Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[jamesster445]

Probability of overwatch in dlc? Last year some things people had against it were the lack of nintendo connection and overwatch being a single game as opposed to being a series. Overwatch was said to be petering off as well.

Now Overwatch is on switch as well as overwatch 2 confirmed for switch.
I wasnt around for fighter pass character 5 discussion so i was wondering what people thought about it.
I think It seems like it could be a likely nintendo pick given that you could promote the current game recently ported, and the new game up and coming.

Nintendo NY planned a launch event for Overwatch on Switch but they cancelled because of Hong Kong. It is popular in Japan though, which is something most FPSes can't say.

 

[slrigeigdew]

meanwhile if they went for most of the top first party picks like say say Dixie, Waluigi, or BWD, they really wouldn't be adding much to the crossover, assuming the content they'd come with is already present in the game in the first place

idk, maybe it's just me

Can you elaborate on this please? Piranha plant is the only 1st party character that didn't offer anything besides the character and that's because it wasn't part of the fighter's pass. Everything that came with Byleth was brand new and wasn't already in the game.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Ok, Not sure if this was done recently but.. Villain Pass. No rules. No items. Newcomer / DLC Speculation Discussion thread, hazards off. GO.


1) Zoda (StarTropics)
2) Medusa (Kid Icarus)
3) King Hippo (Punch Out!)
4) Metal Sonic (Sonic the Hedgehog)
5) Bass (Megaman)
6) Nightmare (Soul Calibur)

1. Skull Kid
2. Goenitz/Goeniko (King of Fighters/SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos)
3. Hornet (Hollow Knight)
4. Takenaka Hanbei (Sengoku Basara)
5. Sturm or
   Spoiler

   Clone Andy
   (Advance Wars)
6. Mage Ganondorf

 

[TheCJBrine]

don't get me wrong, I'd love me characters like bwd, but I feel like third parties would offer a whole lot more in terms of hype

for one, there's the new worlds aspect, which makes Smash as a crossover feel that much more grandiose.

When a third party character is added, you're almost always guaranteed new content, especially assuming, with the exception of echoes, Smash seems very keen on keeping 3rd parties a one per franchise thing

meanwhile if they went for most of the top first party picks like say say Dixie, Waluigi, or BWD, they really wouldn't be adding much to the crossover, assuming the content they'd come with is already present in the game in the first place

idk, maybe it's just me

I think Bandana Dee could definitely bring new content, considering the small amount of modern Kirby stuff.

 

[Kokiden]

When a third party character is added, you're almost always guaranteed new content, especially assuming, with the exception of echoes, Smash seems very keen on keeping 3rd parties a one per franchise thing

meanwhile if they went for most of the top first party picks like say say Dixie, Waluigi, or BWD, they really wouldn't be adding much to the crossover, assuming the content they'd come with is already present in the game in the first place

idk, maybe it's just me

It's not just you. I echo the same sentiments.

At this point, I'd rather new series and characters over franchises already present in the game.

Never understood the appeal of having Dixie or BWD in Smash. I don't think they'd be too far off from Diddy or Kirby gameplay wise, not to mention they just don't look appealing at all.

If I'm going to be paying for DLC, I'd want something new and substantial, not more of the same.

 

[Guynamednelson]

All the third party hypers say is "50 tracks, 20 cameos, expand the crossover"

I just wanted to BAHN KNUCKLE Mario for God's sake!

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Dixie?...again, 4th in line.

Sakurai was actually planning on adding Dixie since Brawl so she was actually 3rd in line for a while. You say "4th in line" as if she's drastically less important than the other 3 DK characters, and yet, she's made more appearances than Rool in recent years. She even got a trophy over Diddy in Melee and she's the ONLY character from Brawl's Forbidden Seven that Sakurai openly admitted to cutting. Not to mention Tropical Freeze is still being sold on the Switch for full price.

And now that Rool and Banjo are in, her absence is even more baffling and strange. She should be in because there is a big gaping hole in the Rare roster and its ugly and needs to be filled.

But there’s not much reason to add her now.

What exactly does this mean? What specific "reason" was there to add any of the other characters?

I think Bandana Dee could definitely bring new content, considering the small amount of modern Kirby stuff.

Same goes for Dixie, since there's an absolute dearth of DKC3 and Tropical Freeze content, as well as Elma, with the lack of Xenoblade Chronicles X music.

Never understood the appeal of having Dixie or BWD in Smash. I don't think they'd be too far off from Diddy or Kirby gameplay wise, not to mention they just don't look appealing at all.

Clearly you don't know much about either of these characters if you'd think they would play like Diddy or Kirby.

And that part about them not looking appealing is just flat out hurtful (and wrong).

 

[MooMew64]

I really am an island when it comes to wanting first parties, lol.

 

[Idon]

I really am an island when it comes to wanting first parties, lol.

More like Australia, really.

 

[osby]

I don't think arguing about who can bring new content is kinda pointless because well, who can't? Aside from games like Wii Fit or Duck Hunt, every franchise has enough material for at least one fighter pack.

But all DLC newcomers bar Piranha Plant were new characters from games brand new to Smash. Like, I'd love Dixie Kong in Smash but it's kinda obvious that just more Tropical Freeze content isn't going to cut it.

 

[MooMew64]

More like Australia, really.

This thread loves putting down the first party picks, I feel a bit like the odd one out sometimes.

Not that that's a problem. Different people like different things: I don't expect many here would be like me and happily trade every 3rd party DLC character for Octolings.

 

[Jomosensual]

I really am an island when it comes to wanting first parties, lol.

There's a lot of first parties I want. Im more into new series getting in right now(and Cranky Kong, who is the best Kong, but that's a topic for later)

 

[Dinoman96]

Here's my thing: It's not that I don't want characters like Dixie Kong, Rex, Spring Man, Isaac, etc in the game.

It's just that I know for a fact that Nintendo wouldn't add them, at least for DLC.

If we get any more first party characters, it's going to be new characters from the popular long running and established IPs like Fire Emblem and Pokemon that have games being ****ted out every five seconds. We've gone through two different Smash DLC cycles, and our only first party DLC newcomers (outside of PP who is a different can of worms altogether) have been two new Fire Emblem protagonists.

So yes, that's why I shift towards third parties these days. Because I know any of the first party characters I'd like to see have no shot at DLC and the only ones that do are just more promotional FE/Pokemon reps.

 

[GothicSlenderman]

Since the topic of Third Parties in Smash was brought up I might as well bring up something I've been thinking about lately. Smash has been adding a ton of third party content and to be honest minus the occasional speculation of a Pokemon S&S rep, Waluigi memes and those who desire characters like Dixie Kong and Bandana Dee. I've noticed there is a lot less interest in first party content in the Smash community. It almost feels like if Smash didn't add all of these 3rd party guests or essentially evolve into a gaming allstars title rather than just a Nintendo allstars that a lot of people probably would've lost interest in Smash by now.

Does that sound fair to say? I'll be honest, I've been craving new platform fighters as I've been getting bored of Nintendo hogging the thrown for so long and, I won't lie, the only reason I'm still interested is because of the third party content and to complete the roster.

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Can you elaborate on this please? Piranha plant is the only 1st party character that didn't offer anything besides the character and that's because it wasn't part of the fighter's pass. Everything that came with Byleth was brand new and wasn't already in the game.

It's why i said "most of"

Byleth was from a brand spanking new release that had yet to get content added to Smash at that point. It still counts as a new world. And despite being a mega fan of their inclusion as a character (I'm talking someone who was in my top 5 most wanteds and has a good chance of being my new main ), I'd personally say the additional content Byleth comes with doesn't quite have the same oomph as say Joker, Terry, or Banjo's assuming it's still just FE at the end of the day.

there's only so many more Nintendo choices that bring brand new stuff at this point. the only one I can think of at the top of my head is Ring Fit Adventurer, and maybe a new upcoming 2020-2021 release that we still know little to nothing about at this point, but that's pretty much it

just about every other Nintendo thing substantial enough is already represented as is.

Like let's say if Waluigi got in, what would he be adding to the crossover that isn't already there?

I'm not saying first parties wouldn't be hype at all (especially assuming one of my absolute most wanteds is a first party), I'm just saying third parties would bring a lot more to the table in terms of size and scope

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Sakurai was actually planning on adding Dixie since Brawl so she was actually 3rd in line for a while. You say "4th in line" as if she's drastically less important than the other 3 DK characters, and yet, she's made more appearances than Rool in recent years. She even got a trophy over Diddy in Melee and she's the ONLY character from Brawl's Forbidden Seven that Sakurai openly admitted to cutting. Not to mention Tropical Freeze is still being sold on the Switch for full price.

And now that Rool and Banjo are in, her absence is even more baffling and strange. She needs to be in because there is a big gaping hole in the Rare roster and its ugly and needs to be filled.


What exactly does this mean? What specific "reason" was there to add any of the other characters?



Same goes for Dixie, since there's an absolute dearth of DKC3 and Tropical Freeze content, as well as Elma, with the lack of Xenoblade Chronicles X music.

Clearly you don't know much about either of these characters if you'd think they would play like Diddy or Kirby.

And that part about them not looking appealing is just flat out hurtful (and wrong).

Nobody “needs” to be in Smash.

Dixie has no upcoming release to coincide with. She isn’t from a recent release, which is what any first party newcomer DLC has been paired with.

Is she a notable Nintendo character that isn’t playable? That I can agree with. Is she going to get added because of it? I personally don’t believe so.

If she were that high up on Nintendo/Sakurai’s list, my bet is she would be in already. She may have been planned, but she isn’t currently in.

With Bandanna Waddle Dee, having played the games he is in, I’m not sold on him. Yes, he uses a spear. But how does the spear function to make him interesting? How does he as a character convince the broader audience to purchase him and play Smash when he costs $6? I’m not convinced of that personally. This is, again, somebody who has played the game.

I’m also looking for new series and characters to get in at this point anyway. I’d much rather prefer music, a stage, and character from a series not yet in Smash than a new character, stage, and music from a series that has a plethora of content already.

 

[Invisible Shiny Bulbasaur]

I would be absolutely thrilled if one of the challenger packs was inspired by Tropical Freeze. That game has one of my favorite soundtracks of all time, and I'd love to have a Donkey Kong Country stage that isn't jungle themed.
I don't think it'll happen, and I am more than content with K. Rool and all the DKC content he brought with him, but I would be over the moon to see Dixie or Cranky in the fighters pass. Honestly, I would be more hyped for them than I would be for any character not already in the game.
That said, I know I'm not exactly in the majority on that one.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Since the topic of Third Parties in Smash was brought up I might as well bring up something I've been thinking about lately. Smash has been adding a ton of third party content and to be honest minus the occasional speculation of a Pokemon S&S rep, Waluigi memes and those who desire characters like Dixie Kong and Bandana Dee. I've noticed there is a lot less interest in first party content in the Smash community. It almost feels like if Smash didn't add all of these 3rd party guests or essentially evolve into a gaming allstars title rather than just a Nintendo allstars that a lot of people probably would've lost interest in Smash by now.

Does that sound fair to say? I'll be honest, I've been craving new platform fighters as I've been getting bored of Nintendo hogging the thrown for so long and, I won't lie, the only reason I'm still interested is because of the third party content and to complete the roster.

There's plenty of people that wanted first parties before the game came out. It wasn't until Joker and "Characters you won't expect in Smash" that people really began ****ting on first parties.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

She isn’t from a recent release, which is what any first party newcomer DLC has been paired with.

Piranha Plant.

 

[MooMew64]

TBH this whole debate is pointless and will do nothing but frustrate both sides who are trying to tell the other their side is "better".

People get hyped for different things. No one here is gonna change their mind on what they want. For me personally, I could care less about the cross over, I want to have fun playing as my favorite characters. I could care less if they bring something new to the table: I want to play as Waluigi, so heck yeah I'd pay $6 for him.

That's just me, though.

 

[Dinoman96]

Piranha Plant.

PP is, like what I said, a very very different case from the rest of the DLC.

It was clearly something that was meant to be in the base roster but couldn't make it due to time. That's why, unlike the other DLC reps, it actually has a Palutena's Guidance.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

Dixie and Dee watching everyone in the thread collectively taking shots at them and calling them boring characters that would bring “nothing” to Smash.

 

[Kokiden]

She needs to be in because there is a big gaping hole in the Rare roster and its ugly and needs to be filled.

Clearly you don't know much about either of these characters if you'd think they would play like Diddy or Kirby.

And that part about them not looking appealing is just flat out hurtful (and wrong).

There's a big gaping hole in the roster in the form of franchises that have NOT made it into the game yet.

You're more than welcome to disagree with me on this. You are entitled to your opinion, as I am mine, so I'm not sure why this is "hurtful."

We're discussing video game characters, not making snide personal shots at one another.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Honestly, between all the different kinds of characters we could get for Fighters Pass 2, I think the most ideal would be a mix...

• Two or three characters that would introduce something completely new to Smash and really make some hype-filled waves with their inclusion (2B, Dante, Phoenix Wright, Heihachi, Professor Layton, Doom Slayer, Master Chief, etc.)
• Two or three characters that technically wouldn't bring anything "new", but are still heavily requested by fans and would be worth including because just having them playable at all would be enough at this point (Dixie Kong, Waluigi, Bandana Waddle Dee, Geno, Isaac, Lloyd, Skull Kid, etc.)
• One "surprise" character that no one saw coming, either because they're not as comparatively popular as other characters, or people just don't think they have a chance (Sol Badguy, Ratchet & Clank, Excitebiker, etc.)

There's absolutely no reason to exclude one or two of these types of characters in favor of the other.

Like let's say if Waluigi got in, what would he be adding to the crossover that isn't already there?

I've already addressed this argument once before, and to sum up my stance: DLC characters don't have to bring in a lot of content. Not every character has to bring in 50 music tracks like Terry did, and in the case of Waluigi specifically, the Mario series is big enough that it wouldn't be difficult to include enough new content for a Spirit Board and music.

 

[perfectchaos83]

PP is, like what I said, a very very different case from the rest of the DLC.

It was clearly something that was meant to be in the base roster but couldn't make it due to time. That's why, unlike the other DLC reps, it actually has a Palutena's Guidance.

While PP was a different matter, I'm all open to the idea of stand alone character DLC for characters like Ashley and Waluigi. It really shouldn't have to be one extreme or the other.

 

[Mushroomguy12]

There's a big gaping hole in the roster in the form of franchises that have NOT made it into the game yet.

You're more than welcome to disagree with me on this. You are entitled to your opinion, as I am mine, so I'm not sure why this is "hurtful."

We're discussing video game characters, not making snide personal shots at one another.

I'm fine with disagreements, but saying that those two characters would have little to no gameplay differences from Diddy and Kirby is plainly ignorant.

 

[MooMew64]

Remember when people politely shared with each other what characters they wanted and didn't bicker about how their way was better?

Yeah, me neither.

 

[shinhed-echi]

Here's my thing: It's not that I don't want characters like Dixie Kong, Rex, Spring Man, Isaac, etc in the game.

It's just that I know for a fact that Nintendo wouldn't add them, at least for DLC.

If we get any more first party characters, it's going to be new characters from the popular long running and established IPs like Fire Emblem and Pokemon that have games being ****ted out every five seconds. We've gone through two different Smash DLC cycles, and our only first party DLC newcomers (outside of PP who is a different can of worms altogether) have been two new Fire Emblem protagonists.

So yes, that's why I shift towards third parties these days. Because I know any of the first party characters I'd like to see have no shot at DLC and the only ones that do are just more promotional FE/Pokemon reps.

*Applause*

This is exactly how I feel.
This is why I loved the idea of the 3rd party pass.
And that’s why the 5th character trailer for FP1 was the absolute worst for me. It was the very thing I was expecting to be avoided by having an all 3rd party pass. The bad taste in my mouth... it still won’t go away.

 

[GothicSlenderman]

There's plenty of people that wanted first parties before the game came out. It wasn't until Joker and "Characters you won't expect in Smash" that people really began ****ting on first parties.

That's really note worthy. It's true, I think the fighters pass and the info we were given about it at the game awards in 2018 really elevated people's expectations. I would even say they sky rocketed after Banjo, Terry and the announcement of additional DLC. Since they opened so many doors for someone's favorite character it make it in. I even see people speculating for Sony to make an appearance in Smash these days with people speculating characters like Kratos.

 

[Garteam]

Honestly, I could see why Disney would be hesitant to let Sora into Smash.

From a brand perspective, joining Smash is a lot more risky than you might think. You're essentially signing up your character for a game where they shoot at, slice up, and use a hammer to beat a plethora of other characters for sport. Obviously, it's done in a relatively slapstick way, but that could still be a step in a slightly more edgy direction for many of these characters' brands. Likewise, you also have to accept that your character is appearing alongside any characters in the game or any characters that will be added through DLC in the future. It's not enough to be cool with your character sharing a product with brands like Metal Gear, Persona, and Bayonetta, you have to be cool with the possibility that series like Resident Evil and Doom could be alongside your character next.

Contrast this with Disney, a company that has made excessive brand control a major pillar of their business strategy. If Disney licenses their characters, they want to be as hands on as possible to ensure you're using their characters in a way that's consistent with a very particular image. Step outside their set lines? Congrats! You've just earned your product a spot in the "Forget this ever happened" corner of the Disney vault.

Despite Kingdom Hearts being aimed at an older audience, we've seen Disney apply this approach for this brand as well. And, I mean, why wouldn't they? Not only has this approach worked in the past, but Kingdom Hearts is also connected to numerous other products Disney places a lot of value in (Mickey Mouse, their animated library, Pixar's catalog), so controversy involving Kingdom Hearts could ripple out and effect some of the big money makers. So, when its framed like this, why would you take that risk? Pleasing a handful of fans and getting some free publicity and royalties really isn't worth putting someone else in the driver's seat when you've got a very specific destination in mind.

That being said, I do feel sorry for Sora's fans. It always sucks to take a big blow to your chances, no matter who the character is. I have no real connection to the character myself, but I do have an old friend who absolutely loves the series, so I would've been interested in seeing Sora for her sake.

On a side note, it's almost a miracle that the Pokemon Company is still onboard with Smash, considering how protective they are of their brand. It wouldn't surprise me if they wanted off Mr. Sakurai's Wild Ride in the past, only to get rangled back in.

 

[Kokiden]

I'm fine with disagreements, but saying that those two characters would have little to no gameplay differences from Diddy and Kirby is plainly ignorant.

Probably. I won't say I'm an expert on those 2, but fact remains that I find them highly unappealing for Smash.

Remember when people politely shared with each other what characters they wanted and didn't bicker about how their way was better?

Yeah, me neither.

All I'm seeing are people disagreeing about what characters they think would be good in Smash or not, and why.

You're mistaking personal preference and opinions for outright stating something is "better."

No one is saying someone is wrong for thinking a certain way, or if a contrasting opinion is inferior.

Keeping discussions pertaining only to characters, and people not taking personal potshots at one another, is being civil and polite already.

Disagreements =/= impolite.

 

[GoodGrief741]

"Ugh, like, I don't hate first parties, but what would they even bring beyond a new character to this fighting game?"

Y'all celebrated base game Ultimate despite the fact that we only got 4 new stages and 2 new franchises, but now every character has to bring a stage, and not just a stage, but a stage that couldn't have been in Smash before. Otherwise it's not "fresh".

Y'all spoiled as ****, can't wait for Smash 6 when everyone's celebrating whatever did happen. At the end of the day everyone pretends to be an armchair dev but then they'll praise whatever Sakurai does anyway.

Evidence points to Terry getting handpicked by Sakurai because he's a fan of Fatal Fury.

Sakurai recently reiterated Nintendo picked the characters.

But isn't it nice when unexpected and even forgotten characters make it into Smash?

According to this thread, only if they're third party.

Never understood the appeal of having Dixie or BWD in Smash. I don't think they'd be too far off from Diddy or Kirby gameplay wise, not to mention they just don't look appealing at all.

Wow, that's so uninformed. I'm actually surprised, a Smash fan that hasn't touched a DKC game or a modern Kirby game.

 

[Lamperouge]

First party or third party, I just want characters that are appealing to me and are fun to play.

 

[Kokiden]

"Wow, that's so uninformed. I'm actually surprised, a Smash fan that hasn't touched a DKC game or a modern Kirby game.

Already said I'm not an expert on those characters. I've played DK games in the past, but they never really stood out to me all that much.

Not everyone plays a wide variety of games. I play less games, but sink more time into the ones that I do.

Is this a gatekeeping thing, where someone who plays Smash ALSO has to play every franchise represented in the game to have an opinion on what they want, or don't want?

My disagreement on the matter is in terms of visual appeal. Like I've said multiple times, they don't LOOK like the type of characters that I'd want to play in smash, therefore I'd be apprehensive about paying for them.

I'm not sure why people are so offended about some just not liking their most wanted. No character is going to appeal to everyone.

From some of the comments on here, it sounds like I burnt a flag with their desired characters logo on it or something, or I'm going around swearing and attacking those that prefer first parties. Y'all need to chill. Seriously lol.

I'm not knocking you for your preference, so how about showing others the same courtesy?

 

[krokotopia101]

Am...I the only still holding on hope for Adeleine & Ribbon? Truth be told, I kinda prefer them over Waddle Dee.

 

[ZelDan]

As someone who is a huge fan of Kirby and think his modern games are great (Well, not so much Star Allies, that game is just kinda okay in my eyes), I'm largely indifferent to BWD.

Dixie not being in is still lame as **** though.

 

[DevaAshera]

As someone who is a huge fan of Kirby and think his modern games are great (Well, not so much Star Allies, that game is just kinda okay in my eyes), I'm largely indifferent to BWD.

Dixie not being in is still lame as **** though.

I agree on both counts entirely.
I love Waddle Dees, they're my second fav in Kirby behind Adeleine, but I'm indifferent to him in Smash.
I also think Dixie should have been in..but I also don't think she's a big enough draw for DLC.

 

[Goombaic]

Am...I the only still holding on hope for Adeleine & Ribbon? Truth be told, I kinda prefer them over Waddle Dee.

I'd say Adeline is a dark horse first party pick, the major problem for her being that most first party picks are dark horses to begin with. Seeing as Crystal Shards content is scarce and Adeline herself isn't even a spirit, I'd rate her chances above a lot of many other first party characters, but still very unlikely.

 

[slrigeigdew]

It's why i said "most of"
I'd personally say the additional content Byleth comes with doesn't quite have the same oomph as say Joker, Terry, or Banjo's assuming it's still just FE at the end of the day.

I love how you completely glossed over Hero lol. (But I get it, Square characters tend to get the short end of stick when it comes to DLC) I agree with most of what of you said but there's still plenty of content 1st parties can bring in terms of stages and music (I'll give you spirits tho)

Am...I the only still holding on hope for Adeleine & Ribbon? Truth be told, I kinda prefer them over Waddle Dee.

Us Adeleine supporters are a rare breed, my friend. I'm just worried that the meme of Sakurai hating Kirby games he didn't make isn't just a meme.

 

[blackghost]

I'm keeping it simple by saying that a more iconic character would usually generate more hype than one that's less iconic. It's subjective, but if you were to reveal Terry, Waluigi, Dixie, and BWD back to back, I don't think Terry would be the one a majority of the world would be jumping up and down for. I also think Waluigi could give Joker a run for his money in terms of worldwide buzz. Whatever disinterest Japan had for him would likely be made up by NA and EU's reaction.

people continue to vastly overestimate these secondary (or tertiary ) Nintendo characters. I still cant tell if waluigi actually has supporters outsideof this echo chamber or just memes. No i don't believe that the same level excitement from non-nintendo centric videogame fandom is going to like waluigi or dixie kong as they would/did like joker or other third party beloved characters.
I watch videogame streamers and thier biggest reactions this season were terry and joker. by far.