Newbie 13: Organization XIII Mafia ~Town Wins!~

[Xivii]

Werekill the Pheonix wagon is complete BS. I don't like the way people are hopping on him for very little reason at all other than his inactivity. If he goes completely inactive then he will be replaced.

bpc and Kooz have yet to explain their reasoning for getting on that all the sudden.

 

[Lore]

I love you for that L pic, Zen. :3

And yeah, you're right. I was slightly implying that a few posts ago, but you put it better than I could have.

 

[Lore]

And good point. I'm sticking on it, though, until there's actually a chance of a wagon switch. By the way, there's also a chance that he will be modkilled instead of replaced.

For the record, FoS: Sangfroid

 

[Xivii]

He wont be modkilled without warning. The wagon wont switch unless you change your vote. It's either you or Sang today. I wont let the Pheonix lynch happen.

 

[Lore]

... Fine.

Vote: Sangfroid

If it gets too close to deadline without anymore votes, I'm switching back.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Meh. You can buy it or not. It's all a matter of trust and if you don't trust me then fine. I finally went out with it because I figured if I waited any longer you would say what you are saying now. Plus, I figured if J had decided to tell me about it then he would know that it wasn't against the rules.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Okay. Not going to lie. This shakes my reads up my town read on you a little bit Sang.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

@Acro. Yeah yeah I know, alright? Everyone is going to be saying that. Not much I can do about it, being as I can't go back in time and tell the truth in the first place instead of being a scardy little kitten.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Alright. This is my view on the D1 lynch after my re-read (exluding my own if it does happen):

I feel that Acro, Zen, and Kuzi are town. Most of the others I'm null with. But, I still very much think that Werekill is scum, and, after my re-read, I think Pheonix might be as well. I am also slightly suspicious of Panta and Garg, but it pales in comparison to the other two. Werekill did things early on that make me think he is mafia. For one, he voted for me saying that I was being defensive when many other people before him had said the same thing. Then, he piggybacks with Pheonix in saying that I was just a pressure vote. But, lately, he has been doing things that make him seem town to me. He has stuck with his idea that me, Kuzi, and Garg might be scum. If he were mafia, I think he might have changed his thoughts based on all of the attention he has gotten for it. Also, he has been active. I don't like that he's adamant in trying to get rid of an inactive, but I understand where he's coming from.

And that brings us to the inactive. Pheonix. He made very few posts, and, although that's not enough to really get a read on him, it is enough to make me entirely suspicious of him. He first came in offering some "help" and then gave a two-liner about how there wasn't much to go off of when plenty had already happened. He never responded to Kuzi's question, either. After that, he comes back saying pretty much nothing of consequence and saying that he was going to pressure vote me because I seemed defensive which, again, had been said plenty of times before that. Also, he says that I was just voting for Garg because of his jokes. He comes back even later saying that he forgot about the game. Again, in this post, he never really gave any information about anything, instead choosing to make defenses. It was all just... nothing. I don't want to lynch him today, but, other than Werekill and a slight scum read from Panta or Garg, I don't really get any scum tells from anyone else.

Panta seemed to be making a lot of mistakes and overlooking silly things. He also got really upset when he messed up about something and seemed ready to give up. But, he has been active and seemingly working to find the mafia.

Garg just seems to be jumping any wagon he sees and, though he did explain it earlier, he went from me to Panta to Werekill and then to Pheonix.

Cadet just seems null to me at the moment.

@Werekill. Why did you never respond to my #338 post? You replied to the first part but that was the 20th and still no response on the second part. Until that gets cleared up, I will forever think you are mafia.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Sangfroid. Would you consider voting Pheonix over Werekill for today's lynch since you think both are scum?

 

[Xivii]

Acrostic why don't you think Werekill is scum?

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

If werekill answers my 338 post effectively... possibly.

 

[Lore]

@Sang: Sorry, sorry. I'm on my ipod, and it's a ***** and a half to make big replys with. I'm also at the Olympic Training Center, so I really can only check in for short intervals.

... Wait a minute! I can just go on one of the desktops here in the center! I'll go take care of all this asap.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

I'd appreciate it.

 

[Lore]

@Acrostic: why did you edit and add "since you think both are scum?" Against 'da rules, my friend.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Technically, you couldn't put it against him seeing as there's no evidence. also, i believe Kuzi said something about that early on and I think he has done it himself once or twice. You did so, too, did you not? In one of your bigger posts.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

I'm not condoning it. I'm just explaining something that happened earlier on.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

He seems to have been initially had a bad start due to V/LA. At the time the lynch was stratified between Pheonix/Werekill and I would prioritize Werekill as he was trying to contribute and Kooz's read on his reaction. I don't know how to interpret the bandwagon change, I'm treating it as null tell at the moment. Most responses to my comments are coming across as null, but the way his rhetoric and attitude make me inclined to believe he could be town. I do find some discrepancies surrounding Were which I haven't worked out yet. Kooz hasn't been answering a lot of questions.

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

@Acrostic: why did you edit and add "since you think both are scum?" Against 'da rules, my friend.

I'm editing a lot within the 2 minute frame. If this is against the rules then I apologize and will stop. However I don't see anything wrong with it.

 

[Xivii]

Werekill I've seen you do the same thing.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

@werekill. Why would you change your vote so quickly just because of Zen's argument? I think a few of us have been making that same argument, but you didn't acknowledge that. As I recall, you were adamant to remove Pheonix as he wasn't posting.

 

[Xivii]

Sang, you're honestly telling me that you didn't consider that since J told you, it wasn't against the rules before?

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

I really didn't.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

I don't know how I couldn't have thought of that before, but... <-(for myself) I am honestly telling you that, before that point, it had never occured to me.

 

[Xivii]

I think you would have considered it since you apparantly gave it enough thought to lie about it.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

I honestly didn't even really think. All I thought about was how it might be against some rule that nobody really followed. By the time I actually started to calm down and think, the damage was done. I believe it honestly stemmed from when before the game started that I said I was told to tell I was a girl and Kuzi kind of got on my case about it a bit, even after I said it was J.

 

[Xivii]

OK :o

Vote: Werekill

 

[Xivii]

When I reread your 605 and 609 it just doesn't seem legit to me >_<

Probably going to switch my vote back.

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Sangfroid. Would you consider voting Pheonix over Werekill for today's lynch since you think both are scum?

But, and yes I'm coming back to this, I'm not entirely sure. Of course, we only have those few posts from Pheonix and, sure, there were plenty of scummy things in them but... if we have a chance to get a replacement then... I'd rather have Pheonix.

 

[Lore]

Werekill I've seen you do the same thing.

I apologize if I have done it in the past. I was just noticing it, that's all.

@werekill. Why would you change your vote so quickly just because of Zen's argument? I think a few of us have been making that same argument, but you didn't acknowledge that. As I recall, you were adamant to remove Pheonix as he wasn't posting.

Making what argument? I'm sorry that potentially removing a scummy person makes me switch wagons; I had already stated before that the only reason why I wasn't pushing for anyone else was because I didn't think a wagon switch was really possible.

Anyway, on to 338!

Alright, here we go. I’ve laid it all out for you. Sorry for the length of this, but it was the easiest way.

Okay, well, first of all, before I had voted for Garg, Kuzi had asked for whom I would vote for if I had the chance. This is my post:

I guess I understand where you’re coming from with the idea that I didn’t give enough support with my Garg suspicion early on, but he was just the first, and only person for a while, that seemed like scum to me.

With my #201 post, I had finally decided to vote for the person I had been having suspicion of, and he had been the only one to really give me mafia reads. I mean, it’s early on. What other reasons can a person really have for voting except for a feeling that early? But, I digress.

We're already past this, so I don't see a reason to respond to this.

I came back to this at #206 and #207

This was for who was town, which you seemed to not get.

And we have already agreed that you had worded it badly. Next!

Now, where in the world did you get the idea to pressure-vote me? Because, from your post, it seemed like you had other reasons to want to vote me, so why would you go back and change your reasons later instead of sticking with them?

I consider a pressure vote to be a vote on a person that uses mostly solid reasons with some level of shakiness in order to see what response you get from the person in question. Imo, if you say that it's a pressure vote at the time, it weakens the ability to pressure, so this might be why you think here that I changed my reasons.

Now, go back and read my #210 post, please.

#211, I come back to what I have said over and over again, yet you continue to bring up crap.
I’m not sure what you want to take from this line from Kuzi, but I figured I should let you look at this as well.

You have to remember that I still didn't believe that you had sufficient reasons at the time for the vote. However, we're already past this now, so I'll move on.

Here, I have to thank Kuzi for saying what I apparently had issues with trying to find the correct words to say:

And, once again, I believed that you hadn't really stated your reasons, except in a vague way. Stating reasons for waiting to vote is not the same as stating reasons FOR the vote. But, once again, we're past this, so I'll move on.

Now, what were you’re reasons for thinking it was an OMGUS vote? Because, you stated it but never went back to it, even after Kuzi, me, and even Garg commented on it.

Honestly, the OMGUS was a shot in the dark. Garg had voted for you out of nowhere, so I thought that you might have been OMGUS'ing him. However, I realized that this was wrong, so I never went back to it.

And this is where our suspicion with you started:



I understand this one was posted by phoenix, but, immediately after, you followed up with this, claiming to change from being suspicious at my so-called OMGUS vote:

The conversation that cleared up the joke thing was between Garg and me, starting mostly at either #144 or #203 and #206, all of which was before you made your vote on me known.

I, personally, did not believe that it had cleared up the joke thing, but I wasn't referring to you voting for the action of joking itself. I didn't like your reasoning of "he's hoping that people pass over him because of his jokes." That's what I meant by voting for him because of jokes; I didn't think of it as sufficient reasoning to think that someone's scummy because it seemed really reachy to me.

On a side note... JUSTICE.

Here, you didn’t really answer this part of Kuzi’s post and I want you to now.

I mean, there’s nothing else on this entire thread that might be taken as scummy? Really?

You have to remember that I was pretty busy around that point, and I honestly just skimmed the thread a bit. After seeing your vote I went back and read more of your stuff, but that's about it.

Besides, not many people had been active around then, so it was difficult to get clear reads.

Now, in your #326 post, you commented on my explanation of wanting to vote Garg and say that nowhere else did I explain the Garg vote. I thought I had made it clear but I must not have. I admit my wrongdoing on that part. But, I did explain my reasons eventually, and even slightly beforehand.

Yeah, we've gone over this already, so ignoring! At least we both admit that we were each wrong in some little ways.

There we go! Satisfied in some ways, SW?

 

[Lore]

OK :o

Vote: Werekill

... And the SW train disappears? I still don't really believe her.

 

[Lore]

Oh, and I also don't like how you dropped it like it was nothing so quickly. >_>

 

[Xivii]

@Werekill: #668

I'm really at a crossroads here. Her posts in general seem so townie, but that whole event doesn't look genuine at all.

 

[Lore]

@Werekill: #668

I'm really at a crossroads here. Her posts in general seem so townie, but that whole event doesn't look genuine at all.

Alright, didn't really see it. Would you be ok with SW as a potential D2 lynch?

Unvote, Vote: Pheonix again.

 

[Xivii]

Only if we lynch you. I'll fight the Pheonix lynch to the death.

 

[Lore]

And why are you still so against me?

 

[Xivii]

Because you're still the scummiest from the day.

 

[Xivii]

Vote: Sang

I think I'm set with this. Kooz please join me :O

 

[SangfroidWarrior]

Thank you. Yes, I am satisfied. You're reasonings make sense, so I am not as suspicious of you, but I still am to an extent.

What I meant by "He's making jokes hoping people will pass over him" is that he didn't really post anything of pertinence early on. I understand it was early on and he just felt like joking but... I wanted more from him than just batman jokes. And I don't think it's something we need to revive

But, in reference to the pressure-vote thing, I think it was slightly more scummy of you to immediately say that you were just pressuring me right after Pheonix did than it would have been to say it immediately or to just not say it at all and only bring it up when people asked you about it. Again with the OMGUS call.

Regardless, thank you. I appreciate it. And I know you still don't believe me. I can't really do anything more to convince you, can I?

 

[#HBC | Acrostic]

Werekill. I haven't done a thorough read as I am still around the end of going through BPC. However it seems like your entire behavior D1 is oriented around self-survival. When I skimmed it seems like you coasted when the noose was off your neck. Also your choice of people to lynch seems more oriented by self-defense and self-survival then being based around tells or process of elimination. I find this behavior contradictory to Kooz's town tell on you given your self-vote and previous behavior.