Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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ryumo the Zekenator

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It is Sakurai's job to do the research, you can't honestly pretend that it's acceptable not to do so in 2019 with games being a global affair. Is it something that could, and should, have been caught by localization? Sure, but given the standard that Sakurai himself abides to, this slipping by him is uncharacteristically sloppy.
One of the most common things that the fanbase commonly fails to understand is that perceptions vary from country to country, and in the case of this country perception vs this other country perception, Megaman is a Japanese character so it makes sense that Sakurai goes with what he perceives of him. Plus Megaman was added for Sm4sh about 5 years ago. And probably was in development since 2012 so the 2019 comment feels quite off.
 
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One of the most common things that the fanbase commonly fails to understand is that perceptions vary from country to country, and in the case of this country perception vs this other country perception, Megaman is a Japanese character so it makes sense that Sakurai goes with what he perceives of him. Plus Megaman was added for Sm4sh about 5 years ago. And probably was in development since 2012 so the 2019 comment feels quite off.
The comment also applies to 2012, not like that's a recent phenomenon. And obviously I understand why Sakurai made the choice he made, that doesn't mean it isn't still a mistake and that he can't be criticized for it. He puts a lot of thought into representing characters so that they feel true and familiar to fans, this time he made a choice that for most of the world is perplexing.
 

Strider_Bond00J

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I wouldn't have a problem with Lloyd or another Tales of character to close of the Fighters Pass, though I'd probably be more in favour of Lloyd since I'm more familiar with since he's been a long-requested character and had that Mii Costume of him in Smash 4. I don't have much in the way of experience with the Tales of games outside of a small time with Graces f (which I couldn't exactly gel with for some reason), but I'd probably be okay with giving Symphonia, Berseria or the upcoming Tales of Arise game a try.
 

Sysreq

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The comment also applies to 2012, not like that's a recent phenomenon. And obviously I understand why Sakurai made the choice he made, that doesn't mean it isn't still a mistake and that he can't be criticized for it. He puts a lot of thought into representing characters so that they feel true and familiar to fans, this time he made a choice that for most of the world is perplexing.
Speak for yourself. To me it makes perfect sense. Look at all the rest of the series icons and the gear fits right in. None of them have any kind of perspective to them like your previous picture of the helmet did. They're all flat images of something except for Little Mac's glove. I assume this is for visual clarity and simplicity.
 

TheAJJohnson

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Am I the only one who just want all the DLC characters here just so we can get it overwith? Lol
I just want little drips so we can have something to drink between reveals. The drought of information is killing me...

Have Sakurai come out on Twitter and say something like, "Man...is it hot in here or is it just me?" #SmashBrosUltimate

The community would go wild, in a fun and good way! It drums up speculation and keeps Smash in people's minds. It's a win-win. Here are some other fun tweet ideas

"Wow...I'm dizzy..." #SmashBrosUltimate

"How many swords is too many?" #SmashBrosUltimate

"When we said this was the ultimate fighting game cross-over, we really meant it." #SmashBrosUltimate

"Are assist trophies always stuck in their glass container?" #SmashBrosUltimate

"Dragons!" #SmashBrosUltimate
 
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Garteam

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Why just settle for those two? There is Incineroar as well. After all, Decidueye was the defacto Gen 7 Mon, the next Greninja and Grass Starter and Ash's ace in the anime! :teeth:
Incineroar was in a weird place, where he was a dark horse among dark horses for half the speculation period and considered by many as the most obvious character for the second half of the speculation period. Prior to about the August direct, Decidueye was seen as the forerunner, with Mimikyu in second, Lycanroc in third, and Incineroar hanging around fourth. Then Vergeben leaked him and he was seen as an inevitability, with any who doubted him committing a fool's errand.

In retrospect, I'm actually pretty glad that Piranha Plant and Joker didn't get leaked. It would've really ruined a lot of the surprise those two initially had. I remember waiting in line at a midnight launch for Ultimate when someone said Joker from Persona 5 was announced. I honestly didn't believe them until I got home and saw the trailer myself.
 
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Speak for yourself. To me it makes perfect sense. Look at all the rest of the series icons and the gear fits right in. None of them have any kind of perspective to them like your previous picture of the helmet did. They're all flat images of something except for Little Mac's glove. I assume this is for visual clarity and simplicity.
440-4409001_megaman-helmet-png-mega-man-helmet-png.jpg

Is this more your jam? The helmet doesn't need the perspective to be recognizable, that's how simple and iconic it is.

(Also, check out the symbols for Mother, Castlevania, Wii Sports Resort and Pilotwings, and come back to me on how a slightly tilted version of the helmet is less simple than those)
 
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I just want little drips so we can have something to drink between reveals. The drought of information is killing me...

Have Sakurai come out on Twitter and say something like, "Man...is it hot in here or is it just me?" #SmashBrosUltimate

The community would go wild, in a fun and good way! It drums up speculation and keeps Smash in people's minds. It's a win-win. Here are some other fun tweet ideas

"Wow...I'm dizzy..." #SmashBrosUltimate
"How many swords is too many?" #SmashBrosUltimate
"When we said this was the ultimate fighting game cross-over, we really meant it." #SmashBrosUltimate
"Are assist trophies always stuck in their glass container?" #SmashBrosUltimate
"Dragons!" #SmashBrosUltimate
Wait until the last DLC happens and it be years of speculation before new roster. That’s the most painful wait
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Is this more your jam? The helmet doesn't need the perspective to be recognizable, that's how simple and iconic it is.

(Also, check out the symbols for Mother, Castlevania, Wii Sports Resort and Pilotwings, and come back to me on how a slightly tilted version of the helmet is less simple than those)
I don't have the software to check the silhouette, but I feel like it would be kinda muddy. The silhouettes that you mentioned that keep them recognizable:
  • Earthbound's logo makes good use of negative space and relies on the fact that it looks like the Earth.
  • Castlevania's logo implies that you're looking up from it just due to how the bottom is, however it could be interpreted as a side view with mountains obscuring the rest of it.
  • Wii Sports Resort's is a completely dead on look. The line in the center maybe implies a river, but it honestly just looks like what it is: A fancy stamp.
  • Pilotwings's logo is the most dynamic for sure, and that line down the side of the plane pretty much saves it (otherwise it wouldn't look like a plane).
Personally, I think that if the helmet can work in the minimalistic clip-art style of the other logos then it would be the best choice.
 

Opossum

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And obviously I understand why Sakurai made the choice he made, that doesn't mean it isn't still a mistake and that he can't be criticized for it.
And likewise, just because you don't like it, it doesn't mean it was a mistake.
 

N3ON

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It's odd to see people defending the option that had resonance with one territory when there was one that had resonance globally.
Typically only appealing to one area is seen as a shortcoming. Probably still would be had Sakurai gone with the helmet.
 
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And likewise, just because you don't like it, it doesn't mean it was a mistake.
I'm not sure what point this is supposed to be making? I'm far from the only person who thought the gear was a weird choice, this is just an ad hominem. Can you actually provide an argument in favor of your point? I have.
 
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View attachment 241354
Is this more your jam? The helmet doesn't need the perspective to be recognizable, that's how simple and iconic it is.

(Also, check out the symbols for Mother, Castlevania, Wii Sports Resort and Pilotwings, and come back to me on how a slightly tilted version of the helmet is less simple than those)
It took me until now to realize megaman has a heart shaped layer to his helmet.

Bret Hart for Smash conformed
 

Idon

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It's odd to see people defending the option that had resonance with one territory when there was one that had resonance globally.
Typically only appealing to one area is seen as a shortcoming. Probably still would be had Sakurai gone with the helmet.
Don't get me wrong, I love the helmet way more, but as far as "nitpicky details that bother me" a niche logo is the least of my concerns as opposed to a dozen other little things I dislike.

like ZSS's jet heels.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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The 2 blue colours force the entire helmet to be black.

I must say that I don't understand why this didn't get approved and why we got the gear instead.
Not too bad. I'm actually not a fan of how it looks at this angle, but I do think it's better than a random gear.

*whistling in the background*

What's good, heart breakers? Nothing new as of lately?
We're discussing the Mega Man series icon. Probably the dumbest conversation we've had here but at least it's not the worst.

Don't get me wrong, I love the helmet way more, but as far as "nitpicky details that bother me" a niche logo is the least of my concerns as opposed to a dozen other little things I dislike.

like ZSS's jet heels.
Or how the Gaur Plain stage doesn't take place on Gaur Plain.
Or how Mega Man's Hard Knuckle attack is actually the Mega Arm.
 
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I'd prefer the helmet to a gear but Mega Man has plenty of good representation in Smash already, so the series symbol comes off as such a minor thing to get annoyed about.
Oh it is for sure, this was just me talking to someone about logo pet peeves before this turned into the 'Sakurai is a God and he can do no wrong' show.
*whistling in the background*

What's good, heart breakers? Nothing new as of lately?
Clearly not as this is what we're talking about.

Well, Doom Eternal got delayed, if that means anything.
 

Ninjaed

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Don't get me wrong, I love the helmet way more, but as far as "nitpicky details that bother me" a niche logo is the least of my concerns as opposed to a dozen other little things I dislike.

like ZSS's jet heels.
Ugh, don't remind me of my profound hatred for high heels being everywhere in video game on female characters. Even when they make no sense at all! You even get ninjas or spies or w/e who are supposed to be nimble and stealthy with frigging high heels! Or knights in high heels, because who cares about balance in battle right? It's not like someone could tackle you and you'd need solid footing to not fall to the ground where they could unsheathe their dagger and stab you right in the eyesockets!
 
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Oh it is for sure, this was just me talking to someone about logo pet peeves before this turned into the 'Sakurai is a God and he can do no wrong' show.
Except nobody is even acting that way. You complained about the icon choice, and people responded with why Sakurai most likely went with what he did. You instead took their responses, turned it into "he should do his research better!" and more complaining about how the icon should be a "worldwide choice"

Who cares. It's already in the game and isn't going to be changed.
 

NonSpecterificGuy

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Oh it is for sure, this was just me talking to someone about logo pet peeves before this turned into the 'Sakurai is a God and he can do no wrong' show.

Clearly not as this is what we're talking about.

Well, Doom Eternal got delayed, if that means anything.
I mean I agree with you about it SHOULD being a helmet but I don't necessarily think the Gear is horrible since it is very much associated with him in Japan. And Sakurai is from Japan.

Then again, there's a few eries symbols I would change. Fire Emblem, Kid Icarus, and HOLY **** WHO THOUGHT IT WAS A GOOD IDEA TO GIVE TERRY A STAR THAT LOOKS JUST LIKE KIRBY'S BUT FLATTER?
 

N3ON

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Because it's such an non-issue.
Don't get me wrong, I love the helmet way more, but as far as "nitpicky details that bother me" a niche logo is the least of my concerns as opposed to a dozen other little things I dislike.

like ZSS's jet heels.
All I did was observe an inconsistent logic. If you want to impress the trivial nature of what's being discussed, I'm not sure I'm the culprit you're looking for.
 

NintenZ

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At this point I don’t even want another sonic character.
Honestly I can’t blame you.

The franchise is the definition of ****ing zombie and it’s a shell of what it once was, SEGA has evolved, but Sonic just hasn’t, and that’s honestly a damn shame.
 

Plank08

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Honestly I can’t blame you.

The franchise is the definition of ****ing zombie and it’s a shell of what it once was, SEGA has evolved, but Sonic just hasn’t, and that’s honestly a damn shame.
It’s really sad too, Sonic 2 was the first game I’ve ever played, but these new games just aren’t doing it for me, and now I barely even want tails in smash.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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Ugh, don't remind me of my profound hatred for high heels being everywhere in video game on female characters. Even when they make no sense at all! You even get ninjas or spies or w/e who are supposed to be nimble and stealthy with frigging high heels! Or knights in high heels, because who cares about balance in battle right? It's not like someone could tackle you and you'd need solid footing to not fall to the ground where they could unsheathe their dagger and stab you right in the eyesockets!
I kinda agree with this, though I actually like Zero Suit Samus's jet heels. They make her look cooler in my opinion. I also don't think they should be removed from Peach, Bayonetta, or Rosalina since they feel relevant to the the character of the former and just complete the look for the latter. Wouldn't bat an eye if Daisy started wearing converse or sneakers though. I feel like that would be so in character for her and she'd probably pull off the dress and sneakers look pretty well too.

Wendy's design is awful and I couldn't care less about what she wears.

I think it is worth noting that out of all the humanoid women in the game (:ultbayonetta::ultwendy::ultcorrinf::ultinkling::ultisabelle::ultlucina::ultpalutena::ultpeach::ultdaisy::ultpokemontrainerf::ultrobinf::ultrosalina::ultvillagerf::ultwiifittrainer::ultzelda::ultzss:) very few of them are pretty princesses. There's also warriors, normal people, an action (anti?)hero, and even an abomination (Wendy), so there's a decently wide variety of characters to chose from in the female department.

Honestly I can’t blame you.

The franchise is the definition of ****ing zombie and it’s a shell of what it once was, SEGA has evolved, but Sonic just hasn’t, and that’s honestly a damn shame.
I guess he's too busy Running in the 90's. *Bah doom tshhhhh*

I feel like the Sega should treat Sonic like a new franchise. People liked Sonic Mania, so they should focus on that. Who knows? Maybe it'll act like Super Mario Bros., and the next two games will be like Super Mario Bros. 3 and Super Mario World; perfecting their 2D games before making the jump to 3D. (They might also want to ditch the pixel art for hand drawn visuals so they can stand out more against the indies.)
 
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I kinda hope Lloyd gets in so that I can be 2.5/5.

A 50% batting ratio for FP #1 is solid.

For those wondering, if Lloyd is #5 I'd have advocated for him, Hero, and (kinda) Banjo (even though I argued for Steve I was aware of Banjo's merits and how he might get in instead). Despite being the largest Joker supporter in the general thread, I never seriously thought he'd get in, so I don't count him. I didn't see Terry coming, so of course I wouldn't count him.
 
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Sysreq

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It’s really sad too, Sonic 2 was the first game I’ve ever played, but these new games just aren’t doing it for me, and now I barely even want tails in smash.
Same for me--Sonic 2 was my first game, but after Sonic Adventure 2: Battle...meh, don't care about Sonic anymore. Though I guess I wouldn't complain about another Sonic character.
 
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Plank08

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Same for me--Sonic 2 was my first game, but after Sonic Adventure 2: Battle...meh, don't care about Sonic anymore. Though I guess I wouldn't complain about another Sonic character.
I wouldn’t complain either, I’d happily take Shadow since he’s easy to make, but if it was tails or something I would just give a “oh I guess that makes sense..” or “It’s not Sackboy but I’ll take it:ultpacman:
 

Idon

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Honestly, for Terry's Star, I wish they used his Garou "Running Wild" Star:
terry garou.png

Just surround it in a circle and boom, it's distinctly Terry's.

Speaking of Garou, he better have that as an alt costume when ****ing School uniform Joker got in, lmao.
 

DevaAshera

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View attachment 241354
Is this more your jam? The helmet doesn't need the perspective to be recognizable, that's how simple and iconic it is.

(Also, check out the symbols for Mother, Castlevania, Wii Sports Resort and Pilotwings, and come back to me on how a slightly tilted version of the helmet is less simple than those)
If Mega Man's helmet was used at all, this would probably have been the best way to do it. All the details show while only using 1 solid colour and negative space.
57a66edc4041c.jpg
Honestly I can’t blame you.

The franchise is the definition of ****ing zombie and it’s a shell of what it once was, SEGA has evolved, but Sonic just hasn’t, and that’s honestly a damn shame.
I mean, you say that, but it does have a good game every so often..its just that Sega has a bad tendency of dropping the ball or changing the play style for no reason.
I mean, the recent successes are Sonic Generations and Sonic Mania.
All the same, even with the flops, the series still does really well.
Honestly, for Terry's Star, I wish they used his Garou "Running Wild" Star:
View attachment 241395

Just surround it in a circle and boom, it's distinctly Terry's.

Speaking of Garou, he better have that as an alt costume when ****ing School uniform Joker got in, lmao.
While I agree that Terry should have that (or, because I'm biased, female Terry) as an alternate costume..Joker's student costume makes sense considering that the Student portion of the game outside of Mementos is just as important to the experience of Persona 5 as the Palaces and Mementos are as Thief Joker.
 

Idon

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While I agree that Terry should have that (or, because I'm biased, female Terry) as an alternate costume..Joker's student costume makes sense considering that the Student portion of the game outside of Mementos is just as important to the experience of Persona 5 as the Palaces and Mementos are as Thief Joker.
I certainly understand why they used that costume, but the fact remains I think it's a bit of an oddity when Joker's primary thieving outfit is the one they use for almost all the promotional materials.

Not saying I'm opposed to it, mind you, just that if Joker could get something as minor as that, one of Terry's defining games and a big SNK fan favorite should definitely get at least something akin to it.
 

DarthEnderX

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Does Fatal Fury have EX moves like King of Fighters?
Some of them. I know Mark of the Wolves does.

Mega Man using a gear when his helmet is one of the most iconic costumes in gaming and is recognizable even in silhouette is one of the dumbest things possible.

Street Fighter and Final Fantasy using initials though is one of my pet peeves. Not that hard to use a Moogle or a Crystal or a Chocobo for FF (I would have even taken the meteor given how iconic it is). Stumped on alternatives for Street Fighter beyond a silhouette of Ryu in the Hadouken or Shoryuken positions, but would have still preferred that to the alternative.
I blame these franchises for not having created their own iconic symbols beforehand.

Who cares. It's already in the game and isn't going to be changed.
You say that, but FF's icon changed.
 

PLATINUM7

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You say that, but FF's icon changed.
Uhh, no it didn't.

A few series have had their symbols updated. The only one to change to something else entirely is Metal Gear, which most likely has to do with Kojima leaving Konami (the symbol, while representing FOX, was also the Kojima Productions logo).
 
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