iterate on Isabelle to make her more unique than cut her altogether. She is far too significant of an asset to the company and is arguably more popular to play than Villager these days... at least from what I see, personally.

In general I also feel underwhelmed by this crop of first party newcomers, but it's easier to talk about the veterans that aren't here than the newcomers that I think should be. I get that it's tough when we're talking a significantly condensed roster but I dunno if this would cut it.

It's kinda interesting when you think about it. Robin is one of the most distinct FE characters in terms of moveset and appearance, but seems to be put on the chopping block often when it comes down to FE roster revamps. I'd imagine it's largely a mix of A: Wanting to keep the lineup relatively limited, B: Wanting to make room for a newcomer, usually Lyn and/or Alear/a Switch 2 reserve slot, and C: Lucina being far and away the most popular Awakening character and being an Echo of Marth, which is usually seen as not factoring into the final count due to being quick moveset clones. Even if you declone her a bit, it seems like most rosters are fine with Lucina as an Echo for Awakening coverage, letting them throw in another Fire Emblem character without overloading things.

also i think a lot of people just dont like his moveset

 

[Hypercat-Z]

Fair enough.

I thought that maybe just ONE Echo wouldn't hurt so I added in Daisy, but maybe I should've used Bowser Jr. instead.

What? You think Bowser Jr. is a echo? WHAT??

 

[SPEN18]

On Falco/Wolf

Wolf never would've made it as a full unique character. The whole point of adding him was that he'd take less work than Krystal. So, yeah you could have given him some of the weapons from Assault or whatever else and that would've been cool, but too much of that just defeats his one actual advantage over Krystal.

To be real, both Falco and Wolf were very lucky inclusions. One, that Melee was actively looking to fill its roster with a lot of clone characters, and two, that they had just enough resources in Brawl to make another clone character for Star Fox, but not enough for that to be a unique character. Both are not character types that would typically make it in, with one being a pure sidekick / secondary party member type and the other a secondary villain type. It just so happens that Star Fox was considered a big enough franchise at the time to get secondary reps, at least as clones, and that Fox's original moveset is, I guess, abstracted enough from the source material (for lack of better wording) that other SF characters could be put over it (also the on-foot gameplay in SF even up through Assault was simplistic enough that Falco/Wolf didn't really do much of anything in concrete gameplay that Fox couldn't).

Anyway, it's strange to think about how Falco often manages to escape being grouped by fans with the rest of the "Melee clone" crew consisting of Doc, Pichu, YL, Roy, and Falcondorf. Ignoring Falcondorf as a pretty special case, these are all generally considered pretty low-priority characters. And again ignoring Falcondorf, there really isn't much about Falco's resume or semiclone gameplay role that should, on paper, separate him from the group. Sure, Doc, Pichu, and YL get a rap for being "alternate versions" of other characters, and those plus Roy are parts of series with many more characters than SF, and that's probably where a lot of the distancing comes from, alongside Falco's competitive relevance to Melee. But then again, with SF's decrease in relevance and Falco's competitive spotlight waning in the newer entries, those advantages are likely weaker than ever. So it's weird to see so many people put him into "near lock" status when personally I think he's closer to the rest of those Melee clones in priority.

 

[ninjahmos]

What? You think Bowser Jr. is a echo? WHAT??

What I meant to say was maybe ONE Echo wouldn't hurt so I picked Daisy, but then I thought maybe the roster should've been Echo-less, so I should've picked Bowser Jr. instead.

 

[Kirbeh]

Oh, we're doing rosters again? Well, here's my rehashed roster:

View attachment 395555

Again, I know it's not great, but I tried mixing most likely with some of my most wanted characters. Anyway, tell me what you think.

I know it gets asked every couple pages and I probably should of made note of it by now, but what's the program you and others have been using? Last time I made a roster was still in the old Roster Maker hosted here on the boards.

Or did you whip that up on your own in PS or CSP?

 

[SharkLord]

On Falco/Wolf

Wolf never would've made it as a full unique character. The whole point of adding him was that he'd take less work than Krystal. So, yeah you could have given him some of the weapons from Assault or whatever else and that would've been cool, but too much of that just defeats his one actual advantage over Krystal.

To be real, both Falco and Wolf were very lucky inclusions. One, that Melee was actively looking to fill its roster with a lot of clone characters, and two, that they had just enough resources in Brawl to make another clone character for Star Fox, but not enough for that to be a unique character. Both are not character types that would typically make it in, with one being a pure sidekick / secondary party member type and the other a secondary villain type. It just so happens that Star Fox was considered a big enough franchise at the time to get secondary reps, at least as clones, and that Fox's original moveset is, I guess, abstracted enough from the source material (for lack of better wording) that other SF characters could be put over it (also the on-foot gameplay in SF even up through Assault was simplistic enough that Falco/Wolf didn't really do much of anything in concrete gameplay that Fox couldn't).

Anyway, it's strange to think about how Falco often manages to escape being grouped by fans with the rest of the "Melee clone" crew consisting of Doc, Pichu, YL, Roy, and Falcondorf. Ignoring Falcondorf as a pretty special case, these are all generally considered pretty low-priority characters. And again ignoring Falcondorf, there really isn't much about Falco's resume or semiclone gameplay role that should, on paper, separate him from the group. Sure, Doc, Pichu, and YL get a rap for being "alternate versions" of other characters, and those plus Roy are parts of series with many more characters than SF, and that's probably where a lot of the distancing comes from, alongside Falco's competitive relevance to Melee. But then again, with SF's decrease in relevance and Falco's competitive spotlight waning in the newer entries, those advantages are likely weaker than ever. So it's weird to see so many people put him into "near lock" status when personally I think he's closer to the rest of those Melee clones in priority.

To be fair, Falco's been a staple since his introduction. Aside from Falcondorf - A unique case, as you said - Everyone else skipped Brawl, and Doctor Mario and Young Link wouldn't come back until Ultimate. Falco, on the other hand, stuck around and got decloned, which stuck for 4 and Ultimate. Plus, as you said, Falco's a distinct character and not an alternate version, on top of being a staple of the Melee tournament scene, so he's not seen as replaceable in the same way

I know it gets asked every couple pages and I probably should of made note of it by now, but what's the program you and others have been using? Last time I made a roster was still in the old Roster Maker hosted here on the boards.

Or did you whip that up on your own in PS or CSP?

I use this thing https://benshoeman.github.io/Roster-Maker/

Truth be told it's rather clunky and takes a while to set up, but it's what I've been working with for my rosters

 

[ninjahmos]

I know it gets asked every couple pages and I probably should of made note of it by now, but what's the program you and others have been using? Last time I made a roster was still in the old Roster Maker hosted here on the boards.

Or did you whip that up on your own in PS or CSP?

Smash Bros. Roster Maker

Smash Bros. Roster Maker

Create your ideal roster for Super Smash Bros. in the browser!

benshoeman.github.io

 

[TheLamerGamer]

Been playing the playtest finally (couldn't yesterday because of an assignment, took the evening off today), and without really saying too much (or anything of substance), my guess of it being a switch 2 tech demo stands, but for a feature available at launch... probably not. Feels too barebones still, although the foundation they have is super fun (I'm enjoying just moving around, it feels really good).

As for a character from it in Smash... nah. Can't say anything about it properly but I don't think these guys are gonna be memorable by design.

 

[ninjahmos]

OK, I admit that last roster was pretty bad, but hopefully this one will be better.

 

[SPEN18]

To be fair, Falco's been a staple since his introduction. Aside from Falcondorf - A unique case, as you said - Everyone else skipped Brawl, and Doctor Mario and Young Link wouldn't come back until Ultimate. Falco, on the other hand, stuck around and got decloned, which stuck for 4 and Ultimate. Plus, as you said, Falco's a distinct character and not an alternate version, on top of being a staple of the Melee tournament scene, so he's not seen as replaceable in the same way

Yeah, those are all reasons, but what I'm saying is most of those reasons are weaker than I think some give them credit for. Like, Roy is not an "alt ego" character either and he still gets the low-priority rap. The Melee competitive scene thing has literally zero relevance now, it just influenced Falco's in-Smash popularity, which has seemingly gone down as the roster has expanded. And then again the "staple" thing I think is probably a weaker argument than ever before, too. Of course, simply outprioritizing a good chunk of the other clones would give Falco a shot to return on its own, I just think if you compare him to an average semiclone like, say, Roy or Lucas (if we allow comparison with the Brawl newcomers), it's much more of an apples-and-oranges thing than some would purport.

 

[SharkLord]

Yeah, those are all reasons, but what I'm saying is most of those reasons are weaker than I think some give them credit for. Like, Roy is not an "alt ego" character either and he still gets the low-priority rap. The Melee competitive scene thing has literally zero relevance now, it just influenced Falco's in-Smash popularity, which has seemingly gone down as the roster has expanded. And then again the "staple" thing I think is probably a weaker argument than ever before, too. Of course, simply outprioritizing a good chunk of the other clones would give Falco a shot to return on its own, I just think if you compare him to an average semiclone like, say, Roy or Lucas (if we allow comparison with the Brawl newcomers), it's much more of an apples-and-oranges thing than some would purport.

I think popularity has a big role in keeping Falco around, honestly. Star Fox might be a dormant franchise and Nintendo doesn't do much to support Melee's competitive scene, but Falco's popularity kept going and I think that's enough incentive for Sakurai to want to keep him around. For what it's worth, Roy and Lucas both came back as DLC because of being vocally requested to come back; Even if Falco did get cut in the base game, I'd imagine there would be enough outcry to justify him being DLC later on

 

[Nabbitfan730]

I got a new sig!

Whatcha think?

For the sake of Smash related discussion...

This is your new newcomer lineup in a new Smash game. How do you react?

Paper Mario, Midna, that SV legendary, Tails and Elma? Huge Pass. Safe and Uninteresting

Some of these can be trimmed.

Also why not Heavy?

 

[SharkLord]

Paper Mario, Midna, that SV legendary, Tails and Elma? Huge Pass. Safe and Uninteresting

Some of these can be trimmed.

Also why not Heavy?

I'm going to be honest I have not heard Elma's name uttered in like a year before now. The current "safe picks" for Xeno are currently Noah and Mio thanks to XC3 being one of the big releases on the later Switch era. Meanwhile, XCX is locked to an unpopular system without servers, and while the devs have stated they're interested in making an XCX2, they also said they wanted to make an XC4 in the same interview. Elma is not a safe pick in the slightest

 

[Shinuto]

Here's my newcomer picks restrained to 24 fighters

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Paper Mario, Midna, that SV legendary, Tails and Elma? Huge Pass. Safe and Uninteresting

Some of these can be trimmed.

Also why not Heavy?

Midna and Elma safe?

I'm starting to think people don't actually know what that word means.