Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[TheYungLink]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to. I'll start:

Nintendo:

Dixie Kong
Toadette
Midna
Style Savvy character
Elma
Fiora
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard
Lyn
Caeda

Third-party:

Lara Croft
2B
Female alts for The Hero (specifically Dragon Quest III and IV)
Carmen Sandiego (thanks to this thread for bringing it up, I really want this now lol)
Jill Valentine
Chun-Li

Even working with this "limitation", there's a ton of great characters in here. They have as much reason to be here as many of the other characters already in Smash. So all the people scared of or disgusted by the prospect of "adding a female character JUST to fill a quota", try it for yourself and see if you REALLY think it's so bad.

 

[Schnee117]

I mean to be fair SNK ported like 80% of his series to switch before Terry joined Smash and I'm pretty sure Joker's 3DS game was coming the same week as he was announced for smash so those guys have Nintendo ties.

I'm not saying they don't have ties but that the ties they have aren't particularly strong and are irrelevant to them being in Smash.

 

[OrpheusTelos]

Bruh, if you feel you'd be justified in boycotting Smash over K. Rool, why are you getting on people's cases over boycotting the game if a female isn't added to the DLC? That's hypocrisy right there if I've ever seen it.

Look, you yourself said you prefer cartoony, non-human mascot characters. Well, how about if some people prefer female characters? That's literally what we call a "preference".

Donkey Kong fans are truly the most oppressed social group. Clearly women and minorities don't deal with anything worse than not getting a character they want in a fighting game, nope not at all.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Smash bros is a series that's basically a hall of fame for videogame legends, I don't think an arbitrary quota is something this series needs, with the exception of maybe a "genre" quota to get characters from every kind of game in smash.

Honestly with that in mind the female characters I think truly deserve a spot in the roster are Chun-Li, Jill, Lara, Morrigan and Ms Pacman.

Maybe put Lyn in that selection as well.

 

[DarthEnderX]

name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash.

I just did this a couple pages ago, but...

Shantae [Shantae].
Toadette/Captain Toad [Treasure Tracker]
Jill Valentine [Resident Evil]
Amaterasu [Okami]
Morrigan [Darkstalkers]
Nakoruru [Samurai Shodown]
Ribbon Girl/Spring Man [ARMS]
SV-001 Metal Slug [Metal Slug] driven by Fio, Eri, Marco and Tarma.
Impa as a Sheik echo.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Steve would have Alex as a female alt.

Alex is a builder, explorer, and hunter.

 

[Ridrool64]

You all know my answer, but I'm taking the title of first Arle Nadja vote anyway.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to. I'll start:

Nintendo:

Dixie Kong
Toadette
Midna
Style Savvy character
Elma
Fiora
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard
Lyn
Caeda

Third-party:

Lara Croft
Female alts for The Hero (specifically Dragon Quest III and IV)
Carmen Sandiego (thanks to this thread for bringing it up, I really want this now lol)
Jill Valentine
Chun-Li

Even working with this "limitation", there's a ton of great characters in here. They have as much reason to be here as many of the other characters already in Smash. So all the people scared of or disgusted by the prospect of "adding a female character JUST to fill a quota", try it for yourself and see if you REALLY think it's so bad.

Hoho, this is gonna be a good one, though I'm adding a "I must like the idea of this character getting in" rule
Jeanne
Terra, Tifa, Ultimecia
Dixie
Chie, Naoto
Susie
Tetra
Vivian
Sheeda, Celica, Lyn, Edelgard, Byleth
ZX, Tron Bonne
Kumatora
Chun Li, Makoto, Ibuki, R.Mika, Juri, Menat, Poison, Sakura
Fiora, Melia, Elma
Shanoa, Sypha, Yoko, Charlotte
Blaze
Captain Syrup, Ashley, Mona
SNK: King, Leona, Nakoruru, Shiki, Blue Mary, Mai, Mature
Bloodstained: Miriam
Nier: 2B
Guilty Gear: May, I-No, ABA, Haehyun, Jam, Dizzy


That's all I'm able to think of in a rather short time after 6 hours of sleep, 7 and a half hours of physical labour and 2 hours of cycling and when it's midnight

EDIT: Just thought of a **** ton more like Jill, Morrigan, BB Hood, Orie, Hilda and even more which makes this even harder on my incredibly fatigued state

 

[GoodGrief741]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to. I'll start:

Nintendo:

Dixie Kong
Toadette
Midna
Style Savvy character
Elma
Fiora
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard
Lyn
Caeda

Third-party:

Lara Croft
2B
Female alts for The Hero (specifically Dragon Quest III and IV)
Carmen Sandiego (thanks to this thread for bringing it up, I really want this now lol)
Jill Valentine
Chun-Li

Even working with this "limitation", there's a ton of great characters in here. They have as much reason to be here as many of the other characters already in Smash. So all the people scared of or disgusted by the prospect of "adding a female character JUST to fill a quota", try it for yourself and see if you REALLY think it's so bad.

Which is why this is a discussion with no point. For one, obviously we can't alter what happens (hell, what was decided a long time ago), but also, whether you're craving for female characters, or indifferent to them, or against them, we can all be confident that characters won't be added to satisfy quotas, or excluded because of discrimination. If we get Doomguy, nobody'll be saying Sakurai's sexist. If we get Jill Valentine, nobody'll say Sakurai did it to fulfill a quota. And if we get a male rando or a female rando, we'll all agree that as flawed as the selection might have been, gender played no part in it.

Well, at least I have enough faith in humanity to believe that will be the case.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Which is why this is a discussion with no point. For one, obviously we can't alter what happens (hell, what was decided a long time ago), but also, whether you're craving for female characters, or indifferent to them, or against them, we can all be confident that characters won't be added to satisfy quotas, or excluded because of discrimination. If we get Doomguy, nobody'll be saying Sakurai's sexist. If we get Jill Valentine, nobody'll say Sakurai did it to fulfill a quota. And if we get a male rando or a female rando, we'll all agree that as flawed as the selection might have been, gender played no part in it.

Well, at least I have enough faith in humanity to believe that will be the case.

Idk man, this is the same planet with people who have such hatred for women they get incredibly furious at a woman not smiling in a movie poster

 

[Sysreq]

Hoho, this is gonna be a good one, though I'm adding a "I must like the idea of this character getting in" rule

Guilty Gear: ABA


EDIT: Just thought of a **** ton more like Jill, Morrigan, BB Hood, Orie, Hilda and even more which makes this even harder on my incredibly fatigued state

Someone acknowledges mah girl!!

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Someone acknowledges mah girl!!

Of course I'm gonna mention Nakoruru if I get to mention ****in Leona and Shiki

 

[Wunderwaft]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to. I'll start:

Nintendo:

Dixie Kong
Toadette
Midna
Style Savvy character
Elma
Fiora
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard
Lyn
Caeda

Third-party:

Lara Croft
2B
Female alts for The Hero (specifically Dragon Quest III and IV)
Carmen Sandiego (thanks to this thread for bringing it up, I really want this now lol)
Jill Valentine
Chun-Li

Even working with this "limitation", there's a ton of great characters in here. They have as much reason to be here as many of the other characters already in Smash. So all the people scared of or disgusted by the prospect of "adding a female character JUST to fill a quota", try it for yourself and see if you REALLY think it's so bad.

Sure, I'll play.

Nintendo:
Pauline
Dixie Kong
Midna
Ashley
Captain Syrup
Pyra
Lyn
Sami
Impa


Third Parties:
Reimu Hakurei
2B
Terra Branford
Lara Croft
Jeanne
Jill Valentine
Morrigan Aensland
Kat


There's probably more but these are the ones that are popping through my head right now.

 

[Sysreq]

Of course I'm gonna mention Nakoruru if I get to mention ****in Leona and Shiki

Don't really know what Nakoruru has to do with Guilty Gear, but sure
feel free to r/whooosh me if appropriate

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Anyway I hope I didn't post over 50 characters just so people would gloss over the more obscure or odd picks

 

[GoodGrief741]

Idk man, this is the same planet with people who have such hatred for women they get incredibly furious at a woman not smiling in a movie poster

Boy oh boy was that one a doozy. But I guess I have higher hopes for the great people of the Smash fandom.

 

[Flyboy]

Nintendo:
Elma
Style Savvy Rep
Akira Howard with a female alt
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard von Hresvelg
Octoling with a female alt
Pearl & Marina
Ribbon Girl/Twintelle/Min-Min
Akari Hayami
Dixie Kong
Krystal
Mona
Captain Syrup
Impa
Ayumi Tachibana
Mach Rider

Third Party:
Marina Liteyears
2B
Arle Nadja
Alis Landale
Alicia Melchiott
Amy Rose
Chun-Li
Jill Valentine
Amaterasu
Tron Bonne
Roll
Lara Croft
Heather Mason
Katrielle Layton
Velvet Crowe
KOS-MOS
Tifa Lockhart
Terra Branford
Nakoruru
Team Metal Slug (with Fio)
Mai Shiranui
Carmen Sandiego
Reimu Hakurei

In this baffling situation where people seem to insist that adding a female character is "filling a quota" I still don't see how any of those could possibly be a bad addition. In fact, several of those are my most-wanted and all of them have earned their spot in gaming or Nintendo history. Like setting aside the fact that the conversation was already discussed civilly until someone decided to come in and be lame, if you break it down it's facts that even in this "worst case scenario" where someone holds a gun to Sakurai's head and forces him to add a female character 9/10 times it's going to be someone that fits the "deserving" bill.

 

[Sysreq]

Which is why this is a discussion with no point. For one, obviously we can't alter what happens (hell, what was decided a long time ago), but also, whether you're craving for female characters, or indifferent to them, or against them, we can all be confident that characters won't be added to satisfy quotas, or excluded because of discrimination. If we get Doomguy, nobody'll be saying Sakurai's sexist. If we get Jill Valentine, nobody'll say Sakurai did it to fulfill a quota. And if we get a male rando or a female rando, we'll all agree that as flawed as the selection might have been, gender played no part in it.

Well, at least I have enough faith in humanity to believe that will be the case.

Which makes it all the more baffling why people **** on others for simply expressing that they want female characters. People can say "I want Geno" or "I want more cartoony non-humans" but once you say "I want a girl character", people's feathers get ruffled for some reason.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Which makes it all the more baffling why people **** on others for simply expressing that they want female characters. People can say "I want Geno" or "I want more cartoony non-humans" but once you say "I want a girl character", people's feathers get ruffled for some reason.

My best guess is that it might sound too close to positive discrimination in a certain light. Which is a controversial topic when talking about real life individuals, so I guess that's where the problem might stem from.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

SMAASH! Puppy It is the same. A token female is just the same as a token non-white, both are non-standard or considered non-standard. Sometimes you get a mix of both, one demographic commonly used in advertising and recent games solely pushing an agenda, black women.

Adding a character because they represent a genre comes off as superfluous, but as you said, Chief represents a series that's made a mark on the industry, the genre he's apart of doesn't make a difference, just like Banjo to doesn't represent 3D platformers but instead represents a key piece of Nintendo that no longer exists.

I feel like you're seeing the word "women" and immediately assuming a political agenda, but this isn't quite the case. For example, my bit about Master Cheif could have read:

Say you wanted a female character. You don't want to add one for the sake of it, but if you reached into the category, pulled out Lara Croft and thought "Everyone will love this due to her impact on gaming and female fans will get thrown a bone as well since she will be a new female character to play with" then you've made a genuinely good pick.

Or it could have said:

Say you wanted an action adventure character. You don't want to add one for the sake of it, but if you reached into the category, pulled out Lara Croft and thought "Everyone will love this due to her impact on gaming and action adventure fans will get thrown a bone as well since she will be a new action adventure character to play with" then you've made a genuinely good pick.

All I did was swap out nouns and the message was the same.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Don't really know what Nakoruru has to do with Guilty Gear, but sure
feel free to r/whooosh me if appropriate

But... Leona and Shiki are SNK characters and I even listed them there. Shiki's even from the same game

 

[Deleted member]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to.

Lemme see:

Morrigan (of course)
Mai Shiranui
Athena Asamiya
KOS-MOS
2B
Saber
Velvet Crowe
Shantae
Jill Valentine
Dixie Kong
Elma
Pyra/Mythra (I know they'll come with Rex but still lmao)

That's it for now.

Which is why this is a discussion with no point. For one, obviously we can't alter what happens (hell, what was decided a long time ago), but also, whether you're craving for female characters, or indifferent to them, or against them, we can all be confident that characters won't be added to satisfy quotas, or excluded because of discrimination. If we get Doomguy, nobody'll be saying Sakurai's sexist. If we get Jill Valentine, nobody'll say Sakurai did it to fulfill a quota. And if we get a male rando or a female rando, we'll all agree that as flawed as the selection might have been, gender played no part in it.

Well, at least I have enough faith in humanity to believe that will be the case.

If we do get Doomguy, I'll be quite pissed. If we get Jill, that's okay. Randoms? It'll make me curious as long as they're female.

Seriously, I can imagine some of my reactions from here. Now let me just step back and have my rage do the talking fo rthe moment

Doomguy:
"WTF WHERE'S MY GIRLS AT? SEXIST! **** THIS FIGHTERS PASS! EWW...EVERY OTHER FIGHTING GAME OFFERED GIRLS WHILE SMASH IS STILL STUCK WITH BOYS. SHAME ON THE GAMING COMMUNITY. JUST ONE FEMALE FIGHTER IS ALL I ASK! BOYCOTT SMASH! CANCEL FIGHTERS PASS 2! LOOK AT THAT! IT'S SO ****ING EASY!

Jill/Morrigan/etc.:
"FINALLY **** YES WE GOT A FEMALE FIGHTER LEZZZ GOOOO"
Others: "Where's my Doonguy and Haya and stuff? This is bull****! Waste of a character slot! Who wants this? **** YOU LESLEY AND YOU'RE STUPID FEMINIST BULL****!"

Sorry for the all-caps rage. It's just....a demonstration.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I guess I’ll contribute my own female characters I’d like in Smash list:

Nintendo:

-Midna
-Ashley
-Mach Rider
-Female Octoling
-Ana
-Paula
-Kumatora
-Adeleine
-Brittany
-Vivian
-Dixie Kong

Third-party:

-Alex (would take up half of Steve’s alts.)
-Amy Rose
-Ms. Pac-Man

Reimu and Shantae would also be cool.

 

[Schnee117]

But... Leona and Shiki are SNK characters and I even listed them there. Shiki's even from the same game

They meant ABA from Guilty Gear, not Nakoruru

 

[Sysreq]

But... Leona and Shiki are SNK characters and I even listed them there. Shiki's even from the same game

I think there was some crossing of the wires lol

 

[Cutie Gwen]

They meant ABA from Guilty Gear, not Nakoruru

Is it obvious that I'm tired as ****?

 

[Deleted member]

Is it obvious that I'm tired as ****?

Yeah...pretty much. You probably need some rest, like I do.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Yeah...pretty much. You probably need some rest, like I do.

Yeah but it's my one day off so I'm gonna be irresponsible as **** so I can regret it tomorrow

 

[Deleted member]

I feel like you're seeing the word "women" and immediately assuming a political agenda, but this isn't quite the case. For example, my bit about Master Cheif could have read:


Or it could have said:


All I did was swap out nouns and the message was the same.

Everyone wants an FPS rep to fill a genre quota and everyone's fine.

Everyone wants a female character to fill a gender quota and everyone whines.

 

[Nemuresu]

Which makes it all the more baffling why people **** on others for simply expressing that they want female characters. People can say "I want Geno" or "I want more cartoony non-humans" but once you say "I want a girl character", people's feathers get ruffled for some reason.

No one says that asking for females is bad.

It's been repeated countless times that what people don't like is to demonize Nintendo and Sakurai for not including them as if they were intentionally intending to offend others with it. If Waluigi fans got flack for acting in similar manners then I'm not sure what makes this case any different unless you don't approve of that past situation either.

I myself have said that no female characters in third-party line-ups is a rather glaring omission (just look at the amount of women listed in this thread, it's quite good enough to fill about two to three seasons worth of DLC), but you don't see me calling the creators sexist because of that, since their intentions aren't malicious at all as they just want to turn Smash into the greatest crossover out there. And the only thing to do is to tell Nintendo that these characters are worth a damn and hope they listen like they did with Banjo.

 

[Sysreq]

Is it obvious that I'm tired as ****?

Footage of Cutie Gwen in front of her monitor

Spoiler

 

[GoodGrief741]

If we do get Doomguy, I'll be quite pissed. If we get Jill, that's okay. Randoms? It'll make me curious as long as they're female.

Seriously, I can imagine some of my reactions from here. Now let me just step back and have my rage do the talking fo rthe moment

Doomguy:
"WTF WHERE'S MY GIRLS AT? SEXIST! **** THIS FIGHTERS PASS! EWW...EVERY OTHER FIGHTING GAME OFFERED GIRLS WHILE SMASH IS STILL STUCK WITH BOYS. SHAME ON THE GAMING COMMUNITY. JUST ONE FEMALE FIGHTER IS ALL I ASK! BOYCOTT SMASH! CANCEL FIGHTERS PASS 2! LOOK AT THAT! IT'S SO ****ING EASY!

Jill/Morrigan/etc.:
"FINALLY **** YES WE GOT A FEMALE FIGHTER LEZZZ GOOOO"
Others: "Where's my Doonguy and Haya and stuff? This is bull****! Waste of a character slot! Who wants this? **** YOU LESLEY AND YOU'RE STUPID FEMINIST BULL****!"

Sorry for the all-caps rage. It's just....a demonstration.

I do hope that you're joking.

 

[Deleted member]

I do hope that you're joking.

Yes. I was joking.

 

[GoodGrief741]

Yes. I was joking.

Might wanna add a /s or a Pac-Man at the end of that post, sarcasm doesn't read well online.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Yes. I was joking.

Oh good. I thought you were serious.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

Okay, let's pretend that the supposed "worst thing ever happens" and we HAVE to get a female character next "to fill an arbitrary quota" like all the boogeymen are saying.

Working with that limitation, name all the women you genuinely want to see in Smash. All the people who are against the quota? I especially want YOU to participate as well. Just sit there and think, or do research if you have to. I'll start:

Nintendo:

Dixie Kong
Toadette
Midna
Style Savvy character
Elma
Fiora
Byleth with a female alt
Edelgard
Lyn
Caeda

Third-party:

Lara Croft
2B
Female alts for The Hero (specifically Dragon Quest III and IV)
Carmen Sandiego (thanks to this thread for bringing it up, I really want this now lol)
Jill Valentine
Chun-Li

Even working with this "limitation", there's a ton of great characters in here. They have as much reason to be here as many of the other characters already in Smash. So all the people scared of or disgusted by the prospect of "adding a female character JUST to fill a quota", try it for yourself and see if you REALLY think it's so bad.

Sophitia from Soul Calibur would be kinda clean too.

 

[Deleted member]

Doomguy:
"WTF WHERE'S MY GIRLS AT? SEXIST! **** THIS FIGHTERS PASS! EWW...EVERY OTHER FIGHTING GAME OFFERED GIRLS WHILE SMASH IS STILL STUCK WITH BOYS. SHAME ON THE GAMING COMMUNITY. JUST ONE FEMALE FIGHTER IS ALL I ASK! BOYCOTT SMASH! CANCEL FIGHTERS PASS 2! LOOK AT THAT! IT'S SO ****ING EASY!

Jill/Morrigan/etc.:
"FINALLY **** YES WE GOT A FEMALE FIGHTER LEZZZ GOOOO"
Others: "Where's my Doonguy and Haya and stuff? This is bull****! Waste of a character slot! Who wants this? **** YOU LESLEY AND YOU'RE STUPID FEMINIST BULL****!"

Sorry for the all-caps rage. It's just....a demonstration.

This ties back to a previous post I typed yesterday.

If you want idk Geno and nothing more--to a point where everything but Geno is disappointing and it's annoyingly all you talk about, I think I have room to call that person narrowminded. Similarly to female reps, if that's all you want and damn any other topic, I have room to think that person is equally narrowminded.

E: Oh it was a joke. Could have fooled me, and that's not a good thing.

 

[Sysreq]

No one says that asking for females is bad.

Really? 'Cause that user earlier seemed to be saying that.

It's been repeated countless times that what people don't like is to demonize Nintendo and Sakurai for not including them as if they were intentionally intending to offend others with it. If Waluigi fans got flack for acting in similar manners then I'm not sure what makes this case any different unless you don't approve of that past situation either.

I don't approve of Waluigi fans' actions and I think bothering Sakurai is one of the most annoying things the Smash fanbase does. I don't think Nintendo or Sakurai should be held accountable in this instance. Unrelated, but I do think Nintendo should be held accountable for other things *coughNintendoOnlinecough*

I myself have said that no female characters in third-party line-ups is a rather glaring omission (just look at the amount of women listed in this thread, it's quite good enough to fill about two to three seasons worth of DLC), but you don't see me calling the creators sexist because of that, since their intentions aren't malicious at all as they just want to turn Smash into the greatest crossover out there. And the only thing to do is to tell Nintendo that these characters are worth a damn and hope they listen like they did with Banjo.

I don't think they're necessarily sexist either--I just want a goddamned girl character in my Smash DLC. Are you gonna fault me for it? Are you gonna fault the Geno fans or Bandana Dee fans for wanting them? I honestly don't see the difference.

 

[Deleted member]

Man this conversation sucks

**** people who call Sakurai sexist
**** people who look down on wanting women in Smash.

Done done.

 

[Deleted member]

No one says that asking for females is bad.

It's been repeated countless times that what people don't like is to demonize Nintendo and Sakurai for not including them as if they were intentionally intending to offend others with it. If Waluigi fans got flack for acting in similar manners then I'm not sure what makes this case any different unless you don't approve of that past situation either.

I myself have said that no female characters in third-party line-ups is a rather glaring omission (just look at the amount of women listed in this thread, it's quite good enough to fill about two to three seasons worth of DLC), but you don't see me calling the creators sexist because of that, since their intentions aren't malicious at all as they just want to turn Smash into the greatest crossover out there. And the only thing to do is to tell Nintendo that these characters are worth a damn and hope they listen like they did with Banjo.

Even so...this just makes their chances look bleak.