Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[HyperSomari64]

The next Mario Kart will do just fine, so long as they replace all the pink gold and cat variants with characters people actually like.

Like Pikachu and Eddie the Mean Old Yeti.
(I don't now why did I used the wrong Pac icon)

 

[DarthEnderX]

I think the whole thing about it making not sense for Nintendo to do ports on a system with backwards compatibility is a bit blind to what the rest of the industry is doing. I've brought this up before, but one of the first releases for the PS5 was a remaster of Spider-Man, which came out only two years prior. The PS5 in general has multiple PS4 remasters/remakes. The Series X advertises next gen upgrades pretty heavily, though it's unique in that it has backwards compatibility with every Xbox game since 2001.

It would make plenty of sense for Nintendo to do a remaster of titles like BOTW as a full release, because "BOTW with good performance and higher res" is a good selling point that will do really well for comparitively little dev time. The same applies to a lot of Nintendo's major releases.

Honestly, yeah.

Even if Switch 2 WAS backwards compatible, if Nintendo was like "Here's Smash Ultimate for Sw2. It's in 4K, has rollback netcode, and is going to have more Fighters Passes", I'd be like "Here's my $70/voucher."

 

[Noipoi]

Eddie the Mean Old Yeti.

Beloved icon of a massive multimedia franchise

Pikachu

Who gives a **** obscure character from a spin off of a dormant franchise

 

[pitchfulprocessing]

Regarding this bit, I dunno, Nintendo consistently puts out regular releases, whereas Sony and Xbox only have a small handful of exclusives to bank on. Hell, Sony just doesn't have a major release to put out this year, short of more remasters. And we know that Ratchet and Clank lost money, despite inarguably getting critical acclaim and fairly high sales. Nintendo's remade some old titles, but not to the same extent as Sony's situation

Though, you raise a good point about playtesters and contractors. Nintendo's 99% retention rate is impressive, but that may well have been inflated by not counting part-time workers

The easiest way to look at it to just look at the number of SIE published titles for this year on both the PS5 and PS4. Counting unique titles and exclusing classics, they have 7 for this year released or announced so far. Now look at Nintendo's output this year, counting unique titles, they have 7 released or announced so far.

Sony doesn't have a major title announced yet this year, but I don't think Nintendo does either really, and comparing the two, Helldivers 2 absolutely eclipses any of Nintendo's releases this year in terms of sales and profability. Of course, a lot of that is on PC, but that speaks to how their strategies differ. Sony has been finding a lot of success with pushing for their games as timed exclusives while later giving a PC port, and it's significant because even prior to getting a PC port, those remasters sell really well.

You might have seen this image floating around, and while it gives sort of a general idea, it doesn't really tell the full story

Nintendo and Sony count their profits in different ways in a lot of areas. A significant example is game sales, the standard is that when you purchase a game on a platform, the platform holder gets 30% of the revenue while the remaining 70% goes to the publisher of the game. Nintendo counts this as 30% revenue and 0% expense, while Sony counts it as 100% revenue and 70% expense, which results in Sony having a seemingly lower profit margin as 70% was never theirs, despite it being the same amount of money. Both kinds of counting are common. This kind of bookkeeping is mostly just meant for a company's internal margins and benchmarks, and aren't meant for direct comparisons to other companies. From what we know, Nintendo probably is more profitable, but we definitely know Sony makes way more revenue, which is useful in its own measure. Really, it's complicated and there's a lot of factors going into these kinds of things, which is part of why console wars are so silly.

I guess the real point is that I do think AAA budgets and dev times are ballooning far too high, and as Nintendo increases the strength of their hardware, the effects will become more noticeable to the public for them too. This is a great thread on the matter that I think is worth a read if you're interested.

 

[TheQuester]

As much as the roster was and always will be the most exciting part or any fighting game, all that's changed is that Super Smash Bros. can't sell itself on just the roster. It's gotta have new ideas be it single player, new core mechanics, or...well even good online would go a long way.

It's entirely possible that the series will fully commit to a Street Fighter/Mortal Kombat approach where each game is built around a new set of mechanics that make them unique.

This is a hot take but i wouldn't mind that.
My favourite memories about Smash outside the pre-release is me playing the single player content in Brawl lol.

 

[DarthEnderX]

This is a hot take but i wouldn't mind that.

I'd mind the hell out of that.

Street Fighter should have just kept adding characters to Street Fighter 3, forever!

 

[ninjahmos]

If there's one boss from The Subspace Emissary I'm hoping they'll bring back... it's Tabuu.

 

[DarthEnderX]

If there's one boss from The Subspace Emissary I'm hoping they'll bring back... it's

Porky.

 

[Noipoi]

If there's one boss from The Subspace Emissary I'm hoping they'll bring back... it's Tabuu.

I don’t care how taboo it is. Just tell me

Ba-dum tsss

 

[Wonder Smash]

If Doom Slayer gets in the next game, do you think they'd get Mick Gordon to do a new remix of Rip & Tear or BFG Division like they got Grant Kirkhope to do a new remix of Spiral Mountain?

It doesn't matter to me. I just hope they have the original 1993 versions of the themes.

 

[TheQuester]

what about and splatoon boss?

 

[superprincess]

But if it's a port how will I get rid of Lipless Peach and Derpy Shulk without hacking my game?

On a serious note. If it don't look fresh, there will absolutely be a problem. Just look at what happened to the NSMB series. Totally solid games whose reputation got ruined by stale presentation and recycling the same old assets.

ULTIMATE UGLY ♡

 

[DarthEnderX]

On a serious note. If it don't look fresh, there will absolutely be a problem. Just look at what happened to the NSMB series. Totally solid games whose reputation got ruined by stale presentation and recycling the same old assets.

Meanwhile, TTYD comes out looking pretty much the same, and nobody complains

 

[ninjahmos]

On a serious note. If it don't look fresh, there will absolutely be a problem. Just look at what happened to the NSMB series. Totally solid games whose reputation got ruined by stale presentation and recycling the same old assets.

They could give the next game the Wonder treatment, with new animations and a new artstyle.

Then again... time and resources are a thing.

 

[cashregister9]

Meanwhile, TTYD comes out looking pretty much the same, and nobody complains

You should see how angry people get when it comes to white outlines in Paper Mario....

 

[superprincess]

Meanwhile, TTYD comes out looking pretty much the same, and nobody complains

It has obviously been modernized. You need to be visually impaired not to notice a difference, especially in the environments. Also, comparing a potential sequel to a remake is definitely a choice.

 

[Noipoi]

Meanwhile, TTYD comes out looking pretty much the same, and nobody complains

It's a faithful adaptation, but look at a side by side of the old game and the remake and you'll see the difference.

 

[ninjahmos]

Meanwhile, TTYD comes out looking pretty much the same, and nobody complains

It actually looks more... paper-like, if you know what I mean.

I mean, the series IS called Paper Mario.

 

[Garteam]

"Every floor looks like it has been buffered to ****" and "the game's framerate has been cut in half" are indeed visual changes.

They're not exactly what I'd call positive changes, but they're changes nonetheless.

 

[cashregister9]

In terms of visuals, I do want a different style just so I can look at something new

but I really don't have that many problems with Ultimate's visuals, Except the god damn Saturation.

I did a test for this a while ago

Here are some unedited smash screenshots

here is the same thing with slightly increased saturation

Obviously this is an incredibly imperfect experiment but I do think that the increased saturation looks better, I don't know why ultimate is so washed out

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

But if it's a port how will I get rid of Lipless Peach and Derpy Shulk without hacking my game?

On a serious note. If it don't look fresh, there will absolutely be a problem. Just look at what happened to the NSMB series. Totally solid games whose reputation got ruined by stale presentation and recycling the same old assets.

ULTIMATE UGLY ♡

On the other hand TOTK recycles 90% of its graphics and content from BOTW and nobody minds.
And even NSMBU has sold a ton (more than Wonder, and more than Tropical Freeze) and has been very successful critically so I think it's fair to say most people didn't mind its graphics all that much.

Off-topic: purely as a platformer, NSMBU mops the floor with Wonder imo

 

[Hadokeyblade]

You should see how angry people get when it comes to white outlines in Paper Mario....

I'm that guy.

 

[Among Waddle Dees]

You should see how angry people get when it comes to white outlines in Paper Mario....

Maybe I'm in the minority, but the white outlines might've been a harmless inclusion if they used it right. The problem was that they introduced it during a time when they were implementing an awful, deliberately choppy animation style. There was not really a good reason to have that few animation frames beyond the 3DS hardware. White outlines were mainly just the victim of the storm, even if they weren't exactly great to look at.

The fact they emulated TTYD's old animation style was actually the first excitement phase I had about the remake, before even noticing they kept the old NPC designs intact.

 

[Gorgonzales]

Obviously this is an incredibly imperfect experiment but I do think that the increased saturation looks better, I don't know why ultimate is so washed out

Because then it would be even harder to tell it apart from Smash 4

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

On the other hand TOTK recycles 90% of its graphics and content from BOTW and nobody minds.

It's also a direct sequel in a series that doesn't normally have them, and only the second game with that exact artstyle. Super Smash Bros. consists entirely of direct sequels, and its art style changes in every game, but it's current look is extremely similar to the previous game. I don't think it's that great of a comparison.

 

[TheQuester]

It's also a direct sequel in a series that doesn't normally have them, and only the second game with that exact artstyle. Super Smash Bros. consists entirely of direct sequels, and its art style changes in every game, but it's current look is extremely similar to the previous game. I don't think it's that great of a comparison.

His statemen isn't even true because i've seen plenty of people that wishes they got a game that's not a BOTW sequel instead of TOTK and even call it BOTW 2.0....so im not sure where he's geting "nobody minds" at lol.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Because then it would be even harder to tell it apart from Smash 4

Would it be that difficult?

Spoiler: Comparison

 

[Will]

Would it be that difficult?

Spoiler: Comparison

View attachment 390153
View attachment 390154

No, because Snake is in the second picture.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Would it be that difficult?

Don't think that's the best comparison, I can only tell the bottom pic can't be Smash 4 because Snake is there.

A better comparison would be how Ultimate DK doesn't have the fuzziness of Smash 4's:

Spoiler

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

No, because Snake is in the second picture.

Ah crap. I was trying to get good comparable photos that didn't have something like that, but the pictures from the official site wouldn't load on here for me so I had slim pickings.

Don't think that's the best comparison, I can only tell the bottom pic can't be Smash 4 because Snake is there.

Even with the blunder I suppose that answers my question: It is too difficult to tell since if you look at them at (not even) gameplay distance you need characters that weren't in SSBWIIU to determine if it's SSBU or not.

 

[Scrimblo Bimblo]

His statemen isn't even true because i've seen plenty of people that wishes they got a game that's not a BOTW sequel instead of TOTK and even call it BOTW 2.0....so im not sure where he's geting "nobody minds" at lol.

I'm one of those actually. TotK is the first and only Zelda game that I've dropped, but hey most people seem to love it
Recycling the world map was a little too much imo.

It's also a direct sequel in a series that doesn't normally have them, and only the second game with that exact artstyle. Super Smash Bros. consists entirely of direct sequels, and its art style changes in every game, but it's current look is extremely similar to the previous game. I don't think it's that great of a comparison.

But when has Smash ever had a radical art style change after Melee? The most unique one is Brawl and that's mostly just due to the colors being very desaturated.

 

[TheQuester]

What do you guys think are Lloyd chances in Smash 6?
I played Symphonia like years ago and it was fun.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

But when has Smash ever had a radical art style change after Melee? The most unique one is Brawl and that's mostly just due to the colors being very desaturated.

You answered your own question. Super Smash Bros. Brawl follows the "hyper-realism" trend by adding a ton of detail and turning the saturation way down. SSB4 does a 180, turning the saturation way up and removing detail from characters that don't need it. Even SSBU tries something different, adopting a watercolor aesthetic, it's just the result is not super different compared to SSB4.

 

[Gengar84]

What do you guys think are Lloyd chances in Smash 6?
I played Symphonia like years ago and it was fun.

I think Lloyd has a pretty decent chance. I think the fact that he had a Mii outfit and some of the Mii custom moves appear to have been inspired by his arts is a good sign. I’m a big fan of Tales as a series but I never really cared much for Lloyd as a character. He’s probably the most likely but I’d personally rather have Shionne, Velvet, or Yuri. Symphonia had my favorite overall in game soundtrack so I’d still be happy with Lloyd even though he isn’t who I’d personally go with.

 

[Freduardo]

What do you guys think are Lloyd chances in Smash 6?
I played Symphonia like years ago and it was fun.

Probably not great.

But if you liked Tales of Symphonia and have a switch, Tales of Vesperia goes on sale often and is similarly fun. Especially with a friend.

 

[Gengar84]

Probably not great.

But if you liked Tales of Symphonia and have a switch, Tales of Vesperia goes on sale often and is similarly fun. Especially with a friend.

What makes you think his chances aren’t great? There are so many potential newcomers that I agree any one third party character individually probably doesn’t have great odds but Tales seems like it has a pretty good shot, Lloyd or otherwise. I’m not sure but I’d imagine that Bandai-Namco assisting with the development of Smash probably makes negotiations easier. I feel like any character that has a Mii outfit or Assist Trophy probably has a bit of an edge since they already have one foot in the door. Of course, I could be wrong and Smash is pretty hard to predict.

 

[TheQuester]

What makes you think his chances aren’t great? There are so many potential newcomers that I agree any one third party character individually probably doesn’t have great odds but Tales seems like it has a pretty good shot, Lloyd or otherwise. I’m not sure but I’d imagine that Bandai-Namco assisting with the development of Smash probably makes negotiations easier. I feel like any character that has a Mii outfit or Assist Trophy probably has a bit of an edge since they already have one foot in the door. Of course, I could be wrong and Smash is pretty hard to predict.

Well, tbf, it's possible they could pick Yuri from Vesperia over him and i guess even Cress and Alphen (i doubt these last two, but it's technically possible).
But i do think Lloyd is the most likely Tales rep eitherway.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I feel like any character that has a Mii outfit or Assist Trophy probably has a bit of an edge since they already have one foot in the door.

And yet the number of times this lead anywhere could be counted on one finger when it comes to guests.

And it still ended up being someone else.

 

[RileyXY1]

And yet the number of times this lead anywhere could be counted on one finger.

Just four so far, and all of them are first-party.

 

[Gengar84]

Well, tbf, it's possible they could pick Yuri from Vesperia over him and i guess even Cress and Alphen (i doubt these last two, but it's technically possible).

Yeah that’s true. I think Lloyd is the most popular among Smash fans but he’s far from the only viable option. If I could choose any main protagonist from the series to join Smash, it would be a tag duo of Alphen and Shionne followed by Velvet Crowe. Yuri is another great character but I feel he’s probably not as interesting moveset wise as either of the above options.