Newbie 17 - Breaking Bad Mafia! Game over! Who won?

[ranmaru]

Yes, I am, Apparently

I read that as is...

 

[Axel]

Well Vinyl is my big suspect at the moment, Kuz. I can't understand his train of thought at all, he seems really nervous or something. I can't help but think he's talking to someone, so must be scum, but I don't think it's Ran so I don't know who. That's my first point of call.

No it's cool, I can stay like 20mins. but that's all, ok?

Uh, I'd rather lynch Ran I guess, because I haven't got a read on vinyl yet.

Alright, more importantly what is with this?

 

[ranmaru]

Man Shotty hard lurkin'

 

[Vinylic.]

I wanted to discuss it! I had given up trying to read Ran, I wanted to focus on Vinyl, because the prevailing opinion seemed to be both Ran and Vinyl both being scum, and they'd implicated one another so heavily i didnt think that was likely. I can't help but think that maybe Vinyl is really bad town, but no-one's really put enough pressure on him to answer this question for me.

The question of thinking if I'm really bad town or what?

 

[Axel]

Ran, legitimately who do you think is the other scum team? It's in both our interest to find them.

 

[ranmaru]

Ha.

Legit, I believe

.. uh...

maybe... uh...


JD and Vitamin.

 

[ranmaru]

More so Vitamin than JD.

 

[ranmaru]

Either way I hope to see some cross fire from the scum team. And seeing as I have been super open with my reads, hopefully this will be the case. : D

 

[#HBC | Kary]

Zen: basically, my gut feeling is that Vinyl is scum. But every time I go over it I just wonder whether he could be nervous/bad town- and he could be talking to say someone that's not in the game, or just be the kind of guy that changes playstyle under pressure. With Ran, my gut and everything I look at suggests that he's scum, he's scum all over. Nothing he is going to do will convince me otherwise. Maybe i'm just so wound with him i'm mis-reading him but... still not prepared to consider him town.

 

[ranmaru]

Yes Ran, I did, because I thought, maybe, you MIGHT just be town. But somehow I don't care anymore, as JDietz has laid down the law.

This post shows otherwise, Kary.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

so while i'd rather pressure vinyl, i'd rather vote ran as I'm more certain of him being scum.

 

[#HBC | Kary]

@Vinyl: I think it was really bad town or scum. It's like your play is just the wrong tone for you to be town.

Anyways, that's all from me. See you in the aftersleep.

 

[ranmaru]

Like seriously. If not JD and Vitamin.. I'd look at the inactives. That's it.

I think getting scum will be like this:

Kary > Shotty > Vitamin > JD

That should net us 3 obv scum. JD is a slight scum read but I got that as soon as he joined my wagon.

 

[Shottymaster]

So now I'm obvious scum. Explain how I went from "clueless town" to Kary's scumbuddy in such a short period of time.

 

[ranmaru]

I already have, havent you read?

What us your read on kary?

If I flipped town, would he be next?

 

[#HBC | Kary]

So hey. I probably should've taken Kuz's advice and just got some sleep, but i don't really like to quit. I'm posting this now to in order to try and clean up some of things I said. I'm going to direct comments at people but they're really for everyone.

@Kuz: You asked me who to look at if I flip town, and I said Vinyl. I am about 50% certain that Vinyl is scum, and this is really bothering me, so I wanted someone to look into that. I still don't have a solid read on him, I just have this lingering suspicion that he must be scum, and I want that to be resolved.
On the other hand, I am 96% certain that Ran is scum, which is why when you asked me who I'd rather lynch, I said Ran. The reason I didn't suggest him as someone to look into is because just about everyone is convinced he's scum, and because if I flip town, Ran would look even more guilty for having spent the whole day saying I was scum.

@Ran: As I've just said, I'm 96% certain of you being scum, and nothing that you say is going to change this. But because there's always a chance I'm wrong, and because I don't want us all to just stroll into a mislynch, I wanted us to discuss it once more and at least lay out a half-decent case against you. I'm not even trying to defend you, I'm just trying to help town. And of course I'm going to vote for you if some players leave me no choice, because people like you are on my waggon.

@JDietz: I can honestly say that I wasn't trying to disrupt your lynch. I can see now why I could have done that, but I still believe that it is best for town if we spend just a little longer trying to get responses from people, and going over our cases for/against. I'm all for postponing the lynch on Ran, but I'm not trying to undermine it, i'm just trying to question it. I don't play like a regular newbie town, and I wasn't prepared to see Ran lynched to a chorus of 'yeah I guess' that wouldn't tell us anything.

@Vinyl: Confused the names? Your play... I cannot understand it. Also, your post #462? ("Mostly looks like he's playing around with me.") I feel like this has been long overdue.

@Zen: I feel like you're throwing your weight around again. Don't know why that is.

Oh and before I forget,
@Mod: please prod o-Serin-o

 

[Ori_bro]

Holy crap a lot happened. I'll be going over everything in a bit.

Spoiler

I told you all Kuz is a godlike player

 

[VitaminC]

Holy crap a lot happened.

This.

Welcome to the game, Kuz. How's it going?

Homework for a few hours, but I'll try to check every once in a while to keep up with how fast this is starting to move again. My vote is still staying on Ran, looking at Kary and/or Vinyl after the flip. And @Aleate, Serin, and all inactives, now would be a good time to get active again.

 

[Jdietz43]

[size=5Ran is at L-2[/size]

Zen, hop back on Ran. We're dealing with Kary after the flip. It's time to end this.


@Shotty: You're here, mind if I pick your brain for awhile? Also are you willing/confident to vote Ran.

 

[Jdietz43]

EBWOP: Size tags... make me sad

Ran is at L-2

 

[Jdietz43]

... and then he realized that "Size 5" is actually pretty small.

Ran is at L-2

And if that doesn't work right: then forget it lol

 

[ranmaru]

I already have, havent you read?

What us your read on kary?

If I flipped town, would he be next?

Still waiting for the answer to this

 

[o-Serin-o]

Okay, I'm back. Reading now.

 

[o-Serin-o]

From what I've read, the play for toDay is going to be Ran, Vinyl, or Kary? Fair enough.

When I saw Ran give the okay on the lynch for today, I thought to myself:

Not sure if playing smart
Or just bluffing.

But regardless of that Kary has contradicted his reads toward Vinyl.

I'm about to read all of Vinyl's posts.

 

[Jdietz43]

Let me know when you finish, I'd love to hear your thoughts before the day wraps up if possible.

 

[ranmaru]

From what I've read, the play for toDay is going to be Ran, Vinyl, or Kary? Fair enough.

When I saw Ran give the okay on the lynch for today, I thought to myself:

Not sure if playing smart
Or just bluffing.

But regardless of that Kary has contradicted his reads toward Vinyl.

I'm about to read all of Vinyl's posts.

What do you mean?

 

[Shottymaster]

I already have, havent you read?

1. No, you haven't. That "explanation" not only had almost nothing pertaining to me, but it contained literally zero relevant content. Being the experienced mafia player you are, I'm sure you know that people, by nature, will skim walls of text rather than read them in-depth. Which is why you thought you could post nothing and get away with it as if you defended yourself adequately.

Notice here how Kary doesn't address Shotty's actions. Instead he is just advising him, and asking him if he was serious about me. Of course he was. He has already given suspicion towards me before, so why ask if it was strong? I didn't see the benefit of him asking this, and it seems fake to me.

2. This is slightly related to me but means nothing. Kary simply asked me what I thought of you. A single post doesn't have to address every single thing. Of course the both of us are suspicious of you, but so is just about everyone else because you have given ample reason to develop such an opinion of you. Why ask if my suspicion was strong? Because it was the point where you almost went up the gallows and I'm guessing that he was wondering whether or not, in my opinion, we should lynch you at that moment.

It seems he thought I really wanted to lynch him. But he forgets that I have said earlier on, that he was clueless town, WHILE I was voting him. So I don't see how he got that idea.

I feel he was trying to use that against me to FORCE a suspicion onto me. This was when my read changed, Zen. Obviously Vynil has not been opportunistic at all. He was being bullied into voting me, and he's still town.

3. I have no clue what you mean by your response here. What I was addressing in your post is how quickly your opinion changed without sufficient explanation.

@Underlined: Why is a piece about Vinyl in a response to a section about me? Seems like you're trying to intentionally confuse people as to what you mean.

Underlined, this shows that Shotty forgot to fake a suspicion torwards Kary. This seems odd to me. Like he had to put that in to make his push on me genuine, because I wasn't the only one 'wagoning' him. Shotty hasn't even spoken about Kary ever again, dunno why.

4. I ask him a simple question to provoke a little conversation and you try and convince people that it means that I'm his scumbuddy, trying to brush off the bandwagon that meant absolutely nothing until now? I simply asked him a question that could've been satisfactorily answered in a single sentence and the matter would have been dropped. So of course if I ask a single question about someone then that means I'm scum.

Hey, Serin, why haven't you posted much yet? Oh look, I'm scumbuddies with Serin now, right Ran?

This is one of your most BS arguments yet, Ran. I hadn't focused much yet on Kary because he NEVER GAVE ME A REASON TO DO SO. You, on the other hand, have been directly interacting with me and in the process revealed your status of scum.

I wonder why Shotty hasn't even mentioned Kary.

@Shotty: Tell me where you got the feeling that I shouldn't be trusted and why.

5. So, after I directly call you out, you instantly try to deflect it onto Kary. We get it. You think Kary is scummy. I think he is too, but with MUCH less solid reasons than my read on you.

And if you had actually read my post, you would have seen this:

"(this is just gut instinct, no real evidence here), I just get the feeling that he just shouldn't be trusted."

6. Right before your underlined part of my post, I DIRECTLY answered the question you asked in response to my post. You were clearly trying to fend the blame off because you knew you were trapped and you did a pretty crappy job of it. Even more evidence that you're scum.

You have done nothing but dodge blame all game and covered it up extremely poorly. Mind explaining why your read on me changed from "Clueless Town" to "Kary's scumbuddy"? You never gave any solid reasoning. I called you out and then asked a simple question to Kary that would've resulted in a simple answer, and you use that as a basis to call me scum? You are the sole reason I forgot about Kary until then. You provided a LOT more to work with and frankly, Kary's simple bandwagon didn't show anything. I only asked him about it to pressure him a bit, make him come up with a reason just to get him to talk. Based on what you said, after I asked Kary that one question, I automatically became scum to you. There was never any solid evidence to back up your claims against me in the first place. Furthermore, you went from hopping on the bandwagon against me in the beginning to saying that there was no way I was scum, and then doing a complete 180 and being completely convinced that I'm scum and trying to get people on against me with you.

To recap:

1. I know you know that people won't read walls of text in-depth and instead opt to skim. Quantity < Quality. You try to post as much as you can to cover the fact that you have no concrete evidence.

2. You are trying to use this to force your opinion of Kary onto me as well. So what if he didn't address my actions? That in no way is enough evidence to conclude ANYTHING AT ALL. He simply asked for my input about you and you didn't like that, so you tried to turn it around on whoever you could. Guess what, it didn't fool anyone.

3. All I had said in the post corresponding to this quote was that you never explicitly stated your reasoning for your wildly swinging opinion. You go on to talk about how Vinyl was still town to you, which leads me to believe that you threw that into your otherwise well-organized post in hopes that someone skimming would see it as something that holds some value. Either that or you really don't know how to organize a post, but seeing your other large posts and the fact that they are all flawlessly- and relevantly-organized, I am forced to accept the former.

4. This is one of the most ludicrously useless points you've made in the entire game. What I got from your response was that I was almost completely innocent until I asked Kary a casual question, and once I had done that I suddenly became his scum buddy. The only way I'm affiliated with Kary is having a similar opinion of you, but apparently you have been able to connect us out of literally no evidence at all, rather, completely BS hollow assumptions. This incriminates you even more as scum.

5. When you realize that I have a solid claim against you, what do you do? Do you try to discuss your way out of it and argue your situation like a townie? Nope, you instead opted to attempt to deflect my argument against you onto Kary, whom you have long since expressed suspicion against.

6. You try to further support your bad argument by calling me to support my innate distrust for you, even when the answer was literally immediately before the sentence that you questioned. I don't know if there's a specific name for a terrible, hollow argument commonly used in Mafia, but if I knew of it I would use that to describe this portion of your "argument".

So you have no valid supporting evidence in your claims, and use those weightless claims to try and lynch one who you had said was 100% town not two days before, without explaining at all why your opinion changed. Hmm. You lie and try to cover it up, and when your bad job is discovered you try to deflect the blame onto someone you also don't have significant evidence against?

Remind me: What alignment tries to do that?

Oh wait, I remembered: Scum.



I think I have now made it abundantly clear why I am suspicious of you. You have supplied me with enough reason to conclude that you're scum. Now, without wasting any more time, Vote: Ranmaru

 

[Jdietz43]

Alright, that answers my "will you vote for Ran question"

Ran is at L-1



Shotty: out of the inactives who will you be looking into after today assuming a Ran scum-flip? (I assume I can already guess Kary and Vinyl will be automatic and just skip asking that)

 

[Axel]

Vote: Ranmaru

 

[Shottymaster]

@Jdietz: I haven't heard any real content from Kuz since he just recently joined so I plan to prod him a little. I also want to hear from Serin and Aleate because at this point the inactives need to start making an effort to contribute because otherwise they will likely be lynched out of inactivity and that's on the bottom of things we want.

 

[ranmaru]

@Shotty:

What us your read on kary?

If I flipped town, would he be next?

 

[ranmaru]

Ouch that kick mang.

Still town.

My reads are the same as I last posted them.

Any questions?

 

[Jdietz43]

Lol... very nice.


@Shotty: wanna just pop an opinion on the last question before flips? Who are you looking at?

 

[Jdietz43]

EBWOP: Ignore that repeat question lol... I got refresh ninja'd.

 

[Axel]

Ran if you give us your partner, I will make sure he lives until we have the other scum team. Deal?

 

[ranmaru]

Hmmm, I don't have the answer to that.

Try again.

 

[Jdietz43]

@Ran: yes one last question: who is your scummate.

 

[ranmaru]

Same response.

JD, who is your scummate? Can you tell us that?

 

[Jdietz43]

Also... if you're town: I will hurt you. Just saying.

That play was a** from a townie

 

[JTB]

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch!
Deadline 4/22, 11:59 PM EST

Vinyl. [0]
Aleate [0]
Ori_bro [0]
o-Serin-o [0]
GLG [0]
VitaminC [0]
Shottymaster [0]
Jdietz [0]
Kary [1] Ranmaru
Zen [0]
th3kuzinator [0]
Ranmaru [7] VitaminC, Kary, Jdietz, th3kuzinator, Vinyl, Shottymaster, Zen

Not voting: Aleate, o-Serin-o, GLG, Ori_bro

A lynch has been decided! The game is now in twilight until the flip is posted.