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Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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N3ON

Gone Exploring
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It is crazy that Nintendo knew all the content that was going to be in Ultimate, and chose to weigh the 8/8 Direct with so much amazingness and the 11/1 Direct with so much eh and meh and neh instead of, y'know, maybe making things a bit more balanced.

The Grinch leak obv made the 11/1 Direct sting all that much more for people, but even without it, it would've been underwhelming.

Wait? What's this about a new leak?
No new leak.
 

Swamp Sensei

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To be fair, the last direct had an introduction to spirits and an adventure mode.

Those are admittedly a pretty big selling point.

Yeah, not everyone liked those ideas, but on paper, its a fine thing to focus on.
 

CosmicQuark

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We tried to warn ya'll.
Some hilariously wrong speculation I had at the time:

“No way would they reveal only two characters with box art. Has to be a placeholder.”

“It can’t be called Spirits mode. Their editor would be smart enough not to let people easily unblur it. Knowing that could happen, it’s a fake code name used just in case people unblur it.”

And the immortal, “Banjo looks so cleeeean on the mural along with Isaac and Geno.”
 

StormC

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To be fair, the last direct had an introduction to spirits and an adventure mode.

Those are admittedly a pretty big selling point.

Yeah, not everyone liked those ideas, but on paper, its a fine thing to focus on.
I think if they led with World Of Light it would have played a lot better. I get that was their "big reveal" at the end but I personally was disappointed that "Spirits" turned out to just be some sort of weird gacha mode... having an actual Adventure Mode to go with it got me actually excited.

I really enjoyed World Of Light even if it felt a little padded out at times, so it all worked out I guess.
 

Swamp Sensei

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I think if they led with World Of Light it would have played a lot better. I get that was their "big reveal" at the end but I personally was disappointed that "Spirits" turned out to just be some sort of weird gacha mode... having an actual Adventure Mode to go with it got me actually excited.

I really enjoyed World Of Light even if it felt a little padded out at times, so it all worked out I guess.
I personally loved World of Light more than SSE but I guess I'm the minority there.

That said... spirits aren't any more gacha then trophies were in past games.

And were much better than custom parts...
 

Sestetz

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Okay, so suppose Vol. 2 had 10 fully unique fighters. Who would you want, and who do you expect? Here's my general wishlist:
View attachment 276509
MySmashTop10.png
Good idea! Here's my wishlist. For Rhythm Heaven it's blank because I think a couple things could work: (Karate Joe, Chorus Kids, Tibby)
 
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CosmicQuark

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What I loved about SSE was it made it more than a fighting game—platforming sections to break up the fights and have some fun down time. But that’s because I’m not a fan of fighting games—I’m a fan of Smash as a celebration of gaming. From what I’ve seen of WoL it’s just fight after fight after fight and it forces Ultimate back into the box of being just another fighting game.

I’ve grown into spirits though. It was incredibly confusing and unintuitive, and still is. I like them better than trophies as there’s more of them, and they’re actually integrated into gameplay. Just wish it was more fun to collect them, easier to find what I need and need to know, and descriptions that allow me to instantly know what I’m looking at; instead I rely on unofficial sites that catalogue them.
 

GoodGrief741

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I mean Ultimate is cool and all but I sleep until the Grinch 7 are in Smash.

What are everyone's thoughts on Volume 2 being a mainly 3rd party vs. first party pass now that know that Imran Khan was only making those tweets to hint at Min Min? Do you still think it'll be mainly 1st party? 3:3 equal with 3rd parties, or even 4:2 3rd parties?

I personally think it's a bit too early to call still. I think we're getting at least 2 3rd parties based on a Famitsu column Sakurai wrote. Who they will be? Bias aside, I still think there's a pretty decent chance Dante is in there. While there's no proven connection between Mii Costumes and the parent company receiving a brand new fighter, we still haven't seen Monster Hunter and there's still an opportunity to add other Capcom properties in through Mii Costumes if that is the route they take (Ace Attorney, for example). Dante also has a console exclusive Definitive Edition for Devil May Cry 3, which comes after the infamous interview with Mr. Itsuno that said, "Well, I think Dante should be on a Nintendo console first before he's in Smash, don't you?" Said article was then followed by Dante appearing on Nintendo consoles, and a definitive version as well.

Does it mean he's in? No, but those are nothing but positives for him considering I believe DMC1 Switch was announced around the time decisions for Volume 2 would have been made. I could be wrong, however.

Otherwise, I think it's decently wide open. If we're seeing more 3rd parties, Travis Touchdown has a connection through Suda51 (friends with Sakurai), Crash is always a solid "dream matchup" pick (Mario v Sonic v Crash Bandicoot). 2B would be a mainstream "strike while the iron is hot" pick, similar to Joker in that respect (the thing with meeting Yoko Taro I'm not entirely sold on yet. Obviously they met for the first time at that event, but when in the timeline does the company meeting happen? If 2B is later in the pass, why would Sakurai need to meet with Yoko Taro upon acquisition?).

First parties, I almost feel like are straightforward. Rex and XC2 were considered for base so that could come in handy for selection now, but Nintendo is choosing AND XC2 isn't as relevant. Gen 8 Pokemon...maybe? Pokemon is big enough to be an exception to almost anything, but I think it's still notable that they didn't do a spirit event for Three Houses, and we got Byleth. I do get the argument that certain spirits are arguably fair game for now, but I think we'll have to wait and see for Pokemon. Aside from that...1st parties, or at least the demanded ones, rely a bit on more upgrades. With upgrades, I'm still not convinced we're gonna get some blowout of them.

What do you think?
I'm feeling at most two third parties. I don't think that you open a majority third party Pass with Min Min.
 

DarthEnderX

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Mii Costumes I want:
Since Kunio is already probably out for being playable, I want him as a Brawler costume.

Also Reimu as a gunner so I can stop hearing that until next game.

But what I REALLY need is a Mii Mage so I can have, just, sooo many JRPG wizards!
 
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Ben Holt

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I'm almost certain that Geno is going to be somewhere in Fighter's Pass Volume 2. It's time.
But then again, I was 99% sure that Spring Man was in, so that tells you how reliable my dumb ass is.
 

Cutie Gwen

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Not to mention that for a long time, he wasn't even popular in the Pokemon community either.

A vocal segment thought he looked stupid.
No, Greninja was popular in the community, it was considered the best starter of Kalos and Protean was available since launch, which made it VERY good for conpetitive battling and made it more popular as a result
That's something I don't get about the defense of Cacomallow.


Why does it matter if the recreation is an exact 1:1 replica? The fact is that someone was able to not only do it, but prove it's more than doable to someone with the knowhow.


Sure, it's not a 1:1, but like, if you gave a modeler like, enough time, and if they actually cared enough, then, yeah they absolutely could 1:1 re-create it.
Desperation. That's literally all people need. When Grinch was new, bringing up how little it made sense to just announce 7 characters in one go, how on the nose those characters seemed to be and how it didn't match up with the empty E3 2018 Smash banner went you with "WELL IT'S FANSERVICE HOW COULD IT BE FAKE"
 

DarthEnderX

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I'm almost certain that Geno is going to be somewhere in Fighter's Pass Volume 2. It's time.
I mean, that's pretty much guaranteed at this point.

The only question is, whether it's going to be as a character, or a Mii costume.
 

Swamp Sensei

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No, Greninja was popular in the community, it was considered the best starter of Kalos and Protean was available since launch, which made it VERY good for conpetitive battling and made it more popular as a result
He was at the point he was included at Smash.

But during the XY leaks and for a short while after launch, he and the rest of the Kalos starters got some flack.
 

TwiceEXE

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I mean, that's pretty much guaranteed at this point.
I'm really curious about your thoughts on this. I see many people thinking certain characters are "near locks", and those guesses almost always end up being wrong. But then they just move onto the next character that is certain to get in. Look at all the speculation during the last fighter pass for example. Heck, I'm pretty sure I saw at least a dozen people convinced that Crash was Fighter 6.

So I guess I'm just wondering what the thought process is behind thinking a character is near certainly in (in this case, Geno)? Because the Mii costume hasn't returned? Because he hasn't been added so that means he... will be?

I'm just curious and a bit of a cynic that doesn't think any given character is anything more than a long shot.
 

zriL

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I'm almost certain that Geno is going to be somewhere in Fighter's Pass Volume 2. It's time.
But then again, I was 99% sure that Spring Man was in, so that tells you how reliable my dumb ass is.
Most likely as a Deluxe Mii Costume.
 

StormC

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I think Geno has good odds but he definitely 100% could just not be in the Pass. It's too early for me to make confident predictions.
 

DarthEnderX

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So I guess I'm just wondering what the thought process is behind thinking a character is near certainly in (in this case, Geno)?
I thought the 2nd sentence summed up my thoughts pretty easily.

With the return of Heihachi's Mii costume, we now know that season 2 is going to continue bringing back missing Smash 4 costumes, of which almost all of them have returned at this point.

So by the end of the season, Geno is either going to be a new character(unlikely), or his Mii costume will return(far more likely).
 
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Animegamingnerd

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I'm really curious about your thoughts on this. I see many people thinking certain characters are "near locks", and those guesses almost always end up being wrong. But then they just move onto the next character that is certain to get in. Look at all the speculation during the last fighter pass for example. Heck, I'm pretty sure I saw at least a dozen people convinced that Crash was Fighter 6.

So I guess I'm just wondering what the thought process is behind thinking a character is near certainly in (in this case, Geno)? Because the Mii costume hasn't returned? Because he hasn't been added so that means he... will be?

I'm just curious and a bit of a cynic that doesn't think any given character is anything more than a long shot.
Hope, fanboying, denial, having unrealistic expectations, and desire for wanting to happen tricks so many Smash fans into thinking their picks were locks.
 
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zriL

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They also explicitly reminded us that some spirit battles will be upgraded with mii costumes with the example of Cuphead (not Min Min). This is exactly Geno's situation, while other missing costumes don't have spirits in the game. This almost looks like they are setting up Geno's mii costume, I won't be surprised if he is in the next batch of mii costumes.
 
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WeirdChillFever

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They also explicitly reminded us that some spirit battles will be upgraded with mii costumes with the example of Cuphead (not Min Min). This is exactly Geno's situation, while other missing costumes don't have spirits in the game. This almost looks like they are setting up Geno's mii costume, I won't be surprised if he is in the next batch of mii costumes.
Could also be for new costumes, like Callie and Marie.
 

Sabrewulf238

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I'm just curious and a bit of a cynic that doesn't think any given character is anything more than a long shot.
I don't think it's cynical. I think it's a rational reaction to the fact that we got an Arms rep for the first character of the pass when pretty much nobody was considering it as a possibility.

Personally I'd be kinda hesitant to say any character has more than a 25% chance right now. My top picks would probably be Rayman or Geno but I'd still expect to be wrong.
 

Al-kīmiyā'

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I remember reading something about how the jiggly physics of the Mallow hat hadn't been replicated. Is that still the case?
 
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zriL

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I remember reading something about how the jiggly physics of the Mallow hat weren't replicated. Is that still the case?
If this takes hours to replicate, why would someone waste his time to prove a likely fake leak is fake ?
It mostly means nobody cares rather than being "impossible" to replicate.
 

PK-remling Fire

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I remember reading something about how the jiggly physics of the Mallow hat hadn't been replicated. Is that still the case?
In the video posted a couple pages back the Mallow hat had jiggle physics.

*edit: at around 0:53 the video zooms into the Mallow hat using jiggle physics
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Mii Costumes I want:

- Hollow Knight
- Shovel Knight
- Quote (Cave Story)
- Hat Kid
- Klonoa
- Pyramid Head (Silent Hill)
- Sephiroth (Final Fantasy VII)
- Sakura Shinguji (Sakura Wars)
- Segata Shanshiro
- Nightmare (Soul Calibur)
- Kiryu (Yakuza)
- Spyro hat
Gunvolt, Ori, Monokuma, Pearl and Marina. That’s all I need on the costume front, anything else is a bonus


Pyramid Head, Hollow Knight, Hat Kid, Sephiroth and Nightmare costumes would be dope too
 
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Heoj

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no this can't be real cacomallow is real mii costumes are made a bunch in advance and byleth pushed back the real fighter 5 and cacomallow will come with them it's impossible to replicate it so it has to be re-


ignore that its not a 1:1 recreation so its fake cacomallow is real because i want it to be real so it has to be real because whatever i think is right and anyone who disagrees is wrong and an idiot how dare you disagree with me cacomallow is real and i wont hear otherwise

View attachment 276532

lalalalalalalala i cant hear you cacomallow is real and i wont believe otherwise

Actually though A+ meme. I approve.

I kind of cringe at this strawman take, like i think cacomallow is 50/50 but what your doing is just plain exaggerating and misrepresenting the arguments of those that support the leak. Maybe you should try and understand where cacomallow supporters are actually coming from.


It's a means of moving the goalposts and nothing else.

It's similar to the Grinch leak, where people so desperately want it to be true that they'll believe it no matter what anyone says.

I look forward to people still saying Cacomallow can happen after Fighter 10 is released.
The overall opinion of cacomallow is that its most likely fake by fp8 so again, you should stop exaggerating.


Like tehponycorn said, it's as simple as moving the goalpost and denial. You get a good-looking leak that could be real? Beat the horse till it turns to dust. And in the cases of Geno and Doomguy, sometimes you cling to whatever can help you.
People definitely arent "beating a dead horse" by supporting cacomallow as its never treated as the sole thing going for geno(as well as doomguy). Cacomallow is usually just noted as an "in the air" sort of thing, like a bonus point for genos chances.
 
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Cutie Gwen

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Maybe you should try and understand where cacomallow supporters are actually coming from.
We already understand it though, they just go "omg it cool it HAS to be real" because there is literally nothing that goes in it's favour. To pretend that it still has a chance of being real after 8 months, mods showing at can be fake and the ****ing debug mode timer on the original video 'leak' is simply put, idioitic. You have nothing to gain by defending a ****ty fake leak but by insisting it still could be real despite all the evidence of the contrary, you're making a fool out of yourself
 

TwiceEXE

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The overall opinion of cacomallow is that its most likely fake by fp8 so again, you should stop exaggerating.
I mean... people should have realized it's fake already. It will likely be 2021 (or very close) by the time FP8 is released. Propping up a fake leak for that long is just going to end in major disappointment and hurt feelings.

But hey, it doesn't affect me either way.
 

rychu_supadude

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It just seems like a blatantly obvious fake to me from the moment it came out. "Where's the rest of it?" - If you can leak this, why can't you leak any other costumes or characters. Having it be two significantly less popular costumes that imply the inclusion of two massively popular characters is the cherry on top that sends my bull**** meter flying.

ESRB footage and the Ken screenshot were once in a lifetime freak occurrences.
 

I.D.

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That's something I don't get about the defense of Cacomallow.


Why does it matter if the recreation is an exact 1:1 replica? The fact is that someone was able to not only do it, but prove it's more than doable to someone with the knowhow.


Sure, it's not a 1:1, but like, if you gave a modeler like, enough time, and if they actually cared enough, then, yeah they absolutely could 1:1 re-create it.
Some people don't understand nobody wants to waste dozens of hours of unpaid work for the sole purpose of proving wrong a small group in a small corner of the internet, who are most likely going to dismiss your work anyway and try to keep the leak alive against all odds.
 
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Rie Sonomura

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Come on y’all, Min Min drops literally tomorrow. MAYBE we’ll see a datamine of 8.0. Why can’t y’all wait till then??
 

Cutie Gwen

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Come on y’all, Min Min drops literally tomorrow. MAYBE we’ll see a datamine of 8.0. Why can’t y’all wait till then??
I mean for us Europeans it's in two days but at most we'll see Min Min's codename. I don't understand why people expect them to **** up again and leave up data after the whole Brave fiasco and how they stopped leaving it in back in Smash 4 when Roy and Ryu leaked
 
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