Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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My first Party Pass would be all AT promotions if I'm being honest. I feel like it's the best way to satiate most Nintendo fan desires

1. Ashley
2. Waluigi
3. Isaac
4. Midna/Skull Kid
5. Springman

Don't much care to add Echoes, but I'd like Medusa and DQ Heroine

Oh, that's a major shame. Thanks, TIL. I'm really struggling to see a Chinese-aimed pick - other than SNK - that wouldn't raise loads of eyebrows in the Smash scene. For example I'd imagine that most Smashers would react to a theoretical LoL / Dota 2 character with a collective "WTF? Why?".
If we're being honest, my first thought for a character that panders to China was Touhou. I'm still looking into what all China enjoys, but most of it is Mobas and Mobage which I am fairly confident aren't going to be in the pass for a multitude of reasons.
 
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N3ON

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If Project M just lasted a few more months we would've seen Lyn actually playable in a Smash game with a finished and polished moveset. A tragedy among tragedies... View attachment 234608
I'm not privy to everything that happened in the PMDT's backroom. There may be legal factors of which I'm unaware. That's how I'll qualify it. But the real tragedy to me was the seemingly selfish way that P:M was halted. All these things were in the pipeline, then those few at the helm leave many lower level contributors hanging so they can start their own project, while instructing that no one mod their partially finished mods.

If they had finished those characters up, then moved on to their own thing, fine. If they had said "we're done, but here are those partially completed characters for people to finish", fine. If the higher-ups moved on from P:M, and left it to continue in the hands of the other people working on the project, fine. But the way they ended it leaves a rather bitter aftertaste.
 

Idon

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I'm not privy to everything that happened in the PMDT's backroom. There may be legal factors of which I'm unaware. That's how I'll qualify it. But the real tragedy to me was the seemingly selfish way that P:M was halted. All these things were in the pipeline, then those few at the helm leave many lower level contributors hanging so they can start their own project, while instructing that no one mod their partially finished mods.

If they had finished those characters up, then moved on to their own thing, fine. If they had said "we're done, but here are those partially completed characters for people to finish", fine. If the higher-ups moved on from P:M, and left it to continue in the hands of the other people working on the project, fine. But the way they ended it leaves a rather bitter aftertaste.
Yeah, if they did one last sendoff trailer on par with 3.6 trailer, I'd have some closure, but seeing how it ended and the people that have shared their final stories regarding it, there's a huge sense of disappointment.
 
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Don't really care about an echo pass, but if we're talking about a first party pass then my wish list would go like this:
1) Waluigi
2) Ashley
3) Rex & Pyra
4) Dixie Kong
5) Fawful
 

Will

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Unless you're Shadow or Dixie, I'm not seeing anyone else being made into an Echo anytime soon.
 

AEMehr

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talking video game characters in smash is fun, i want in

First Party
Waluigi (Super Mario); Probably has a heavy emphasis on "cheating". A lot of his attacks would have weird sweet spots that are absolutely bonkers, but as a trade off the attacks themselves without the sweet spots are very subpar and he'd be pretty slow / big. He also would have a lot of range for a Brawler type character, but despite his range he really doesn't have anything disjointed aside from attacks that use the Tennis Racket. In a sense I guess his design philosophy would be similar to King K. Rool, where they just have a lot of things that really dumb when you land them. But if you understand how to not get hit by the "gimmicks" you'll find the matchup is relatively easy.

Excitebike Racer (Excitebike); A character that'd be very momentum based. Might have some of the worst traction in the game, but unlike the other fighters their top speed causes damage on contact (like some spirits in the game). It'd be interesting if they would approach a system that could force the bike to overheat and stall, which could either punish the Racer heavily by gutting their movement speed or causing the Bike itself to explode. Meaning they have to wait for a timer to run before they can have the Bike come back, and forced to play with a very weak moveset as the Racer would have to run and fight hand to hand. I understand in the past the character was scratched from concept because they couldn't think of a way for him to jump, but I'm sure if Piranha Plant as since joined the roster they wouldn't worry too much about the player's suspension of disbelief.

Dillon (Dillon's Rolling Western); Heavy emphasis on rushdown, with some aerial combo bread and butters. For instance, landing a rolling attack sets the opponent up for a forward aerial attack combo (the fair'd probably have three parts like Bayonetta's, since the aerial attacks Dillon does has three hits as well in RW). In combat for Rolling Western you are highly rewarded for keeping the combo counter up by acquiring better gems, ore, and cash the higher the number is, so I would figure they'd approach a similar design philosophy in Smash where they reward you for actually landing combos. Dillon's pretty slow objectively speaking, but he cuts the gap real quickly using Rolling / Grind attacks. So while he's not really your traditional type of zone-breaker that closes in with their innate speed and frame data, he has some options that might be unreactable at certain ranges and better combo-enders that reward actually landing them.

Nikki (Swapnote / Nintendo Letter Box); Artistic fighter! Her drawings come to life with the power of the revolutionary glasses-less stereoscopic 3D power of the Nintendo 3DS! I would imagine she'd be very setup heavy, having longer start up on more of her attacks because i want her attacks to be able to be more detailed the longer they're charged. So maybe she'd have the ability to sketch prior and then you can use the charge from sketching on many different moves. I feel like there's a lot of room for charming stuff and references in a moveset where someone is drawing a bunch of stuff. Like she already draws Bullet Bills and Smash Balls as an assist trophy, so that would be just a taste of stuff she could pull off.

Min Min (ARMS); The champion of the ARMS Party Crash Grand Prix, Min Min has a unique set of attributes that her adversaries simply can't match! She uses her legs in combat, wow! It allows her to have a mixed form of combat where she realistically can fight up close and at a range. I think it'd be really cool if she had an install with charging her left arm permanently until she's in a tumble state, meaning moves that use her left ARM (the Dragon for obvious reasons) would have a boost in attack and knockback. It'd be cool if she had a traditional air dash through her aerials or even as a special. I think it'd also be really cool if her air dashes and even back roll deflected projectiles / or had a hitbox but the hitbox seems a bit excess on a dodging attack lol. Still I think it'd be really cool and fit the character so I'm down with it. I mean they literally did add two moves the can instantly KO you regardless of your % based on chance so really would this sound that weird?

Echo Fighters
Ms. PAC-MAN (PAC-MAN); Her game is better and I want this for more namco roulette stuff and it'd be cool if they mess with her up special / down special. Maybe even changing attributes of her Bonus Fruit.
Dixie Kong (Donkey Kong Country); She could be made into her own fighter, yeah, but I think she also the potential to be a fun different take on Diddy for players. Higher second jump to compensate for her getting Spinning Kong.
Proto Man (Mega Man); Would be really sick if they just used different attacks from all of the various Mega Man games, kinda like how they approached Mega Man's custom moves in Smash 3DS/Wii U.
Glass Joe (PUNCH-OUT!!); Literally a joke character, but that's okay.
Louie (Pikmin); Just an excuse to add more captains. I doubt we'll be getting any big gameplay differences for a character from the Pikmin franchise.
 
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Honestly speaking in a little spotty on the idea of another Pass as is, much less 2-just with the current one+ Mii skins we're shelling a little over 100 bucks as is for the full thing.

This list is more for the fun of it though so I'll be back with my ideers a bit later. Also I get the feeling that if we get an Echo Pack it could possibly be free going by how Samurai views them as just bonuses going by an interview from back in Sm4sh times.
 

AEMehr

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I mean I'm just talking characters I'd like to see.

I don't think we're getting anything beyond what is promised. Let alone any of the characters I personally mentioned haha. Except maybe Waluigi? I don't see it too out of the realm of possibility.
 

Guybrush20X6

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I'm not privy to everything that happened in the PMDT's backroom. There may be legal factors of which I'm unaware. That's how I'll qualify it. But the real tragedy to me was the seemingly selfish way that P:M was halted. All these things were in the pipeline, then those few at the helm leave many lower level contributors hanging so they can start their own project, while instructing that no one mod their partially finished mods.

If they had finished those characters up, then moved on to their own thing, fine. If they had said "we're done, but here are those partially completed characters for people to finish", fine. If the higher-ups moved on from P:M, and left it to continue in the hands of the other people working on the project, fine. But the way they ended it leaves a rather bitter aftertaste.
And I think that bitter after taste was one of the factors that killed off Icons: Combat Arena.
Though I still contend the worst one was the choice of name. If I have to stop and think "what was that name again" every time then it's too generic.
 

SKX31

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Honestly speaking in a little spotty on the idea of another Pass as is, much less 2-just with the current one+ Mii skins we're shelling a little over 100 bucks as is for the full thing.
The line between "Sound business model" and "Microtransaction Hell" (Metal Gear Survive, Artifact) is sometimes a fine one, mind. I'm pretty sure Nintendo and most other companies (like Activison with Crash Team Racing) wouldn't be this bold weren't it for League's and TF2 / CSGO / Dota 2's models basically substaining those games for years.

For example - Valve releases a "Battle Pass" in time for every International (Dota 2's world championship, held anually) since 2013. A couple things to note:

A) 25 % of the proceeding go to the International's price pool.
B) The "Battle Pass" contains loads of items, skins etc. - including exclusives - for seemingly every character and thing in the game. Those items - and sometimes the chance to gamble for more exclusive items (at no further cost, but still) - are rewarded as the Battle Pass is leveled up. Via playing the game, getting achievements etc. Or, you guessed it, spending more money on it. All items are completely cosmetic - sometimes include special particle effects etc.
C) Oh, and the Lvl 1 Battle Pass is a $10 thing, There are $30 and $45 variants (that skips directly to level 50 and 100 respectively, with all the rewards up to those respective points automatically granted). The rewards go up to level 2000, with repeating rewards starting to happen after level 300.

It sounds like Microtransaction Hell at first glance. And guess what? It's a major success each and every year. Buying everything in Dota 2, League etc. is about as likely as buying everything in Train Simulator:



But fans still throw money eagerly at those things. The intent's not to have people buy everything, but enough to cause dollar sign eyes among corporate heads. Of course people do have a point when they consider the model unfair instead of fair - again, Metal Gear Survive, Artifact and judging by Cadiccarus' reactions, Crash Team Racing post-launch. And both Konami and Valve are still aching after MGS / Artifact's failures; one could view Snake's return and the Belmonts' addition as a way to distract from the now dead Survive.

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo goes for a second Fighter Pass. The Battle Pass returns each year, by comparision the theoretical Fighter Pass 2 would come out around March 2020 at the absolute earliest - at least 15 months after Fighter Pass 1 (December 2018 alongside the base game). While Smash is different from F2P MOBAs, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo at least looked at how other fighting games do their DLC before doing a FP2 or not. They might have looked at the MOBAs microtransaction structures too, at least to look at how much people tolerate or consider a fair trade off for their money.
 
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Not adding more DLC characters would be a baffling decision by Nintendo (albeit one of many in their history).
Especially considering how well the Switch is selling and the fact that we are most likely not going to see another Smash game being released until Nintendo decides to release the Switch's successor, but that's about 5-8 years from now. They promised a 7-10 year lifespan for the Switch and we're only in Year 3.
 

ryumo the Zekenator

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I don't think Nintendo stopping DLC after this pass is a bad decision, especially if the parties involved move to other projects.

I understand wanting more content and using other games as examples, but at the same time, there is a point where I feel just these concepts of first-party/echo/whatever passes to be just wanting more content just for the sake of it instead of wanting the characters.

Plus whatever works for other games doesn't necessarily fits for Smash or Nintendo in general and, if Im being honest, having to keep putting money on a game is pretty unappealing on the long run. A lot of companies just end up having the entire cost of the DLC surpassing that of the main game which is insane, I would rather get a new game by then. Its one of the things that I'm glad Nintendo didn't catched up even if they have a few games that are guilty of this.
 

Rie Sonomura

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I can see them releasing standalone characters periodically (likely from already represented series so they wouldn't have to create a stage) to keep people checking back into Ultimate and to make the long wait until Smash 6 more bearable for the fans.
If they don’t include a stage, I at least hope they can include at most 6 new music tracks with individual characters. I could understand no songs with Piranha Plant, but if say, Elma were individual DLC, she needs to come with Uncontrollable and The Key We’ve Lost at the bare minimum. Or Octoling being packaged with Fly Octo Fly, as another example
 
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I did not share with you the fact that I was 100% sure that Hero and Banjo-Kazooie would be announced at E3 2019, but hey, I would have had no satisfaction, because it was too obvious.

But as I return to this forum to tell my life, I tell myself that I could tell you which are the most likely characters with my cold logic and no particular desire.

In case it is a license that already exists, it will be Byleth or Pokémon 8G (Grookey).

In case it would be a license that does not have a fighter yet, the most logical seems to me to be 2 characters that Sakurai wanted to put in Sm4sh. Namely Heihachi Mishima and a Rhythm Heaven character who does not have a Spirit (Tap Trial Girl seems to me to be the most interesting choice)
 
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I think there is enough merit to do a second pass. If it happens or not is unknown. So far it sounds like Sakurai isn't thinking or too excited about it, but whether or not Nintendo lets Ultimate go after one pass and a year of post-release content is another question.

Undoubtedly this pass sold well. That's a factor they'll put into consideration before pulling the plug. They still have an extensive library of IPs, first party or not, that can be used for DLC beyond character 5. As they approach the mid-life of the Switch's lifespan, the timing is still ideal to do another pass then call it quits too.
 
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Has this been posted yet?
Nice proof of concept, but those character renders aren't in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate's artsyle (and seem to be in two different artstyles themselves), and the picture of the Mars Core "stage" doesn't actually show a stage layout so if it's supposed to be a leak then it's 100% fake.

Also, Kitchen Ace? That's a very weird way of censoring that phrase.
EDIT: Oh my gosh that's it's actual name.
 
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yeet123

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I think there is enough merit to do a second pass. If it happens or not is unknown. So far it sounds like Sakurai isn't thinking or too excited about it, but whether or not Nintendo lets Ultimate go after one pass and a year of post-release content is another question.

Undoubtedly this pass sold well. That's a factor they'll put into consideration before pulling the plug. They still have an extensive library of IPs, first party or not, that can be used for DLC beyond character 5. As they approach the mid-life of the Switch's lifespan, the timing is still ideal to do another pass then call it quits too.
My bet is that the dev team is gonna take a break, and during their hiatus theyll drop some echoes to tide fans over. then theyll come back for a nintendo fighters pass
 
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My bet is that the dev team is gonna take a break, and during their hiatus theyll drop some echoes to tide fans over. then theyll come back for a nintendo fighters pass
Don't see the need to drop echoes during their break. I wouldn't be surprised if they do take a small break between passes, but we will get nothing as...they are on vacation.

We'll just have to wait. More than fair enough.
 
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Rie Sonomura

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My Nintendo Fighters Pass (I'm not taking Spirits into consideration here) :
  1. Bandana Dee
  2. Akira Howard (Astral Chain)
  3. MinMin
  4. Gen 8 Pokemon (final evo of Grookey)
  5. Rex and Pyra/Mythra
Bandana Dee, Min-Min, Rex, Pyra and Mythra are Spirits though. Unless you meant “Assist Trophies” in place of “Spirits”
 
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Bandana Dee, Min-Min, Rex, Pyra and Mythra are Spirits though. Unless you meant “Assist Trophies” in place of “Spirits”
Nah that's not what I meant, just that I discard the "Spirits deconfirm" rule for a hypothetical Nintendo Fighters Pass, 'cause if we're being honest here there aren't many choices left for Nintendo characters if most of them are already spirits lmao
That's why I'm taking the most popular ones, may they already be spirits are not...

It's gonna be whoever they primarily promote, not whoever fills a quota.

And if it does fill a quota I hope that quota is "Pokemon that's not another humanoid starter"
There's that very true leak for Pokemon Sword and Shield, which predicted dynamaxing and stuff, that actually discusses the starter evolutions, and hypothetically Grookey would be
just a big gorilla with drums lol, not really humanoid but that's just how it'd be in Smash :-/
Honestly I just put Grookey here because it'd be the next logical step after Incineroar imo, but ya can't really predict Sakurai and Gamefreak these days sooooo....
 
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So I found this video discussing Nintendo working with Valve on the Switch. They specifically wanted Half-Life.

Maybe this is a sign they'd also want Gordon Freeman in Smash?
I'd be pretty down for a fair few Valve Games on Switch. Half Life and Half Life 2 would be amazing with updated graphics...not sure TF2 would work as well as it does on PC as the 360 and PlayStation ports were pitiful...Left 4 Dead and the Portal Games though...
 
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SKX31

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I'd be pretty down for a fair few Valve Games on Switch. Half Life and Half Life 2 would be amazing with updated graphics...not sure TF2 would work as well as it does on PC as the 360 and PlayStation ports were pitiful...Left 4 Dead and the Portal Games though...
I could def. see a port of most of those games. Wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo and Valve had contingencies in mind in case Tactics floundered as it did - especially if Smash was brought up during the talks and / or Sakurai expressed interest in Gordon Freeman (he's praised Half Life 2 in the past). We have basically no idea if that ever was brought up unless we get official word.

The closest Valve event to announce anything would be the upcoming (aformentioned) International held in Shanghai (Group Stages start late evening-midnight EST up to Sunday, the double bracket Main Event where they'd likely announce anything runs throughout next week from Tuesday to Sunday). But I doubt that they'd announce anything non-Dota related, and the last time they announced anything was when they announced Artifact during the International 2017. We all know how "well" Artifact went down.

Not holding my breath there. If they announce anything that's not related to Dota Underlords (whether that comes to Switch or not), then I'll be really surprised.
 
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I'd be pretty down for a fair few Valve Games on Switch. Half Life and Half Life 2 would be amazing with updated graphics...not sure TF2 would work as well as it does on PC as the 360 and PlayStation ports were pitiful...Left 4 Dead and the Portal Games though...
I used to be a TF2 360 player. Switching to the PC version in 2012, you really got to see how different the game had become.

I could def. see a port of most of those games. Wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo and Valve had contingencies in mind in case Tactics floundered as it did - especially if Smash was brought up during the talks and / or Sakurai expressed interest in Gordon Freeman (he's praised Half Life 2 in the past). We have basically no idea if that ever was brought up unless we get official word.

The closest Valve event to announce anything would be the upcoming (aformentioned) International held in Shanghai (Group Stages start late evening-midnight EST up to Sunday, the double bracket Main Event where they'd likely announce anything runs throughout next week from Tuesday to Sunday). But I doubt that they'd announce anything non-Dota related, and the last time they announced anything was when they announced Artifact during the International 2017. We all know how "well" Artifact went down.

Not holding my breath there. If they announce anything that's not related to Dota Underlords (whether that comes to Switch or not), then I'll be really surprised.
I'd kill for a Half-Life/Portal collection. Half-Life 1, Opposing Force, Blue Shift, Half-Life 2, Lost Coast, Episode 1, Episode 2, Portal, and Portal 2 all in one package on the go would be incredible.
 
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I used to be a TF2 360 player. Switching to the PC version in 2012. You really got to see how different the game had become.
Oh man, remember the only update the 360 got was the ability to limit classes...some smartass would pick Engine and sent the limit to Pyro only after that just to mow down poor saps.

Switching to PC was the best decision I ever made.

Oh right, Smash newcomer talk...

Who do you think would be the likeliest Valve character to jump to Smash? Heavy, Gordon Freeman, Chell, one of DOTA's many heroes or a Left 4 Dead character?

Personally I'd love me some Bill, but between his smoking, swearing and his VA passing he's an unlikely choice even if he could tie in to the upcoming Dead By Daylight release...(okay he's a pc exclusive survivor but trust me guys, Bill's amazing).
 
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Oh man, remember the only update the 360 got was the ability to limit classes...some smartass would pick Engine and sent the limit to Pyro only after that just to mow down poor saps.

Switching to PC was the best decision I ever made.

Oh right, Smash newcomer talk...

Who do you think would be the likeliest Valve character to jump to Smash? Heavy, Gordon Freeman, Chell, one of DOTA's many heroes or a Left 4 Dead character?

Personally, I'd love me some Bill, but between his smoking, swearing and his VA passing he's an unlikely choice even if he could tie into the upcoming Dead By Daylight release...(okay he's a pc exclusive survivor but trust me guys, Bill's amazing).
Based on the video I posted, it would see Half-Life would be what they would go for. So Gordon Freeman would be the pick. He's also my most wanted character. Half-Life is right up there with Doom and Halo as a legendary FPS franchise. Hell, I'd call them the Big 3 as far that genre is concerned. I'd love to see the trio of Doom Slayer, Gordon Freeman, and Master Chief make it into Smash one day.
 
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Who do you think would be the likeliest Valve character to jump to Smash? Heavy, Gordon Freeman, Chell, one of DOTA's many heroes or a Left 4 Dead character?
In terms of likelihood I think this would go to Gordon Freeman. He's the closest thing Valve has to a mascot, even though they forgot about him and abandoned the series. Half Life is their first IP and it's engine is what led to the creation of Team Fortress, Portal, and Left 4 Dead. It should be remembered that Half Life was huge when it came out, it was a hit when it released and everyone was talking about it. Sakurai himself even commented on the Half Life series before and was praising it immensely.
 

SKX31

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Who do you think would be the likeliest Valve character to jump to Smash? Heavy, Gordon Freeman, Chell, one of DOTA's many heroes or a Left 4 Dead character?
If I'll rank then realistically:

1. Gordon Freeman
2. Heavy
3. Chell
4. DOTA rep (if a MOBA was chosen, they'd go for one of the poster children. Likely Lina - who just happens to be a Slayer. Yea, she shares the name of - and is based on the Slayers character. Her abilities even references the Light novel!).
5. Left 4 Dead rep

Yea, I'm agreeing with UberPyro64 UberPyro64 and Wunderwaft Wunderwaft .
 
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