Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[CosmicQuark]

Just in a few days a lot of questions will be answered.

- What will the stage layout look like with 6 or more stages downloaded?
- Who will be buffed or nerfed?
- What will be Min Min's Classic Mode?
- Will the Smash Intern accidentally leak a character/s in the 8.0.0 version?
- Why am I talking like an Action Cartoon narrator?

This is what I’m most curious about. I was thinking we might not know until FP7 since there is an empty spot, but then I realized the Training Stage Select Screen is actually filled up. So no matter what, we’ll find out in a couple days.

I hope they program it so they just add to the page. I would really love the option to have one full page, as well as a sort feature so I could have screens based on “Stages from Super Smash Bros. 64” or “Stages from The Legend of Zelda Series” where they’re much bigger. Though that won’t happen as if that were the case Sakurai would have mentioned it.

Worst case scenario they add a next page button, which would be horrible.

 

[MarioRaccoon]

I hope they program it so they just add to the page. I would really love the option to have one full page, as well as a sort feature so I could have screens based on “Stages from Super Smash Bros. 64” or “Stages from The Legend of Zelda Series” where they’re much bigger. Though that won’t happen as if that were the case Sakurai would have mentioned it.

Worst case scenario they add a next page button, which would be horrible.

I would like a new page button and they divide the stages in two parts so the icons can be bigger, it look very tiny in Switch screen and sometimes is difficult to see well.

Something like Smash 64, Melee and Brawl in the first page, then the second Smash 3DS, WiiU and Ultimate.

 

[Aetheri]

Honestly at this point, the only thing Sakurai is focusing on in terms of "rules" is whether or not they are video game characters, because that's the whole point of Smash. And even then I'd bet there'd even be some leeway depending on the given situation.

He may or may not include or exclude different characters for different reasons as he's really going case by case. And I feel like Sakurai's focusibg more on finding reasons to add a character rather than why certain characters can't be added.

He's not looking to fill quotas he's trying to add quality content to a game that's already rich with content.

 

[Knight Dude]

I'm team Marx for the next Kirby rep because Marx rules and BWD's moveset doesn't seem fun. Not sure if being a boss deconfirms though so I'm not exactly exciting it to happen in this game

I mean, technically both Ganon and Bowser are bosses. They could just take Marx's more normal form and have that be playable instead.

There's a lot of characters that I also feel have an air of "completing" a series.

Toad and Waluigi from Mario
Toon Zelda and a different version of Ganon from Zelda
Generation 3, 5 and 8 Pokemon
Dixie Kong and Cranky Kong from DK
Poochie and/or Kamek from Yoshi
Slippy, Peppy and Krystal from Star Fox
Bandanna Dee from Kirby

And that's just the original series. Only one that I'd say has all the characters it needs based on my very odd gut feeling is Metroid.

I don't know how many of those would feel "complete" to me, cause its a VERY subjective thing. I can see what you mean with Mario and Kirby, and that's coming from a guy who doesn't particularly want Toad or Waluigi. I just recognize they're pretty popular overall, and would be sick for a lot of other people.

Metroid is more or less complete with the characters they have, but if they finally dap up Sylux, maybe it can join too. I doubt Kraid's gonna be playable, cause he was never really as popular as Ridley was, nor has the lore connection to Samus' origins.

Dixie would be an ideal choice. Not sure if all of Fox's crew need to be playable, but at least Krystal has her own established Gimmicks to set her apart from the rest.

But I will probably never be sold on Kamek being a "needed" character. Poochy's OK tho. Yoshi's labeled as its own thing, but really it's been treated mostly as an extension of Mario content, unlike Wario and DK, which feels more fleshed out in terms of content. I would honestly settle for Yoshi getting a decent amount of music. Seriously, the Final Boss theme from the first game would be a perfect fight song.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I would like a new page button and they divide the stages in two parts so the icons can be bigger, it look very tiny in Switch screen and sometimes is difficult to see well.

Something like Smash 64, Melee and Brawl in the first page, then the second Smash 3DS, WiiU and Ultimate.

The reason why I don’t like that is what if all my favorites are on the second page? Don’t want to have to constantly press next page each time.

Which is why I mentioned I’d like the ability to sort, that way if you pick a game “64, Melee, Brawl, etc” only stages from that game show up and are big and easier to see. But if you’re comfortable viewing the full page with everything you have that option too.

I like options.

 

[SharkLord]

Could you give me a source on that?

Gotcha.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[Speed Weed]

alright so hear me out guys

 

[Knight Dude]

Made this a long time ago, but I'd be down for a polearm user.
THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE
View attachment 276457

"STANDING HERE...I REALIZE....YOU ARE JUST LIKE ME...TRYING TO MAKE HISTORY!"

"I'm making the mother of all omelettes Dee."

 

[Goombaic]

But I will probably never be sold on Kamek being a "needed" character.

Yeah that's a pretty extreme position to put Kamek when he's barely playable in Mario spinoffs. Kamek's one of my most wanted, but his chances are pretty bad, especially compared to Bandana Dee and Dixie Kong.

 

[SirBillyBob]

He technically doesn't use a lance as most people would, but I think he'd be a neat Capcom rep.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

alright so hear me out guys
View attachment 276464

How would it look like with Stage Morph?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

alright so hear me out guys
View attachment 276464

my inner graphic designer is screaming

i'd just add another tab and call it a day

 

[Knight Dude]

Well, if they DO add another tab to the stage select, how would you guys feel about separating each game (or two, 64 and Melee could share a page, as could 3DS and Wii-U) into different pages, but making the thumbnails larger so that its easier to see them at a glance?

EDIT: It'd be more pages, but said pages might be less cluttered.

 

[N3ON]

ZUN wants his character in Smash. As does Suda51. As does Ed Boon. As does Marty Stratton. As do the Ubisoft guys with Rayman.

If you were around during the ballot, you'd remember just how many devs expressed a desire to have their character included. At this point there must be over twenty different statements from devs expressing a willingness or desire for their property to be in Smash Bros.

But simply saying you'd like for it to happen in and of itself isn't really a point in the character's favour, because it's not something that sets you apart from the rest of the crowd.

In fact, it'd be interesting to see just how many devs have talked about getting their IP(s) in Smash, were someone to compile all the statements.

 

[Knight Dude]

ZUN wants his character in Smash. As does Suda51. As does Ed Boon. As does Marty Stratton. As do the Ubisoft guys with Rayman.

If you were around during the ballot, you'd remember just how many devs expressed a desire to have their character included. At this point there must be over twenty different statements from devs expressing a willingness or desire for their property to be in Smash Bros.

But simply saying you'd like for it to happen in and of itself isn't really a point in the character's favour, because it's not something that sets you apart from the rest of the crowd.

In fact, it'd be interesting to see just how many devs have talked about getting their IP(s) in Smash, were someone to compile all the statements.

I think Ono also mentioned something about wanting M.Bison as the Capcom Smash character, due to how much he'd contrast most of the characters but said Mega Man would make the most sense.

 

[SNEKeater]

There's no hard rule against characters primarily associated with rival which is why we have but note that the former two have had Sakurai explicitly cite outside demand for their inclusion (fan demand in Cloud's and Kojima himself for Snake) and that Joker ended up being an exception in context of the Fighter Pass (the other fighters being a 1st party, a former 1st party, a 3rd party heavily associated with Nintendo, and a console agnostic company known for their arcade glory days). I feel that characters in the vain of 2B or Kiryu if they get into Smash will still be an exception to the rule rather than anything denoting a trend towards 3rd Parties characters with minimal Nintendo presence.

It's true that Kiryu isn't really associated with Nintendo consoles, but the first two Yakuza games were remastered for Wii U. Not the best platform to release a game I guess, but people usually forgets about that.

 

[toonito]

There's a lot of characters that I also feel have an air of "completing" a series.

Toad and Waluigi from Mario
Toon Zelda and a different version of Ganon from Zelda
Generation 3, 5 and 8 Pokemon
Dixie Kong and Cranky Kong from DK
Poochie and/or Kamek from Yoshi
Slippy, Peppy and Krystal from Star Fox
Bandanna Dee from Kirby

And that's just the original series. Only one that I'd say has all the characters it needs based on my very odd gut feeling is Metroid.

agree with Toad, Waluigi, the Pokemon, and BWD for "completing" a series

other characters to complete a series

Meowth: swap
Raichu: conditional if stays on roster to have the Pika line playable; if cut then Raichu's not as important to me

Elma & Rex/Pyra for Xenoblade

Tails
Chun-Li: swap

Ms. Pac-Man

Tifa

Villains to complete a series (even though these days I prefer the following characters as bosses in Classic Mode)

Porky or Giygas

Kamek

Black Shadow

Hades

Zanza

Big Boss

Dr. Eggman

Dr. Wily

M. Bison

Sephiroth

Jubileus or Aesir

Dr. Coyle (this smilie came quick lol)

Dracula

Gruntilda

Geese Howard

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Well, if they DO add another tab to the stage select, how would you guys feel about separating each game (or two, 64 and Melee could share a page, as could 3DS and Wii-U) into different pages, but making the thumbnails larger so that its easier to see them at a glance?

EDIT: It'd be more pages, but said pages might be less cluttered.

That'd honestly look really good, imo.

 

[Knight Dude]

It's true that Kiryu isn't really associated with Nintendo consoles, but the first two Yakuza games were remastered for Wii U. Not the best platform to release a game I guess, but people usually forgets about that.

There's also Project X Zone 1 or 2. He was in one of them at least.

 

[Icedragonadam]

I think everyone can agree that Ultimate has the worst stage layout of the series. It's just so cluttered.

 

[3BitSaurus]

Well, if they DO add another tab to the stage select, how would you guys feel about separating each game (or two, 64 and Melee could share a page, as could 3DS and Wii-U) into different pages, but making the thumbnails larger so that its easier to see them at a glance?

EDIT: It'd be more pages, but said pages might be less cluttered.

I think it would probably look better than trying to cram everything into a single page. Maybe the N64 section would look a bit empty (and also the Ultimate one for those who didn't buy the DLC), but overall I think the presentation would be nicer.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I think everyone can agree that Ultimate has worst stage layout of the series. It's just so cluttered.

That's the consequence of having over 100 stages.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

That's the consequence of having over 100 stages.

Over 100 stages is not inherently a consequence of things being so cluttered.

Trying to cram them into a single screen is the issue, even more so when both Brawl and Smash 4 also sorted with different pages.

 

[PSIGuy]

if we're mucking about with the stage select screen can we PLEASE get the hazard select screen moved to that menu?

 

[CosmicQuark]

He technically doesn't use a lance as most people would, but I think he'd be a neat Capcom rep.
View attachment 276466

While there are other Capcom characters I'm rooting for being playable, it's a shame Ghouls 'n' Ghosts has nothing. It would be a perfect stage, and the music is iconic. I wish there were more stages/music from third party series that didn't get a character, but too prohibitively expensive I guess. I'd buy them even without a character, though.

Well, if they DO add another tab to the stage select, how would you guys feel about separating each game (or two, 64 and Melee could share a page, as could 3DS and Wii-U) into different pages, but making the thumbnails larger so that its easier to see them at a glance?

EDIT: It'd be more pages, but said pages might be less cluttered.

Yeah, that's even worse than a next button as that would mean more cycling through to get to stages I want. Which is why I feel like full screen, with a filter option, is the best. Be able to pick any stage immediately if you want, or have a filter option in the stage rules to filter what stages from which game shows up, allowing them to be bigger and easier to see, with an optional next button if you choose multiple games. More options is better than one compromised option.

Here's what I think it will look like. It's funny how 4 more Fighter Pass characters would make unstacked character selection screen a perfect rectangle, and make the Training Stage Selection Screen a perfect rectangle.

Spoiler: Big Image

 

[cothero]

Aside from the gen 8 Pokémon character, i think Paper Mario also has a decent chance of being added in this fighter's pass with the incoming "Paper Mario: the Origami King" release in July. And thruth be told here, PM should have been added in Smash at least three titles ago.

 

[SKX31]

Oh dangit, completely blanked on K.Rool. What I mean to say is that Ganon would be the first large character with long-reaching normals, like Corrin or the Belmonts. K.Rool is based around his projectile specials, which exempt him from the long-range normals group. His projectiles still have the same general weakness and properties of projectiles, like reflectability or not having anything connecting to the character, while Ganon's trident wouldn't be reflectable and would deal damage a large area in front of him, presumably all at once.
What I meant, in short, was that we'd get Bandana Dee or Ganon before we got a "traditional" spear/polearm user, if that makes sense.

That makes sense, yes. Unless the next FE protag is a polearm / halberd / spear user but whatever.

So like a super heavy Rosalina in essence, but with Byleth's (or even close to Min Min's) reach? Could honestly see that work. Again, Rool works decently - and while Byleth doesn't have a lot of competitive data (due to the pandemic cancelling / postponing a lot of tournaments) the character's also decently designed. So there's definetely a possibility.

if we're mucking about with the stage select screen can we PLEASE get the hazard select screen moved to that menu?

Seconding this, and not just because I personally like Town and City with Hazards On.

*(We'll see about Min Min, kinda think a lot of people - both casual and competitive - will complain if ESAM's prediction comes true and she straight up beats every zoner in the game)

 

[Koopaul]

Well Paper Mario is a stage. Maybe they thought that was good enough for Paper Mario?

I do have this feeling that all the 1st/2nd party characters from Nintendo are going to be from a Switch title. So maybe?

Just think we'd have a stage called Paper Mario and a character called Paper Mario. It'd be just like Duck Hunt!

 

[Jomosensual]

There's a lot of characters that I also feel have an air of "completing" a series.

Toad and Waluigi from Mario
Toon Zelda and a different version of Ganon from Zelda
Generation 3, 5 and 8 Pokemon
Dixie Kong and Cranky Kong from DK
Poochie and/or Kamek from Yoshi
Slippy, Peppy and Krystal from Star Fox
Bandanna Dee from Kirby

And that's just the original series. Only one that I'd say has all the characters it needs based on my very odd gut feeling is Metroid.

6 Star Fox characters feels like it's blowing past the point of extreme

 

[DarthEnderX]

Look at the other posts. They clearly stated their ideas for him.

Yeah, and it's completely irrelevant to my point, that concept of "spooky Kirby boss" is already perfectly represented by the spooky Kirby boss that is already a boss in Smash.

The mere existence of other spooky Kirby bosses doesn't necessitate adding more of them.

 

[Evil Trapezium]

alright so hear me out guys
View attachment 276464

Maybe split it up into Past Stages and New Stages instead?

 

[Will]

Zanza

you have a whole metal face that you will never fight ever in your life already in the game and you throw him out for mr. spoiler man final boss smh

 

[Guynamednelson]

if we're mucking about with the stage select screen can we PLEASE get the hazard select screen moved to that menu?

Normal, Hazards Off, Omega, Battlefield.

Was that so hard?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

What are everyone's thoughts on Volume 2 being a mainly 3rd party vs. first party pass now that know that Imran Khan was only making those tweets to hint at Min Min? Do you still think it'll be mainly 1st party? 3:3 equal with 3rd parties, or even 4:2 3rd parties?

I personally think it's a bit too early to call still. I think we're getting at least 2 3rd parties based on a Famitsu column Sakurai wrote. Who they will be? Bias aside, I still think there's a pretty decent chance Dante is in there. While there's no proven connection between Mii Costumes and the parent company receiving a brand new fighter, we still haven't seen Monster Hunter and there's still an opportunity to add other Capcom properties in through Mii Costumes if that is the route they take (Ace Attorney, for example). Dante also has a console exclusive Definitive Edition for Devil May Cry 3, which comes after the infamous interview with Mr. Itsuno that said, "Well, I think Dante should be on a Nintendo console first before he's in Smash, don't you?" Said article was then followed by Dante appearing on Nintendo consoles, and a definitive version as well.

Does it mean he's in? No, but those are nothing but positives for him considering I believe DMC1 Switch was announced around the time decisions for Volume 2 would have been made. I could be wrong, however.

Otherwise, I think it's decently wide open. If we're seeing more 3rd parties, Travis Touchdown has a connection through Suda51 (friends with Sakurai), Crash is always a solid "dream matchup" pick (Mario v Sonic v Crash Bandicoot). 2B would be a mainstream "strike while the iron is hot" pick, similar to Joker in that respect (the thing with meeting Yoko Taro I'm not entirely sold on yet. Obviously they met for the first time at that event, but when in the timeline does the company meeting happen? If 2B is later in the pass, why would Sakurai need to meet with Yoko Taro upon acquisition?).

First parties, I almost feel like are straightforward. Rex and XC2 were considered for base so that could come in handy for selection now, but Nintendo is choosing AND XC2 isn't as relevant. Gen 8 Pokemon...maybe? Pokemon is big enough to be an exception to almost anything, but I think it's still notable that they didn't do a spirit event for Three Houses, and we got Byleth. I do get the argument that certain spirits are arguably fair game for now, but I think we'll have to wait and see for Pokemon. Aside from that...1st parties, or at least the demanded ones, rely a bit on more upgrades. With upgrades, I'm still not convinced we're gonna get some blowout of them.

What do you think?

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

I think we'll probably have at least 3 3rd parties. Maybe 4.

But it could go either way. We have little information with Min Min. She was a special request, after all. Which means Nintendo didn't simply choose her directly in the same way as others. She's not someone who was on the ballot, or from an obvious upcoming game or was from a very relevant game within the last few years. She's an outlier from the first pass, and that could mean just about anything. We could see characters that are also various requested ones. We could see something like Geno because Sakurai legitimately requested that one, but who knows.

The one thing that's different is Sakurai's statement about pass 1, where none of them were his personal picks. Min Min actually sounds like a personal pick for him, since her and Ninjara are his two favorites. That could mean just about anything for the rest of the pass.

On the stage layout thing, the stages are done by order of appearance, not franchise, so it looks a lot more cluttered by that too. Cramming it one page doesn't help, obviously. It's just the layout choice looks kind of bleh to some.

 

[Cosmic77]

It's too soon to say what the ratio of first-parties and third-parties will be like. That being said, Smash characters are usually revealed from most exciting to least exciting. If there are any big third-parties left, they'll probably be revealed sooner rather than later. Not an unbreakable rule, but that's what happens in most cases.

As for what I'm expecting, I think they'll use this pass to add a few first-party characters who had unfortunate timing. Along with Min Min, I'm guessing Rex and a Gen 8 Pokemon. I'm also guessing they'll add another character from a game that's very new, so maybe BotW 2 or something else that's coming out 2020/2021. Last two spots will probably be third-party.

 

[MooMew64]

The ugly second page on the stage selection screen is unfortunately a necessity. Cramming even more stages on the current SSS just means scrunching the icons down even more, and I have a feeling Sakurai will simply go for the second page option instead.

 

[Deathcarter]

What are everyone's thoughts on Volume 2 being a mainly 3rd party vs. first party pass now that know that Imran Khan was only making those tweets to hint at Min Min? Do you still think it'll be mainly 1st party? 3:3 equal with 3rd parties, or even 4:2 3rd parties?

I personally think it's a bit too early to call still. I think we're getting at least 2 3rd parties based on a Famitsu column Sakurai wrote. Who they will be? Bias aside, I still think there's a pretty decent chance Dante is in there. While there's no proven connection between Mii Costumes and the parent company receiving a brand new fighter, we still haven't seen Monster Hunter and there's still an opportunity to add other Capcom properties in through Mii Costumes if that is the route they take (Ace Attorney, for example). Dante also has a console exclusive Definitive Edition for Devil May Cry 3, which comes after the infamous interview with Mr. Itsuno that said, "Well, I think Dante should be on a Nintendo console first before he's in Smash, don't you?" Said article was then followed by Dante appearing on Nintendo consoles, and a definitive version as well.

Does it mean he's in? No, but those are nothing but positives for him considering I believe DMC1 Switch was announced around the time decisions for Volume 2 would have been made. I could be wrong, however.

Otherwise, I think it's decently wide open. If we're seeing more 3rd parties, Travis Touchdown has a connection through Suda51 (friends with Sakurai), Crash is always a solid "dream matchup" pick (Mario v Sonic v Crash Bandicoot). 2B would be a mainstream "strike while the iron is hot" pick, similar to Joker in that respect (the thing with meeting Yoko Taro I'm not entirely sold on yet. Obviously they met for the first time at that event, but when in the timeline does the company meeting happen? If 2B is later in the pass, why would Sakurai need to meet with Yoko Taro upon acquisition?).

First parties, I almost feel like are straightforward. Rex and XC2 were considered for base so that could come in handy for selection now, but Nintendo is choosing AND XC2 isn't as relevant. Gen 8 Pokemon...maybe? Pokemon is big enough to be an exception to almost anything, but I think it's still notable that they didn't do a spirit event for Three Houses, and we got Byleth. I do get the argument that certain spirits are arguably fair game for now, but I think we'll have to wait and see for Pokemon. Aside from that...1st parties, or at least the demanded ones, rely a bit on more upgrades. With upgrades, I'm still not convinced we're gonna get some blowout of them.

What do you think?

Just going to point out that The Pokemon Company publishes the Pokemon games in Japan so his comment on publishers could theoretically mean only one 3rd Party (though I think were getting half 1st party & half 3rd party).

 

[Deleted member]

What are everyone's thoughts on Volume 2 being a mainly 3rd party vs. first party pass now that know that Imran Khan was only making those tweets to hint at Min Min? Do you still think it'll be mainly 1st party? 3:3 equal with 3rd parties, or even 4:2 3rd parties?

I personally think it's a bit too early to call still. I think we're getting at least 2 3rd parties based on a Famitsu column Sakurai wrote. Who they will be? Bias aside, I still think there's a pretty decent chance Dante is in there. While there's no proven connection between Mii Costumes and the parent company receiving a brand new fighter, we still haven't seen Monster Hunter and there's still an opportunity to add other Capcom properties in through Mii Costumes if that is the route they take (Ace Attorney, for example). Dante also has a console exclusive Definitive Edition for Devil May Cry 3, which comes after the infamous interview with Mr. Itsuno that said, "Well, I think Dante should be on a Nintendo console first before he's in Smash, don't you?" Said article was then followed by Dante appearing on Nintendo consoles, and a definitive version as well.

Does it mean he's in? No, but those are nothing but positives for him considering I believe DMC1 Switch was announced around the time decisions for Volume 2 would have been made. I could be wrong, however.

Otherwise, I think it's decently wide open. If we're seeing more 3rd parties, Travis Touchdown has a connection through Suda51 (friends with Sakurai), Crash is always a solid "dream matchup" pick (Mario v Sonic v Crash Bandicoot). 2B would be a mainstream "strike while the iron is hot" pick, similar to Joker in that respect (the thing with meeting Yoko Taro I'm not entirely sold on yet. Obviously they met for the first time at that event, but when in the timeline does the company meeting happen? If 2B is later in the pass, why would Sakurai need to meet with Yoko Taro upon acquisition?).

First parties, I almost feel like are straightforward. Rex and XC2 were considered for base so that could come in handy for selection now, but Nintendo is choosing AND XC2 isn't as relevant. Gen 8 Pokemon...maybe? Pokemon is big enough to be an exception to almost anything, but I think it's still notable that they didn't do a spirit event for Three Houses, and we got Byleth. I do get the argument that certain spirits are arguably fair game for now, but I think we'll have to wait and see for Pokemon. Aside from that...1st parties, or at least the demanded ones, rely a bit on more upgrades. With upgrades, I'm still not convinced we're gonna get some blowout of them.

What do you think?

At most, half and half, but I'm believing there's going to be 2 1st Parties in Vol 2. It's definitely likely that we'll see another 1st Party character in Vol 2, but the question is not if but when (though I hope it isn't as soon as FP7). So far, Byleth and Min Min are the only 2 1st Party characters in both Fighter Passes to be from a Switch title, and a Gen 8 Pokemon is the most believable candidate for a spot in Vol 2 at the moment. While the spirit event and Pokemon Tourney would make it sound like SwSh has been a nogo, I'd just say it's more likely those were just to promote the release of the games rather than outright deconfirmations like Astral Chain or Ring Fit Adventure. Rex is debatable considering there's a decently small amount of XC2 content with 8 spirits, 3 tracks, and 2 Mii Costumes already in it except for a stage, so if we were going to see Vol 2 become half and half, he could be a possibility. The only wildcard 1st Party character would be Paper Mario depending on the time of Origami King's development.

As far as 3rd Parties go, I threw out my predictions for Vol 2 yesterday, so I'll repost them:

-Dynasty Warriors Rep: sticking to my guns on this 1 since I'm super biased about it and for various reasons: spawned the Musou genre, KT's flagship franchise, their relationship with Nintendo, and the games they've developed under their IPs.

-Billy & Jimmy: thinking there's going to be a retro NES rep in Vol 2, and the series in question will be Double Dragon. The Beat Em up genre is unrepped with a fighter, so my bets are going on the Lee brothers (and if possible, 1 of them could even be an echo).

-Crash: mostly because he's a big want from the community since the conception of the 1st Fighter Pass, so he'll probably be in Smash out of mass fan requests

-Geralt: He's my wildcard pick of Vol 2. Yeah I get the novels came first, but really, it's possible that The Switcher port opened doors for negotiations to add The Witcher to Smash.

Now, if Vol 2 were to be half and half, I'd say either Crash or Geralt won't be in Vol 2 (though Crash would probably end up being the more favorable pick for his popularity among the Smash fandom).

 

[CosmicQuark]

What are everyone's thoughts on Volume 2 being a mainly 3rd party vs. first party pass now that know that Imran Khan was only making those tweets to hint at Min Min? Do you still think it'll be mainly 1st party? 3:3 equal with 3rd parties, or even 4:2 3rd parties?

I personally think it's a bit too early to call still. I think we're getting at least 2 3rd parties based on a Famitsu column Sakurai wrote. Who they will be? Bias aside, I still think there's a pretty decent chance Dante is in there. While there's no proven connection between Mii Costumes and the parent company receiving a brand new fighter, we still haven't seen Monster Hunter and there's still an opportunity to add other Capcom properties in through Mii Costumes if that is the route they take (Ace Attorney, for example). Dante also has a console exclusive Definitive Edition for Devil May Cry 3, which comes after the infamous interview with Mr. Itsuno that said, "Well, I think Dante should be on a Nintendo console first before he's in Smash, don't you?" Said article was then followed by Dante appearing on Nintendo consoles, and a definitive version as well.

Does it mean he's in? No, but those are nothing but positives for him considering I believe DMC1 Switch was announced around the time decisions for Volume 2 would have been made. I could be wrong, however.

Otherwise, I think it's decently wide open. If we're seeing more 3rd parties, Travis Touchdown has a connection through Suda51 (friends with Sakurai), Crash is always a solid "dream matchup" pick (Mario v Sonic v Crash Bandicoot). 2B would be a mainstream "strike while the iron is hot" pick, similar to Joker in that respect (the thing with meeting Yoko Taro I'm not entirely sold on yet. Obviously they met for the first time at that event, but when in the timeline does the company meeting happen? If 2B is later in the pass, why would Sakurai need to meet with Yoko Taro upon acquisition?).

First parties, I almost feel like are straightforward. Rex and XC2 were considered for base so that could come in handy for selection now, but Nintendo is choosing AND XC2 isn't as relevant. Gen 8 Pokemon...maybe? Pokemon is big enough to be an exception to almost anything, but I think it's still notable that they didn't do a spirit event for Three Houses, and we got Byleth. I do get the argument that certain spirits are arguably fair game for now, but I think we'll have to wait and see for Pokemon. Aside from that...1st parties, or at least the demanded ones, rely a bit on more upgrades. With upgrades, I'm still not convinced we're gonna get some blowout of them.

What do you think?

My hope is do what Fighter’s Pass 1 did—mostly third party, with one or two first party characters. Allows for more variety and I’d much rather have series not yet in Smash for the limited spots. Second best are series in Smash, but don’t have a character, which is why Arms was the best first party option. Third best are those who didn’t have a new unique character in Ultimate, which is why while I was underwhelmed with Byleth, I wasn’t upset by it. Another Pokémon while there’s 8-10 in already would be disappointing to me personally as a wasted opportunity.

Keeping that in mind, my hopes for each company, as I’ve already given my Fighter’s Pass wants.

Spoiler

Konami: Bomberman upgrade, though Min Min makes me think assist trophies are off limits. Just a feeling, not a rule.

Sega: Can’t think of any other Sega character I would want, other than another Sonic character. But as I said, unless it’s an echo like Shadow, I’d rather it be series not yet represented.

Capcom: The biggest company to draw from outside of Square, Dante being the biggest one for me. After that, Phoenix Wright is okay but only if Sakurai doesn’t draw from his fighting game appearances and finds something uniquely different, otherwise it would be a wasted opportunity. Would love a Ghouls ‘n’ Ghosts stage, but less interested in Arthur as a character.

Bandai Namco: I doubt Sakurai views Namco having only one character as a bad thing—maybe he considers Pac-Man Namco’s representative, like Terry is for SNK. My want is Agumon, for Pokémon vs Digimon awesomeness, but it would likely be Lloyd if anyone.

Square Enix: I doubt they would get another character, outside of Geno if Nintendo decides to give the Smash fans what they want. But if they did, and there’s many options, I’d go with Lara Croft for her iconic status. That being said, her moveset wouldn’t interest me as much, and I consider that the deciding factor for a character, in my eyes. Third best would be Chrono Trigger.

Microsoft: Master Chief would only be good in my opinion to get massive headlines from places that normally wouldn’t talk about Smash, and that’s pretty much it. I’d prefer a Minecraft stage over Steve, personally, though now that Banjo & Kazooie are in I’m more receptive of the character idea, particularly if they make his alts costumes you can get in Minecraft (e.g., Mario, Donkey Kong, Banjo, etc). My personal want is Conker, but that’s not happening.

Nintendo: The only character I could see being interested in that is likely for DLC is Rex, the rest don’t seem like DLC characters and as I mentioned I’d prefer no Pokémon while I do expect it. That being said, I can’t see Rex being superficially different enough from Shulk to appeal to me, and would hope they’re not a semi or pseudo clone in the vein of Isabelle or Lucas, but a legitimately different style of play. I’d love Dixie Kong and Bandana Waddle Dee, but as characters outside of the Fighter’s Pass model, rather than Fighter’s Pass characters. And that’s all I can think of, which is why I prefer third parties.

New studio: Crash (Activision), Sora (Disney), and Rayman (Ubisoft) are my main wants.