Official Newcomer/DLC Speculation Discussion

[Garteam]

I have a hunch that Heihachi is our next Fighting Game rep. The fact his costume is missing is a little too suspious, especially when its return seemed like an obvious addition for Terry's pack. We also know for a fact that Sakurai has some interest in the character, given how he was considered for Smash 2014. Plus, adding a character from a 3D fighting game would be an easy way to differentiate the next fighting game rep from the Shotos and Terry.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Reminder to everybody that Edgeworth never actually said this line (although it would certainly fit within AA's writing style)

Edgeworth does however mentions Midiclorians, so there's a thing.

Wait what

I don’t remember him mentioning that

 

[Icewolff92]

Can someone tell me what Papa just did because I refuse to click on the video

 

[Nemuresu]

Let's just put the Heihachi situation on this context:
1.- The outfit was absent from a fighting games-themed batch, which included the Akira and Jacky costumes. Unlike what happened with Hero's costume batch, this one is a real big missed opportunity.
2.- Namco showed they can just recycle Unsho Ishizuka's voice clips, and for the matter being, he's already in Smash as Incineroar's JP voice.
3.- If the Pac-Man taunt was really a deconfirmation, why ignore the costume then? If Heihachi was really not in the plans, then there shouldn't have been any reasons to ignore it.
4.- If the reason was that the looks weren't accurate to the character's recent appearance, how complicated could it be to make the hair shorter and change the gi?
There's really two ways for this topic to be resolved, and I lean more towards the one where he's actually gonna be playable.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Call Papagenos a clown if you want... at least he's not as annoying as some other clowns I know...

If Phoenix Wright gets in, I hope this guy gets a spirit battle, so I can take my petty revenge on him for being the worst. Ace Attorney witness. Ever.

 

[Garteam]

Wait what

I don’t remember him mentioning that

Edgeworth posts on r/prequelmemes confirmed.

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

I have a hunch that Heihachi is our next Fighting Game rep. The fact his costume is missing is a little too suspious, especially when its return seemed like an obvious addition for Terry's pack. We also know for a fact that Sakurai has some interest in the character, given how he was considered for Smash 2014. Plus, adding a character from a 3D fighting game would be an easy way to differentiate the next fighting game rep from the Shotos and Terry.

The fact that we already have three traditional fighting game reps makes me doubt that, personally. He was also specifically added to Pac-Man's Namco Roulette taunt in Ultimate, which feels to me like Sakurai is saying, "This is our Tekken representation."

Also, Heihachi is not a Fire Emblem character, so that alone knocks him down a couple hundred pegs. Always have to keep that in mind.

Can someone tell me what Papa just did because I refuse to click on the video

I literally just did, unless you blocked me for some stupid reason.

 

[StarBot]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLmyopN8Cjc

Apparently papagenos video on byleth was faked. He wanted to see how many people he could fool I guess.

I don't really get where he's coming from with this though. The video was pretty ill-advised if you ask me. I mean, yeah he successfully pranked us, but it also lowered his reputation in the community since a lot of people thought it was real for quite a bit of time. I don't know why he kept up the lie for as long as he did, but whatever lol

This is bul**** because he was clearly was agreeing and hearting everyone was extremely upset about Byleth, everyone was using his reaction as a “””””vaild“””” rallying cry for why Byleth was a poor choice

There are people here that saying “his anger was completely warranted, even if it was real”

So what was the point lmao

Also his reactions on that stupid live dissuction video with Lax and Blocked Content had the same views

 

[Krankees]

Reminder to everybody that Edgeworth never actually said this line (although it would certainly fit within AA's writing style)

Edgeworth does however mentions Midiclorians, so there's a thing.

Dang it, now they know I brought false evidnece.

 

[Droodle]

Honestly speaking in terms of character diversity, this pass has been great.

We got:
- Lupin. Kirito.
- The entire DBZ cast
- A cereal mascot
- The most Western character, literally
- A generic anime teacher

Pretty good seeing these strides after the mess that was Smash 4.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Edgeworth posts on r/prequelmemes confirmed.

Phoenix Wright's Final Smash is forcing his opponent to sit through The Grid: Revelations.

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

Honestly speaking in terms of character diversity, this pass has been great.

We got:
- Lupin
- The entire DBZ cast
- A cereal mascot
- The most Western character, literally
- A generic anime teacher

Pretty good seeing these strides after the mess that was Smash 4.

Ignoring Corrin and Bayo, Smash 4's DLC was pretty great, as long you don't mind paying for characters that were already in previous installments.

If you do, then yeah, Ultimate was better. But ONLY on that basis.

 

[TheCJBrine]

I don't understand the "cereal mascot" term. It feels silly to use as an insult or something, just like "anime swordsman," and the first time I saw it used was from a dude who came into the B-K thread, pretend he cared about us hyping ourselves up too much, then threw a fit in the thread after B-K was revealed.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLmyopN8Cjc

Apparently papagenos video on byleth was faked. He wanted to see how many people he could fool I guess.

I don't really get where he's coming from with this though. The video was pretty ill-advised if you ask me. I mean, yeah he successfully pranked us, but it also lowered his reputation in the community since a lot of people thought it was real for quite a bit of time. I don't know why he kept up the lie for as long as he did, but whatever lol

PapaGenos really is the kinda guy who gets rejected by a girl, goes off on her, and then tries to play it off like his friend took his phone huh.

 

[Schnee117]

Can someone tell me what he just did because I refuse to click on the video

He's trying to play off his Byleth reaction as fake because he's been called out for his ****ty behaviour.

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

I don't understand the "cereal mascot" term. It feels silly to use as an insult, just like "anime swordsman," and the first time I saw it used was from a dude who came into the B-K thread, pretend he cared about us hyping ourselves up too much, then threw a fit in the thread after B-K was revealed.

Some people don't like things and come up with disparaging terms for them and that's 100% okay.

 

[---]

RIP anyone who wanted a River City Ransom rep.

RIP Kunio and Double Dragon. Hopefully we can get some costumes in the future. I would love for the Double Dragon main theme or River City Ransom overworld theme in Smash.

Either way it's nice to add another company to the list.

 

[Droodle]

Ignoring Corrin and Bayo, Smash 4's DLC was pretty great, as long you don't mind paying for characters that were already in previous installments.

If you do, then yeah, Ultimate was better. But ONLY on that basis.

Nope.

Mewtwo. Anime.
Lucas. VERY ANIME.
Roy. Realistic Anime.
Ryu. Literally Anime.
Cloud. Japanese Anime.
Corrin. "Big brother has become big sister" Anime.
Bayonetta. Broken Anime.

My logic is infallible.

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

He's trying to play off his Byleth reaction as fake because he's been called out for his ****ty behaviour.

PapaGenos really is the kinda guy who gets rejected by a girl, goes off on her, and then tries to play it off like his friend took his phone huh.

Except he's not "trying to play it off." It's objectively fake. Watch the video.

My logic is infallible.

Unironically fair enough. You're joking, but you don't realize how actually right you are.

 

[Icewolff92]

He's trying to play off his Byleth reaction as fake because he's been called out for his ****ty behaviour.

Wow... just wow....
This is the saddest excuse of damage control I ever heard

 

[Krankees]

RIP Kunio and Double Dragon. Hopefully we can get some costumes in the future. I would love for the Double Dragon main theme or River City Ransom overworld theme in Smash.

Either way it's nice to add another company to the list.

I thought it was just Kunio.

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

Wow... just wow....
This is the saddest excuse of damage control I ever heard

And you're being lied to.

 

[---]

I thought it was just Kunio.

The orange dudes are the Double Dragon brother's sprites from their appearance in River City Ransom.

https://youtu.be/UTTuQzyijZc

 

[Krankees]

The orange dudes are the Double Dragon brother's sprites from their appearance in River City Ransom.

https://youtu.be/UTTuQzyijZc

I forgot about that but I'm not sure it counts.

 

[ZelDan]

Regardless of if PapaGeno's reaction was real or not, it just seems like a dumb idea to fake something like that, whether a positive reaction or negative.

 

[cosmicB]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLmyopN8Cjc

Apparently papagenos video on byleth was faked. He wanted to see how many people he could fool I guess.

I don't really get where he's coming from with this though. The video was pretty ill-advised if you ask me. I mean, yeah he successfully pranked us, but it also lowered his reputation in the community since a lot of people thought it was real for quite a bit of time. I don't know why he kept up the lie for as long as he did, but whatever lol

This is... really bizarre. The fake video wasn't some overacted river of bile, it was just really passive-aggressive. That's not entertaining and pretty much the best thing I can say about it is it's convincing. But like, why add fuel to the fire by keeping this going for days at a time? Because you want to "get back" at the Smash community? That sounds like straight up resentment, not "just a prank bro". Like, it took him nearly a week of reiterating multiple times that the initial reaction was his raw, unfiltered reaction to come out and say it was staged.

It almost feels like damage control. Either that or the toxicity that's been building up over these last few months just flat out broke him, which tbh isn't that outlandish considering how awful it's been pre-cp5 reveal.

 

[TheCJBrine]

Some people don't like things and come up with disparaging terms for them and that's 100% okay.

I mean yeah it's okay, but I guess the discussion earlier where it was brought up seemed a bit weird with it, idk; plus, if it's being used as a genuine insult (which is how the guy I mentioned used it), it sounds silly. A lot of the characters in Smash could be cereal mascots, too, tbh.

MariO's.

PokéLoops.

Kirby's Super Stars.

King Dedede's Perfect Wheat cereal.

 

[Kokiden]

I'll keep this as short and sweet as I can.

If you are disappointed in the way of "Aww, sucks that they are in. I really wanted someone else but hey, we have six more DLC. No sense in getting mad about it. Let them be happy." Then I apologize. I struck out at you unfairly because of the majority of the Smash Fandom being entitled children about a character pick the company and the creator of the game chose.

However, if you are upset because of the "HOES MAD" meme which was created because of salty ass Smash Fans being the wasps that they are and attacking other fanbases because of *Insert characters except Banjo here* being in instead of *Insert character you or the hivemind feel deserves to be in the game* and dislike that they are are smug because of the backlash by said entitled children WHILE ACTIVELY participating in it, to the point of hating mere fanart of the character, then you deserve the hate mail that you get because you're intentionally bringing that negativity to yourself.

If the latter, you have a choice of either continuing to let this eat away at you or just take a breath and let go because in two months time, this will blow over and none of this will matter. Especially if they announce the next DLC Fighter

My participation in Smash discussions in general is mild at best. I rarely post, and when I do, it's more neutral or observatory in nature. I don't participate in extremes, nor do I make things personal and bash other people. Like who you like, idgaf.

So you can imagine how someone like me will take it when a mild post that merely expressed disappointment about a character, and nothing else, was met with extreme nonsense from the Byleth fanbase.

Disappointment =/= hating an entire franchise or the people who like it, but some don't understand this for some reason.

You reacted exactly the same way as the people I am talking about did ironically enough: striking out at me because you assumed I was an extreme hater. You are not the first to do this, and you won't be the last.

My first initial response to that image was more addressing I don't like how smug and obnoxious the fanbase has been for the precise reasons I said above: going all haywire on the wrong people and being a massive **** about it too.

Nothing else needs to be said about this, I'm just annoyed af that people don't understand moderation.

 

[Hinata]

Nope.

Mewtwo. Anime.
Lucas. VERY ANIME.
Roy. Realistic Anime.
Ryu. Literally Anime.
Cloud. Japanese Anime.
Corrin. "Big brother has become big sister" Anime.
Bayonetta. Broken Anime.

My logic is infallible.

Your smug ass Edgeworth avatar makes this post so much better.

 

[Garteam]

The fact that we already have three traditional fighting game reps makes me doubt that, personally. He was also specifically added to Pac-Man's Namco Roulette taunt in Ultimate, which feels to me like Sakurai is saying, "This is our Tekken representation."

Also, Heihachi is not a Fire Emblem character, so that alone knocks him down a couple hundred pegs. Always have to keep that in mind.

I kinda disagree. I don't think the fact that we have already have characters from the genre is necessary a great argument. If I'm doing my math right, we have about 18 characters that hail from an RPG (not counting Fire Emblem, as that's kinda a grey area), the vast majority of which have unique playstyles. If genre fatigue was an issue, we probably wouldn't have this many.

Heihachi would also be very different from Ryu and Terry as well. It kinda makes sense that Ryu and Terry play similarly because, well, Street Fighter and Fatal Fury are somewhat similar games (having a common creator and constantly taking inspiration from the other will do that). Tekken plays so differently from both those series, so Heihachi probably wouldn't have much in common with those two.

Regarding the Pac-Man taunt, I don't think it's a death sentence. It's a just a funny little reference that was probably put in at the last second. I doubt it was really something Sakurai thought about too deeply when planning Smash. If Sakurai really wanted Heihachi, I doubt he'd stop himself and say "Wait, I put a 50 pixel sprite of him in a non-interactive part of another character's moveset! I can't add him!".

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

Regardless of if PapaGeno's reaction was real or not, it just seems like a dumb idea to fake something like that, whether a positive reaction or negative.

Indeed. If it's a fake video, a giant prank to cause attention is ridiculously foolish and only going to make people angry.

If the video was real, he acted poorly, but at least he was honest about how he felt and that's better than heavily lying.

It's fair to say when somebody says "I'll never be mad if I get this character" isn't something to hold onto very well. People can react differently and changes their minds on things. It's not like it was a hard promise(might as well be, heh). He's absolutely within his right to feel differently as different situations come up. How he responds is a different story.

Anyway, he should've let it be or just apologized. Better off not saying he faked it, even if it was faked. Nobody's going to care nor find out most likely, and people would rather forgive him for his outburst if he at least saw the error of it. I mean, not all will, but that's just reality too.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Except he's not "trying to play it off." It's objectively fake. Watch the video.

Objectively fake

I wouldn't use such a modifier.

In the video he says the views are still the same, but he "played up the salt." This doesn't hold for a couple of reasons:

1. The idea of playing up the salt would have to have been one he'd have had before Byleth's presentation. I honestly doubt he went into that presentation with the idea of putting on an act, especially given that he was pretty much banking on Arle
2. He was in the comments section of the original video saying things like "I'm okay now guys XD," which wouldn't line up with an effort to show "max salt"
3. He made numerous comments on Discord expressing similar views to his original video, and
4. He pretty much reiterated these views and mannerisms in his video with Blocked Content and LaxChris

Unless he's been acting for the entire past four days (which is cause for concern in of itself that he would do such a thing to his own fanbase), he's likely playing things off to get the wave of backlash and criticism off of him.

On one hand, I get it. Any sort of criticism can get to you, and the amount that he got from his own fanbase would've worried me too if I were him. On the other hand, all he had to do was own up to the fact that he was just salty. A little bit of honesty and transparency goes a long way, not only with your fanbase, but with people in general.

Either way, this whole situation only makes me think worse of him.

 

[AceAttorney9000]

Regarding the Pac-Man taunt, I don't think it's a death sentence. It's a just a funny little reference that was probably put in at the last second. I doubt it was really something Sakurai thought about too deeply when planning Smash. If Sakurai really wanted Heihachi, I doubt he'd stop himself and say "Wait, I put a 50 pixel sprite of him in a non-interactive part of another character's moveset! I can't add him!".

Whenever someone says "Heihachi is out because of Pac-Man's taunt", I'm always sorely tempted to ask them "Is one of your most wanted characters The Prince of All Cosmos?"

 

[GuiltyGyarados]

Let them be happy.

The problem I have with saying "let FE fans be happy" is that they've already been happy seven times before this.

Imagine if you woke up on Christmas after a whole year of being a good boy, only to get a single present. Your brother, on the other hand, gets EIGHT presents, despite being arguably less well-behaved than you were.

Sure, you can be grateful for your one present, but is it really unjustified for you to NOT feel happy for your brother in this position?

 

[Izanagi97]

He pretty much reiterated these views and mannerisms in his video with Blocked Content and LaxChris

That reminds me, why was he teaming up with those guys

 

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

The problem I have with saying "let FE fans be happy" is that they've already been happy seven times before this.

Imagine if you woke up on Christmas after a whole year of being a good boy, only to get a single present. Your brother, on the other hand, gets EIGHT presents, despite being arguably less well-behaved than you were.

Sure, you can be grateful for your one present, but is it really unjustified for you to NOT feel happy for your brother in this position?

This analogy doesn't hold up.

It's not gifts you're getting. It's a video game crossover that appeals to tons of different fanbases and is way more complicated than good/bad boy. They don't exist in the scenario. It's just a selection of product that doesn't appeal to everyone. Which is more accurate at this point.

It's more people just being angry at a franchise they feel has gotten too many characters. And that's fine. You shouldn't have to be happy. But refusing to let people be happy for it is a problem in itself. There's no good reason to make anyone feel miserable whatsoever.

 

[Icedragonadam]

The fact Resident Evil got spirits is proof that big IPs like Tekken can be spirited away. Heck look at the four 3rd party DLC characters, they were series that Sakurai wanted to promote to the audience and are niche in some way. Like Dragon Quest is the RPG king in Japan but's niche outside of Japan.

Tales would benefit much more from being in Smash as a new game is coming out this year.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

You know, here I am randomly scrolling through Smashboards the before I head to bed, considering I have a big day tomorrow. I think to myself, “I wonder if there’s anything interesting going on!”

We’re. Still. Talking. About. Fire. Emblem.

I get disappointment. I really do. But the fact that some folks drag it on for nearly a week is sad. Like, I get it. You got a character you didn’t want. It sucks.

But like, I don’t know... Do something to get your mind off of it and start fresh? Why is it that folks obsess with being negative about things that they simply cannot change?

Sure, Fire Emblem fans “win again”. The solution is to say how annoying it is and to complain? That solves absolutely nothing and isn’t going to make a difference at this point.

I’m sorry, I just can’t understand how people are still going on about this.

 

[Souless_shadow]

The problem I have with saying "let FE fans be happy" is that they've already been happy seven times before this.

Imagine if you woke up on Christmas after a whole year of being a good boy, only to get a single present. Your brother, on the other hand, gets EIGHT presents, despite being arguably less well-behaved than you were.

Sure, you can be grateful for your one present, but is it really unjustified for you to NOT feel happy for your brother in this position?

"These people already got what they want so they ARENT ALLOWED to be happy"

 

[Izanagi97]

The fact Resident Evil got spirits is proof that big IPs like Tekken can be spirited away. Heck look at the four 3rd party DLC characters, they were series that Sakurai wanted to promote to the audience and are niche in some way. Like Dragon Quest is the RPG king in Japan but's niche outside of Japan.

Tales would benefit much more from being in Smash as a new game is coming out this year.

Yeah, and the current front runners for a Tales rep are Lloyd (the most well known), Yuri (the most popular), and Velvet (the most recent at the moment)