Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

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Nquoid

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Imagine Ubisoft desperately wanting their character in the game to the point they made a model and stuff, only for Nintendo to shut them down lol

I mean, at least he still gets spirit stuff in Ultimate. But maybe Ubisoft is content with Brawlhala...
I just can't imagine Ubisoft having another rep they'd prefer? Obviously Assassin's Creed is probably their biggest franchise. Or maybe they pull from Prince of Persia or Beyond Good and Evil. But Rayman or to a lesser extent the Rabbids feels like such a slam dunk
 
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Why are people so doubtful that a second fighter pass could happen? The Switch is one of Nintendo’s most successful consoles ever and its barely over two years old. Ultimate is only half a year old right now.

Considering we won’t get another console for probably at least another 4-5 years if not more then we won’t get another Smash game for that long if not longer. Why wouldn’t Nintendo want to capitalize on this “Ultimate” version that will most likely be around for +5 years?

Especially with how well Ultimate sold. I’m not saying that another pass will happen, I just don’t see any good reason why it wouldn’t unless Sakurai himself just does not want to work on it anymore.
 

SMAASH! Puppy

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I just can't imagine Ubisoft having another rep they'd prefer? Obviously Assassin's Creed is probably their biggest franchise. Or maybe they pull from Prince of Persia or Beyond Good and Evil. But Rayman or to a lesser extent the Rabbids feels like such a slam dunk
If they add Ezio (or however you spell his name) then his Up Special had better be a swan dive into a pile of hay.
 
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Tbf, does Rayman have that much popularity going for him in Japan? Rabbids, maybe...
Why are people so doubtful that a second fighter pass could happen? The Switch is one of Nintendo’s most successful consoles ever and its barely over two years old. Ultimate is only half a year old right now.

Considering we won’t get another console for probably at least another 4-5 years if not more then we won’t get another Smash game for that long if not longer. Why wouldn’t Nintendo want to capitalize on this “Ultimate” version that will most likely be around for +5 years?

Especially with how well Ultimate sold. I’m not saying that another pass will happen, I just don’t see any good reason why it wouldn’t unless Sakurai himself just does not want to work on it anymore.
I guess because the argument that maybe Nintendo doesn't support DLC for more than a year, if that's true? (Does Splatoon 2 count?) If they'd want to make an exception for the most special and craziest Smash roster ever, fueled by perhaps continued financial success with Ultimate through its DLC, remains to be seen. Considering they're putting money into more complex animated trailers this time around, maybe they could?
 
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Notice how the one game which got DLC for more than a year (Splatoon 2) is the one with a competitive community and Nintendo has been supporting it non-stop since release. Smash also has those 2 things. Not saying this makes more DLC likely but it is certainly very possible.
Yeah, but I think this could be because of the Splatoon devs' view on their competitive community. Sure, they're still kinda trying to form a meta in some capacity, but it's been clear since the first trailer that they kinda wanted an esports-esque thing, in a way. The same can't exactly be said for Smash, even if large steps were taken with Smash 4 and Ultimate.

I believe we will get extended support in the form of patches, but not necessarily new content, like Splatoon. Plus, the way DLC works in these two games is very different in itself.
 
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I'm on board for most of this, but idk if I would trust Google Theory or the 5chan leak parts. Since those have incorrect info on them. Though the Artorias part might just be because it was Dark Souls DLC.
 
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Nquoid

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I'm on board for most of this, but idk if I would trust Google Theory or the 5chan leak parts. Since those have incorrect info on them. Though the Artorias part might just be because it was Dark Souls DLC.
Carmack saying that in December when they would most likely have had to have signed NDAs...
 

Nquoid

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Carmack no longer works for Id software, so nothing he tweets would be a deconfirmation imo
Counter to that though, Grant Kirkhope was no longer with Rare but definitely had to sign contracts. Obviously different for composers actually working on the game. But Nintendo are mostly trying to keep a tight ship here, leaks not withstanding. The last thing they'd allow would be the creator of the character to tweet blatant hints.
 
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Counter to that though, Grant Kirkhope was no longer with Rare but definitely had to sign contracts. Obviously different for composers actually working on the game. But Nintendo are mostly trying to keep a tight ship here, leaks not withstanding. The last thing they'd allow would be the creator of the character to tweet blatant hints.
Kirkhope was doing actual work for the game with his new remix though. Carmack wouldn't be providing anything for smash brothers if Doom was to be represented. Its quite possible Carmack would know absolutely nothing even if the character was in.
 

Nquoid

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Kirkhope was doing actual work for the game with his new remix though. Carmack wouldn't be providing anything for smash brothers if Doom was to be represented. Its quite possible Carmack would know absolutely nothing even if the character was in.
I'd actually be intrigued what kind of contract he has with id. Obviously he sold his shares to Zenimax, but if I recall he's still credited on Doom (2016). Not sure if that's because he worked on it before he left or if he still holds any residual rights somehow. But I doubt he'd be completely in the dark about what they were doing with Doomguy.
 
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Is it possible we don't get a Bamco character in the pass, like how we didn't get one last time for DLC? If I remember right, pretty much everybody thought Lloyd or Heihachi were getting in (after Ryu opened the door to second third parties from the same company, at least), and then neither did. Pac-Man might ride solo again. Not that it'd be a good thing, I just don't think we're getting one necessarily.
 
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Is it possible we don't get a Bamco character in the pass, like how we didn't get one last time for DLC? If I remember right, pretty much everybody thought Lloyd or Heihachi were getting in (after Ryu opened the door to second third parties from the same company, at least), and then neither did. Pac-Man might ride solo again. Not that it'd be a good thing, I just don't think we're getting one necessarily.
I'm not really sure we will be seeing a new Namco character happening myself. They apparently retired Heihachi due to the passing of his voice actor if I recall correctly (Although I guess there are other options for Tekken if they have to). And I don't really see a third JRPG character happening with Tales. Especially if their trying to expand towards a wider audience as they claimed for this DLC pass.

They've got other franchises too I suppose, though I'm not as sure as to how likely those characters are though...

Could very well be wrong though, but I guess we'll see what happens.
 
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I'm on board for most of this, but idk if I would trust Google Theory or the 5chan leak parts. Since those have incorrect info on them. Though the Artorias part might just be because it was Dark Souls DLC.
I feel this is Nicolas Cage levels of putting the pieces together, National Treasure style.
But hell, I want to support this conspiracy. Doom is iconic, influential, and best of all, relevant again.
 
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I feel this is Nicolas Cage levels of putting the pieces together, National Treasure-style.
But hell, I want to support this conspiracy. Doom is iconic, influential, and best of all, relevant again.
This plus the Mick Gordon thing that Untouch posted bring this conspiracy up in full force!

Obviously, there is no guarantee, but it's neat to see the possibility of Doom Slayer coming.
 
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Problem is though that this feels way too open and thus actually hurts Doomguy's chances. Nintendo has been trying to keep lip on the characters what with NDAs and all. I mean the ex Namco employee who leaked that Namco was working on Ultimate had his Twitter deleted immediately. Plus Doom's massively unpopular in Japan compared to the likes of western characters like Banjo and Crash.

Dragon Quest at least has recognizablility in the West with VIII, IX, and XI. Two of the main protagonists from these three even make up half of the costumes.
 

Guybrush20X6

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My personal theory is that there'll be three fighter passes. The first one that we're on currently, one with Echo fighters to bridge a gap and a final one with all original characters.
 
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I'm on board for most of this, but idk if I would trust Google Theory or the 5chan leak parts. Since those have incorrect info on them. Though the Artorias part might just be because it was Dark Souls DLC.
Dunno, man, the 5chan leak and Google theory were both disproven - if not some time ago, then by the E3 Direct.

Sorry if I'm raining on anyone's parade, It's just... while Bethesda's chances are better than they've ever been, I just really doubt other western characters in general, even those I'd be excited for. I mean, even if I have no personal attachment to Doom, I'd be happy to see the first true FPS character in Smash be the granddaddy of the genre, but I still have trouble picturing Bethesda in Smash right now - even if they are among the most likely candidates. We haven't seen Namco or Capcom in the FP yet, plus there's Koei, Ubi, SNK, Level-5... dunno. There's at least a few other choices, most of them in Japan and I doubt we'll see another western developer join Smash so soon.

I'm not really sure we will be seeing a new Namco character happening myself. They apparently retired Heihachi due to the passing of his voice actor if I recall correctly (Although I guess there are other options for Tekken if they have to). And I don't really see a third JRPG character happening with Tales. Especially if their trying to expand towards a wider audience as they claimed for this DLC pass.

They've got other franchises too I suppose, though I'm not as sure as to how likely those characters are though...

Could very well be wrong though, but I guess we'll see what happens.
If you cut out the RPGs from Namco's repertoire, the only really likely choices would be Tekken or SC. And even that depends on whether or not Sakurai got over the technical limitations he had when he tried to think of a way to translate 3D fighter gameplay.

It's so strange... on one hand, we have new stuff to talk about with the SE and Microsoft reps out of the way, but at the same time... it feels like we're going through another info drought, just waiting for a new leak.
 

A.G.L.

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Is it possible we don't get a Bamco character in the pass, like how we didn't get one last time for DLC? If I remember right, pretty much everybody thought Lloyd or Heihachi were getting in (after Ryu opened the door to second third parties from the same company, at least), and then neither did. Pac-Man might ride solo again. Not that it'd be a good thing, I just don't think we're getting one necessarily.
Seeing as how Namco loves DLC themselves (Tekken 7, Soul Calibur 6, Dragon Ball FighterZ, etc). Not to mention how many 3rd parties they have worked with to get characters in their own games. I think people are really sleeping on the fact that Namco most likely will get another fighter. Yes they didn’t get one last time, but just because they didn’t get one in Smash Wii U DLC doesn’t mean they won’t this time. We have to keep in mind how many characters Namco has, they aren’t some obscure company with no characters. Yes they aren’t Banjo hype level, however neither was Ryu from Capcom to a lot of people.

I think a 2nd Namco rep is a pretty safe bet, I’d say 90% likely. The more pressing question is who will they choose. And yes a Tekken rep is possible, they have had time for technology to catch up. So the limitations they had then may not exist now. Also let’s not forget that Tekken characters have been in 2D games before. Heihachi was in both PlayStation All Stars and Street Fighter X Tekken.
 
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A.G.L.

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But I'm sure that if they come up with a Dark Souls character, they can destroy the Internet even harder.
The only "problem" would be that most of the important Dark Souls characters have a sword.
Dark Souls is like the Dark Horse of the Namco speculation characters. That being said I could see it potentially working. Yes it’s another sword character and people will whine. However maybe if they add a heavy sword character it’ll just be different enough that people won’t mind.
 
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Seeing as how Namco loves DLC themselves (Tekken 7, Soul Calibur 6, Dragon Ball FighterZ, etc). I think people are really sleeping on the fact that Namco most likely will get another fighter. Yes they didn’t get one last time, but just because they didn’t get one in Smash Wii U DLC doesn’t mean they won’t this time. We have to keep in mind how many characters Namco has, they aren’t some obscure company with no characters. Yes they aren’t Banjo hype level, however neither was Ryu from Capcom to a lot of people also.

I think a 2nd Namco rep is a pretty safe bet, I’d say 90% likely. The more pressing question is who will they choose. And yes a Tekken rep is possible, they have had time for technology to catch up. So the limitations they had then may not exist now. Also let’s not forget that Tekken characters have been in 2D games before. Heihachi was in both PlayStation All Stars and Street Fighter X Tekken.
I think it was less a question of technology and more of coming up with a way to translate Tekken's 3D limb-based gameplay into Smash. Sakurai likes to be faithful to the characters and the series' original mechanics.

But who knows? He has rejected characters before but then ended up putting them in the next Smash iteration, so... maybe he's thought of a way between Smash 4 and now?

I do think Tekken is the most likely Namco franchise to get in, if those limitations were dealt with. The question is whether it would still be Heihachi.
 

A.G.L.

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I think it was less a question of technology and more of coming up with a way to translate Tekken's 3D limb-based gameplay into Smash. Sakurai likes to be faithful to the characters and the series' original mechanics.

But who knows? He has rejected characters before but then ended up putting them in the next Smash iteration, so... maybe he's thought of a way between Smash 4 and now?

I do think Tekken is the most likely Namco franchise to get in, if those limitations were dealt with. The question is whether it would still be Heihachi.
Heihachi still played like Heihachi in both Playststion All Stars and Street Fighter X Tekken. Just like Akuma still played like Akuma in Tekken 7.

If Akuma and Geese can make the jump to 3D fighters.

Then it would make sense that Heihachi/Kazuya/Jin can make the jump to 2D fighters. Technology has changed perhaps years ago Akuma coming to Tekken seemed impossible, and yet here we are. With TekkenXStreetfighter still coming, that means even more characters will be changing.

So if Namco can figure this out for their own games, and they are helping make Smash Bros Ultimate. I’m sure if they wanted to they can help make their 3D fighters fight like 2D fighters.

As for them choosing Heihachi, due to his fate in Tekken 7. I think Namco will choose Jin or Kazuya.
 
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Louie G.

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Taking those "female fighting game character" claims with a grain of salt but I feel like that dude called Hero before DQ was on most people's radars right? Not sure how well Japan knew of Verge's leaks and such, and back in October when that tweet was posted I think a lot of us were still kinda hung up on Geno. Regardless, if this does add up to anything I'm personally betting on Morrigan. Might be a little biased just because I think Darkstalkers is cool as heck, but she is the crossover queen after all.

As for a new Namco character? I'd much rather have Prince of All Cosmos over Heihachi or Lloyd. Not sure how likely but Katamari representation would be super rad, so here's hoping. Definitely think it would bring a real interesting vibe to the table unlike any character on the roster, I can't really say the same of the aforementioned candidates.
 

KingBroly

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Taking those "female fighting game character" claims with a grain of salt but I feel like that dude called Hero before DQ was on most people's radars right? Not sure how well Japan knew of Verge's leaks and such, and back in October when that tweet was posted I think a lot of us were still kinda hung up on Geno. Regardless, if this does add up to anything I'm personally betting on Morrigan. Might be a little biased just because I think Darkstalkers is cool as heck, but she is the crossover queen after all.

As for a new Namco character? I'd much rather have Prince of All Cosmos over Heihachi or Lloyd. Not sure how likely but Katamari representation would be super rad, so here's hoping. Definitely think it would bring a real interesting vibe to the table unlike any character on the roster, I can't really say the same of the aforementioned candidates.
The twitter user also called VR for Switch. Which is pretty important to note. I still think there's misinformation out there in these leaks, so I tend to not look at them as a binary yes or no in regards to legitimacy. Like with the Gematsu leak for 3DS/Wii U; it didn't get Chrom or Chorus Kids, but it got Pac-Man, Mega Man, Little Mac AND Wii Fit Trainer a year and a half before release, and right before the initial reveal as well. So while a 'Female fighting game character' or whatever may not appear, they got the Hero and Switch VR correct.

Note: I don't know if they specifically got 'Labo VR' or not.
 
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Heihachi still played like Heihachi in both Playststion All Stars and Street Fighter X Tekken. Just like Akuma still played like Akuma in Tekken 7.

If Akuma and Geese can make the jump to 3D fighters.

Then it would make sense that Heihachi/Kazuya/Jin can make the jump to 2D fighters. Technology has changed perhaps years ago Akuma coming to Tekken seemed impossible, and yet here we are. With TekkenXStreetfighter still coming, that means even more characters will be changing.

So if Namco can figure this out for their own games, and they are helping make Smash Bros Ultimate. I’m sure if they wanted to they can help make their 3D fighters fight like 2D fighters.

As for them choosing Heihachi, due to his fate in Tekken 7. I think Namco will choose Jin or Kazuya.
Oh, no, I'm not saying he wouldn't play like Heihachi because the game is 2D or anything, I'm just kind of giving the reasoning Sakurai himself explained during Smash 4. I'm not opposed to the notion at all, this is just the explanation that was given to us.

I do think that transitioning from 2D to 3D and from 3D to 2D are two entirely different beasts, but yeah, I think the only thing in the way is if Sakurai (and Nintendo/Bandai Namco, of course) are satisfied with whatever he proposes.

Though I'm sure the man can make it work, somehow. If he managed to cram 33 years of Dragon Quest in a single character in a way that didn't feel forced or innacurate according to DQ fans, then the Tekken fans would probably be satisfied with his rendition of the characters, too.
 

N3ON

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Counter to that though, Grant Kirkhope was no longer with Rare but definitely had to sign contracts. Obviously different for composers actually working on the game. But Nintendo are mostly trying to keep a tight ship here, leaks not withstanding. The last thing they'd allow would be the creator of the character to tweet blatant hints.
Kirkhope is a freelance composer though, so he can be easily brought in. What is Carmack going to do, program the character?
 

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But I'm sure that if they come up with a Dark Souls character, they can destroy the Internet even harder.
The only "problem" would be that most of the important Dark Souls characters have a sword.
Hypothetically speaking, I don't think any of the bosses will rep Dark Souls as a fighter; they're more like the kind of rep Rathalos makes for Monster Hunter. A fighter from Dark Souls would have to be the main avatar or someone with that structure like Solaire. As far as the sword thing goes, I don't think having 1 is a problem for Dark Souls in Smash. What might be a problem for Sakurai is how to integrate the playstyle of Dark Souls into Smash that stays faithful enough to the games as a lot of its combat is rather slow and relies on stamina for attacking, dodging, and blocking.
 

Idon

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Hypothetically speaking, I don't think any of the bosses will rep Dark Souls as a fighter; they're more like the kind of rep Rathalos makes for Monster Hunter. A fighter from Dark Souls would have to be the main avatar or someone with that structure like Solaire. As far as the sword thing goes, I don't think having 1 is a problem for Dark Souls in Smash. What might be a problem for Sakurai is how to integrate the playstyle of Dark Souls into Smash that stays faithful enough to the games as a lot of its combat is rather slow and relies on stamina for attacking, dodging, and blocking.
Also if you include pyromancies and miracles, magics that don't require a staff, you could do a lot, especially considering how insane some DS3 spells get.
 

A.G.L.

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Oh, no, I'm not saying he wouldn't play like Heihachi because the game is 2D or anything, I'm just kind of giving the reasoning Sakurai himself explained during Smash 4. I'm not opposed to the notion at all, this is just the explanation that was given to us.

I do think that transitioning from 2D to 3D and from 3D to 2D are two entirely different beasts, but yeah, I think the only thing in the way is if Sakurai (and Nintendo/Bandai Namco, of course) are satisfied with whatever he proposes.

Though I'm sure the man can make it work, somehow. If he managed to cram 33 years of Dragon Quest in a single character in a way that didn't feel forced or innacurate according to DQ fans, then the Tekken fans would probably be satisfied with his rendition of the characters, too.
Ah I apologize I misunderstood you, I misread what you had written.

And you are correct in the end its up to Sakurai, Nintendo and Bandai Namco. Hopefully itll happen as I think Bandai Namco has a lot to offer.
Having Jin vs Ryu in Smash for me personally would be super hype! As would seeing Augumon(Digimon) vs Pikachu(Pokemon), or seeing the big 3 jrpgs all represented in Smash (Final Fantasy, Dragon Quest, Tales series). Or seeing Nightmare vs Link again after so many years. So while I understand a lot of people don't see that Bandai Namco will be the hype levels of Banjo or the Hero, theres definitely characters they can bring that'll still be exciting :).
 
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N3ON

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Problem is though that this feels way too open and thus actually hurts Doomguy's chances. Nintendo has been trying to keep lip on the characters what with NDAs and all. I mean the ex Namco employee who leaked that Namco was working on Ultimate had his Twitter deleted immediately.
A cryptic answer and a minor vague tease are nowhere near breaking NDA levels. Pete Hines is literally Bethesda's head PR guy, his job is to dance around information. The Smash fanbase just blows them up and analyzes them to hell and back so they seem monumental.
 
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