Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[ZeldaPlayer87]

considering the slime mii costume having jiggle psychics I wouldn't be surprised If we got a character with jiggle physics(I.E. Kasumi from Dead or Alive,Mai Shiranui from Fatal Fury, Asuka from Senran Kagura) in the near future.

Or E. Honda from Street Fighter.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Alice IS the protagonist of the Resident Evil movies.

Obviously that's not the RE character they'd use. But they wouldn't use the exact name. Just like Joker's name isn't Jack.

Hero's codename was just "yuusha" directly translated into brave instead of hero.

 

[tenworldsguy]

Spoiler: spirits

I give up on the whole Spirits argument. Either I'm correct and we get mostly third parties, or I'm not and I spent this time arguing for nothing. It's starting to evolve into a circle anyways...

Another topic. Suppose third party licencing was never an issue with smash, so Sakuri could freely use any character (of a vidya) regardless of company of origin whenever. What d'y'all think would have changed with Smash?
Personally, I think Banjo, Snake, and Sonic could have been added as early as Melee, with third parties being a greater presence overall

 

[Izanagi97]

So it looks like Meshima got some of the Hero's Params

Spoiler: Twitter post

Hero stats
Walk speed: 0.98
Dash speed: 1.88
Run speed: 1.84
Air speed: 1.01
Fall speed: 1.57
Fastfall speed: 2.512
Weight: 101
Ground friction: 0.11
Air friction: 0.008
Gravity: 0094

— Meshima (@Meshima_) July 31, 2019

He's actually faster on the ground than I thought he was (it's not anything crazy, he's between Pit and WFT in speed, but I was expecting a below average run speed)

 

[TheHiroSeven]

HOLD IT!

Unless they come out and say Spirits disconfirm characters we have no way of knowing that this is the case. Piranha Plant may be evidence that this is the case but we can't know that it isn't a coincidence with the information we have on hand. Spirits may make characters less likely in our eyes but we don't have conclusive evidence that they completely disconfirm characters.

Ooooooh yay! That means my dream pick Isaac still has a chance! Sakurai never said that Assist Trophies deconfirm so that means that Isaac has an insanely high chance of being DLC. Do you see how that logic doesn’t work?

 

[MrElectroG64]

Hey guys, just posting this here because I don’t know where else to post it. It’s a image for a “hypothetical” echo fighter pass (even though spirited characters are there, this was more for fun). I’ll be making more echo pass images in the future, in fact I have a second one coming already.

View attachment 233015

What do you guys think?

Whelp, not sure if many are interested, but I made a second set of “echo” fighters

I’ll probably make one or two more echo fighter pass images before going back to normal movesets. Regardless, enjoy!

 

[MrElectroG64]

Some code names I hope to see:

Player_type_hunter
Player_type_bogard
Player_type_bogardfem
Player_type_skullo
Player_type_binding
Player_type_bubble
Player_type_brazzers
Player_type_undertale
Player_type_wumpa
Player_type_hunter
Player_type_nukem
Player_type_pirate
Player_type_gnorc

Finally, a porn rep!

 

[Dust319]

According to this rumor, the codenames for the final 2 characters are "Alice" and "Dragon". I think that this is fake anyways.

If this is true, there are very few Alice’s in video games. Most notably there is a Touhou Project character named Alice, and there’s an Alice in Bloody Roar. These are not the main characters of their respective games, though. There’s also Alice from Alice: Madness Returns, but that would be a really deep cut.

Alice IS the protagonist of the Resident Evil movies.

Obviously that's not the RE character they'd use. But they wouldn't use the exact name. Just like Joker's name isn't Jack.

If we are going metaphorically like with Joker, that wouldn’t be a bad guess.

My guess would be Frisk from Undertale since Frisk falls down a hole similar to Alice.

Dragon is kinda obliviously Ryu Hayabusa.
It could be a handful of other things, since dragons aren’t uncommon in video games — monster hunter, dragon age, bubble bobble.
Or it could be more obvious like Billy/Jimmy Lee the Double Dragons.

 

[Flyboy]

Whelp, not sure if many are interested, but I made a second set of “echo” fighters

View attachment 233094

I’ll probably make one or two more echo fighter pass images before going back to normal movesets. Regardless, enjoy!

I'm loving both of these! Some of them have characters I'd love to see in future games, like Gooigi, Funky, Liquid, and Metal Sonic. Very cool. That said, I'd argue that an even better Snake echo would be The Boss, a lighter but more physical Snake.

 

[RandomMeleeGuy]

Alright, hear me out for a second.
Earthworm Jim Blasts Off!

 

[MrElectroG64]

I'm loving both of these! Some of them have characters I'd love to see in future games, like Gooigi, Funky, Liquid, and Metal Sonic. Very cool. That said, I'd argue that an even better Snake echo would be The Boss, a lighter but more physical Snake.

Thanks! I also agree with the The Boss idea, in fact, I may even use her for a later echo fighter pass image. Snake has way too many good echo fighter ideas that it’s honestly too hard to choose! I only went with Liquid because I wanted to cash in on some of my PS1 era nostalgia.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Wait, Mii Fighters are banned again in Ultimate? Or were you using ssb4 as an example?

I was using SSB4 as an example. It's why I mentioned weight too~

 

[tenworldsguy]

Whelp, not sure if many are interested, but I made a second set of “echo” fighters

Spoiler: spoiler for the sake of helpin mobile folks

View attachment 233094

I’ll probably make one or two more echo fighter pass images before going back to normal movesets. Regardless, enjoy!

Personally I'd prefer if Louie was a truly unique fighter (I made a complete moveset involving "King of Bugs" a while back for an example) but any more Pikmin representation in general would be great. Maybe make Alph the semiclone/echo? tho it wouldn't make sense for Alph to be using Bulbmin, it doesn't make more sense for him to use Whites or Purples and Olimar Wings.

 

[OrpheusTelos]

While we're on the topic of potential codenames, if we end up with fighter_type_star or something among those lines, I think everyone would loose their minds trying to decipher whether it meant Geno (Legend of the Seven Stars) or Jill Valentine (member of S.T.A.R.S.)

 

[MrElectroG64]

Personally I'd prefer if Louie was a truly unique fighter (I made a complete moveset involving "King of Bugs" a while back for an example) but any more Pikmin representation in general would be great. Maybe make Alph the semiclone/echo? tho it wouldn't make sense for Alph to be using Bulbmin, it doesn't make more sense for him to use Whites or Purples and Olimar Wings.

I agree! This was just an alternate idea for him. Trust me, I made a King of Bugs moveset too, as well as some others! Lol

Additionally, perhaps the President could be the semi-clone that uses Bulbmin instead of Alph? That way he can continue to be an alt of olimar and avoid having to use bulbmin.

 

[SirCamp]

Remember when like half the community thought a Dragon Quest character would be boring?

Some people still might not like the character, but he's hardly boring. I feel vindicated. lol

Also I feel like this is just more proof that it doesn't matter if you can't think of a way to make a character interesting. Sakurai and his team have that more than covered.

 

[GoodGrief741]

While we're on the topic of potential codenames, if we end up with fighter_type_star or something among those lines, I think everyone would loose their minds trying to decipher whether it meant Geno (Legend of the Seven Stars) or Jill Valentine (member of S.T.A.R.S.)

It would clearly be Starfy.

Remember when like half the community thought a Dragon Quest character would be boring?

Some people still might not like the character, but he's hardly boring. I feel vindicated. lol

Also I feel like this is just more proof that it doesn't matter if you can't think of a way to make a character interesting. Sakurai and his team have that more than covered.

Preach.

 

[Icedragonadam]

Based on the release dates of the characters, Banjo and DLC character #4 will be released late September/Early October and November/Early December.

Each of the DLC characters were released within 2 weeks before or after the release of an amiibo wave. The next waves are going to be released on September 20th and sometime November respectively.

 

[Curious Villager]

Remember when like half the community thought a Dragon Quest character would be boring?

Some people still might not like the character, but he's hardly boring. I feel vindicated. lol

Also I feel like this is just more proof that it doesn't matter if you can't think of a way to make a character interesting. Sakurai and his team have that more than covered.

More or less yes, although people will probably still throw the "no moveset potential" argument towards any characters they draw a blank on despite Sakurai and his team proving time and again that their more than capable of coming up with interesting new playstyles for these characters.

They do their research and play the actual games these characters come from to gain a good understanding of who they are, what they can do, what their games are about, what they can bring to the table and work on a moveset based around all of that, they'll be fine.

 

[Playstation Guy 1000]

Based on the release dates of the characters, Banjo and DLC character #4 will be released late September/Early October and November/Early December.

Each of the DLC characters were released within 2 weeks before or after the release of an amiibo wave. The next waves are going to be released on September 20th and sometime November respectively.

You could be right.

 

[Will]

Whelp, not sure if many are interested, but I made a second set of “echo” fighters

View attachment 233094

I’ll probably make one or two more echo fighter pass images before going back to normal movesets. Regardless, enjoy!

>metal sonic is heavier than sonic
>liquid is lighter than snake

despite the fact that echoes can't be have weight differences otherwise dr. mario should've been an echo

 

[volbound1700]

Dr. Mario isn't an echo because he represents Mario's moveset pre-Flud. Dr. Mario is basically the N64/Melee Mario moveset with some minor tweaks.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Ooooooh yay! That means my dream pick Isaac still has a chance! Sakurai never said that Assist Trophies deconfirm so that means that Isaac has an insanely high chance of being DLC. Do you see how that logic doesn’t work?

I never said Spirits have a high chance, I just said it isn't 0%. Also Sakurai did say (or at least heavily imply) that Assist Trophies will not become fighters in one of the "Pic of the Day" announcements for Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3Ds and Wii U. Considering Ultimate was made very soon afterward it can be reasonably assumed that this stance hasn't changed.

My opinion? Characters like Rayman and Elma could still happen, but probably won't. Characters like Isaac and Shovel Knight won't happen.

 

[Door Key Pig]

Dr. Mario isn't an echo because he represents Mario's moveset pre-Flud. Dr. Mario is basically the N64/Melee Mario moveset with some minor tweaks.

Huh, really? So Young Link's kinda that for Link?

 

[NessAtc.]

Ooooooh yay! That means my dream pick Isaac still has a chance! Sakurai never said that Assist Trophies deconfirm so that means that Isaac has an insanely high chance of being DLC. Do you see how that logic doesn’t work?

"doesn't disconfirm" does not equal "is insanely likely", so good job making a strawman to make yourself look smarter.

As for assist trophies, yes, Sakurai has never actually outright said that. And even if he did, he never said it in relation to this game, so there's nothing saying he's not changed his mind. God knows that's happened several times already.

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Huh, really? So Young Link's kinda that for Link?

Well, we don't know why he isn't an Echo actually. It could be because he was a Veteran from Melee. Chrom already proves that you can have a different move from the base, as long as it can be based upon another character with at least a similar base design. Ike has a close enough bodytype to Roy to make the animations easier to put on.

Dr. Mario is a weird case alone. Not simply because of the costume thing(which doesn't mean much), but he did use Mario as a regular base(with Luigi helping with the Doctor Tornado animation), and has the literal same body type. He might be grandfather claused in as a regular clone because of the Melee status. Maybe Sakurai considers his unique attributes different enough too. (Though Ken has his own unique attributes, moreso than any other Echo. While having different moves due to having the same kind of mechanic makes sense, the fact he's still vastly different is something people didn't expect either).

Basically? We don't know what is going on. I hope Sakurai makes the Echo information clearer. The only thing we know for some decisions is that Dark Samus and Chrom were highly requested(implied to be a ballot pick), Richter was chosen alone with Simon to represent both fan favorites in the East and the West, and of course returning guys as veterans who fit the Echo mold. As well as Isabelle not having the same body type for what he considers key to being an Echo(whether or not other factors exist is really difficult to say. Ken and Chrom show that different moves don't mean they are removed from it).

Young Link, that said, did get updated as well as by proxy of regular Link having new moves, is as close as you can get to Classic Link. Bar the Gale Boomerang at best. I mean, Hookshot and Clawshot were more or less the same move, bar model changes. Giving him Triforce Slash does make you feel like he was intended as that. But I don't remember any article stating this as an intention, though. It would make sense. Young Link is a regular version of Link from various games after all. Who better to represent the original moveset? The Trophies were written with it in mind(that Young Link is believed to be the one from Zelda 1).

 

[toonito]

Based on the release dates of the characters, Banjo and DLC character #4 will be released late September/Early October and November/Early December.

Each of the DLC characters were released within 2 weeks before or after the release of an amiibo wave. The next waves are going to be released on September 20th and sometime November respectively.

Someone on r/smashbros expanded on this

I’ve noticed a trend that ties US amiibo release dates to DLC releases/in-depth looks.

Joker got his in-depth look on April 16th, a Tuesday, and a release the next day on April 17th. The Friday before April 16th, April 12th, the Young Link, Ken, and Daisy amiibo released.

The Hero got his in-depth look/release on July 30th, a Tuesday. The Friday before July 30th, July 26th, the Pichu, Isabelle, and Pokémon Trainer amiibo released.

Looking ahead to Banjo-Kazooie, they are slated for a Fall 2019 release. The next wave of amiibo, Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Snake, is slated for September 20th, which is a Friday. Therefore, I predict that we will see an in-depth look at Banjo-Kazooie on September 24th, and see Banjo-Kazooie release on either September 24th or 25th.

Looking even further out, the Incineroar, Chrom, and Simon amiibo are slated for November. I predict that we will see an in-depth look on DLC Fighter 4 the Tuesday after this figures release, and DLC Fighter 4 will launch on the Tuesday or Wednesday following the amiibo launch.

Finally, that brings us to the Richter and Dark Samus amiibo, along with DLC Fighter 5. This one actually goes the other way. DLC Fighter 5 is slated to come out by February 2020, and that would make sense, considering it is about the standard 3 month gap that I have predicted. Therefore, we can assume that the Richter and Dark Samus amiibo will launch the Friday before the launch of DLC Fighter 5.

https://old.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/ck3a1l/trend_in_dlc_release_dates_speculation_for/

TLDR:

Amiibo Theory: Smash Amiibo waves come out on Friday; Character Pack 3/4/5 comes out the following Tuesday/Wednesday

Based on the trend of Joker and now Hero

Banjo-Kazooie allegedly comes out September 24th

Character Pack 4 allegedly comes out the Tuesday after Chrom Simon, and Incineroar amiibos debut on a Friday in November

Character Pack 5 allegedly comes out the Tuesday after Richter and Dark Samus amiibos debut on a Friday in either January or February

 

[tenworldsguy]

Basically? We don't know what is going on. I hope Sakurai makes the Echo information clearer. The only thing we know for some decisions is that Dark Samus and Chrom were highly requested(implied to be a ballot pick), Richter was chosen alone with Simon to represent both fan favorites in the East and the West, and of course returning guys as veterans who fit the Echo mold. As well as Isabelle not having the same body type for what he considers key to being an Echo(whether or not other factors exist is really difficult to say. Ken and Chrom show that different moves don't mean they are removed from it).

Personally, I define an echo as a character who is so heavily modeled after another character they share a basic model and animation style. Isabelle was probably made not an echo because her head probably would have been too drastic a change from Villager's base model, so she was made a semiclone instead. Perhaps the reason characters like Dixie were not added because they were too unique to properly fit the echo mold, and thus would have taken up precious development time.
Under these conditions, someone like Roy probably would have been classified an echo in my eyes had he not undergone Luigification. Without the unique tipper and up special, he was just a palette swap of Marth.

Someone on r/smashbros expanded on this

Spoiler

https://old.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/ck3a1l/trend_in_dlc_release_dates_speculation_for/

TLDR:

Amiibo Theory: Smash Amiibo waves come out on Friday; Character Pack 3/4/5 comes out the following Tuesday/Wednesday

Based on the trend of Joker and now Hero

Banjo-Kazooie allegedly comes out September 24th

Character Pack 4 allegedly comes out the Tuesday after Chrom Simon, and Incineroar amiibos debut on a Friday in November

Character Pack 5 allegedly comes out the Tuesday after Richter and Dark Samus amiibos debut on a Friday in either January or February

When do y'all think DLC4 and DLC5 are being revealed?
I think 4 will be shown at the "Banjo Direct" in presumably late september and 5 the "Four direct" in presumably late october or nearly december

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Personally, I define an echo as a character who is so heavily modeled after another character they share a basic model and animation style. Isabelle was probably made not an echo because her head probably would have been too drastic a change from Villager's base model, so she was made a semiclone instead. Perhaps the reason characters like Dixie were not added because they were too unique to properly fit the echo mold, and thus would have taken up precious development time.
Under these conditions, someone like Roy probably would have been classified an echo in my eyes had he not undergone Luigification. Without the unique tipper and up special, he was just a palette swap of Marth.

Isabelle also had different limb sizes and a different body size. It wasn't just the head.

Another thing is it appears Echoes wasn't even an idea till Smash 4 in general, and it appears they originally had to be costumes. He calls them clones in that game. I do feel like there's an arbitrary difference being used for Dr. Mario, but who knows.

Dixie Kong is far harder to say. It could be just the hair alone wasn't plausible and considered too much of a drastic change. Maybe he still is holding onto the idea of her being a Partner archtype. Maybe she wasn't high priority to begin with(at least that explains K. Rool in Ultimate over her. Or maybe he just was more voted?). If we do get her at some point, he might explain his reasonings more. That said, she'd still work as an Echo as is, even if the only real difference is a unique Up B. That's the bare minimum she needs. Diddy no longer uses his tail on attacks, so that makes her able to do all his moves quite easily. And possibly a new Neutral B based upon a similar idea. From what I was told earlier, to note, is that Dixie and DK share the same body structure, so they could rework his Up B into a variant for hers(not unlike how Chrom got a variant of Ike's Up B), though I can't say for sure if it'd actually work. If not clear, I'm using "maybe"-based phrasing for that reason alone. Anyway, I hope she gets in at some point.

 

[toonito]

When do y'all think DLC4 and DLC5 are being revealed?
I think 4 will be shown at the "Banjo Direct" in presumably late september and 5 the "Four direct" in presumably late october or nearly december

Joker: Revealed in December, released in April
Hero: Revealed in June, released in July
Banjo: Revealed in June, released in September(?)
DLC 4: Revealed in September(?), released in November(?)
DLC 5: Revealed in November (?), released in January or February(?)

Those are my guesses based on the amiibo theory

it's possible DLC 4 and 5 get revealed at the same time like Hero and Banjo (October?) with one being released sooner

 

[Flyboy]

I could see DLC 5 being announced at TGA to bring things full-circle. That said, Amiibo theory is very very interesting. Perhaps a release date announcement at TGA instead?

 

[Icedragonadam]

#4 is going to be revealed in the September Nintendo Direct, unless we get a surprise shadowdrop announcement of a Smash Direct at the end of EVO like last year.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

what if EVO announces an Individual DLC character?

 

[BlueMonk]

what if EVO announces an Individual DLC character?

It wouldn't really make sense to release individual character DLC while the fighter pass is still ongoing

 

[Flyboy]

what if EVO announces an Individual DLC character?

I won't get my hopes up, but that would be wild. Smash is main-eventing, after all, which should be fun either way.

 

[Playstation Guy 1000]

When do y'all think DLC4 and DLC5 are being revealed?
I think 4 will be shown at the "Banjo Direct" in presumably late september and 5 the "Four direct" in presumably late october or nearly december

DLC Character 4-September Nintendo Direct
DLC Charater 5-December(The Game Awards)

 

[TheCJBrine]

what if EVO announces an Individual DLC character?

Me when the announcement begins:

Me when it seems questionable:

Me when it's not Geno or another character I want:


Me when it's not a free bonus:

 

[volbound1700]

Huh, really? So Young Link's kinda that for Link?

Young Link is also not a full echo. If YL and DM had been echoes, they would have been called out as such in the numbering system.

 

[Icedragonadam]

The only reason Joker was at the VGAs was because Nintendo wanted to reveal the first Fighter's Pass character before release to entice fans to buy the pass and it was conveniently a few days before Ultimate's launch date. The most likely thing IMO for DLC character #5 is a final Smash Direct for Ultimate like for Corrin and Bayonetta in 4. I'm sure they want to have a send off for Ultimate like with 4.

 

[RileyXY1]

The only reason Joker was at the VGAs was because Nintendo wanted to reveal the first Fighter's Pass character before release to entice fans to buy the pass and it was conveniently a few days before Ultimate's launch date. The most likely thing IMO for DLC character #5 is a final Smash Direct for Ultimate like for Corrin and Bayonetta in 4. I'm sure they want to have a send off for Ultimate like with 4.

Except there is the possibility of there being more DLC after the Fighter Pass.