Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Rie Sonomura]

Meh

personally feel it’s base or bust for a new Pokémon tbh

idk why I just do

 

[osby]

Did they? I thought Sakurai had more input for the first pass?

Nope, he told the same thing about the first pass as well.

It's just a lot of people didn't believe him because of Joker, Hero, and Terry (conveniently forgetting that Sakurai is a fan of a huge amount of franchises).

 

[DarthEnderX]

I'd also like to know - and we'll likely never know this - the identity of the person within Nintendo that's choosing the characters. Is it Furukawa? Honestly it could be very informative about Nintendo's future strategy and/or business relationships.

There is no person. Just a bin. And whichever company puts the largest briefcase full of money in the bin gets to have their character added.

Considering how perfect Ultimate is, I really just want the next Smash Bros. game to be an extension of Ultimate. Just add on to what we already have rather than starting over every time.

Agreed.

Super Smash Bros. Ultimate Deluxe on the Super Switch! EVERYONE IS STILL HERE!!

Sakurai didn’t say no Echoes would be in this pass... since it’s the last one and there’s still 4 more after the 6, think those 4 missing slots will be Echoes that will be automatically bundled with their “originals”?

I think Echoes are a possibility, but it seems unlikely that 4 characters in the pass will have them. If we get some, more likely, they'll be separate(and hopefully, much cheaper), like Mii Costumes. As an Echo fighter is practically a Mii Custume for a regular character.

**** man we're already nearing 100 if we miss it by 10 then who cares

My brain goblins care!

Hm, but that makes me think, who would be a good new director for Smash Bros.? Would their choices be more fan-oriented or corporate?

Well, a new director isn't likely to have more clout than Sakurai. And since Sakurai's choices are already being dictated by corporate, seems unlikely any new director would be less so.

 

[Herocin]

"Any time someone says anything online you should take it as just their opinion"

Not even 30 minutes later:

"Those things are fully fact"

I'm freaking dead lmao

That’s funny. Probably should have expected it tbh

 

[Eldrake]

I like the list, but I don't inherently agree with this. Sakurai's made it clear that his mission is to make Ultimate as big of a crossover as possible. It's how we got characters like . We also know clearly that third party companies seem very excited to get their IPs in Smash Bros. Phil Spencer was eager to see in Smash, gave us 50 tracks, Sega and Capcom are still putting new content into Ultimate (mii costumes and spirits), they did as good as they could with and his rights--giving us four alternate costumes from different games, and having flipping Konami bring us , ,, and a Bomberman assist trophy is insane.

I wouldn't be surprised if we saw an increase in first party DLC characters, but I'm feeling optimistic over how many third parties we can get.

I have this gut feeling that Valve will be joining the roster of companies involved.

 

[Will]

"Any time someone says anything online you should take it as just their opinion"

Not even 30 minutes later:

"Those things are fully fact"

I'm freaking dead lmao

some things you just gotta let go

he will never give up any argument under the face of the sun, he will find some way to say "nuh uh"

 

[Deleted member]

I have this gut feeling that Valve will be joining the roster of companies involved.

Somehow, I can see a Team Fortress or Freeman mii costume getting in like how we got Altair. That'd still blow the roof off of people.

 

[Will]

Somehow, I can see a Team Fortress or Freeman mii costume getting in like how we got Altair. That'd still blow the roof off of people.

i guess a scout swordfighter would work

 

[Rie Sonomura]

You know

given how Nintendo went full lockdown mode in leaks lately I think December’s kill list (particularly Vergeben’s) might have had some merit to it. Particularly the last known revision that had: no Bandai Namco (but unsure on KOS-MOS oddly enough; no Tales was at least confirmed), no Falcom, no ASW (I think the Kunio Kun event may have knocked out ASW as a whole), I think they said no Capcom (we got a RE event shortly after iirc), no Blizzard Activision, no Mortal Kombat, no Valve or Doom Slayer, no Spike Chunsoft, and INITIALLY said no Spirit/AT promos but later backtracked on that specific thing when updated info came to them. So basically Spirit/ATs might still be on the table.

also the list didn’t say no Square Enix (think it said no Geno specifically tho) and I don’t even remember what Verge’s list said about Arle or Hayabusa

but what if that list was for pass 2, not 1? Just a thought

 

[Opossum]

The final forms of the starters weren’t used. Assuming that one of the three starters isn’t chosen, that’s 3 more spirits. 2 if one of the starters is chosen. Then there’s the Pokémon that got popular after the game’s release. Wooloo, Yamper, Snom, etc. and then the “Legendary” spirit could be a Gigantamax Charizard.

I see what you’re trying to get at, but from my understanding, the second Fighters Pass wasn’t originally planned? I may be mistaken. With Pokémon Sword and Shield doing so well, and having upcoming DLC, I’m just trying to say it’s possible.

But that's what I'm saying. If the scenario I said happened and the house leaders got spirited, we'd still be able to get the spirits Byleth came with, but swapping out the house leaders. And look at all the options that could've replaced them.

Hubert, Ferdinand, Linhardt, Caspar, Petra, Bernadetta, Dedue, Felix, Sylvain, Annette, Mercedes, Ashe, Lorenz, Lysithea, Marianne, Ignatz, Raphael, Leonie, Alois, Shamir, Hanneman, Manuela, Catherine, Cyril, Flayn, Jeritza, Gilbert, Yuri, Constance, Hapi, Balthus, and Three Houses!Anna.

And those are just the playable Three Houses characters who didn't get spirits. Not to mention Hilda, Dorothea, Ingrid, and Seteth wouldn't have gotten them in this hypothetical scenario either, so they'd be on the spirit table for Byleth too.

We don't know for certain if a second pass was originally planned, but it was absolutely known and finalized before the Sword and Shield spirit event released.

 

[Will]

but what if that list was for pass 2, not 1? Just a thought

who's tinfoil hat have you been wearing

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

But that's what I'm saying. If the scenario I said happened and the house leaders got spirited, we'd still be able to get the spirits Byleth came with, but swapping out the house leaders. And look at all the options that could've replaced them.

Hubert, Ferdinand, Linhardt, Caspar, Petra, Bernadetta, Dedue, Felix, Sylvain, Annette, Mercedes, Ashe, Lorenz, Lysithea, Marianne, Ignatz, Raphael, Leonie, Alois, Shamir, Hanneman, Manuela, Catherine, Cyril, Flayn, Jeritza, Gilbert, Yuri, Constance, Hapi, Balthus, and Three Houses!Anna.

And those are just the playable Three Houses characters who didn't get spirits. Not to mention Hilda, Dorothea, Ingrid, and Seteth wouldn't have gotten them in this hypothetical scenario either, so they'd be on the spirit table for Byleth too.

We don't know for certain if a second pass was originally planned, but it was absolutely known and finalized before the Sword and Shield spirit event released.

I’m confused. Are you agreeing with me or not?

 

[Eldrake]

You know

given how Nintendo went full lockdown mode in leaks lately I think December’s kill list (particularly Vergeben’s) might have had some merit to it. Particularly the last known revision that had: no Bandai Namco (but unsure on KOS-MOS oddly enough; no Tales was at least confirmed), no Falcom, no ASW (I think the Kunio Kun event may have knocked out ASW as a whole), I think they said no Capcom (we got a RE event shortly after iirc), no Blizzard Activision, no Mortal Kombat, no Valve or Doom Slayer, no Spike Chunsoft, and INITIALLY said no Spirit/AT promos but later backtracked on that specific thing when updated info came to them. So basically Spirit/ATs might still be on the table.

also the list didn’t say no Square Enix (think it said no Geno specifically tho) and I don’t even remember what Verge’s list said about Arle or Hayabusa

but what if that list was for pass 2, not 1? Just a thought

That theory makes no sense considering that Veggie specifically stated that his kill list was for Fighter Pack 5.

 

[TheCJBrine]

You know

given how Nintendo went full lockdown mode in leaks lately I think December’s kill list (particularly Vergeben’s) might have had some merit to it. Particularly the last known revision that had: no Bandai Namco (but unsure on KOS-MOS oddly enough; no Tales was at least confirmed), no Falcom, no ASW (I think the Kunio Kun event may have knocked out ASW as a whole), I think they said no Capcom (we got a RE event shortly after iirc), no Blizzard Activision, no Mortal Kombat, no Valve or Doom Slayer, no Spike Chunsoft, and INITIALLY said no Spirit/AT promos but later backtracked on that specific thing when updated info came to them. So basically Spirit/ATs might still be on the table.

also the list didn’t say no Square Enix (think it said no Geno specifically tho) and I don’t even remember what Verge’s list said about Arle or Hayabusa

but what if that list was for pass 2, not 1? Just a thought

It was for Byleth’s spot specifically, he and Sabi were hearing who weren’t gonna be FP5. They didn’t know anything about FP6 and beyond except that Hayabusa might be FP6 and that one dude who leaked him got the order wrong (whatever they said about Hayabusa was based on that dude, though, so they didn’t confirm him themselves). If it does somehow bleed into Vol. 2, though, I don’t remember Geno coming up.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Ah right I forgot

at any rate I guess we’re going in blind for this one, all for the better I guess

 

[Opossum]

I’m confused. Are you agreeing with me or not?

I think we disagree, but I could be wrong.

Basically my point is that having more options doesn't mean much when they put their most marketable faces in already, and given when the Spirit event took place, they'd have already known if they were doing a Galar character. So them making an event instead of saving it for a spirit board makes no sense to me.

 

[Gyrom8]

Gen 3 getting done dirty with the timing will always be my biggest gripe - I'm not really fussed if 8 does or doesn't get anything other than spirits at this stage, though a mii costume with a remix would be a little somthing

 

[TheCJBrine]

PushDustIn translated a bit more from Sakurai’s column:
https://twitter.com/pushdustin/status/1230133965769437184?s=21

 

[nessdeltarune00]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

 

[TheCJBrine]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

I’m guessing they definitely weren’t planned until last year.

 

[Deleted member]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

"Ultimate could have ended after I got done with Byleth, but I decided to give you all more fighters to let Ultimate last longer. I hope the fans can appreciate that."

 

[Eldrake]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

Maybe the Fighter's Pass has a bigger budget and they're able to devote extra development time on the characters?

 

[Cosmic77]

This thread is gonna argue about SwSh Spirits until December 2021, isn't it?

Maybe we're getting a Pokemon, maybe not. Honestly, it just depends on how big the gap is between passes and when they started work on the Spirit event. Then you also have to consider when the character would be released, because there's a huge difference between being F6 and F11. If there was ever a game they'd be willing to make multiple Spirits for, it would probably be for something really big like Pokemon.

Either way, if you're adamant that it's not happening, at least humor the idea that it can. We retread over the same points every time, and most of them involve "doesn't make sense to create a Spirit Board" and "past precedents suggest".

 

[osby]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

Basically, it's a reminder to not take things for granted. Ultimate could've ended with the base game or first pass and it would've been enough. But Sakurai's doing his damnest to give us additional content and make more fans happy.

I think a lot of people forgetting just how big Ultimate is when making "that's it?" comments.

 

[Gyrom8]

What does everyone here think Sakurai meant by the characters being “really extra”?

That this is really, really it. I don't see any bonus characters happening or Nintendo strong-arming Sakurai into doing a third pass (which if it did happen, you'd get people saying 'what about a fourth?' etc etc). If we did get a bonus extra character, then they're not some freebie like Plant (who, judging by the evidence, was probably meant to be base game), but our 11th, and final, character in the pass.

 

[Deleted member]

I think a lot of people forgetting just how big Ultimate is when making "that's it?" comments.

that's it? no larryboy? trash ****in game man, nothing to it but fire emblem and mario

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

I think we disagree, but I could be wrong.

Basically my point is that having more options doesn't mean much when they put their most marketable faces in already, and given when the Spirit event took place, they'd have already known if they were doing a Galar character. So them making an event instead of saving it for a spirit board makes no sense to me.

Oh okay. We are disagreeing. I don’t think comparing a hypothetical scenario to two events that happened. Yes, the Three Houses event came with Byleth, and the Sword & Shield event came to celebrate the game’s release. Pokémon aren’t the same as fleshed out characters.

Had there been an event where Edelgard, Dimtri, Claude, Rhea, and Sothis had been in a Spirit Event to celebrate it would have been a different scenario had Byleth been left out because they are the player/main character, and yes it wouldn’t have boded well for Byleth.

Pokémon are Pokémon. The main character in Pokémon is your trainer. Yes, your Pokémon are the supporting cast, and the main appeal of Pokémon is the Pokémon themselves. I feel like I’m not explaining this well.

There’s a difference between the main supporting cast of a story driven game becoming spirits, and Pokémon Sword and Shield only using the starters first forms, one of your rivals signatures, the regional bird, and the box legendaries forms, and that’s it.
Where you are saying had they known a Galar Pokémon was coming, why would they have an event in the first place, I’m saying they didn’t really do a blowout of spirits, and could potentially use Pokémon that gained popularity after release and held back. Like the starter final forms, wooloo, yamper, and Gigantamax Pokemon.

It could happen, but it could also not happen, like you’re saying.

 

[Nemuresu]

I'm so not surprised about the possibility of this being the last batch of DLC. After all, if they can't get five characters to come out in a year anymore, then the team may not be in conditions to keep making more in a decent schedule by the time they're done.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

BotW2 gets tricky, though, as it's hard to imagine who they'd pick unless Sakurai goes back on his "BotW Zelda is a scholar" take.

Unless we get time travel shenanigans and a Young Impa again.

https://www.reddit.com/r/zelda/comments/czbyyx

 

[Lamperouge]

Meh

personally feel it’s base or bust for a new Pokémon tbh

idk why I just do

I feel that way for most, if not all Nintendo franchises that aren't Fire Emblem.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Maybe the Fighter's Pass has a bigger budget and they're able to devote extra development time on the characters?

I doubt it, the fact it's taking more time tells me they've got less staff available to work on the game, meaning less budget for salaries

 

[Deleted member]

Unless we get time travel shenanigans and a Young Impa again.

https://www.reddit.com/r/zelda/comments/czbyyx

I think Ganondorf could be a possibility for BOTW 2 if they decided to make a younger-alive version of him. Or he could be this super creepy undead corpse that fights with black magic, which has a lot of possibilities.

 

[SuperSmashStephen]

Unless we get time travel shenanigans and a Young Impa again.

https://www.reddit.com/r/zelda/comments/czbyyx

Not going to lie, I’d love this.

 

[GillyGrime]

Inspired by the recent Sakurai column, here are my predictions:

- Crash Bandicoot (Been calling this for ages)

- Phoenix Wright (Same with this character, could be Dante but I can imagine Nintendo choosing Phoenix)

- Lloyd Irving (Namco getting more than one character seems likely, Lloyd has been popular since Brawl and is popular in Japan)

- Paper Mario (Nintendo shill pick, wanted to predict something other than generic Gen 8 Pokemon. Lines up with rumours of new Paper Mario game)

- Rayman (The Ubisoft costumes coming and going without a Rayman costume is a huge sign to me, combined with Rayman only having 1 spirit despite the Globox and Barbra trophies from Smash 4)

- Master Chief (Assuming this is the last Smash character for Ultimate, I think they will use their Microsoft connections to break the internet)


I also predict that Geno will return as an upgraded costume (like Sans/Cuphead) with Beware of the Forest Mushrooms. Shantae and Doomguy will also get costumes. Yooka Laylee will get a spirit event only.

Thoughts?

 

[osby]

Inspired by the recent Sakurai column, here are my predictions:

- Crash Bandicoot (Been calling this for ages)

- Phoenix Wright (Same with this character, could be Dante but I can imagine Nintendo choosing Phoenix)

- Lloyd Irving (Namco getting more than one character seems likely, Lloyd has been popular since Brawl and is popular in Japan)

- Paper Mario (Nintendo shill pick, wanted to predict something other than generic Gen 8 Pokemon. Lines up with rumours of new Paper Mario game)

- Rayman (The Ubisoft costumes coming and going without a Rayman costume is a huge sign to me, combined with Rayman only having 1 spirit despite the Globox and Barbra trophies from Smash 4)

- Master Chief (Assuming this is the last Smash character for Ultimate, I think they will use their Microsoft connections to break the internet)


I also predict that Geno will return as an upgraded costume (like Sans/Cuphead) with Beware of the Forest Mushrooms. Shantae and Doomguy will also get costumes. Yooka Laylee will get a spirit event only.

Thoughts?

I don't think we'll get five third parties people talk the most about. I'm 90% sure Nintendo will add three or four relatively nicher characters and Sakurai will be like:

 

[Gyrom8]

Inspired by the recent Sakurai column, here are my predictions:

- Crash Bandicoot (Been calling this for ages)

- Phoenix Wright (Same with this character, could be Dante but I can imagine Nintendo choosing Phoenix)

- Lloyd Irving (Namco getting more than one character seems likely, Lloyd has been popular since Brawl and is popular in Japan)

- Paper Mario (Nintendo shill pick, wanted to predict something other than generic Gen 8 Pokemon. Lines up with rumours of new Paper Mario game)

- Rayman (The Ubisoft costumes coming and going without a Rayman costume is a huge sign to me, combined with Rayman only having 1 spirit despite the Globox and Barbra trophies from Smash 4)

- Master Chief (Assuming this is the last Smash character for Ultimate, I think they will use their Microsoft connections to break the internet)


I also predict that Geno will return as an upgraded costume (like Sans/Cuphead) with Beware of the Forest Mushrooms. Shantae and Doomguy will also get costumes. Yooka Laylee will get a spirit event only.

Thoughts?

I mean if Paper Mario and Rayman got in that'd be hunky dory as they're my second and third most wanted characters respectively

Rayman unfortunately has a lack of presence in Japan and Paper Mario ... hmm, well there's content already in the game but I'm feeling a bit more hopeful about his odds if these rumours actually amount to something as I always thought the main thing against him was the position of his series over the last few years

I have no nostalgic connection to Master Chief (and believe they'd probably stick him earlier in the pass to drive sales), but I can't deny he'd blow the roof off and really be the 'yeah, we can't really beat this can we' pick

 

[pinshadow]

Inspired by the recent Sakurai column, here are my predictions:

- Crash Bandicoot (Been calling this for ages)

- Phoenix Wright (Same with this character, could be Dante but I can imagine Nintendo choosing Phoenix)

- Lloyd Irving (Namco getting more than one character seems likely, Lloyd has been popular since Brawl and is popular in Japan)

- Paper Mario (Nintendo shill pick, wanted to predict something other than generic Gen 8 Pokemon. Lines up with rumours of new Paper Mario game)

- Rayman (The Ubisoft costumes coming and going without a Rayman costume is a huge sign to me, combined with Rayman only having 1 spirit despite the Globox and Barbra trophies from Smash 4)

- Master Chief (Assuming this is the last Smash character for Ultimate, I think they will use their Microsoft connections to break the internet)


I also predict that Geno will return as an upgraded costume (like Sans/Cuphead) with Beware of the Forest Mushrooms. Shantae and Doomguy will also get costumes. Yooka Laylee will get a spirit event only.

Thoughts?

How would they even make a Rayman Mii Costume though? If anything I think the Ubisoft costumes coming in a random pack and not with a Ubisoft character is like the opposite of a huge sign, it feels like a death sentence.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I don't think we'll get five third parties people talk the most about. I'm 90% sure Nintendo will add three or four relatively nicher characters and Sakurai will be like:

View attachment 263081

Sakurai gonna grab 5 niche third party characters to teach us about about Dragon Install to Bodied, the Mirror's Edge exploit for speedrunning, giving sex ed for the Saber presentation, etc

 

[GillyGrime]

How would they even make a Rayman Mii Costume though? If anything I think the Ubisoft costumes coming in a random pack and not with a Ubisoft character is like the opposite of a huge sign, it feels like a death sentence.

Aside from having a "Rayman hat" I don't see why they couldn't just have the costume lack arms/legs providing the proportions of the costume were the same as a Mii Fighter. Seeing as it's purely cosmetic.

Also Rayman could easily come with a Globox brawler, or a Barbra Sword fighter. The Teensies as well off the top of my head. It's far from a death sentence imo

Edit: this theoretical Rayman costume would be a Brawler incase that needed clarifying

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I have a really bizarre feeling that since Sakurai said these were “extra” characters, it’ll mostly be characters that aren’t particularly highly requested, and most likely more first than third parties too